Doctrine of Unconditional Election

[e v e]

Its crystal clear that the scriptures teach election, even unconditional election in salvation. Most people will agree that election is taught in scripture, but very few agree that its unconditional, and totally by grace and Gods sovereign good pleasure, not outside of Himself. Even the OT scripture indicates Gods sovereign prerogative in election and having mercy on whomever He will Ex 33:19

And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy. In this discriminatory fashion God exhibits His Glory

Now Paul alludes to this scripture in his treatise on unconditional election in Rom 9:11-16

11 (For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth)

12 It was said unto her, The elder shall serve the younger.

13 As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated.

14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.

15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.

16 So then it is not of him that willeth, nor of him that runneth, but of God that sheweth mercy.

We learn that there is what Paul terms "the purpose of God according to election" This is a salvific purpose,. its answering the seeming dilema as to why so many jews in national israel are being lost Rom 9:1-6


Its from this background that Paul develops his treatise on the doctirne of unconditional election, or "the purpose of God according to election"

Now let us look at what Rom 9 tells us: By writer of godsonlygospel.com "election is just not fair.


I do differ with the author regarding his statement "The saved are those who are elected by grace through faith, "

I believe the saved are those who are elected by Grace, minus the faith, but Faith being the consequent of election by grace.

However the main point is, the elect are not elected based upon any foreseen actions or deeds , good or bad, that man has done or will do, because the election of grace was made before they were born to do any actions whatsoever, thats the Apostles point.

This treatise by Paul should forever eliminate the false idea that election is based upon anything foreseen in or of the sinner. Its totally unconditional ! Its totally of Sovereign prerogative !

it all has to do with if a soul comes from God, is an eden soul or if rather is of the foreign realm and not of Him..

there are two realms.

 

[e v e]

serpent seed cannot be saved.

 

[brightfame52]

I can't see it either. Your Calvinist lenses must severely bend/refract light for those verses to read as you say they do.

I know you cant see it either, and dont worry, its more than just you two who cant see it.

 

[Red Baker]

There is no support for Calvinism in v. 48. Jack Cottrell Acts 13:48 and Calvinism

You are so desperate that you are even willing to use a Church of Christ minister to support your theory~I know him well, and have debated some of his writings~he believes and teaches baptismal regeneration as all other Campbellites. He is just as proud of his work gospel as you are, and of a truth you both teach the same gospel, with different semantics being used.

So, in you quoting Jack Cottrell, we have the Pharisees joining hands with the Sadducees and opposing the truth.~we see this throughout the NT, nothing new under the sun. Some of the teachings of the Church of Christ are along the lines of the Sadducees, who rejected spirits, angels, and a future resurrection of our bodies~the CoC rejects God's Spirit in many areas of our life from regeneration to enlightenment, etc. You both will deserve the same condemnation of preaching another gospel, per Galatians.

Galatians 1:6-9~"I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed. As we said before, so say I now again, If any man preach any other gospel unto you than that ye have received,let him be accursed."

Galatians 5:1-4~"Stand fast therefore in the liberty wherewith Christ hath made us free, and be not entangled again with the yoke of bondage. Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace."

Modern day circumcision heretics ranges from infant baptism, water baptism for adults, to any work performed by man to any law commandment that basically preaches: "This DO and live, sin, and die".

 

[synergy]

I do not disagree that every form of religion has doctrine (s) that that will prove them to be false~no problem with me on that point. Christ's resurrection from the dead is the main jugular for our faith~for if Christ did not raise from the dead, then our faith is vain and we all will perish in our sins!

Jesus" resurrection from the dead proved that he was indeed the Son of the Living God, thus equal with God in all of his infinite attributes.

So what specifically in your view is Calvinism's Jugular? What is the main difference between Calvinism and Christianity? I see it as how Calvinism treats Soli Deo Gloria in a Zero Sum way. And you continue to skip over discussing Isaiah 6:3, Exodus 3:4, and Matt 17:2 from my previous posts.

Let civic start a new thread on this subject, and I'll come and explain the incarnate Sonship of Jesus Christ, the doctrine I know the word of God will support, the eternal Sonship is false, a doctrine promoted by the man of sin, and cannot be supported by scriptures. Some very sincere Christians have never thought through this subject, thereby, assume a position that they have always heard to be true, when in fact it was promoted by the RCC, and its Nicene Creed.


Absolutely, according to each other's role in the redemption of God's elect, per 2nd Corinthians 13:14.

There's only ONE God that is manifest as three~There's only ONE Spirit of God, not two, three, etc.; God is a Spirit, that has never changed and never will, impossible. God lives in eternity, always has, always will, that will never change, no, not never. The Word in the beginning was God, without qualifications. The Word joined himself to the tabernacle of Jesus of Nazareth, who was begotten by the power of the HIghest, thus making him ONE with his Father in his deity sharing all of the attributes of His Father. If God was his Father, and he was, that made him equal to God, even his enemies understood this blessed truth.


Jesus was the only begotten Son of God, begotten in the manner in which he was begotten according to Luke chapter one. THe only record w have of his conception by God in the womb of Mary his mother. Jesus was not eternally begotten as the Nicene Creed taught. That teaching destroys in deity as God! Jesus was a complex person, fully God, fully man, that lived in this world for around thirty three years. HIs two natures never interacted with each other, even though ever present. A mystery of godliness indeed. Later when a thread is started. You might want to do your homework on the subject of Eternal Sonship verses the Incarnate Sonship before debating the subject. Both believe in the deity of Jesus Christ, but one school of thought actually ends up making Jesus a begotten "god".

It is pure Nestorianism to say that "HIs two natures never interacted with each other, even though ever present". Your Nestorian Jugular is bleeding heresy profusely in addition to Calvinism's heretical Zero Sum view of Soli Deo Gloria.

 

[civic]

Let me say it again,

Sanctification of the Spirit and Regeneration are one.

There is progressional sanctification mentioned numerous times in scripture
Is regeneration progressive ? yes or no

“Progressive” or “experiential” sanctification, as it is sometimes called, is the effect of obedience to the Word of God in one’s life. It is the same as growing in the Lord (2 Peter 3:18) or spiritual maturity. God started the work of making us like Christ, and He is continuing it (Philippians 1:6). This type of sanctification is to be pursued by the believer earnestly (1 Peter 1:15; Hebrews 12:14) and is effected by the application of the Word (John 17:17). Progressive sanctification has in view the setting apart of believers for the purpose for which they are sent into the world: “As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world. For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified” (John 17:18–19). got?

To summarize, “sanctification” is a translation of the Greek word hagiasmos, meaning “holiness” or “a separation.” In the past, God granted us justification, a once-for-all, positional holiness in Christ. In the present, God guides us to maturity, a practical, progressive holiness. In the future, God will give us glorification, a permanent, ultimate holiness. These three phases of sanctification separate the believer from the penalty of sin (justification), the power of sin (maturity), and the presence of sin (glorification).

next...............

hope this helps !!!

 

[synergy]

There is progressional sanctification mentioned numerous times in scripture
Is regeneration progressive ? yes or no

“Progressive” or “experiential” sanctification, as it is sometimes called, is the effect of obedience to the Word of God in one’s life. It is the same as growing in the Lord (2 Peter 3:18) or spiritual maturity. God started the work of making us like Christ, and He is continuing it (Philippians 1:6). This type of sanctification is to be pursued by the believer earnestly (1 Peter 1:15; Hebrews 12:14) and is effected by the application of the Word (John 17:17). Progressive sanctification has in view the setting apart of believers for the purpose for which they are sent into the world: “As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world. For them I sanctify myself, that they too may be truly sanctified” (John 17:18–19). got?

To summarize, “sanctification” is a translation of the Greek word hagiasmos, meaning “holiness” or “a separation.” In the past, God granted us justification, a once-for-all, positional holiness in Christ. In the present, God guides us to maturity, a practical, progressive holiness. In the future, God will give us glorification, a permanent, ultimate holiness. These three phases of sanctification separate the believer from the penalty of sin (justification), the power of sin (maturity), and the presence of sin (glorification).

next...............

hope this helps !!!

It's embarrassing for Calvinists like @brightfame52 to not even understand the basics of Christianity.

 

[civic]

It's embarrassing for Calvinists like @brightfame52 to not even understand the basics of Christianity.

dogma can make one blind when one is defending the teaching of man and not scripture.

I speak from experience.

 

[civic]

I know you cant see it either, and dont worry, its more than just you two who cant see it.

1 Thess 1:4- knowing, brothers and sisters, beloved by God, His choice of you;

Original Word: ἐκλογή, ῆς, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: eklogé
Phonetic Spelling: (ek-log-ay')
Definition: a (divine) selection
Usage: a choosing out, selecting, choice (by God).

The word is used 7 times in the N.T. Most by Paul in Romans 9-11 where is contradicts the Calvinists view on election. The Jews ( Gods elect,chosen ) were not saved as Paul pleads for their salvation in Romans 9-11.

Romans 9:11 N-AFS
GRK: ἡ κατ' ἐκλογὴν πρόθεσις τοῦ
NAS: according to [His] choice would stand,
KJV: according to election might stand,
INT: the according to election purpose

Romans 11:5 N-AFS
GRK: λεῖμμα κατ' ἐκλογὴν χάριτος γέγονεν
NAS: according to [God's] gracious choice.
KJV: according to the election of grace.
INT: a remnant according to election of grace there has been

Romans 11:7 N-NFS
GRK: ἡ δὲ ἐκλογὴ ἐπέτυχεν οἱ
NAS: it has not obtained, but those who were chosen obtained
KJV: but the election hath obtained it,
INT: but [the] elect obtained [it]

Romans 11:28 N-AFS
GRK: δὲ τὴν ἐκλογὴν ἀγαπητοὶ διὰ
NAS: but from the standpoint of [God's] choice they are beloved
KJV: as touching the election, [they are] beloved
INT: however the election beloved on account of

The condition of the clay and the potter. God declares if you repent then I will not bring upon you these disasters/wrath/judgements.

Jeremiah 18
Then the word of the Lord came to me. 6 He said, “Can I not do with you, Israel, as this potter does?” declares the Lord. “Like clay in the hand of the potter, so are you in my hand, Israel. 7 If at any time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down and destroyed, 8 and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relent and not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. 9 And if at another time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be built up and planted, 10 and if it does evil in my sight and does not obey me, then I will reconsider the good I had intended to do for it.


In Romans 9 its the hardened Jew/reprobate is whom Paul prays for in their temporary hardening until all the gentiles are grafted into the branch. The potter/clay is God using the hardened Jews- His elect,chosen people ( destruction ) to bring in non elect vessels of glory ( gentiles) their salvation. The potter/clay is another analogy that contradicts calvinism, not support it. Once the glasses/lens are removed one can see the passages in their greater biblical context and harmonize them.

There are no chapters/verses in the original Greek- so here is the context below which reveals the flaws in Calvinism's soteriology.

Romans 9:30–32 - What shall we say, then? That Gentiles who did not pursue righteousness have attained it, that is, a righteousness that is by faith; 31 but that Israel who pursued a law that would lead to righteousness did not succeed in reaching that law. 32 Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as if it were based on works. They have stumbled over the stumbling stone,

Romans 10:18–21- But I ask, have they not heard? Indeed they have, for “Their voice has gone out to all the earth, and their words to the ends of the world.” 19 But I ask, did Israel not understand? First Moses says, “I will make you jealous of those who are not a nation; with a foolish nation I will make you angry.” 20 Then Isaiah is so bold as to say, “I have been found by those who did not seek me; I have shown myself to those who did not ask for me.” 21 But of Israel he says, “All day long I have held out my hands to a disobedient and contrary people.”

Romans 11:19–23-Then you will say, “Branches were broken off so that I might be grafted in.” 20 That is true. They were broken off because of their unbelief, but you stand fast through faith. So do not become proud, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, neither will he spare you. 22 Note then the kindness and the severity of God: severity toward those who have fallen, but God’s kindness to you, provided you continue in his kindness. Otherwise you too will be cut off. 23 And even they, if they do not continue in their unbelief, will be grafted in, for God has the power to graft them in again.

hope this helps !!!

 

[brightfame52]

again

Sanctification of the Spirit and Regeneration are one. and it occurs before and unto belief of the Truth and its limited to the elect, beloved chosen of the Lord 2 Thess 2:13

13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification[or regeneration] of the Spirit and belief of the truth:

 

[brightfame52]

@civic

The condition of the clay and the potter. God declares if you repent then I will not bring upon you these disasters/wrath/judgements.

Teaching Salvation by works

 

[civic]

@civic



Teaching Salvation by works

no you are teaching that nice try.

 

[brightfame52]

no you are teaching that nice try.

Teaching Salvation by works

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

no you are teaching that nice try.

no you are teaching that, nice try.

 

[civic]

Teaching Salvation by works

Yes your faith is a work

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Yes your faith is a work

And therefore grace is no longer grace.

 

[civic]

And therefore grace is no longer grace.

Yep but not in my theology

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Yep but not in my theology

Your theology is not theology. It is man-centered, so it is actually anthropology.

 

[civic]

Your theology is not theology. It is man-centered, so it is actually anthropology.

Projecting

 

[synergy]

Your theology is not theology. It is man-centered, so it is actually anthropology.

Your theology is not theology. It is Living Dead-centered, i.e.: where Calvinists claim you can be Regenerated (Alive) but not yet Believing (still Dead in Sins).