John 17:3-what Jesus taught

[Matthias]

You did not address my point which is what Jesus and the Apostles taught- Eternal Life is found in the Son, Salvation is found in Him. He who believes in the Son has life. He who does not believe in the Son does not have life but is condemned.

I agree with it.

 

[civic]

Then you haven’t been following his posts to me and my lack of response to them.

Doesn’t this forum have an “ignore” feature? I don’t use it, on any forum I’m on, but who knows that? If I did, it shouldn’t cause you or anyone else to hum.

I was thinking about it - and I may be mistaken - but I believe every forum that I’ve ever been on has had such a feature, and moderators commonly encourage people to use them. (Cuts down on the moderator’s workload.)

@Administrator do we have an ignore feature and if not can we implement one ?

 

[Matthias]

@Administrator do we have an ignite feature and if not can we implement one ?

I don’t know what an “ignite” feature is. If it’s something that‘s optional which each forum member is able to use at their discretion, I won’t use it. Others, of course, might. I don’t care one way or the other about that.

Some moderators consider what Fred does to people who ignore him to be harassment. Do you consider a person who posts incessantly to someone who obviously is never going to respond to them to be harassing / bullying?

 

[Fred]

Some moderators consider what Fred does to people who ignore him to be harassment. Do you consider a person who posts incessantly to someone who obviously is never going to respond to them to be harassing / bullying?

I don't care if you respond or not, but I am not going to let false teaching go unchecked.

Go ahead talk about other things such as your home state or your favorite cookies and I won't respond, but start asserting things that are untrue concerning the Jesus of the Bible then I will respond.

 

[civic]

I don’t know what an “ignite” feature is. If it’s something that‘s optional which each forum member is able to use at their discretion, I won’t use it. Others, of course, might. I don’t care one way or the other about that.

Some moderators consider what Fred does to people who ignore him to be harassment. Do you consider a person who posts incessantly to someone who obviously is never going to respond to them to be harassing / bullying?

That was a typo

 

[Keiw1]

Nope He says eternal life is from Father snd Son- Equals in 17:3 and they share the same glory together before creation 17:5.

Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent. 4 I have brought you glory on earth by finishing the work you gave me to do. 5 And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I had with you before the world began

hope this helps !!!

He says one has to know both. There is no equality-John 20:17, John 5:19,30-- All was GIVEN to Jesus by the one who is greater than him.

 

[Keiw1]

Trinitarians cannot accept that Jesus said that his God is the only true God.

Trinitarians don’t believe that Jesus’s God is the only true God. Trinitarians believe that the Trinity is the only true God.

You do well accepting that Jesus is talking only about his God; not their deity, nor any other.

There is no God besides the Messiah’s God. Everything else is idols.

Even Paul named only the Father as God-1Cor 8:5-6- in 5 warns all other Gods are false.

 

[Keiw1]

Strawman.

Its fact you refuse to accept and would rather mislead others.

 

[Keiw1]

I never see them challenge each other but I would enjoy seeing them discuss it with each other.

@Matthias @Keiw1 @APAK @Wrangler @tigger2 would you guys be willing to discuss that ?

No need Jesus was clear--You MUST pray then like this-Our Father. The Father is the Only true God. He is the hearer of prayers and the one who answers them.

 

[Matthias]

That was a typo

Okay. It happens. No big deal. (I just went back and saw that you corrected it. I understand what you’re asking him now.)

Should I hmmm that you didn’t answer the other question that I asked in my post?

There could be a dozen reasons why you chose not to answer it. None of them make me go hmmm.

 

[Matthias]

Well, now. Let’s see how @civic responds to someone on the forum speaking about me. Speaking a falsehood about me, at that.

* I either have my answer or he’s still thinking it over *

 

[Matthias]

He says one has to know both. There is no equality-John 20:17, John 5:19,30-- All was GIVEN to Jesus by the one who is greater than him.

Another important point that was brought up is that God doesn’t share his glory with anyone. But unlike God, Jesus of Nazareth does share the glory he was given by God with his disciples.

 

[Matthias]

No need Jesus was clear--You MUST pray then like this-Our Father. The Father is the Only true God. He is the hearer of prayers and the one who answers them.

Do you ever speak to the Messiah?

 

[Diserner]

Jesus of Nazareth is a first-century Jewish monotheist. His doctrine is Jewish. His God is only one person, YHWH.

The assumption is the word God is equal to the word person by default, yet there is no Scripture for this.

"One" can mean a lot of things, but the assumption is made it can ONLY semantically mean one PERSON here.

This is nowhere stated and just rather presumed to be the default view—not a proper hermeneutic.

 

[Matthias]

Even Paul named only the Father as God-1Cor 8:5-6- in 5 warns all other Gods are false.

Many trinitarian scholars point this out. There’s a disconnect between JAT and trinitarian scholars. They often don’t know what their theologians are saying in their ivory towers. When those who do know what they‘re saying - be we trinitarian or non-trinitarian - and we inform JAT about what they’re saying, it generally isn’t well received.

There’s the rub. JAT won’t listen to non-trinitarians and doesn’t know or care what their own theologians and scholars are saying. They certainly get precious little of it from the trinitarian pulpit.

 

[Diserner]

Another important point that was brought up is that God doesn’t share his glory with anyone. But unlike God, Jesus of Nazareth does share the glory he was given by God with his disciples.

Does God share his glory in a way with Jesus he does not with anyone else?

This is the key question in this regard.

"Sharing" glory has multiple meanings and gets equivocated.

 

[Matthias]

The assumption is the word God is equal to the word person by default, yet there is no Scripture for this.

"One" can mean a lot of things, but the assumption is made it can ONLY semantically mean one PERSON here.

This is nowhere stated and just rather presumed to be the default view—not a proper hermeneutic.

Didn’t Jesus clearly identify who the one person is?

 

[Matthias]

Does God share his glory in a way with Jesus he does not with anyone else?

This is the key question in this regard.

"Sharing" glory has multiple meanings and gets equivocated.

I don’t think this is difficult.

”The glory which you have given me I have given to them” - Jesus, John 17:22

The glory he’s referring to is the glory which he asked God for in John 17:5.

 

[Keiw1]

Another important point that was brought up is that God doesn’t share his glory with anyone. But unlike God, Jesus of Nazareth does share the glory he was given by God with his disciples.

Jesus has his own glory. The Father has his own glory.

 

[Keiw1]

Do you ever speak to the Messiah?

No the Messiah told all to pray to his Father.