Doctrine of Unconditional Election
- Thread starter brightfame52
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brightfame52
Well-known member
Yet we can rest assured, if God isn't willing that something happens, then it simply will not happen ! How does that oppose election ? Many shall perish duh
Fool4Christ
Active member
perish duh... They didn't choose to believe in Jesus.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Yet we can rest assured, if God isn't willing that something happens, then it simply will not happen !
Fool4Christ
Active member
I'm resting assured that God gave me a freewill to choose Jesus or reject Him. The Bible is clear that we not only have the ability to choose, we also have the responsibility to choose wisely.
brightfame52
Well-known member
So what Jesus did you supposedly choose ? Who is He according to scripture ? What has He done, and for whom did He do it for ?
brightfame52
Well-known member
If election wasn't unconditional, then it couldn't be what scripture calls " the election of grace" Rom 11:5
5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. Also unconditional election of grace is always reserved for a remnant, not everyone.
5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. Also unconditional election of grace is always reserved for a remnant, not everyone.
civic
Well-known member
He sure did
I'm sorry that you are rejecting Jesus.
Jesus never once taught that faith was given , granted or a gift .He said " YOUR FAITH " has saved and healed you. Not the faith I gave you has saved you, healed you.
Luke 7:50
And he said to the woman, Thy faith ( not the faith I have given you )hath saved thee; go in peace.
Luke 8:48
"Daughter," said Jesus, "your faith (not the faith I have given you )has healed you. Go in peace."
Luke 17:19
Then Jesus said to him, "Rise and go; your faith( not the faith I have given you ) has made you well!"
Luke 18:42
"Receive your sight!" Jesus replied. "Your faith(not the faith I have give you ) has healed you."
Matthew 8:10
When Jesus heard this, He marveled and said to those following Him, "Truly I tell you, I have not found anyone in Israel with such great faith.
Matthew 8:13
Then Jesus said to the centurion, "Go! As you have believed, so will it be done for you." And his servant was healed at that very hour.
Matthew 9:2
Just then some men brought to Him a paralytic lying on a mat. When Jesus saw their faith, He said to the paralytic, "Take courage, son; your sins are forgiven.
Matthew 9:22
Jesus turned and saw her. "Take courage, daughter," He said, "your faith has healed you." And the woman was cured from that very hour.
Matthew 9:29
Then He touched their eyes and said, "According to your faith will it be done to you."
Matthew 15:28
"O woman," Jesus answered, "your faith is great! Let it be done for you as you desire." And her daughter was healed from that very hour.
Mark 5:34
"Daughter," said Jesus, "your faith has healed you. Go in peace and be free of your affliction."
Mark 10:52
"Go," said Jesus, "your faith has healed you." And immediately he received his sight and followed Jesus along the road.
John 4:53
So the father knew that it was at the same hour, in the which Jesus said unto him, Thy son liveth: and himself believed, and his whole house.
Faith is a conviction of the mind that Christ is God. Jesus said unless you believe that “ I AM” you will die in your sins.(John 8:24) Read the whole chapter. Paul declared one must confess Jesus is Lord(YHWH) to be saved and those who call upon Him will be delivered(Joel 2:32). Secondly it is a voluntary surrender to Him as Lord or Master of your life. By faith our mind trusts in God, our heart responds to His love and our will submits to the commands of God. Our life yields to obedience in our service to Him. Faith goes beyond reason, it believes without understanding why. ( Heb 11:1) Faith chooses to endure ill treatment (Heb 11:25) Faith accepts all things as a part of God will, Paul’s imprisonment.( Phil1:12) You are not born with faith, it comes from hearing Gods word(Rom 10:17) You cannot be saved without faith.(John 3:36) No peace with God without faith.(Rom 5:1) You are justified by faith(Gal 2:16) Christ dwells in our hearts by faith (Eph 3:17) The Spirit is received by faith (Gal 3:2)
conclusion: I have scripture that supports 100% the biblical principle of faith and what is required by man to be saved. You have fatalism/determinism/hyper calvinism as your salvation- not faith, not the gospel, not Christ. your doctrine teaches you were saved before you were created, before there was a gospel, before you believed and without the gospel.
hope this helps !!!
civic
Well-known member
The condition of the clay and the potter. God declares if you repent then I will not bring upon you these disasters/wrath/judgements.
Jeremiah 18
Then the word of the Lord came to me. 6 He said, “Can I not do with you, Israel, as this potter does?” declares the Lord. “Like clay in the hand of the potter, so are you in my hand, Israel. 7 If at any time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down and destroyed, 8 and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relentand not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. 9 And if at another time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be built up and planted, 10 and if it does evil in my sight and does not obey me, then I will reconsider the good I had intended to do for it.
In Romans 9 its the hardened Jew/reprobate is whom Paul prays for in their temporary hardening until all the gentiles are grafted into the branch. The potter/clay is God using the hardened Jews- His elect,chosen people ( destruction ) to bring in non elect vessels of glory ( gentiles) their salvation. The potter/clay is another analogy that contradicts calvinism, not support it. Once the glasses/lens are removed one can see the passages in their greater biblical context and harmonize them.
There are no chapters/verses in the original Greek- so here is the context below which reveals the flaws in Calvinism's soteriology.
Romans 9:30–32 - What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but that Israel who pursued a law that would lead to righteousness did not succeed in reaching that law. 32 Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone,
Romans 10:18–21- But I ask, have they not heard? Indeed they have, for “Their voice has gone out to all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world.” 19 But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says, “I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation; with a foolish nation I will make you angry.” 20 Then Isaiah is so bold as to say, “I have been found by those who did not seek me; I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me.” 21 But of Israel he says, “All day long I have held out my hands to a disobedient and contrary people.”
Romans 11:19–23-Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. 22 Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. 23 And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again.
Remember Israel- the Jews are Gods Elect/ Chosen people.
Pauls summary of Romans 9: Faith vs Works is what Paul is addressing in Romans 9. Gentiles ( non elect by faith ) Jews/Israel ( Gods elect,chosen) by works.
Romans 9
That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but the people of Israel, who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal. 32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone. 33 As it is written:
“See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes people to stumble
and a rock that makes them fall,
and the one who believes in him will never be put to shame.
The above is the same teaching in Romans 3 below :
Romans 3
But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from law, although the law and the prophets bear witness to it, 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction; 23 since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins; 26 it was to prove at the present time that he himself is righteous and that he justifies him who has faith in Jesus. 27 Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On the principle of works? No, but on the principle of faith. 28 For we hold that a man is justified by faith apart from works of law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, 30 since God is one; and he will justify the circumcised on the ground of their faith and the uncircumcised through their faith.
And if we keep reading into chapter 9 the hardened Jew/reprobate is whom Paul prays for in their temporary hardening until all the gentiles are grafted into the branch. The potter/clay is God using the hardened Jews- His elect,chosen people ( destruction ) to bring in non elect vessels of glory ( gentiles) their salvation. The potter/clay is another analogy that contradicts calvinism, not support it. Once the glasses/lens are removed one can see the passages in their greater biblical context and harmonize them.
hope this helps !!!
civic
Well-known member
We know that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of Christ. Romans 10:17. We know that God saves those who believe – 1 Corinthians 1:21. We know that we receive the spirit and are sealed with the spirit through belief in the gospel- Ephesians 1:13.
Sin is the transgression of the law- 1 John 3:4. Sin is known thorough/by the law- Romans 7:7. The law is a schoolmaster to bring us to Christ- Galatians 3:24-25. Where there is no law there is no transgression of the law- Romans 4:14. Sin is not counted against anyone when there is no law. Romans 5:13.
In Colossians 2:13-15 we read the following: When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14 having canceled the charge of our legal indebtedness, which stood against us and condemned us; he has taken it away, nailing it to the cross. 15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
Ephesians 2:14-15: For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility.
2 Corinthians 5:18-20: All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: 19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. 20 We are therefore Christ’s ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ’s behalf: Be reconciled to God.
So, we see from the above scriptures it’s not sin per se that keeps the sinner from God it is unbelief. Faith is the issue. In Romans 5:1-2 we read the following: Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2 through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we boast in the hope of the glory of God
Its unbelief that keeps one from salvation and places them under condemnation. This is taught throughout the N.T. gospels and epistles. Here we see what Jesus and Paul declared below.
John 3:18: Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
John 3:36: Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them
Romans 11:20: Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith.
Hebrews 3:19: So, we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief. Cf Heb 4:6- unbelief
Our loving God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked (Ezekiel 33:11). Our loving Father took pleasure to bruise His Son to reconcile us to God as an offering for our sins. (Isaiah 53:10).
It is by faith in the Son through the message of the gospel that saves and unbelief which condemns. The gospel is for all mankind, all the world, for everyone. God desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. (1 Timothy 2:4). God is the Savior of all men, especially of believers (1 Timothy. 4:10), For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to everyone (Titus 2:11) For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all (Romans 11:32). The Lord is not slow in keeping His promise as some understand slowness, but is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish but everyone to come to repentance (2 Peter 3:9). God sent His Son into the world to take away the sin of the world (John 1:29) and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for sins of the whole world. (1 John 2:2). and He died for all, that those who live should live no longer for themselves, but for Him who died for them and rose again (2 Corinthians 5:15). But we do see Jesus, who was made lower than the angels for a little while, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone. (Hebrews 2:9)
conclusion: @brightfame52 you stand refuted with your false claims about faith and salvation.
Correct believing in Jesus saves while those who remain in unbelief are condemned. Jesus taught this simple truth many times and spells it out for us in John 3:14-18.
John 3
Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
hope this helps !!!
Sin is the transgression of the law- 1 John 3:4. Sin is known thorough/by the law- Romans 7:7. The law is a schoolmaster to bring us to Christ- Galatians 3:24-25. Where there is no law there is no transgression of the law- Romans 4:14. Sin is not counted against anyone when there is no law. Romans 5:13.
In Colossians 2:13-15 we read the following: When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, 14 having canceled the charge of our legal indebtedness, which stood against us and condemned us; he has taken it away, nailing it to the cross. 15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
Ephesians 2:14-15: For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility.
2 Corinthians 5:18-20: All this is from God, who reconciled us to himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation: 19 that God was reconciling the world to himself in Christ, not counting people’s sins against them. And he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. 20 We are therefore Christ’s ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ’s behalf: Be reconciled to God.
So, we see from the above scriptures it’s not sin per se that keeps the sinner from God it is unbelief. Faith is the issue. In Romans 5:1-2 we read the following: Therefore, since we have been justified through faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ, 2 through whom we have gained access by faith into this grace in which we now stand. And we boast in the hope of the glory of God
Its unbelief that keeps one from salvation and places them under condemnation. This is taught throughout the N.T. gospels and epistles. Here we see what Jesus and Paul declared below.
John 3:18: Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
John 3:36: Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life, but whoever rejects the Son will not see life, for God’s wrath remains on them
Romans 11:20: Granted. But they were broken off because of unbelief, and you stand by faith.
Hebrews 3:19: So, we see that they were not able to enter, because of their unbelief. Cf Heb 4:6- unbelief
Our loving God takes no pleasure in the death of the wicked (Ezekiel 33:11). Our loving Father took pleasure to bruise His Son to reconcile us to God as an offering for our sins. (Isaiah 53:10).
It is by faith in the Son through the message of the gospel that saves and unbelief which condemns. The gospel is for all mankind, all the world, for everyone. God desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. (1 Timothy 2:4). God is the Savior of all men, especially of believers (1 Timothy. 4:10), For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to everyone (Titus 2:11) For God has consigned all to disobedience, that he may have mercy on all (Romans 11:32). The Lord is not slow in keeping His promise as some understand slowness, but is patient with you, not wanting anyone to perish but everyone to come to repentance (2 Peter 3:9). God sent His Son into the world to take away the sin of the world (John 1:29) and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for sins of the whole world. (1 John 2:2). and He died for all, that those who live should live no longer for themselves, but for Him who died for them and rose again (2 Corinthians 5:15). But we do see Jesus, who was made lower than the angels for a little while, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone. (Hebrews 2:9)
conclusion: @brightfame52 you stand refuted with your false claims about faith and salvation.
Correct believing in Jesus saves while those who remain in unbelief are condemned. Jesus taught this simple truth many times and spells it out for us in John 3:14-18.
John 3
Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. 18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God’s one and only Son.
hope this helps !!!
civic
Well-known member
Calvinisms Total depravity and inability who need regeneration to become alive- they also use lazarus as an illustration of dead and his inability to believe until brought back to life(regeneration ). They conflate and equivocate using the word dead and give it a meaning the bible never does. In calvinism these are all synonyms- dead, corpse and zombie.
The T is false so right from the start its wrong.
civic
Well-known member
what he said
civic
Well-known member
you are wrong once again.
There is progressional sanctification mentioned numerous times in scripture
Is regeneration progressive ? yes or no
“Progressive” or “experiential” sanctification, as it is sometimes called, is the effect of obedience to the Word of God in one’s life. It is the same as growing in the Lord (2 Peter 3:18) or spiritual maturity. God started the work of making us like Christ, and He is continuing it (Philippians 1:6). This type of sanctification is to be pursued by the believer earnestly (1 Peter 1:15; Hebrews 12:14) and is effected by the application of the Word (John 17:17). Progressive sanctification has in view the setting apart of believers for the purpose for which they are sent into the world: “As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world. For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified” (John 17:18–19). got?
To summarize, “sanctification” is a translation of the Greek word hagiasmos, meaning “holiness” or “a separation.” In the past, God granted us justification, a once-for-all, positional holiness in Christ. In the present, God guides us to maturity, a practical, progressive holiness. In the future, God will give us glorification, a permanent, ultimate holiness. These three phases of sanctification separate the believer from the penalty of sin (justification), the power of sin (maturity), and the presence of sin (glorification).
next...............
hope this helps !!!
civic
Well-known member
Original Word: ἐκλογή, ῆς, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: eklogé
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-log-ay')
Definition: a (divine) selection
Usage: a choosing out, selecting, choice (by God).
The word is used 7 times in the N.T. Most by Paul in Romans 9-11 where is contradicts the Calvinists view on election. The Jews ( Gods elect,chosen ) were not saved as Paul pleads for their salvation in Romans 9-11.
Romans 9:11 N-AFS
GRK: ἡ κατ' ἐκλογὴν πρόθεσις τοῦ
NAS: according to [His] choice would stand,
KJV: according to election might stand,
INT: the according to election purpose
Romans 11:5 N-AFS
GRK: λεῖμμα κατ' ἐκλογὴν χάριτος γέγονεν
NAS: according to [God's] gracious choice.
KJV: according to the election of grace.
INT: a remnant according to election of grace there has been
Romans 11:7 N-NFS
GRK: ἡ δὲ ἐκλογὴ ἐπέτυχεν οἱ
NAS: it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained
KJV: but the election hath obtained it,
INT: but [the] elect obtained [it]
Romans 11:28 N-AFS
GRK: δὲ τὴν ἐκλογὴν ἀγαπητοὶ διὰ
NAS: but from the standpoint of [God's] choice they are beloved
KJV: as touching the election, [they are] beloved
INT: however the election beloved on account of
Obadiah
Well-known member
So too at the present time there is a remnant, chosen by grace. Romans 11:5
Paul is making the case that God has not rejected Israel as His people, as well as the fact that a remnant of Israel has remained faithful to God by faith in Christ. This small portion of the Jewish people have received Christ as Messiah instead of rejecting Him in order to try to be saved by their works through the law.
Paul proclaims now that this remnant has been chosen by God's grace. By this, Paul means that they have not earned their place in this faithful remnant of Israelites. Just as Gentile Christians are chosen by God's grace, these Israelites have received salvation as a gift. Paul wants to be clear they have not earned it in any way by being faithful to the law of Moses.
The following verse not only summarizes this point, it also stands alone as a crucial part of Christian theology. Grace cannot be mixed with good works—either salvation is attained according to God's grace, or it's earned by deeds. It cannot be both at the same time. Paul has already demonstrated that salvation by one's own works is impossible.
Romans 3:10 as it is written: None is righteous, no, not one.
Romans 3:20 For by works of the law no human being will be justified in his sight, since through the law comes knowledge of sin.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Unconditional Election cant be conditioned on ones Faith or believing, for the simple fact, ones Faith or believing was conditioned upon Gods election of them from the beginning, which results in their Faith or believing 2 Thess 2:13
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through[ with, by means of, by] sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
So how could the results/effects be also the cause ?
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through[ with, by means of, by] sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
So how could the results/effects be also the cause ?
brightfame52
Well-known member
He sure didnt.
brightfame52
Well-known member
If election wasn't unconditional, then it couldn't be what scripture calls " the election of grace" Rom 11:5The condition of the clay and the potter. God declares if you repent then I will not bring upon you these disasters/wrath/judgements.
Jeremiah 18
Then the word of the Lord came to me. 6 He said, “Can I not do with you, Israel, as this potter does?” declares the Lord. “Like clay in the hand of the potter, so are you in my hand, Israel. 7 If at any time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down and destroyed, 8 and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relentand not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. 9 And if at another time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be built up and planted, 10 and if it does evil in my sight and does not obey me, then I will reconsider the good I had intended to do for it.
In Romans 9 its the hardened Jew/reprobate is whom Paul prays for in their temporary hardening until all the gentiles are grafted into the branch. The potter/clay is God using the hardened Jews- His elect,chosen people ( destruction ) to bring in non elect vessels of glory ( gentiles) their salvation. The potter/clay is another analogy that contradicts calvinism, not support it. Once the glasses/lens are removed one can see the passages in their greater biblical context and harmonize them.
There are no chapters/verses in the original Greek- so here is the context below which reveals the flaws in Calvinism's soteriology.
Romans 9:30–32 - What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but that Israel who pursued a law that would lead to righteousness did not succeed in reaching that law. 32 Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone,
Romans 10:18–21- But I ask, have they not heard? Indeed they have, for “Their voice has gone out to all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world.” 19 But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says, “I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation; with a foolish nation I will make you angry.” 20 Then Isaiah is so bold as to say, “I have been found by those who did not seek me; I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me.” 21 But of Israel he says, “All day long I have held out my hands to a disobedient and contrary people.”
Romans 11:19–23-Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. 22 Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. 23 And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again.
Remember Israel- the Jews are Gods Elect/ Chosen people.
Pauls summary of Romans 9: Faith vs Works is what Paul is addressing in Romans 9. Gentiles ( non elect by faith ) Jews/Israel ( Gods elect,chosen) by works.
Romans 9
That the Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, have obtained it, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but the people of Israel, who pursued the law as the way of righteousness, have not attained their goal. 32 Why not? Because they pursued it not by faith but as if it were by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone. 33 As it is written:
“See, I lay in Zion a stone that causes people to stumble
and a rock that makes them fall,
and the one who believes in him will never be put to shame.
The above is the same teaching in Romans 3 below :
Romans 3
But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from law, although the law and the prophets bear witness to it, 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction; 23 since all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 they are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption which is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as an expiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God’s righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins; 26 it was to prove at the present time that he himself is righteous and that he justifies him who has faith in Jesus. 27 Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On the principle of works? No, but on the principle of faith. 28 For we hold that a man is justified by faith apart from works of law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? Is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yes, of Gentiles also, 30 since God is one; and he will justify the circumcised on the ground of their faith and the uncircumcised through their faith.
And if we keep reading into chapter 9 the hardened Jew/reprobate is whom Paul prays for in their temporary hardening until all the gentiles are grafted into the branch. The potter/clay is God using the hardened Jews- His elect,chosen people ( destruction ) to bring in non elect vessels of glory ( gentiles) their salvation. The potter/clay is another analogy that contradicts calvinism, not support it. Once the glasses/lens are removed one can see the passages in their greater biblical context and harmonize them.
hope this helps !!!
5 Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace. Also unconditional election of grace is always reserved for a remnant, not everyone.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Election is of grace, and man naturally is totally depraved, dead in sin
brightfame52
Well-known member
Tulip is the Gospel of Gods Grace. Do you know what the acronym TULIP stands for ?
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