Doctrine of Unconditional Election

[brightfame52]

So it is not a work and you stand self refuted

sorry agreement in gender does not mean they are the same

It is in identification of a pronoun with its antecedent that one examines for agreement in gender, but

neither faith or grace are pronouns.

You are therefore abusing grammar

Faith is by Grace Rom 4:16

16 Therefore it is of faith, that it might be by[according to] grace; to the end the promise might be sure to all the seed; not to that only which is of the law, but to that also which is of the faith of Abraham; who is the father of us all,

The elect believe by or because of grace Acts 18:27

27 And when he was disposed to pass into Achaia, the brethren wrote, exhorting the disciples to receive him: who, when he was come, helped them much which had believed through grace:

Eph 2:8

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Faith and Grace agree in Gender here, showing they are of one and the same, now is Grace of ourselves ?

 

[brightfame52]

@Doug Brents

John 1:12 does not say anything about God giving us the power to believe. It says that those who believe receive the right to become children of God. Our belief is the condition upon which God gives us the right to become His children.

Its both, God gives the right to believe and the ability. The word power exousia:

1. power of choice, liberty of doing as one pleases
   1. leave or permission
2. physical and mental power
   1. the ability or strength with which one is endued, which he either possesses or exercises
3. the power of authority (influence) and of right (privilege)

And Vs 13 informs that the ones believing were born of God

Our belief is the condition

No its a privilege and ability granted Phil 1:29 29 For unto you it is given in the behalf of Christ, not only to believe on him, but also to suffer for his sake;

 

[e v e]

Greetings Eve~this will be very short.

The RCC do not believe in sola scriptura,

sola scriptura is much older than the reformation (which failed).

the real problem is whose words are sola since kjv and septuagint are sorcery texts.

 

[Red Baker]

sola scriptura is much older than the reformation

Very true. It goes all the way back to the Lord Jesus, and even the OT, Isaiah wrote:

Isaiah 8:20​

“To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.”

By definition, Sola Scriptura means scripture alone is authoritative for the faith/doctrine and practice of the very elect.

I could heap scriptures on you, but pretty sure to no profit, and the reason why is this: bottom line, it is a matter of faith, either you have faith that God has given to each nation (the elect within) his word in their own tongue, just as it was first given ~ word for word, and every jot and tittle....or, you do not have faith in this truth. If one part, scripture(s), book, could be questionable, so could another part, and that would leave us with no word of God to be trusted.

Matthew 5:18​

“For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.”

I'm finished talking about subject in this thread.

 

[brightfame52]

Notice how that God first Loved us and then chose us, thats who He gives to believe the truth, He sets them apart by the sanctifying work of the Spirit. 2 Thess 2:13

Notice its the same pattern as it pertained to His Chosen People Israel, He first said He loved them and chose them and set them apart Deut 7:6-7

6 For thou art an holy people unto the Lord thy God: the Lord thy God hath chosen thee to be a special people unto himself, above all people that are upon the face of the earth.

7 The Lord did not set his love upon you, nor choose you, because ye were more in number than any people; for ye were the fewest of all people:

Gods choice of a people is unconditional.6

 

[e v e]

Very true. It goes all the way back to the Lord Jesus, and even the OT, Isaiah wrote:

Isaiah 8:20​

“To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.”

By definition, Sola Scriptura means scripture alone is authoritative for the faith/doctrine and practice of the very elect.

I could heap scriptures on you, but pretty sure to no profit, and the reason why is this: bottom line, it is a matter of faith, either you have faith that God has given to each nation (the elect within) his word in their own tongue, just as it was first given ~ word for word, and every jot and tittle....or, you do not have faith in this truth. If one part, scripture(s), book, could be questionable, so could another part, and that would leave us with no word of God to be trusted.

Matthew 5:18​

“For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.”

I'm finished talking about subject in this thread.

you misread my reply.

 

[Red Baker]

you misread my reply.

I see~my apology.

the real problem is whose words are sola since kjv and septuagint are sorcery texts.

Please explain what you are saying.

 

[e v e]

I see~my apology.


Please explain what you are saying.

ptolemy ii viewed himself as a god. All his statuary is greek. All the pomp and imagery at his coronation was Greek, and pagan. the cost of that one (coronation) event was more than the total worth of the richest man on earth today... in gold coin. the same man built the library in which he wanted to place a copy of hebrew 'scripture.' To fit his own view, which was not christian. He had the men who would translate vetted, ending of course with those sympathetic to his views. And they proceeded to write down a version of what God said. This was the septuagint. It was not what God said.

I include a link simply to verify its age and the above regarding ptolemy ii. https://biblearchaeology.org/research/new-testament-era/4022-a-brief-history-of-the-septuagint

Ptolemy's version set a point of view into motion, a version and interpretation of events.

Later came the kjv. James - an occultist as were newton, kant, descartes and many others (not in historical order) - hired magician and occultist John Dee to oversee the work. To this day the new age adores john Dee as a sorcerer and 'science' gives him accolades and celebrates him. Much of this project involvement is scrubbed from the net but available to research at university libraries. This first edition of the kjv is filled with masonic symbolism and continues the sorcery of the septuagint. To see
but one example of the continuity of these texts, affecting every modern bible, here. https://www.septuagint-lxx.com/kjv

As to early theology, it was enthralled in the medieval period with greek philosophy (which IS greek theology) and this philosophy was viewed as science, a classical education. Newtons laws are straight out of plato. Jerome writing letters to greeks for understanding, Augustine converts to christianity because it accepts greek knowledge. Augustine's trinitate (on the trinity) text is a text of aristotelian and platonic substance theory, Augustine's genesis writings are a horror, and yet, he is elevated and makes many decisions on canon. The protestant reformation fails to examine this. Much of Augustine's theology remains in place. The reformation failed. Aquinas' summa later on: a treatise of greek theology marked as christianity, using greek exegetical method and logical structures and greek concerns as its truth by which to discuss christianity, all in response to averroes, an islamic aristotelian scholar whose theological acumen Aquinas admired.

today: all of this is taught in theology departments. Just one example, but i have many, an evangelical in a forum spouted a bunch of plato he learned in theology class, not like I am doing by criticizing it but instead he was doing like augustine did: blending christianity to those foreign-to-God concepts.

I'm just cliff noting. It's a bit much information and I do not know the extent of your desire to study it. But this gives a very rough sketch of the evil done to keep His sons today from understanding what He said!!

Do recall the Words He spoke were not ever written down. Josephus notes this. But once disobedient and ending in captivity, when God was Not speaking to them anymore!!!, then they were. This making His words vulnerable (to corruption, as outlined above.)

 

[e v e]

I see~my apology.


Please explain what you are saying.

Thank you for letting me explain , even though the explanation is very limited. It is not easy to cover details in such a limited space.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

ptolemy ii viewed himself as a god. All his statuary is greek. All the pomp and imagery at his coronation was Greek, and pagan. the cost of that one (coronation) event was more than the total worth of the richest man on earth today... in gold coin. the same man built the library in which he wanted to place a copy of hebrew 'scripture.' To fit his own view, which was not christian. He had the men who would translate vetted, ending of course with those sympathetic to his views. And they proceeded to write down a version of what God said. This was the septuagint. It was not what God said.

I include a link simply to verify its age and the above regarding ptolemy ii. https://biblearchaeology.org/research/new-testament-era/4022-a-brief-history-of-the-septuagint

Ptolemy's version set a point of view into motion, a version and interpretation of events.

Later came the kjv. James - an occultist as were newton, kant, descartes and many others (not in historical order) - hired magician and occultist John Dee to oversee the work. To this day the new age adores john Dee as a sorcerer and 'science' gives him accolades and celebrates him. Much of this project involvement is scrubbed from the net but available to research at university libraries. This first edition of the kjv is filled with masonic symbolism and continues the sorcery of the septuagint. To see
but one example of the continuity of these texts, affecting every modern bible, here. https://www.septuagint-lxx.com/kjv

As to early theology, it was enthralled in the medieval period with greek philosophy (which IS greek theology) and this philosophy was viewed as science, a classical education. Newtons laws are straight out of plato. Jerome writing letters to greeks for understanding, Augustine converts to christianity because it accepts greek knowledge. Augustine's trinitate (on the trinity) text is a text of aristotelian and platonic substance theory, Augustine's genesis writings are a horror, and yet, he is elevated and makes many decisions on canon. The protestant reformation fails to examine this. Much of Augustine's theology remains in place. The reformation failed. Aquinas' summa later on: a treatise of greek theology marked as christianity, using greek exegetical method and logical structures and greek concerns as its truth by which to discuss christianity, all in response to averroes, an islamic aristotelian scholar whose theological acumen Aquinas admired.

today: all of this is taught in theology departments. Just one example, but i have many, an evangelical in a forum spouted a bunch of plato he learned in theology class, not like I am doing by criticizing it but instead he was doing like augustine did: blending christianity to those foreign-to-God concepts.

I'm just cliff noting. It's a bit much information and I do not know the extent of your desire to study it. But this gives a very rough sketch of the evil done to keep His sons today from understanding what He said!!

Do recall the Words He spoke were not ever written down. Josephus notes this. But once disobedient and ending in captivity, when God was Not speaking to them anymore!!!, then they were. This making His words vulnerable (to corruption, as outlined above.)

So is there a translation or early MSS that you think is accurate and preserved with integrity?

 

[Red Baker]

ptolemy ii viewed himself as a god. All his statuary is greek. All the pomp and imagery at his coronation was Greek, and pagan. the cost of that one (coronation) event was more than the total worth of the richest man on earth today... in gold coin. the same man built the library in which he wanted to place a copy of hebrew 'scripture.' To fit his own view, which was not christian. He had the men who would translate vetted, ending of course with those sympathetic to his views. And they proceeded to write down a version of what God said. This was the septuagint. It was not what God said.

I include a link simply to verify its age and the above regarding ptolemy ii. https://biblearchaeology.org/research/new-testament-era/4022-a-brief-history-of-the-septuagint

Ptolemy's version set a point of view into motion, a version and interpretation of events.

Later came the kjv. James - an occultist as were newton, kant, descartes and many others (not in historical order) - hired magician and occultist John Dee to oversee the work. To this day the new age adores john Dee as a sorcerer and 'science' gives him accolades and celebrates him. Much of this project involvement is scrubbed from the net but available to research at university libraries. This first edition of the kjv is filled with masonic symbolism and continues the sorcery of the septuagint. To see
but one example of the continuity of these texts, affecting every modern bible, here. https://www.septuagint-lxx.com/kjv

As to early theology, it was enthralled in the medieval period with greek philosophy (which IS greek theology) and this philosophy was viewed as science, a classical education. Newtons laws are straight out of plato. Jerome writing letters to greeks for understanding, Augustine converts to christianity because it accepts greek knowledge. Augustine's trinitate (on the trinity) text is a text of aristotelian and platonic substance theory, Augustine's genesis writings are a horror, and yet, he is elevated and makes many decisions on canon. The protestant reformation fails to examine this. Much of Augustine's theology remains in place. The reformation failed. Aquinas' summa later on: a treatise of greek theology marked as christianity, using greek exegetical method and logical structures and greek concerns as its truth by which to discuss christianity, all in response to averroes, an islamic aristotelian scholar whose theological acumen Aquinas admired.

today: all of this is taught in theology departments. Just one example, but i have many, an evangelical in a forum spouted a bunch of plato he learned in theology class, not like I am doing by criticizing it but instead he was doing like augustine did: blending christianity to those foreign-to-God concepts.

I'm just cliff noting. It's a bit much information and I do not know the extent of your desire to study it. But this gives a very rough sketch of the evil done to keep His sons today from understanding what He said!!

Do recall the Words He spoke were not ever written down. Josephus notes this. But once disobedient and ending in captivity, when God was Not speaking to them anymore!!!, then they were. This making His words vulnerable (to corruption, as outlined above.)

Greetings again Eve~I have read this through three times to make sure I'm following you correctly, and I think I have a solid grasp of what you saying~let me come back make one last post to give my opinion on the matter, and then lets move on to discuss only the scriptures.

 

[Red Baker]

ptolemy ii viewed himself as a god. All his statuary is greek. All the pomp and imagery at his coronation was Greek, and pagan. the cost of that one (coronation) event was more than the total worth of the richest man on earth today... in gold coin. the same man built the library in which he wanted to place a copy of hebrew 'scripture.' To fit his own view, which was not christian. He had the men who would translate vetted, ending of course with those sympathetic to his views. And they proceeded to write down a version of what God said. This was the septuagint. It was not what God said.

Our Lord never mentioned the septuagint, which should show us what he thought of it. He always quoted the scriptures written by Hebrew prophets, written to the Jews in their own language. A number of times during His earthly ministry, Jesus responded to questions with, “It is written…” (7 times in Matthew, 4 times in Mark, 5 times in Luke, 1 time in John). In the Bible, we also read of many time when Jesus quoted the truths of God from the Hebrew Scriptures~many, many times.

Later came the kjv. James - an occultist as were newton, kant, descartes and many others (not in historical order) - hired magician and occultist John Dee to oversee the work. To this day the new age adores john Dee as a sorcerer and 'science' gives him accolades and celebrates him. Much of this project involvement is scrubbed from the net but available to research at university libraries. This first edition of the kjv is filled with masonic symbolism and continues the sorcery of the septuagint. To see but one example of the continuity of these texts, affecting every modern bible, here. https://www.septuagint-lxx.com/kjv

John Dee died before the work was even started if I'm correct, or at least died while it was being translated. Besides the first English Bible was done in 1382~The Bible in its entirety was translated into English, with John Wycliffe's translation in 1382..200 plus years earlier. Also, who cares how we got the scriptures, God is able to protect his word for his children just as he first gave it to Moses, no problem~he has used unregenerate men in the past to do his will, there are many examples in the scriptures concerning this~ Also, please consider:

Proving the King James Version

Proving the King James Version Where is scripture in 2023? We must have God's words for our faith and practice. Are they in paraphrases or the Pope's library? Do we pick and choose from the Babel of competing versions? God promised to preserve His words, and He gave rules to identify them, so

letgodbetrue.com

As to early theology, it was enthralled in the medieval period with greek philosophy (which IS greek theology) and this philosophy was viewed as science, a classical education. Newtons laws are straight out of plato. Jerome writing letters to greeks for understanding, Augustine converts to christianity because it accepts greek knowledge. Augustine's trinitate (on the trinity) text is a text of aristotelian and platonic substance theory, Augustine's genesis writings are a horror, and yet, he is elevated and makes many decisions on canon. The protestant reformation fails to examine this. Much of Augustine's theology remains in place. The reformation failed. Aquinas' summa later on: a treatise of greek theology marked as christianity, using greek exegetical method and logical structures and greek concerns as its truth by which to discuss christianity, all in response to averroes, an islamic aristotelian scholar whose theological acumen Aquinas admired.

You may very well be correct concerning Newton whom I do not accept as a true bible believer based upon what little I know of him, even though many do.

Augustine I do accept as a true man of man, mostly based upon his work later in his life, not at the beginning. Near the end of his life, Augustine of Hippo meticulously reviewed everything he had ever published. He wrote an entire catalogue of his own works, a painstakingly annotated bibliography with hundreds of revisions and amendments to correct flaws he saw in his own earlier material. The book, titled Retractationes, is powerful evidence of Augustine's humility and zeal for truth. Not one of his earlier publications escaped the more mature theologian's scrutiny. And Augustine was as bold in recanting the errors he perceived in his own work as he had been in refuting the heresies of his theological adversaries. Because he reviewed his works in chronological order, Retractationes is a wonderful memoir of Augustine's relentless, lifelong pursuit of spiritual maturity and theological precision. His forthrightness in addressing his own shortcomings is a good example of why Augustine is esteemed as a rare model of both godliness and scholarship.

I base my feelings toward him on his understanding of the scriptures~his work on Revelation 20 was way ahead of his time, a view still embraced by many of God's children including myself, I found his work after I came to the knowledge of the truth on this subject.

Augustine's genesis writings are a horror~Eve, so would some of mine concerning the book of Revelation, when I first started out fifty years ago, that I was taught by the premill followers~much like watching to a science fiction movie! Christians do get converted just as I did about three years after coming to Christ (and still am btw) Conversion is a life long cycle which most all of God children go through.

I'm just cliff noting. It's a bit much information and I do not know the extent of your desire to study it. But this gives a very rough sketch of the evil done to keep His sons today from understanding what He said!!

Eve, *I'm not going to waste precious time studying things that do not profit, the scriptures have too many truths within them to learn, and we will never be converted to the extent we could be, if we follow the philosophy of the world in seeking after their foolish wisdom.

Colossians 2:8​

“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.”

Josephus notes

Now that's one person I would never even consider trusting! A profess infidel! His works have been almost put on par with God's words and has been used to support one of the most wicked doctrines being taught today................ the 70 A.D. theory as a fulfillment of bible prophecy.

Eve, thank you for your time, time is precious. RB

 

[e v e]

Our Lord never mentioned the septuagint, which should show us what he thought of it. He always quoted the scriptures written by Hebrew prophets, written to the Jews in their own language.

It was never written. As for trusting, neither Josephus or anyone else, including augustine or james or the kjv are reliable. All the ancient texts must be cross read carefully. Not everything Josephus said is wrong, but yes I grant you, a judaizer most likely.

A number of times during His earthly ministry, Jesus responded to questions with, “It is written…” (7 times in Matthew, 4 times in Mark, 5 times in Luke, 1 time in John). In the Bible, we also read of many time when Jesus quoted the truths of God from the Hebrew Scriptures~many, many times.

The NT is also corrupted, so, I cannot simply say yes to that. The hebrew scriptures were corrupted already. Jesus was quoting What He the Father said, with no need to refer to the corrupt scroll.

John Dee died before the work was even started if I'm correct, or at least died while it was being translated.

Nevertheless he had much influence over James, fellow occultist, and the thing is full of occult symbols, plus blesses the septuagint, ptolemy's monstrosity.

Besides the first English Bible was done in 1382~The Bible in its entirety was translated into English, with John Wycliffe's translation in 1382..200 plus years earlier. Also, who cares how we got the scriptures, God is able to protect his word for his children

Yes, His words and His souls can hear Him. I do not include translations mentioned in that.

just as he first gave it to Moses, no problem~he has used unregenerate men in the past to do his will, there are many examples in the scriptures concerning this~ Also, please consider:

Proving the King James Version

Proving the King James Version Where is scripture in 2023? We must have God's words for our faith and practice. Are they in paraphrases or the Pope's library? Do we pick and choose from the Babel of competing versions? God promised to preserve His words, and He gave rules to identify them, so

letgodbetrue.com

to me, regeneration is at the Change when His sons meet Him on the clouds. All we have until then is His promise to get us out of here!

You may very well be correct concerning Newton whom I do not accept as a true bible believer based upon what little I know of him, even though many do.

yes.

Augustine I do accept as a true man of man, mostly based upon his work later in his life, not at the beginning. Near the end of his life, Augustine of Hippo meticulously reviewed everything he had ever published. He wrote an entire catalogue of his own works, a painstakingly annotated bibliography with hundreds of revisions and amendments to correct flaws he saw in his own earlier material.

Well, I am not convinced but will leave it there. Augustine did much damage and it is all still in place.

The book, titled Retractationes, is powerful evidence of Augustine's humility and zeal for truth.

Well no, it just shows that he covered his bases.

Not one of his earlier publications escaped the more mature theologian's scrutiny.

They have not been scrutinized well at all, even as I type.

And Augustine was as bold in recanting the errors he perceived in his own work as he had been in refuting the heresies of his theological adversaries. Because he reviewed his works in chronological order, Retractationes is a wonderful memoir of Augustine's relentless, lifelong pursuit of spiritual maturity and theological precision.

Those
"confessions" are awful and document how he accepted Christianity when it could be synchronized to Greek philosophy/science. See Brown's autobiography as well.

His forthrightness in addressing his own shortcomings is a good example of why Augustine is esteemed as a rare model of both godliness and scholarship.

I base my feelings toward him on his understanding of the scriptures~his work on Revelation 20 was way ahead of his time, a view still embraced by many of God's children including myself, I found his work after I came to the knowledge of the truth on this subject.

Well, in my view he got absolutely everything wrong.

Augustine's genesis writings are a horror~Eve, so would some of mine concerning the book of Revelation, when I first started out fifty years ago, that I was taught by the premill followers~much like watching to a science fiction movie! Christians do get converted just as I did about three years after coming to Christ (and still am btw) Conversion is a life long cycle which most all of God children go through.


Eve, *I'm not going to waste precious time studying things that do not profit, the scriptures have too many truths within them to learn, and we will never be converted to the extent we could be, if we follow the philosophy of the world in seeking after their foolish wisdom.

How do you know what profits?

Colossians 2:8​

“Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.”

Now that's one person I would never even consider trusting! A profess infidel! His works have been almost put on par with God's words and has been used to support one of the most wicked doctrines being taught today................ the 70 A.D. theory as a fulfillment of bible prophecy.

Eve, thank you for your time, time is precious. RB

Thank you RB.

 

[Red Baker]

Romans 9

letgodbetrue.com

 

[brightfame52]

Election refers to God’s making a choice on whom to save. It is unconditional in that there is no condition or requirements man must meet before Gods chooses to save him. This is true because Gods choice of the person occurred before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4 and when man is born into world he is dead in trespasses and sins Eph 2:1,5. So there are no conditions or requirements he can meet before God chose him to save him from his lost plight ! So election is all of grace Rom 11:5-6

Election is prior to Faith, and will result in Faith Acts 13:48

48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.

God did the ordaining, and when does God do the ordaining ? From the beginning Acts 15:18

18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world or from of old ! 7

 

[brightfame52]

Romans 9

letgodbetrue.com

Nice resource !

 

[brightfame52]

There are election of persons, we see this in the scripture:

1 Pet 1:2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

These are the blessed ones the Father chose for Himself in Christ before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4-5

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love:

5 Having predestinated us unto the adoption of children by Jesus Christ to himself, according to the good pleasure of his will,

He foreknew them because He predestinated them

In fact foreknowledge has that meaning, its the word prognōsis:
forethought, prearrangement
foreknowledge, previous determination.

Individuals are in view here from Jesus own words Matt 24:31

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Matt 24:24

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

Mark 13:20

20 And except that the Lord had shortened those days, no flesh should be saved: but for the elect's sake, whom he hath chosen, he hath shortened the days.

The word chosen here to describe the elect, its the same exact word in Eph 1:4

eklegomai:

to pick out, choose, to pick or choose out for one's self

1. choosing one out of many, i.e. Jesus choosing his disciples
2. choosing one for an office
3. of God choosing whom he judged fit to receive his favours and separated from the rest of mankind to be peculiarly his own and to be attended continually by his gracious oversight

 

[brightfame52]

1 Pet 2:4-10 shows us that Both Christ and believers are the Chosen of God

4 To whom coming, as unto a living stone, disallowed indeed of men, but chosen of God, and precious,

5 Ye also, as lively stones, are built up a spiritual house, an holy priesthood, to offer up spiritual sacrifices, acceptable to God by Jesus Christ.

6 Wherefore also it is contained in the scripture, Behold, I lay in Sion a chief corner stone, elect, precious: and he that believeth on him shall not be confounded.

7 Unto you therefore which believe he is precious: but unto them which be disobedient, the stone which the builders disallowed, the same is made the head of the corner,

8 And a stone of stumbling, and a rock of offence, even to them which stumble at the word, being disobedient: whereunto also they were appointed.

9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

10 Which in time past were not a people, but are now the people of God: which had not obtained mercy, but now have obtained mercy.



Verse 4 is speaking of Christ being Chosen of God and Vs 9 is speaking of believers who were chosen in Him, they were His seed, or generation

Now notice in Vs 9 they are called a chosen generation. That word generation means:

kindred

1. offspring
2. family

They are Christs offspring, seed or generation, Chosen in Him Eph 1:4

Yes Jesus had a offspring, seed, generation in Him Isa 53:10

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

This referring to Christ having a seed, its the hebrew word zeraʿ:

1. offspring, descendants, posterity, children

And this is His generation Ps 22:30

A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation

Now this chosen seed or generation is what Peter refers to in 1 Pet 2:9, and they were Chosen in Christ who is Gods Chosen 1 Pet 2:4 God chose them together before the foundation of the world Eph 1:4

4 According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: 9

 

[e v e]

election has been confused in theology ...

Every soul of Him has a job.

the 144k meeting Him on the clouds are the first group going Home. They have a job. The apostles had a different job. Moses had a different job.

Many more than just the 144k are going home after rapture. Longer story.

The darby rapture version is depraved, claiming only the remnant elect are to be restored to eden paradise. Wrong. This darby idea of the Change is based on lots of Huge mistakes.

 

[e v e]

another huge mistake is esau's invented concept many adopted ... the "I am already saved"...

a mess .