You are presenting a Strawman. Nobody becomes a believer knowing all truths. The Bible only requires that you make a willful commitment to believe and confess Jesus and you will be saved through regeneration . I strongly suggest that you stop promoting the Living Dead state of the Reformed movement. It's embarrassing for you.
Doctrine of Unconditional Election
- Thread starter brightfame52
- Start date
Again, I'm not of the Reformed movement, which only goes to show your lack of understanding of such things.
They can speak for themselves, and there are some very capable men that can do so. Pretty sure you would not want to enter into a debate with some of them.
What is Reformed Theology?
The terms Reformed or Reformation, are historical terms. What is Reformed Theology, and how does it differ from other forms of christianity? by Tony Warren
www.mountainretreatorg.net
I never said a sinner becomes a believer knowing all truth~those are your words, not mine.
That is a false doctrine~another gospel, which is not another, for there's only one gospel, that proclaims Jesus secured eternal life by his obedience and faith for God's elect.
So, you are having a sinner who God said is at enmity against him, doing spiritual acts before he is regenerated!
So, really it is folks like you that believes in lifeless zombies being able to hear, walk, see, communicate, being able ask God to give them life like he has! Strange indeed.
Putting children's games aside to a more serious note~It is impossible according to God's own testimony for those in the flesh, or their natural condition apart from regeneration by the Spirit of God to please him; to submit to him; Need proof, I'm sure you will just cast it away from you for your man made gospel, that rejects God's truth for their own gospel that exalts man's ability doing spiritual acts pleasing to God before he gives them a heart to do so.
You are calling God a liar, by holding to your gospel of works and also you are denying what Jesus secured for his people by his obedience and faith in God. This should concern you.
Ezekiel 11:19~And I will give them one heart, and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh, and will give them an heart of flesh:
Again:
No man can or will submit to God until God gives them a new heart to do so! God gives them a heart so that they CAN please, obey, serve, and follow him.
But your zombie according to you can hear, believe, repent, and do spiritual acts pleasing to God without God giving them a heart to do so!
I never said you were. If I discuss Alien life forms, does that automatically mean that you are an alien life form?
I was in innumerable debates with Calvinists at CARM for several years. They called me everything derogatory imaginable because I consistently proved them wrong Biblically and they just couldn't stand it.
The fact remains that the Reformed movement is a total mess and who is there to clean it up?
Bible verse(s) please. Personal viewpoints do not qualify as God's word. Sorry.
Nope. I'm having a sinner whose heart is contrite and in that way God promises to never despise him. (Psalms 51:17)
It's your TD error that is causing you to misjudge the common man as a zombie. I judge man as perfectly capable of hearing the Gospel for those who are sincere and willing to do so. See Rom 10:9.
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
It's you who casts away Rom 10:17 that says that faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. Carry on with your man made gospel.
Permit me to introduce you to James 2:24:
24 You see then that a man is justified by works, and not by faith only.
Wonderful verse that perfectly aligns with the fact that Faith precedes Regeneration.
Personal viewpoints do not qualify as God's word. Sorry.
You're the one who calls the common person a zombie, not me. You sound terribly confused.
Read Rom 10:8-17 and enlighten yourself on what the Bible says a common person can do.
I see that you persist in believing that Regeneration precedes Belief, which means that there is a time when you are regenerated (alive) but not yet believing (still dead in sin) - a living dead person in other words. By your very own words, they are unwittingly promoting a Religion of Zombies.
Once again, I'm not of the Reformed community of believers~that being said, there are certain men among them who are very capable of defending some of the doctrines of grace, men that you could not stand toe to toe with, based upon what I have read from your pitiful posts.
Whether or not you proved them wrong, I do not know, since I was not there, but, I'm here, and I see not one thing that would lead me to believe you did what you claim you did.
I'm coming back and address your post above~stay with me, and see if you can defend your gospel based on man's works.
I welcome your challenge whole-heartedly. Iron sharpens iron and I hope you're up to the task.
Keep your remarks brief, concise, and directed to the subject discussed. Any form of tangential verbosity will be thrown out.
synergy~the avenues I could take to prove this truth are numerous. I ever labor not to interject my personal beliefs, my beliefs are founded upon thus saith the Lord God. I for one provided scriptures, generally more than folks like you are willing to address. We shall see. Are you ready to defend your teachings? Let us see.
A few questions for you to answer. Why are Christians commanded to rejoice? Because spirits are subject unto us? Because we have decided to follow Jesus? Because we are not like other men, blinded by lust, love of power and the deceitfulness of riches? etc., etc. No, because our names are written in heaven.
WHERE ARE OUR NAMES WRITTEN IN HEAVEN?
Paul also blessed fellow laborers with their names in the Book of Life (Philippians 4:3). In the Book of Life, which is the determining factor for eternal destiny (Revelation 20:11-15).WHAT IS IT CALLED?
It is called The Book of Life of the Lamb Slain, which is descriptive (Revelation 13:8). It is the Book of Life, for every one whose name is in it shall have everlasting life. Please take note: It is the Book of Life of the Lamb, for it was His work to secure life for all those in it. It is the Book of Life of the Lamb slain, for the purchase price of it was His own life. If you find problems with what I'm saying then prove me wrong at any point.WHOSE BOOK IS IT?
It is the Lamb’s Book of Life, and it is the only entrance into heaven (Rev 21:27). Jesus Christ of Nazareth is the Lamb of God, Who took away our sins (John 1:29,36). Jesus Christ as the Lamb of God was given power to give eternal life (John 17:1-5) to those given to him from his Father.Please consider thsi next point carefully: He is the Mighty One chosen of the people for God’s great work of grace (Ps 89:19). He is the One Mediator between God and men to be testified in due time (I Tim 2:5-6). The Lamb of God is no inferior or weak title, for He is also King of kings (Rev 6:16; 17:14).
WHAT IS IN IT?
Names, my brethren – the personal names of each of God’s elect (Luke 10:20; Phil 4:3). These names are also engraved on the palms of his faithful hands (Isaiah 49:13-17). He has known each of us from eternity, for He has foreknown us (Rom 8:29; Mat 7:23). But there are no names of angels, for the angels were preserved, not saved (Ist Tim 5:21). But there are no names of devils, for they are reserved for destruction (Jude 1:6). Therefore they desire to see these glorious blessings upon mere men (Ist Peter 1:10-12).WHOSE NAMES ARE IN IT?
The names of God’s elect are in the Book of Life (Daniel 12:1 cp Matthew 24:21-22). The names of the entire church and general assembly of all the elect (Hebrews 12:23). Some of Paul’s faithful friends and fellow laborers were written in it (Philippians 4:3). Again, every one of the children given by God to Jesus Christ for Him to save (Hebrews 2:13).HOW WERE THE NAMES CHOSEN?
It was by the unconditional grace and will of God to bestow mercy (Ro 9:15; Ex 33:19). The great God chose us in Christ by the good pleasure of His will and grace (Ep 1:3-6). Do not just disagree, prove where we are wrong with scriptures of your own.WHEN WERE THEY WRITTEN THERE?
The names were written there from the foundation of the world (Revelation 13:8; 17:8). It is wrong to say “the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world” from this text, for by comparison we can see that this is confusing prepositional phrases. Jesus was only foreordained to be slain before the foundation of the world, but He was not truly slain until His incarnation and death on the cross (Ist Peter 1:20). The prepositional phrase “from the foundation of the world” modifies the verb “written,” rather than the noun phrase “lamb slain.” We know this by comparing the two texts and when the Lamb was truly slain. For the time given for election was before the foundation of the world (Eph 1:4). His great purpose and promise were made before creation (2nd Tim 1:9; Tit 1:2). Psalm 87:6 is not the book of life by the timing of its writing and its context (Eze 13:9). Malachi 3:16 is the book of remembrance written for Divine favor upon the faithful.They were not written down during an invitation or soul winner’s prayer, for it is far too late and far too cheap a price for inclusion in this book. The song “A New Name in Glory” by C. Austin Miles in 1905 is pure heresy by Scripture.
We have a ways to go in answering your post and answer we shall. More alter...
Let me continue asking you questions, if answered scripturally, will prove our point, so that it would be impossible for any work monger to answer with his gospel based on his own good works in obtaining and maintaining his salvation from sin and condemnation. More on the book of life of the Lamb.
I'm going down another avenue when I post next time. We have given you several scriptures in support of what we are saying, more than you most likely will proof check, but, I would to Gdo you would.
IS THE BOOK OF REVELATION 5 THE BOOK OF LIFE?
Yes. For the signifying of realities in heaven show great similarities between them. It is filled so full it is written on the backside, which shows the subject is the everlasting covenant of grace, including the beneficiaries (5:1 cp Ist Cor 2:9; 2nd Cor 9:15; Eph 3:8). The seven seals of judgments are against the enemies of the elect (5:1 cp 5:9-11). It was the Lamb’s book, for He only was worthy to take and open it (5:2-7 cp 21:27). It is the “book of life of the lamb slain,” so a “lamb as it had been slain” (5:6,9 cp 13:8). John wept that no man could open it, which makes it much more than just judgments. The song and blessings that immediately break forth are of redemption and salvation to the Lamb, which are indicative of the blessings of the Book of Life (5:9-14). It obviously includes more than just names, for it is the everlasting covenant of God; but it also includes the names of all the beneficiaries, as do all wills and covenants.WHAT IS THE PRICE OF THE BOOK?
The price of the book was the lifeblood of the Son of God – Jesus Christ our Saviour. We are redeemed out of the earth by His precious blood (Ist Peter 1:18-20; Rev 5:9). Creation waited for our Jesus to ascend into heaven and offer His blood (Heb 9:14). So, if the price is his blood, then then it cannot be both his life and our good works, it is either, or.WHO CAN OPEN THE BOOK?
As we see clearly in Revelation 5:2-5, only the Lion of the tribe of Judah could do so. The Owner, Who paid the full purchase price of His Own precious blood, and no other~which includes his obedience and life of perfect faith~you cannot separate them, impossible, and neither can you add to them. For your information, no Pope, apostle, pastor, or parent can even approach this glorious throne (Ps 49:6-9). Jesus is the Way, Truth, and Life; and there is no other Saviour (John 14:6; Acts 4:12), but the Son of God in whom God was well pleased with~sinners are only accepted on his behalf standing as their surety before God. Do you have a problem with this? Your doctrine does.WHAT ARE THE BENEFITS OF THE BOOK?
Deliverance from Satan and coming judgment (Matt 12:28-29; Col 2:14-15; Hebrews 2:14; Ist John 3:8; Rev 12:10-11; Ist Thess 1:10; Heb 9:27-28; Rev 20:11-15). Eternal life – which God has commanded and promised to us (Psalm 133:3; Titus 1:2). New body – which by His Divine power will be like His glorious body (Phil 3:21). Inheriting all things (Rev 21:8,27). Time would fail us to properly consider adoption, atonement, forgiveness, justification, pardon, propitiation, reconciliation, redemption, sanctification, and glorification.I'm going down another avenue when I post next time. We have given you several scriptures in support of what we are saying, more than you most likely will proof check, but, I would to Gdo you would.
brightfame52
Well-known member
In Paul's Epistle to the Romans, he dauntlessly declared eternal unconditional election, and counters the objections of his opposers.
Rom 9:11-13 "For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God, according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; it was said unto her, the elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated."
The opposers are now ready to charge God with being unfair and unrighteous Rom 9:14-15
14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
To be at odds with unconditional election is to be at odds with revealed Gospel Truth ! 4
Rom 9:11-13 "For the children being not yet born, neither having done any good or evil, that the purpose of God, according to election might stand, not of works, but of him that calleth; it was said unto her, the elder shall serve the younger. As it is written, Jacob have I loved, but Esau have I hated."
The opposers are now ready to charge God with being unfair and unrighteous Rom 9:14-15
14 What shall we say then? Is there unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
To be at odds with unconditional election is to be at odds with revealed Gospel Truth ! 4
There are only two ways to obtain eternal life~God's way or Satan's counterfeit. Either God freely impart eternal life as a free and unconditional gift, or man must perform certain conditions of faith, or works to obtain God free gift of eternal life. If man must do anything, then God's grace ceases to be grace and it becomes of works performed by a sinner, thus man becomes his own saviour, religious financing becomes determines eternal destiny, and Satan has robbed Jesus Christ of his glory!
Introduction into another avenue for us to prove that salvation from sin and condemnation is 100% unconditional, not 95%, but 100% of pure grace, according to Romans 11:
When the consummation of all things come to an end and the last stone of God's spiritual temple is lay (finished) there shall be shouts of grace just as it was when the first stone was laid in the OT temple~for God's grace was 100% the determining factor in bringing many sons to glory.
How are sinners saved? Does God save them by free grace? Or do they help to save themselves by some act? Or are they commanded to do something to cooperate with God and make Jesus Christ’s work effective for them?
There are only two ways a sinner can be saved. Either God saves him unconditionally as a free gift of His grace, or he must do something in order to obtain it for himself.
There is no other choice. All religions and doctrines are either unconditional or conditional. Either man does nothing for his salvation, or he must do something.
If you were to send $100 to the most effective missionary or soul winner you know, could you possibly get another name in the book of life? Or is that work done only by God in Jesus Christ?
Some require baptism; others require church membership; some require sacraments; and others require parts of Moses’ law. While another party requires only faith and a decision.
Yet all five of these popular ideas are the same. They all require sinful man to do something to save himself, even if it is only requiring him to believe and confess some salvation formula, as we see on taking place on SLB broadcasting, Jimmy Swaggart's TV network.
In all five cases, the determining factor for heaven or the lake of fire is what each man does. If that is the case, then man is his own saviour; and his eternal destiny is based on his choice and action.
God’s gift of salvation is entirely different. He gives it out of His free and sovereign grace, and He will receive all the glory for it.
If we require conditions for salvation, then we make God a debtor; and He is not in debt to man!
Eternal life is unconditional, for God gave it as a free gift to His elect, whom He chose for salvation before the world began. It originated in the mind and purpose of God, and He performs all the operations of grace to accomplish it. Man is entirely passive in the gift of eternal life.
Faith and obedience are the results of this gracious salvation, not conditions for it in any way whatsoever. They are the evidence of eternal life, not the means or instrument to obtain it.
This study will look at seven proofs establishing this fact beyond any doubt. All plans of salvation requiring some action from the sinner are horribly wrong, for eternal life is a free gift of God’s grace through Jesus Christ without any conditions of any kind.
Introduction into another avenue for us to prove that salvation from sin and condemnation is 100% unconditional, not 95%, but 100% of pure grace, according to Romans 11:
Salvation from sin and condemnation is of pure grace without any mixture of..... "this DO and live, sin and die"...... the pure language of the law of works speaking.
When the consummation of all things come to an end and the last stone of God's spiritual temple is lay (finished) there shall be shouts of grace just as it was when the first stone was laid in the OT temple~for God's grace was 100% the determining factor in bringing many sons to glory.
See Gill's notes: https://www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/gills-exposition-of-the-bible/zechariah-4-7.html
How are sinners saved? Does God save them by free grace? Or do they help to save themselves by some act? Or are they commanded to do something to cooperate with God and make Jesus Christ’s work effective for them?
There are only two ways a sinner can be saved. Either God saves him unconditionally as a free gift of His grace, or he must do something in order to obtain it for himself.
There is no other choice. All religions and doctrines are either unconditional or conditional. Either man does nothing for his salvation, or he must do something.
If you were to send $100 to the most effective missionary or soul winner you know, could you possibly get another name in the book of life? Or is that work done only by God in Jesus Christ?
Some require baptism; others require church membership; some require sacraments; and others require parts of Moses’ law. While another party requires only faith and a decision.
Yet all five of these popular ideas are the same. They all require sinful man to do something to save himself, even if it is only requiring him to believe and confess some salvation formula, as we see on taking place on SLB broadcasting, Jimmy Swaggart's TV network.
In all five cases, the determining factor for heaven or the lake of fire is what each man does. If that is the case, then man is his own saviour; and his eternal destiny is based on his choice and action.
God’s gift of salvation is entirely different. He gives it out of His free and sovereign grace, and He will receive all the glory for it.
If we require conditions for salvation, then we make God a debtor; and He is not in debt to man!
Eternal life is unconditional, for God gave it as a free gift to His elect, whom He chose for salvation before the world began. It originated in the mind and purpose of God, and He performs all the operations of grace to accomplish it. Man is entirely passive in the gift of eternal life.
Faith and obedience are the results of this gracious salvation, not conditions for it in any way whatsoever. They are the evidence of eternal life, not the means or instrument to obtain it.
This study will look at seven proofs establishing this fact beyond any doubt. All plans of salvation requiring some action from the sinner are horribly wrong, for eternal life is a free gift of God’s grace through Jesus Christ without any conditions of any kind.
Proof #1 of 7
Man has no natural desire or ability to obey or please God for salvation.Every person is conceived with a nature at war against God and the things of God. Human affections and desires are so ruined by Adam’s sin that men hate God and rebel against His commandments. Though man has not lost his faculties of reasoning, his ability/power to perceive and appreciate the things of God is so corrupted by sin that he resents and despises them. He has no affection or fear of God and is directed entirely by selfish ambitions toward sin. He will not and cannot humble himself and seek God, for his nature is totally corrupt and at war against Him. It is impossible for him to obey or please God for eternal life, for he is dead and would never do it. Romans 3:9-18
God told Adam he would die, if he ate the fruit (Gen 2:17). He ate it anyway, and he died that day. Though he lived physically for 930 years (Gen 5:5), his soul died in affection toward God, just as he had been warned. After sinning, he hid from God and blamed Eve for his sin, rather than repent and beg for mercy (Gen 3:8, 3:12). He was dead toward God and righteousness.
Teaching that man can choose to believe or obey God is the same lie Satan told Eve. Though God promised death for eating the fruit, Satan told Eve she would not die (Gen 3:4). But they both died that day, and men are still spiritually dead today. It is a satanic lie that man is alive and able to choose God by his free will. He is spiritually dead toward God.
Adam generated children like himself – spiritually dead (Genesis 5:3). And so we are all spiritually dead by natural conception (Eph 2:1; Col 2:13). We may be alive physically, but our souls are dead toward God and instinctively seek sin and obey Satan (Eph 2:2-3; Tit 3:3).
We are enmity against God; (not just an enemy, which is bad enough, but at war against God) we will not seek God; sinners do not fear God (Rom 8:7; 3:11, 3:18). They will not and cannot please God (Rom 8:7-8). Sinners cannot see His kingdom or hear His words (John 3:3; 8:43, 8:47). The things of God, even presented by the Holy Spirit, are foolish to our depraved minds; we cannot discern or know them; and we will not receive them (Ist Cor 2:14).
Man naturally hates God and fights against His Spirit (Gal 5:17). Void of faith toward God (Ps 10:4; 2nd Thess 3:2; 2nd Cor 4:3-4), he will not and cannot please Him (Heb 11:6; Rom 14:23).
Rehabilitation will not improve man’s desire or ability (Is 26:10; Luke 16:31), for he is dead. Rehab only works for the living, and man is dead: he doesn’t need therapy, he needs life. He doesn’t need medication; he needs resurrection. He doesn’t need a doctor; he needs a Creator.
When planning salvation, God saw man’s lack of desire and ability. He looked down from heaven to see if any understood and desired Him, but He found none, no, not one! (Ps 14:1-3; 53:1-3; Rom 3:9-18). So He designed salvation without conditions, for no man could perform any.
Proof #2 of 7
God expressly denies man’s will or works in obtaining salvation.The Bible clearly rejects man’s decisions or actions in obtaining eternal life. God gives salvation as a free gift without any conditions or qualifications, and it is His will that determines eternal life, not the will of the sinner. His eternal counsel and choice is the basis for eternal life. And in order for salvation to be by grace, man cannot have any role in it; or grace would no longer be grace, and man would put God in a position of debt. Proven above. Man’s will and efforts are totally excluded.
God plainly denies man’s will or efforts in salvation (John 1:13; Rom 9:16). These two texts are enough for those who tremble at God’s word. They are plain, powerful, and conclusive. Yet the first is generally ignored when corrupting John 1:12, and the second is quite unknown to most men.
God also clearly denies man’s works in his own salvation (Rom 4:6; 9:11; Eph 2:9; 2nd Tim 1:9; Tit 3:5). If man’s works were included, God would be in debt to man; and He is not (Rom 4:4). If they were included, man would have reason to boast; but God does not allow it (Eph 2:9). If they were included, grace would no longer mean grace, for grace excludes works per the testimony of Paul. (Rom 11:6).
God saves men while they are dead in sins, not while they are willing or working (Rom 5:6-10; Eph 2:1- 5). He saves them while they are enemies, not while they are friends seeking Him. Salvation is a free gift, so God is never repaying man (Rom 5:18; 6:23; 4:4; 11:35).
Only God’s will is the only active will in the giving of eternal life (John 3:8; 5:21; Eph 1:5; Rom 9:15; James 1:18; Heb 10:9-10). God’s glorious will is altogether sovereign, and man can no more direct it than he can direct the wind. To steal this prerogative from God and give it to man is blasphemy. God’s mercy and predestinating purpose are based in His Own will, not in the will of man. His will and choice and decision are the basis for salvation, not that of dead rebel sinners.
Even faith is considered a work, part of the law, and a commandment (John 6:28-29; Matt 23:23; Ist John 3:23). And eternal life is not by works, the law, or commandments (Tit 3:5; Gal 2:21; 5:4; Rom 3:19). The only faith Scripture allows is faith trusting the God Who justifies the ungodly, which is very different from believing God justifies the faithful (Rom 4:5). Faith is only an evidence of eternal life, not a condition or means for it.
For those who believe eternal life is conditioned upon man’s faith, they must answer whether this faith is with or without works. Synergy, this is your chance. Without works, it is no more than a devil’s faith and worth nothing (James 2:19); with works, it contradicts all the verses rejecting works (Tit 3:5). Synergy you must also explain how man obtains faith, since before regeneration he has none (Ps 10:4). You have a major problem to deal with, your friends might need to help out, but will or can they offer any help, I do not think so. You are on the wrong side of this debate, and it is only going to get harder and harder for you since God will offer no help to those seeking righteousness by their own works of the flesh.
Proof #3 of 7
Faith and works are results of salvation, not conditions or means for it.Spiritual desire, ability, and action toward God are results of eternal life, not conditions for it. Eternal life includes the ability to know and please God, and this order is not to be reversed. Without God’s saving intervention, men would continue on in their natural condition ~ enemies of God and servants of sin. Faith and works are compatible and necessary, not to the obtaining of eternal life, but rather to the evidence of it. Faith and works prove God has already saved us. John 5:24
Since man is spiritually dead and depraved by nature, it is only by God’s glorious power we are brought to desire and obey Him (Ps 110:3; Phil 2:13). The desire to love and fear God results from this saving change worked in us by His might (Ps 65:4; Rom 8:15; Jer 32:39-40).
Until a man is born again, he cannot even see the kingdom of God (John 3:3); therefore any sight or desire of the kingdom of God is an evidence of regeneration, not a condition for it. Regeneration brings with it a hearing ear and the ability and desire to know Him (Pr 20:12; John 8:47; 17:2-3).
Salvation prepares us for good works; it is not because of good works (Eph 2:10; 4:24; Tit 2:14).
Faith itself is the gift of God in salvation secured by Jesus Christ~Ephesians 2:8; for without His gracious giving of faith, on the behalf of Christ, we would never have it (Gal 5:22; Ist Cor 12:3; Rom 8:14; 12:3; Acts 18:27; 2nd Pet 1:1). It is the fruit and evidence of His Spirit in our lives, without which we would never have it or sustain it.
It took the same power that resurrected Jesus from the grave to give us faith and cause us to believe (Eph 1:19), for by nature we are God-haters and truth-rejecters, as we have shown, and will continue to prove.
Faith and works are the evidence of salvation, therefore they cannot be conditions, means, or instruments of salvation (Acts 10:34-35; I John 2:29; 3:7, 3:14; 4:7; 5:1, 5:4).
Proof #4 of 7
Jesus Christ saves sinners by Himself without any human cooperation.There is only one Saviour – Jesus Christ of Nazareth, and He does not share His glory. He came into this world to save sinners, and He did so by His substitutionary obedience and death for His people. No one else could or would assist Him. He is the Second Adam and legal representative of the elect. He fulfilled the righteousness of God perfectly, and He bore the wrath of God completely for them. He justified, reconciled, and sanctified them to God, without the help of any man. His one offering perfected them forever, and He ever lives to intercede for them. Romans 5:12-19
Adam was the federal head and covenant representative of all men in Eden. His sin condemned them as sinners and brought death and eternal judgment upon them all (Romans 5:12-14). Our own sins are only secondary and result from his sin, for God had chosen him as our legal representative – and he failed miserably and condemned us all to death and judgment.
If a person never hears and/or rejects the Bible history of Adam, it does not matter – he is still guilty for Adam’s sin and condemned to death and eternal judgment. If a person were not to sin himself, it does not matter – he is still guilty for Adam’s sin and stands condemned before God.
Jesus Christ is the Second Adam. He was the federal head and covenant representative for His people ~ God’s elect. His perfect obedience and sacrificial death were applied to their accounts, and thus He saved them by Himself. His singular obedience made the elect righteous, just as Adam’s singular disobedience made them sinners (Rom 5:15-19). All in Adam – by natural conception – die; and all that are in Christ – by election of pure grace ~ shall live (Ist Cor 15:22; Ist Pet 1:2).
We cannot add to this legal transaction ~ Jesus saved us by Himself. Hallelujah! All the singing in heaven will be to the glory of the Lamb, for no other man had any part in redeeming our souls (Rev 5:1- 14). There is only one soul winner in heaven – Jesus the Saviour. Men here may deceive themselves and others as soul winners, but Jesus obtained eternal life for us by Himself. Synergy, why would you desire to fight against this glorious truth, is beyond me, apart from knowing the pride in man's heart of desiring to have a part in his salvation, and thinking he's not as wicked as the scriptures declares that man is.
The new and everlasting covenant, with all its spiritual blessings and benefits, is in force by means of the Testator’s death (Heb 9:11-17). We cannot and do not put it in force ourselves, for we were written in the Lamb’s Book of Life as beneficiaries before the world began (Rev 17:8). Thank you blessed God that this is so.
Jesus Christ purged sins away by Himself in one solitary act of obedience (Heb 1:3; 10:9-14). No wonder He cried on the cross of Calvary, “It is finished!” (John 19:30). And to add anything to His finished work is to attempt to destroy (for attempt is all man can do!) the whole message of the gospel (Gal 2:21; 5:4; I Cor 1:30-31).
As surely as Mary had a son named Jesus, He saved His people from their sins (Matt 1:21); and there is salvation in no other name (Acts 4:12). He is the only way to the Father (John 14:6). And we come only through his faith and obedience, nothing in our hands we bring, simply to the cross we trust fully in!
Proof #5 of 7
The gospel and its ordinances were never intended to give eternal life.Man is spiritually dead and hates God, so He must powerfully intervene to save him. The gospel is merely good news and cannot do this, for man finds it foolish and despises it, and the Bible rejects his will and works in salvation. The gospel and ordinances educate and comfort the elect – who were saved fully and infallibly by Jesus alone. The gospel no more helps dead sinners than news of the cure for cancer helps in a cemetery. It reveals and displays God’s wisdom and power in salvation, but preaching this news to dead sinners cannot regenerate or justify them. Only the elect ever appreciate it, and then only for knowledge and comfort. Baptism and the Lord’s Supper are figurative ordinances to symbolize salvation obtained by Jesus Christ alone. The gospel does not bring life, it only manifes where there could be life, it will bring life to light when preached faithfully. 2nd Timothy 1:9,10
Men have long tried to make ceremonial religion their saviour, rather than humble themselves before a holy and sovereign God. Adam and Eve tried fig leaves to cover their guilt and shame; Israel hauled the Ark of the Covenant into battle; they worshipped the brass serpent of Moses; and they trusted foolishly in their temple (Gen 3:7; I Sam 4:3; 2nd Kings 18:4; Jer 7:4).
Rome and her Protestant daughters have taken this vanity to new depths with their sacramental religion. All seven sacraments of Rome and the two sacraments of Protestants are contrary to the Bible, for there was never saving efficacy or sanctifying power in New Testament ordinances.
The ordinances were delivered to churches of saints, not to the unsaved (Ist Cor 11:1-2). Baptism is a figure and likeness of salvation by Christ’s death and resurrection, not the means of salvation (Ist Pet 3:21; Rom 6:5). The Lord’s Supper is a memorial of Christ’s death, not the application of it (Ist Cor 11:26). Both of them simply witness Jesus Christ and salvation by Him (Ist John 5:6-8).
The gospel is not the means of salvation, but the good news of it to those already saved (Ist Cor 1:18, 22- 24). It cannot help the lost, for it is foolishness to them (2nd Cor 4:3-4; Ist Cor 2:14; Luke 16:31; John 8:43, 8:47). Preaching the gospel to them proves their condemnation (2nd Cor 2:15-16).
Salvation takes God’s creative power to overcome the depraved and spiritually dead nature of sinful man and give him a new heart (Eph 1:19-20; 2:5-7, 2:10; James 1:18). The gospel cannot do this, for it is only news of God’s great salvation in Jesus Christ.
The gospel brings eternal life to light, but it does not bring life as we said above~(2nd Tim 1:10). Believing the gospel is the result of salvation, not the means or condition of it (Acts 13:48; I John 4:15; 5:1).
Paul preached in synagogues, where men already feared God and trusted the Scriptures (Acts 17:2). He prayed for deliverance from men who were not already saved (2nd Thess 3:1-2). And this is why he wanted to preach the gospel to the faithful saints at Rome (Rom 1:8-15).
I'll finish later.... the Lord willing....RB
The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
Amen. I'm reminded of a Genesis passage that would fit free-will.
4 “You are not spiritually dead,” the serpent said to the free-willer. 5 “For God knows that you can choose of your own free will, which means you are like God, knowing how to choose good over evil.”
Proof #6 of 7
The Bible gives examples of sinners saved without any conditions.Since God saves sinners unconditionally by His own sovereign wisdom and power in Jesus Christ, and the gospel and its ordinances are only for the education and comfort of the elect, then there should be examples of such cases in the Bible. And there are many. The previous proofs and the following examples solve the perpetual questions men have had about infants, idiots, and the heathen. Salvation is by God’s grace alone, and it can easily reach every class of man in every situation. The examples to follow cover every man and thus are comforts for our souls.
We have already shown in the previous five proofs that God’s elect are saved fully and infallibly without conditions. But let us add to these proofs with specific examples of such from the Bible.
What about John the Baptist? He leaped for joy in his mother’s womb at the presence of Jesus, and he did so by the Holy Ghost (Luke 1:15, 44). Joy is a fruit of the Spirit and an evidence of eternal life, so we know John was regenerated before he was born of his mother. (Gal 5:22; Rom 8:14-15; I Pet 1:8).
What about Cornelius? He feared God, which no unsaved man does (Rom 3:18); and he gave alms and prayed acceptably to God (Acts 10:1-4). And this was true before hearing the gospel or being baptized. Peter revealed by the Spirit he was already accepted with God (Acts 10:34-35).
What about Lot? He loved Sodom more than righteousness, and he ended up incestuously with his daughters in a cave (Gen 13:12; Gen 19:14, 16, 20, 36). Yet we are taught by the Spirit Lot was a just and righteous man, saved by the glorious grace of God by Christ’s obedience (2nd Pet 2:7-9)~certainly not by any works of righteousness Lot performed.
What about the rich young ruler? Though he chose his riches over Christ, Jesus loved him; and he went away sorrowful – two marks of a man with eternal life (Mark 10:17-27). Jesus hates the wicked (Ps 5:5; Matt 7:23); and only spiritual men desire to follow Christ. Riches are a strong obstacle to obedience; but salvation by an omnipotent God is easy even in such cases.
What about Israel in the wilderness? They ate and drank spiritually of Jesus Christ, which is to have eternal life (Ist Cor 10:1-4); but they were disobedient and rebellious (Ist Cor 10:5). Yet God chose them, chastened them, called them children, and loved them (Deu 7:6-8; 8:5; 14:1; 33:1-3).
What about blinded Israel? Paul declares that a portion of elect Israel was blinded to the gospel, so that though they were enemies of the gospel, they were beloved in election (Rom 11:25-32).
What about infants? There is no doctrine of salvation on earth that consistently and Scripturally provides for infants, except the truth of unconditional salvation. Since eternal life is entirely by God’s grace in Jesus Christ, dying elect infants are saved the same way as all other sinners~the same is true of idiots and heathrens~only unconditional election of grace provides for such people.
Proof #7 of 7 with a conclusion to follow.
Unconditional salvation is the only doctrine giving God all the glory.Eternal life entirely by grace without human conditions gives God an infinite and undivided measure of glory. Any conditional system of salvation, even those requiring only faith, make man the determiner of his own destiny – and thus his own savior. But there will be no sharing of glory in heaven, for Jesus Christ will receive it all. The wicked do not perish, because they failed to do what the righteous did, but rather because Jesus Christ did not do for them what He did for the righteous. Salvation is of the Lord, and this fact cannot be modified or compromised.
If a mere offer requires conditions, then it is a reward and not a free gift; then the Giver is in debt to the one meeting the conditions (Rom 4:4); then it is of works rather than grace (Rom 11:6); then the Giver is robbed of glory by the one performing (Ist Cor 1:26-31). Only by eliminating all conditions does God get all the glory (Eph 2:9; Rom 11:33-36; I Cor 4:7; Titus 3:4-7).
The true God is Jealous, and He will not share His glory (Ex 34:14; Is 42:8). He has so designed salvation to give Himself all the glory (Ist Cor 1:26-31; Rom 2:29; 9:23; Eph 2:7).
God created all things – even the wicked for the day of evil ~ for Himself and His own pleasure (Prov 16:4; Rev 4:11). He did not create us for our pleasure, and then helped us out of our sins. He was not surprised by sin in Eden at all, for it was all part of His purpose to glorify Himself. If you do not like this truth, then you have a problem, take it up with God at the day of judgement.
Salvation is not remedial to deliver damned sinners God pitied, but rather revelatory of His glorious nature by the judgment of the wicked and the deliverance of the elect (Rom 9:14-24). He chose to display His wrath and power in the one category and His glorious riches in the other.
Many talk and sing about salvation by grace, but only unconditional eternal life is truly gracious; for if we add conditions to His grace, then sinners choose their own salvation. The difference between eternal life and perishing is not man’s choice at all, but God’s (Ist Thess 1:2-4; 2nd Thess 2:13).
God based salvation on His own will in predestination for His own glory (Eph 1:5-6, 11-12). He has mercy on whom He chooses, without regard for man’s will or efforts (Rom 9:15-16). This is the truth of the word of God.
If God wanted all men saved and sent Jesus to die for them, based on their compliance, then two things are true – He is the most frustrated Being and His work effectively accomplished nothing.
Jesus victoriously saved His people from their sins without losing one (Matt 1:21; John 6:39), and the elect know He saved them exclusively by Himself (Rev 5:1-14; Heb 2:13; Rev 6:10).
There is only one soul winner in heaven – Jesus Christ, the Son of God. All glory to the Lamb of God.
