sorry that is absolutely false
The bible teaches there is one God
The bible tells us Jesus is God
The Spirit is God
The father is God
Jesus is not the Father is not the Spirit
There is the doctrine of the trinity
Jesus the Man Before John !
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
The bible teaches there is one God
The bible tells us Jesus is God
The Spirit is God
The father is God
Jesus is not the Father is not the Spirit
There is the doctrine of the trinity
Peterlag
Well-known member
Father is not a creature. It's a title... a name. I am not 3 different creatures because I'm a son, brother and cousin. These are names and titles.
The Father is a person who is not Jesus and is not the Holy Spirit
The doctrine of the trinity
The bible teaches there is one God
The bible tells us Jesus is God
The Spirit is God
The father is God
Jesus is not the Father is not the Spirit
There is the doctrine of the trinity
Peterlag
Well-known member
You don't understand that the word Father does not tell us what He is? For example I'm human made up of flesh, blood, water and bone. I'm not a Peterlag or a cousin. Peterlag or cousin are titles... names. So what is God?
Are you going to tell the readers you cannot identify the person who calls Christ his son?
Peterlag
Well-known member
Well, you started it. So let's look at it...
1.) Jesus is God
2.) Holy Spirit is God
3.) What's the third?
The Father is God
brightfame52
Well-known member
He is the beginning !
Col 1:18
18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
This scripture sets forth a profound Mystery and Truth, that Christ as the Head of His Body the Church, was in the beginning, in other words, He existed in this capacity as the Head of the Body, His Church, at the beginning of the World, and it is what is referred to here Rev 3:14
14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Prov 8:23
23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
And He was set up the Head of His Body the Church, which are called the Sons of men in Prov 8:31
31 Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
Thats His Church, members of His Body, that He takes delight in, and it is those He made in His Image and Likeness, who are the ones to be conformed to His Image through redemptive blessing Rom 8:29
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
The Ones Created in His Image Gen 1:26
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Matt 13:37
37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed[offspring, descendants] is the Son of man; See Gen 1:26 !
As the beginning the Head of the Church, He is also the originating cause Eph 3:9
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
In other words, Creation had an Redemptive Purpose hidden in Christ, it was a Mystery !
It was the redemptive purpose for that world[The Church He is the Head of ] chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 6
Col 1:18
18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
This scripture sets forth a profound Mystery and Truth, that Christ as the Head of His Body the Church, was in the beginning, in other words, He existed in this capacity as the Head of the Body, His Church, at the beginning of the World, and it is what is referred to here Rev 3:14
14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;
Prov 8:23
23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
And He was set up the Head of His Body the Church, which are called the Sons of men in Prov 8:31
31 Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
Thats His Church, members of His Body, that He takes delight in, and it is those He made in His Image and Likeness, who are the ones to be conformed to His Image through redemptive blessing Rom 8:29
29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.
The Ones Created in His Image Gen 1:26
26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Matt 13:37
37 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed[offspring, descendants] is the Son of man; See Gen 1:26 !
As the beginning the Head of the Church, He is also the originating cause Eph 3:9
9 And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
In other words, Creation had an Redemptive Purpose hidden in Christ, it was a Mystery !
It was the redemptive purpose for that world[The Church He is the Head of ] chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4
4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 6
He chose believers (those in Christ) to be holy and blameless
Nothing there about chosing unconditionally selected men to be saved
If Peterlag knew Christ, he would know the Father. Peterlag does not sufficiently explain the passages to another meaning from their indications of the deity of Christ in the Godhead. I should have recorded what Peterlag finally revealed about his concept of Jesus.
Peterlag
Well-known member
Father is not a God. It's not a creature. It's not a thing. It's a name. A tile.
A person other than the son who is Christ and is known to be deity.
So is Peterlag saying the Father is not God either? Peterlag is starting to sound like an ignorant atheist. The more that guy shares his ideas the worse he sounds.
His words
"Father is not a God. It's not a creature. It's not a thing. It's a name. A tile."
Sure. Might as well be that Peterlag calls God a tile. I have shared with some people that if they want to get people to reject the trinitarian concept of God they need to counter all the details of that doctrine. One guy tried to reverse the burden, possibly as if his concept was better from the beginning. He even apparently has a manuscript ready if he finds a publisher. But there are many verses across the scriptures that would have to be explained (away). So far these unitarians just seem to get focused on Christ's humanness and then disregard the passages that speak of his divinity in the Godhead
Clearly not a sufficient methodology
brightfame52
Well-known member
Who is the First Man ever Born ?
Job 15:7
7 Art thou the first man that was born? or wast thou made before the hills?
Jn 1:30
This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he[a man] was before me.
I already know that the consensus will say Adam the First 1 Cor 15:45
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
But that pertains only to manifestation, also Adam was not born or beget or fathered, he was created, or made, and that after a pattern of another Man, the Man Christ Jesus, His Mediator 1 Tim 2:5
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
This statement is false if Christ Jesus was not the Mediator of men in Adam at Creation, at Creation, men had One God and One Mediator, the Man Christ Jesus, the thing was, Christ Jesus the Mediator was not yet manifested as He would be later I jn 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
He became Manifested through means of the Incarnation, the Virgin Birth !
The Man Christ Jesus is the First Man Born and by that is meant :
I.first in time or place
A.in any succession of things or persons
II.first in rank
A.influence, honour
B.chief
C.principal
III.first, at the first
In all things, including being a Man He must have the Preminence Col 1:18
18 And he is the head of the body, the church[As Mediator]: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
The word preeminence means :
I.to be first, hold the first place
That word first in Job 15:7 for first man is the hebrew word ri'shown :
I.first, primary, former
A.former (of time)
i.ancestors
ii.former things
B.foremost (of location)
C.first (in time)
D.first, chief (in degree)
Christ the Mediator Man [1Tim 2:5] was before Adam as He was before John 1:30, in fact Adam took the form and shape of a Man after being made in the Image and Likeness of his God Man Mediator, Christ Jesus !
Job 15:7
7 Art thou the first man that was born? or wast thou made before the hills?
Jn 1:30
This is he of whom I said, After me cometh a man which is preferred before me: for he[a man] was before me.
I already know that the consensus will say Adam the First 1 Cor 15:45
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second man is the Lord from heaven.
But that pertains only to manifestation, also Adam was not born or beget or fathered, he was created, or made, and that after a pattern of another Man, the Man Christ Jesus, His Mediator 1 Tim 2:5
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
This statement is false if Christ Jesus was not the Mediator of men in Adam at Creation, at Creation, men had One God and One Mediator, the Man Christ Jesus, the thing was, Christ Jesus the Mediator was not yet manifested as He would be later I jn 3:8
He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
He became Manifested through means of the Incarnation, the Virgin Birth !
The Man Christ Jesus is the First Man Born and by that is meant :
I.first in time or place
A.in any succession of things or persons
II.first in rank
A.influence, honour
B.chief
C.principal
III.first, at the first
In all things, including being a Man He must have the Preminence Col 1:18
18 And he is the head of the body, the church[As Mediator]: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
The word preeminence means :
I.to be first, hold the first place
That word first in Job 15:7 for first man is the hebrew word ri'shown :
I.first, primary, former
A.former (of time)
i.ancestors
ii.former things
B.foremost (of location)
C.first (in time)
D.first, chief (in degree)
Christ the Mediator Man [1Tim 2:5] was before Adam as He was before John 1:30, in fact Adam took the form and shape of a Man after being made in the Image and Likeness of his God Man Mediator, Christ Jesus !
Except
John 1:1 (KJV 1900) — 1 IN the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
But he was not a man at that time, And you have a problem with scripture
1 Cor 15:45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
1 Cor 15:47The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Who is the First Man ever Born ? 2
Job 15:7
7 Art thou the first man that was born? or wast thou made before the hills?
The second portion of this verse gives us more insight into who this First Man Born is, by the words of inquiry"or wast thou made before the hills?"
The word made here is the hebrew word chuwl and means:
ii.to be brought forth
D.(Hophal) to be born
Which is its meaning in Prov 8:24-25
24 When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.
25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
Did you notice again the phrase "before the hills" ? Where did we see it before ? Here Job 15:7
7 Art thou the first man that was born? or wast thou made before the hills?
The First Man was born, brought forth before the Hills were ! Prove 8:24-25 is speaking of the Wisdom of God, which is Christ 1 Cor 1:24
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
And who is Christ ? Why He is the The Man Mediator between God and Men 1 Tim 2:5
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
He delighted as Mans Mediator before they were Created Prov 8:31
31 Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
Some Translations of Prov 8:25
25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: are:
before the mountains were settled in place, before the hills, I was given birth,NIV
before the mountains were set in place— before the hills—I was born,NET
And before the mountains would be established, and before the hills, I was formed in the womb.Aramaic Bible in Plain English See Ps 110:3
The Septuagint reads:
25 before the mountains were settled, and before all hills, he begets me.
which terms relate to being born, Hence the First Man to be born is the Lord Jesus Christ as The Mediator between God and Men 1 Tim 2:5, The Man Wisdom, and we are His Children if we receive this Mystery Lk 7:35
But wisdom [Christ] is justified by all her children. 6
Job 15:7
7 Art thou the first man that was born? or wast thou made before the hills?
The second portion of this verse gives us more insight into who this First Man Born is, by the words of inquiry"or wast thou made before the hills?"
The word made here is the hebrew word chuwl and means:
ii.to be brought forth
D.(Hophal) to be born
Which is its meaning in Prov 8:24-25
24 When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.
25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
Did you notice again the phrase "before the hills" ? Where did we see it before ? Here Job 15:7
7 Art thou the first man that was born? or wast thou made before the hills?
The First Man was born, brought forth before the Hills were ! Prove 8:24-25 is speaking of the Wisdom of God, which is Christ 1 Cor 1:24
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
And who is Christ ? Why He is the The Man Mediator between God and Men 1 Tim 2:5
5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
He delighted as Mans Mediator before they were Created Prov 8:31
31 Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
Some Translations of Prov 8:25
25 Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: are:
before the mountains were settled in place, before the hills, I was given birth,NIV
before the mountains were set in place— before the hills—I was born,NET
And before the mountains would be established, and before the hills, I was formed in the womb.Aramaic Bible in Plain English See Ps 110:3
The Septuagint reads:
25 before the mountains were settled, and before all hills, he begets me.
which terms relate to being born, Hence the First Man to be born is the Lord Jesus Christ as The Mediator between God and Men 1 Tim 2:5, The Man Wisdom, and we are His Children if we receive this Mystery Lk 7:35
But wisdom [Christ] is justified by all her children. 6
1 Corinthians 15:45 (KJV 1900) — 45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
