Runningman
Well-known member
So Lord God Almighty died? Who resurrected God?
󠅤 The Lord sent Jesus Christ
- Thread starter Runningman
- Start date
atpollard
Well-known member
Strangely, there is some confusion in scripture about that:
John 10:17-18 [ESV] For this reason the Father loves me, because I lay down my life that I may take it up again. No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord. I have authority to lay it down, and I have authority to take it up again. This charge I have received from my Father."
- Jesus
Romans 8:9-11 [ESV] You, however, are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Anyone who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to him. But if Christ is in you, although the body is dead because of sin, the Spirit is life because of righteousness. If the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, he who raised Christ Jesus from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit who dwells in you.
- Spirit
Romans 6:4 [ESV] We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.
Galatians 1:1 [ESV] Paul, an apostle--not from men nor through man, but through Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised him from the dead--
- Father
Act 4:10 [ESV] let it be known to all of you and to all the people of Israel that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified, whom God raised from the dead--by him this man is standing before you well.
Ephesians 1:15-20 [ESV] For this reason, because I have heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love toward all the saints, I do not cease to give thanks for you, remembering you in my prayers, that the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give you the Spirit of wisdom and of revelation in the knowledge of him, having the eyes of your hearts enlightened, that you may know what is the hope to which he has called you, what are the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints, and what is the immeasurable greatness of his power toward us who believe, according to the working of his great might that he worked in Christ when he raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places,
- God
Peterlag
Well-known member
I never cared for the Catholic doctrine or the philosophy of its protestant sisters.
There's no teaching on the trinity anywhere in the Bible. No whole paragraph or chapter teaching that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. It seems it would have been clearly stated in the Bible and in the earliest Christian creeds if the doctrine of the Trinity was genuine and central to Christian belief and especially if belief in it was necessary for salvation as many Trinitarians teach. God gave the Scriptures to the Jewish people, and the Jewish religion and worship that comes from that revelation does not contain any reference to or teachings about a triune God. Surely the Jewish people were qualified to read and understand it, but they never saw the doctrine of the Trinity.
101G
Well-known member
Died from the flesh. no blood, meaning the NEW CREATION, and all who is BORN again are NEW CREATURES IN HIM, for he is the FIRSTFRUIT of the NEW CREATION. and a NEW BODY follows .... at his coming. now scripture, James 2:26 "For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also."
ok Runningman, tell us who or what died....... the BODY or the Spirit. (smile). you should have know this. that's basic bible truth there.
in much GL
101G.
Peterlag
Well-known member
Now there's a good question. Did Jesus have the spirit on him like the Prophets of Old or born within him like the Christian? God put the holy spirit upon Jesus immediately after he was baptized by John the Baptist because Jesus himself needed God’s gift of the holy spirit to have supernatural power just as the leaders and prophets of the Old Testament did. This fulfilled the Old Testament prophecies that God would put the holy spirit upon the Messiah enabling him in his ministry. The gift of the holy spirit was born “in” believers (John 14:17) after the Day of Pentecost rather than resting “upon” them and this is one reason why Christians are said to be “born again” of God’s spirit (1Peter 1:3, 23). Christians have spiritual power when they receive the gift of the holy spirit (Acts 1:8) because the holy spirit is born in them and becomes part of their very nature, and this is why Christians are called God’s “holy ones” which is usually translated as “saints” in the New Testament.
God put His gift of the “holy spirit” or the “spirit” on as many people as He deemed necessary in the Old Testament, and we see this when we look at how God took the spirit that was upon Moses and put it upon the70 elders of Israel. However, today everyone who makes Jesus Christ their Lord receives the indwelling gift of the holy spirit and that's why Peter on the Day of Pentecost quoted the prophecy in Joel that said God would “pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh." Many scholars admit the concept of the Trinity that also includes reference to the "Holy Spirit” as an independent “Person” cannot be found in the Old Testament. The Jews to whom the Old Testament was given did not recognize any such being. It's a well-known historical fact that “Hear, O Israel! Yahweh is our God, Yahweh alone,” was the cry of Israel. No verse or context openly states or even directly infers that there is a separate “Person” called “the Holy Spirit."
Almost every English version translates John 14:17 similarly to “even the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it neither sees him nor knows him.” Translators capitalize “Spirit” and use “he” and “him” because of their theology. The Greek word “spirit” is neuter and the text could also be translated as “the spirit of truth” and paired with “which” and“it.” The New American Bible reads “which the world cannot accept, because it neither sees nor knows it.” Capitalizing the “H” and “S” and using the English pronoun “He” is appropriate when God is being referred to as “the Holy Spirit.” However, when we see the “h” and “s” having the lowercase such as "the holy spirit" and all the pronouns referring to that spirit being impersonal such as “it” and “which” is when the subject under discussion is the gift of God’s nature.
One of the ways we know that “pneuma hagion”often refers to the gift of God’s nature is that it “belongs” to God, who calls it “my” spirit. The spirit is called “God’s” spirit in many verses and King David understood the holy spirit belonged to God because he wrote “…do not take your holy spirit from me.” The Bible shows us that “the holy spirit” is under God’s authority and direction, which makes sense when we understand it's the gift of His nature that He gives to believers. The words “Messiah” in Hebrew (mashiyach מָשִׁיחַ) and “Christ” in Greek (christosΧριστός) both mean “anointed one.” Thus, the early Christians would have known him as “Jesus the anointed one.” God “anointed” Jesus Christ with the holy spirit and that's why Jesus was said to have been “anointed” even though people knew he had never been formally anointed with oil (Acts 4:27;10:38).
atpollard
Well-known member
If you quoted a scripture among all your unfounded opinions denying scripture, I must have blinked and missed it.
However, I am certain that your “taint so” made no effort to address the point of my post and any of the specific claims about WHO raised Christ in all of the verses that I quoted: Jesus did, the Spirit did, the Father did and God did.
So WHO raised Jesus?
According to SCRIPTURE (which I value, even if you don’t), it was GOD (Father, Jesus, Spirit). [verses provided and underlined for emphasis, but ignored by those who choose not to see].
101G
Well-known member
Now back to my brother @Peterlag,
you must not have read my post for a discussion on the "saviour" in the bible. or maybe you didn't want to go first, after 101G gave you the floor. either way no problem.
Here is the misunderstanding, and errors on the unitarian behalf. those deliverance, or salvation was physical salvation from a physical oppression, and, or, bondage. This also was the great misconception of the Jews in our Lord’s day. they was expecting physical deliverance from Rome oppression, instead of a spiritual deliverance from their own sins. then, as today, the unitarian misconception is in the same error. the Jews was always looking for physical deliverance when the root cause of their physical bondage, or oppression was a spiritual condition called sin. and this circle of people sinning, and God putting them in bondage continue until God put an end to sin. (the coming of Christ, God shared in flesh as a man). so the answer was to delivered them spiritually so that they would not be physically bound, or oppressed anymore. For when the Son make you free, you’re free indeed. Notice this being set free, is not the same as being made free. simply put, if God deliver you spiritually, its once and for all, you want be physically bound, or oppressed anymore. you will never have to be again delivered physically anymore. Because spiritual bondage, (SIN), causes physical bondage, (and because his seed remain in us we are FREE and not in the bondage of sin).
If one would just look at the book of Judges. every time the children of Israel disobeyed, (spiritually), meaning they sinned against God. God allowed other nations to oppress them, or put them in bondage. and when they cried out, God would raise up “a” human to deliver, or save them from their physical bondage, and oppressor. when Jesus, our Lord, came they was looking for physical deliverance from their physical oppressor as before. they was looking for the same old cycle, and routine. they sin, and God would put them in bondage. they cry out, he would send a deliverer. that’s why the law was change, and why he put an end to sin, at the cross. but this time God himself came in the likeness of a human saviour, and delivered them Spiritually, putting an end to sin.
knowing this, can a human man fight against a spiritual enemy to deliver a people?, the answer is a resounding NO. only a human can fight against another human to overcome another human. but one need the Spirit of God to fight, or overcome another spirit, (if one is in the flesh and in sin). that’s the FAILURE of the unitarian doctrine, or their believe. you can’t fight a spirit with human flesh. Satan is an spirit, Hebrews 1:7 "And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire”. That like coming to a gunfight with a knife. you will lose every time. one need the most powerful Spirit to overcome a spirit that have power. yes Satan have, or had power.
and here he is, GOD ALMIGHTY. IN FLESH as a MAN. Matthew 26:26 "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body. 27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins”. that word remission, is the Greek word, G859 ἄφεσις aphesis (af'-es-is) n. it means, freedom, pardon, deliverance, forgiveness, liberty. WAIT A MINUTE, liberty?, yes, scripture, 2 Corinthians 3:17 "Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty”. LIBERTY is in the Spirit, and not in a man. so the notion of our Lord Jesus as being a mere human man is nonsense. Jesus our God came in the LIKNESS of human flesh to deliver us, save us. he, God took part, and was not a partaker of human nature. TOOK PART IS NOT THE SAME AS PARTAKE, Will the REAL SAVIOUR STAND UP. Isaiah 43:10 "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am “he”: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. 11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour”. notice two things here. as we have already stated, the small case “s” in saviour, and the “a” as the only saviour. “and beside me there is no saviour”. that means only one saviour. here, our Lord and God is referring to himself in flesh and blood as in the likeness of a human man, in spirit, (because he was
G2758 κενόω kenoo (ke-no-ō') v. 1. to make empty.) hence the small letter "s" in saviour, as a MAN. notice what God said in Isaiah 60:16 "Thou shalt also suck the milk of the Gentiles, and shalt suck the breast of kings: and thou shalt know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob”.
Here God is telling us that it will be him that saves. lest see God himself as SAVIOUR. Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you”. so I ask, who is coming?. Answer, GOD. But did not the scriptures say that he sent his Son?. John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved”. Wait a minute, hold the press. God sent?. I thought God was coming according to Isaiah 35:4. So what’s going on here, is this a contradiction?. lets clear up the smoke. read Isaiah 35:4 again, and pay careful attention to the latter part of the verse. "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you”. Did you see it?. If not here it is. The scripture stated that “he” will come. What’s the big deal here. If one would notice , the verse say that “God” will come, and it said, “even God”. but at the end of the scripture it said, “he” will come and save you. now the revelation of the God's diversity, or ECHAD. All through out the verse it said, God, even God is coming. But when it gets to the end of the scripture, it changes from God to says “he” will come and save you. why not say “God” will come and save you. just as it say “God” will come, even “God” at the beginning of the verse. what’s the revelation? it’s the “he”, who is God, but in diverse manner, meaning in flesh, bone, with blood as a MAN. for it is the BLOOD that makes atonement. but God is a Spirit, and the Lord Jesus is that Spirit. then how are we to explain this, man, this Christ is God in flesh?. answer, ECHAD/“diversity”. scripture, Philippians 2:6 as we have already establish. here the word form, mean nature. “for God is a Spirit”, (see John 4:24a). 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men”, again, the word form, means nature, and that nature was shared in flesh & bone with blood. he, (God) took part in the nature of the servant, which is flesh, bone and blood, (human). verse 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross”. that’s our answer, “And being found in fashion as a man”. so it was our God, who is Lord, (NOTICE, SHARED), in human flesh and blood, (the virgin birth of a body for God to come in as the equal share of himself). who came as a child, a son, an offspring, as the prophet Isaiah said, 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace”. that’s why we see “he” will save you in Isaiah 35:4. he is that child, he is that son, the ECHAD/diversity of God as a MAN.... Human "saviour". Luke 2:11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord”. notice the capital “S” in saviour, and the “a” meaning the one and only Saviour. so with this capitalization of Saviour here, we know that it is God. but notice the second half of the verse. “which is Christ the Lord”. this clearly shows that God, (LORD), O.T. is God in the flesh, (Lord), N.T. just as Thomas said, John 20:28 "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God”. Just as David did in Psalms 110:1. notice the capital “M” in My Lord?. this is FACE to FACE, person to person. the Lord, God, in flesh and bone, is now seen, and heard, and can be touched. can we back this up in scripture?, yes, 1 John 1:1 "That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life”. there we have it. John said, “That which was from the beginning”. question what was that from the beginning?, answer, Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters”. that’s what was from the beginning, “the Spirit”. the LORD, all caps is God without flesh, without bone and without blood. and now, the Lord is God, the same Spirit in flesh and blood, (diversified, meaning “a” in spirit, shared, of God, the ECHAD). note the scripture states, Genesis 1:2 “OF” God, meaning an offshoot, a BRANCH, or offspring of God IN FLESH, hence “SON”, as a man. or as the old testament prophet Zechariah said, the man that is my “fellow”, or the “another”. listen, Zechariah 13:7 "Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones”. the man that is MY FELLOW. what is the Spirit saying here? it is God himself in another, (allos) Fashion, or FORM, (FLESH). Isaiah 52:10 "The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God”. Isaiah 40:10 "Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him”. did one see it?. notice the verse said, “the Lord GOD will come”. the Lord........... GOD?. who is the one who is coming?. the Lord is GOD. NOT THE "LORD" GOD, but the "Lord" God, meaning God in Flesh. for the "Lord" Jesus said, John 13:13 "Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am." This verse complements Isaiah 65:4. it say his arm shall rule for him. this arm is the “he” in Isaiah 35:4, and revealed in Isaiah chapter 53. Jesus the Christ is to rule. “he” Jesus the Christ, the ECHAD/diversity of God is the fulfillment of God own will. why?, because “he” is GOD in flesh, as an offspring, who came to do the will of his Father/LORD/Spirit. just as Isaiah 40:10 stated, he is God in flesh as a man, (the ECHAD/diversity). the flesh is the Son of God, (that which was born). and the ECHAD/diversified spirit is the Son of man, (spirit, small case). as a man, yes a mighty man, supportive scripture, Isaiah 42:13 "The LORD shall go forth as a mighty man, he shall stir up jealousy like a man of war: he shall cry, yea, roar; “he” shall prevail against his enemies”. when did “he”, God, the ECHAD/diversified spirit come as a man?. Scripture, Matthew 1:21 "And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for “he” shall save his people from their sins”. this “he” again, is the “he” of Isaiah 35:4. So the unitarian got it wrong as to a human agent for God when it’s God himself that came.
as in Isaiah 63:4 when God said that there was no one to help. “For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come. 5 And I looked, and there was none to help; and I wondered that there was none to uphold: therefore mine own arm brought salvation unto me; and my fury, it upheld me”. so no one, (as a human), was found worthy to save. this is the vision that John saw in revelation chapter 5, listen. Revelation 5:1 "And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals. 2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof? 3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. (there it is, no man was worthy). 4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. 5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof”. hold it, the root of David is God. and he, God, promised David that “he” God would sit on his, “David”, throne. but wait a minute, is not God a Spirit?. so how can God, being Spirit set on David throne. dose not Jeremiah 23:23 & 24 states, "Am I a God at hand, saith the LORD, and not a God afar off? 24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the LORD. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the LORD”. I ask, how can a God who fill heaven and earth sit on a natural throne?. Lets get the scripture for this throne, and he that sit on it. Psalms 132:11 "The LORD hath sworn in truth unto David; he will not turn from it; Of the fruit of thy body will I set upon thy throne”. so if God, who is Spirit will sit upon David throne, how is he, God, going to do that?. Answer, by making a body to dwell in. Supportive scripture, Hebrews 10:5 "Wherefore when “he” cometh into the world, “he” saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me”. Again the “he” is God, who came, just as Isaiah 35:4 clearly stated, God, even God, “he” will come and save you. So the “he” that is come is God, the the ECHAD of God, or his “diversified” spirit/the Last/Son/Lord. remember, spirit, “s” in small case, signifying a man, FLESH, BONE, AND WITH / BLOOD. Listen, Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour”. Notice the small case “s” in saviour. But notice the all capital “LORD”. This is the ECHAD/diversity of God, the “he” in Isaiah 35:4, the Saviour in Matthew 1:21, this is the ECHAD/diversity of Isaiah 9:6 when it said, (a) son is given. this is the ECHAD/diversity in Hebrews 1:8 that declares the Son as GOD, (IN FLESH), "Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom”. this is the ECHAD/diversity, that “he” that laid in the beginning the foundation of the earth is called “Lord” which, Hebrews 1:10 states. "And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands”. Did you see it?, in verse 8 “he” the Son is called, God, and in verse 10, “he”, the Son is called Lord. Here in these verses is our foundation scripture, Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD”. The word Lord in the new testament is the same word LORD in the old testament. When God spoke Prophetically in the old testament by the prophets. “he”, God, without FLESH, BONE, and without BLOOD was speaking of future events. lets see this ECHAD/diversity plainly. Psalms 110:1 "A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool”. The Lord is the LORD in FLESH, BONE, but without BLOOD. The Lord signify the Spirit in flesh. While LORD signify the Spirit without FLESH AND BONE, notice without BLOOD. LORD, all caps, signify the Spirit without flesh, without bone, and without blood. this is a fundamental truth throughout the bible. even in the first man, Adam, when God made the woman from the man, he had no blood. question, what was made of the woman from the man? Answer flesh and bone, but what was missing? answer BLOOD. Lets check the record. Genesis 2:21 "And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; 22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. 23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man”. Question?, where is the BLOOD?. there is None, only when man fell into sin was blood given a temporary LIFE.
so, only God could save man from his SINS. this is the failure of the unitarians doctrine. not a "saviour" from physical bondage, but a "saviour" from spiritual bondage.
in much GL
101G.
you must not have read my post for a discussion on the "saviour" in the bible. or maybe you didn't want to go first, after 101G gave you the floor. either way no problem.
"The Unitarians Doctrine Corrected"
The Unitarian belief, and their doctrine. their belief is that our Lord Jesus the Christ is just a human man who God chose to deliver, or save his people, and later glorified him. notice two things in the books of Isaiah & Luke accounts. the small case “s” in saviour, (indicating a human). Isaiah 43:11. and the “a” as in one who is doing the saving in Luke 2:11. In combining these things, this is signifying a human agent of God as the Unitarian believe, and not God himself as Saviour. but notice the capitalization of the “S” in Saviour here in Luke 2:11. "For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord”. this is not signifying a human saviour. but the divine God himself, in human form. lets look at some examples of “a” human saviour to support this belief of the unitarian. And from this view, then we can see their mistake in that it's God who save, and why. 2 Kings 13:3 "And the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he delivered them into the hand of Hazael king of Syria, and into the hand of Benhadad the son of Hazael, all their days. 4 And Jehoahaz besought the LORD, and the LORD hearkened unto him: for he saw the oppression of Israel, because the king of Syria oppressed them. 5 And the LORD gave Israel a saviour, so that they went out from under the hand of the Syrians: and the children of Israel dwelt in their tents, as beforetime”. This human saviour who delivered, or save Israel from Hazael king of Syria, and Benhadad the son of Hazael was the son of Jehoahaz, Joash, see 2Ki 13:25. So God used a human man as “a” saviour from oppression. And we know that God used Moses, a human man, to deliver, or save the children of Israel from the Egyptians oppression. as well as the woman Deborah, or any of the human judges who God raised up as saviours. Lets look at this agents, or human saviour clearly, Nehemiah 9:27 "Therefore thou deliveredst them into the hand of their enemies, who vexed them: and in the time of their trouble, when they cried unto thee, thou heardest them from heaven; and according to thy manifold mercies thou gavest them saviours, who saved them out of the hand of their enemies”. so clearly we see that God used men, human men or women, be it male or female, as a saviour.Here is the misunderstanding, and errors on the unitarian behalf. those deliverance, or salvation was physical salvation from a physical oppression, and, or, bondage. This also was the great misconception of the Jews in our Lord’s day. they was expecting physical deliverance from Rome oppression, instead of a spiritual deliverance from their own sins. then, as today, the unitarian misconception is in the same error. the Jews was always looking for physical deliverance when the root cause of their physical bondage, or oppression was a spiritual condition called sin. and this circle of people sinning, and God putting them in bondage continue until God put an end to sin. (the coming of Christ, God shared in flesh as a man). so the answer was to delivered them spiritually so that they would not be physically bound, or oppressed anymore. For when the Son make you free, you’re free indeed. Notice this being set free, is not the same as being made free. simply put, if God deliver you spiritually, its once and for all, you want be physically bound, or oppressed anymore. you will never have to be again delivered physically anymore. Because spiritual bondage, (SIN), causes physical bondage, (and because his seed remain in us we are FREE and not in the bondage of sin).
If one would just look at the book of Judges. every time the children of Israel disobeyed, (spiritually), meaning they sinned against God. God allowed other nations to oppress them, or put them in bondage. and when they cried out, God would raise up “a” human to deliver, or save them from their physical bondage, and oppressor. when Jesus, our Lord, came they was looking for physical deliverance from their physical oppressor as before. they was looking for the same old cycle, and routine. they sin, and God would put them in bondage. they cry out, he would send a deliverer. that’s why the law was change, and why he put an end to sin, at the cross. but this time God himself came in the likeness of a human saviour, and delivered them Spiritually, putting an end to sin.
knowing this, can a human man fight against a spiritual enemy to deliver a people?, the answer is a resounding NO. only a human can fight against another human to overcome another human. but one need the Spirit of God to fight, or overcome another spirit, (if one is in the flesh and in sin). that’s the FAILURE of the unitarian doctrine, or their believe. you can’t fight a spirit with human flesh. Satan is an spirit, Hebrews 1:7 "And of the angels he saith, Who maketh his angels spirits, and his ministers a flame of fire”. That like coming to a gunfight with a knife. you will lose every time. one need the most powerful Spirit to overcome a spirit that have power. yes Satan have, or had power.
and here he is, GOD ALMIGHTY. IN FLESH as a MAN. Matthew 26:26 "And as they were eating, Jesus took bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and gave it to the disciples, and said, Take, eat; this is my body. 27 And he took the cup, and gave thanks, and gave it to them, saying, Drink ye all of it; 28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many for the remission of sins”. that word remission, is the Greek word, G859 ἄφεσις aphesis (af'-es-is) n. it means, freedom, pardon, deliverance, forgiveness, liberty. WAIT A MINUTE, liberty?, yes, scripture, 2 Corinthians 3:17 "Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty”. LIBERTY is in the Spirit, and not in a man. so the notion of our Lord Jesus as being a mere human man is nonsense. Jesus our God came in the LIKNESS of human flesh to deliver us, save us. he, God took part, and was not a partaker of human nature. TOOK PART IS NOT THE SAME AS PARTAKE, Will the REAL SAVIOUR STAND UP. Isaiah 43:10 "Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am “he”: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. 11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour”. notice two things here. as we have already stated, the small case “s” in saviour, and the “a” as the only saviour. “and beside me there is no saviour”. that means only one saviour. here, our Lord and God is referring to himself in flesh and blood as in the likeness of a human man, in spirit, (because he was
G2758 κενόω kenoo (ke-no-ō') v. 1. to make empty.) hence the small letter "s" in saviour, as a MAN. notice what God said in Isaiah 60:16 "Thou shalt also suck the milk of the Gentiles, and shalt suck the breast of kings: and thou shalt know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob”.
Here God is telling us that it will be him that saves. lest see God himself as SAVIOUR. Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you”. so I ask, who is coming?. Answer, GOD. But did not the scriptures say that he sent his Son?. John 3:16 "For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life. 17 For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved”. Wait a minute, hold the press. God sent?. I thought God was coming according to Isaiah 35:4. So what’s going on here, is this a contradiction?. lets clear up the smoke. read Isaiah 35:4 again, and pay careful attention to the latter part of the verse. "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you”. Did you see it?. If not here it is. The scripture stated that “he” will come. What’s the big deal here. If one would notice , the verse say that “God” will come, and it said, “even God”. but at the end of the scripture it said, “he” will come and save you. now the revelation of the God's diversity, or ECHAD. All through out the verse it said, God, even God is coming. But when it gets to the end of the scripture, it changes from God to says “he” will come and save you. why not say “God” will come and save you. just as it say “God” will come, even “God” at the beginning of the verse. what’s the revelation? it’s the “he”, who is God, but in diverse manner, meaning in flesh, bone, with blood as a MAN. for it is the BLOOD that makes atonement. but God is a Spirit, and the Lord Jesus is that Spirit. then how are we to explain this, man, this Christ is God in flesh?. answer, ECHAD/“diversity”. scripture, Philippians 2:6 as we have already establish. here the word form, mean nature. “for God is a Spirit”, (see John 4:24a). 7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men”, again, the word form, means nature, and that nature was shared in flesh & bone with blood. he, (God) took part in the nature of the servant, which is flesh, bone and blood, (human). verse 8 And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross”. that’s our answer, “And being found in fashion as a man”. so it was our God, who is Lord, (NOTICE, SHARED), in human flesh and blood, (the virgin birth of a body for God to come in as the equal share of himself). who came as a child, a son, an offspring, as the prophet Isaiah said, 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace”. that’s why we see “he” will save you in Isaiah 35:4. he is that child, he is that son, the ECHAD/diversity of God as a MAN.... Human "saviour". Luke 2:11 For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord”. notice the capital “S” in saviour, and the “a” meaning the one and only Saviour. so with this capitalization of Saviour here, we know that it is God. but notice the second half of the verse. “which is Christ the Lord”. this clearly shows that God, (LORD), O.T. is God in the flesh, (Lord), N.T. just as Thomas said, John 20:28 "And Thomas answered and said unto him, My Lord and my God”. Just as David did in Psalms 110:1. notice the capital “M” in My Lord?. this is FACE to FACE, person to person. the Lord, God, in flesh and bone, is now seen, and heard, and can be touched. can we back this up in scripture?, yes, 1 John 1:1 "That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, of the Word of life”. there we have it. John said, “That which was from the beginning”. question what was that from the beginning?, answer, Genesis 1:1 "In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters”. that’s what was from the beginning, “the Spirit”. the LORD, all caps is God without flesh, without bone and without blood. and now, the Lord is God, the same Spirit in flesh and blood, (diversified, meaning “a” in spirit, shared, of God, the ECHAD). note the scripture states, Genesis 1:2 “OF” God, meaning an offshoot, a BRANCH, or offspring of God IN FLESH, hence “SON”, as a man. or as the old testament prophet Zechariah said, the man that is my “fellow”, or the “another”. listen, Zechariah 13:7 "Awake, O sword, against my shepherd, and against the man that is my fellow, saith the LORD of hosts: smite the shepherd, and the sheep shall be scattered: and I will turn mine hand upon the little ones”. the man that is MY FELLOW. what is the Spirit saying here? it is God himself in another, (allos) Fashion, or FORM, (FLESH). Isaiah 52:10 "The LORD hath made bare his holy arm in the eyes of all the nations; and all the ends of the earth shall see the salvation of our God”. Isaiah 40:10 "Behold, the Lord GOD will come with strong hand, and his arm shall rule for him: behold, his reward is with him, and his work before him”. did one see it?. notice the verse said, “the Lord GOD will come”. the Lord........... GOD?. who is the one who is coming?. the Lord is GOD. NOT THE "LORD" GOD, but the "Lord" God, meaning God in Flesh. for the "Lord" Jesus said, John 13:13 "Ye call me Master and Lord: and ye say well; for so I am." This verse complements Isaiah 65:4. it say his arm shall rule for him. this arm is the “he” in Isaiah 35:4, and revealed in Isaiah chapter 53. Jesus the Christ is to rule. “he” Jesus the Christ, the ECHAD/diversity of God is the fulfillment of God own will. why?, because “he” is GOD in flesh, as an offspring, who came to do the will of his Father/LORD/Spirit. just as Isaiah 40:10 stated, he is God in flesh as a man, (the ECHAD/diversity). the flesh is the Son of God, (that which was born). and the ECHAD/diversified spirit is the Son of man, (spirit, small case). as a man, yes a mighty man, supportive scripture, Isaiah 42:13 "The LORD shall go forth as a mighty man, he shall stir up jealousy like a man of war: he shall cry, yea, roar; “he” shall prevail against his enemies”. when did “he”, God, the ECHAD/diversified spirit come as a man?. Scripture, Matthew 1:21 "And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for “he” shall save his people from their sins”. this “he” again, is the “he” of Isaiah 35:4. So the unitarian got it wrong as to a human agent for God when it’s God himself that came.
as in Isaiah 63:4 when God said that there was no one to help. “For the day of vengeance is in mine heart, and the year of my redeemed is come. 5 And I looked, and there was none to help; and I wondered that there was none to uphold: therefore mine own arm brought salvation unto me; and my fury, it upheld me”. so no one, (as a human), was found worthy to save. this is the vision that John saw in revelation chapter 5, listen. Revelation 5:1 "And I saw in the right hand of him that sat on the throne a book written within and on the backside, sealed with seven seals. 2 And I saw a strong angel proclaiming with a loud voice, Who is worthy to open the book, and to loose the seals thereof? 3 And no man in heaven, nor in earth, neither under the earth, was able to open the book, neither to look thereon. (there it is, no man was worthy). 4 And I wept much, because no man was found worthy to open and to read the book, neither to look thereon. 5 And one of the elders saith unto me, Weep not: behold, the Lion of the tribe of Juda, the Root of David, hath prevailed to open the book, and to loose the seven seals thereof”. hold it, the root of David is God. and he, God, promised David that “he” God would sit on his, “David”, throne. but wait a minute, is not God a Spirit?. so how can God, being Spirit set on David throne. dose not Jeremiah 23:23 & 24 states, "Am I a God at hand, saith the LORD, and not a God afar off? 24 Can any hide himself in secret places that I shall not see him? saith the LORD. Do not I fill heaven and earth? saith the LORD”. I ask, how can a God who fill heaven and earth sit on a natural throne?. Lets get the scripture for this throne, and he that sit on it. Psalms 132:11 "The LORD hath sworn in truth unto David; he will not turn from it; Of the fruit of thy body will I set upon thy throne”. so if God, who is Spirit will sit upon David throne, how is he, God, going to do that?. Answer, by making a body to dwell in. Supportive scripture, Hebrews 10:5 "Wherefore when “he” cometh into the world, “he” saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me”. Again the “he” is God, who came, just as Isaiah 35:4 clearly stated, God, even God, “he” will come and save you. So the “he” that is come is God, the the ECHAD of God, or his “diversified” spirit/the Last/Son/Lord. remember, spirit, “s” in small case, signifying a man, FLESH, BONE, AND WITH / BLOOD. Listen, Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour”. Notice the small case “s” in saviour. But notice the all capital “LORD”. This is the ECHAD/diversity of God, the “he” in Isaiah 35:4, the Saviour in Matthew 1:21, this is the ECHAD/diversity of Isaiah 9:6 when it said, (a) son is given. this is the ECHAD/diversity in Hebrews 1:8 that declares the Son as GOD, (IN FLESH), "Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom”. this is the ECHAD/diversity, that “he” that laid in the beginning the foundation of the earth is called “Lord” which, Hebrews 1:10 states. "And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands”. Did you see it?, in verse 8 “he” the Son is called, God, and in verse 10, “he”, the Son is called Lord. Here in these verses is our foundation scripture, Deuteronomy 6:4 "Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD”. The word Lord in the new testament is the same word LORD in the old testament. When God spoke Prophetically in the old testament by the prophets. “he”, God, without FLESH, BONE, and without BLOOD was speaking of future events. lets see this ECHAD/diversity plainly. Psalms 110:1 "A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool”. The Lord is the LORD in FLESH, BONE, but without BLOOD. The Lord signify the Spirit in flesh. While LORD signify the Spirit without FLESH AND BONE, notice without BLOOD. LORD, all caps, signify the Spirit without flesh, without bone, and without blood. this is a fundamental truth throughout the bible. even in the first man, Adam, when God made the woman from the man, he had no blood. question, what was made of the woman from the man? Answer flesh and bone, but what was missing? answer BLOOD. Lets check the record. Genesis 2:21 "And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof; 22 And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. 23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man”. Question?, where is the BLOOD?. there is None, only when man fell into sin was blood given a temporary LIFE.
so, only God could save man from his SINS. this is the failure of the unitarians doctrine. not a "saviour" from physical bondage, but a "saviour" from spiritual bondage.
in much GL
101G.
101G
Well-known member
another ERROR of the day for you, spirits are not BORN, but "GIVEN. no flesh and blood woman birth a spirit. spirits are GIVEN. scripture, Isaiah 42:5 "Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein:" Pete you should have known this. that's basic bible knowledge.
another ERROR on your part. LISTEN CAREFULLY, Philippians 2:6 "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:" Philippians 2:7 "But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:" Philippians 2:8 "And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross."
Pete, Pete, the Lord Jesus was in a G2758 κενόω kenoo (ke-no-ō') v. .... STATE, 1. to make empty. this is why he was anointed/EMPOWERED at his baptism..... my God Pete, please read the POST above.
in much GL.
101G
Peterlag
Well-known member
Philippians 2:6 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should confess or believe that Jesus is God. From the Septuagint and their other writings, the Jews were familiar with morphē referring to the outward appearance, including the form of men and idols. To the Greeks, it also referred to the outward appearance, including the changing outward appearance of their gods and the form of statues. The only other New Testament use of morphē outside Philippians is in Mark, and there it refers to the outward appearance. Also, the words related to morphē clearly refer to an outward manifestation or appearance. The word morphē refers to an outward appearance or manifestation. Jesus Christ was in the outward appearance of God, so much so that he said, “He who has seen me has seen the Father.” Christ always did the Father’s will, and perfectly represented his Father in every way.
Peterlag
Well-known member
I saw it but I don't do Revelation
Peterlag
Well-known member
There's no trinity or teaching that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. Now how do I find a Scripture saying there's no trinity? There were no cars when Jesus walked the earth. And that's why there's no Scripture saying there are no cars because there were no cars. But if you want Scripture on who raised Jesus from the dead. Perhaps this will help...
atpollard
Well-known member
More “no scripture” empty opinions, I see.
“Talk to the hand.”
Runningman
Well-known member
That doesn't mean Jesus acted to resurrect himself. The kind of authority that Jesus was referring to the lay down his life and take it up again was of the passive variety in which God was going to resurrected Jesus. I guess there is at least a dozen places around the New Testament where Jesus isn't even have said to have resurrected himself once. Therefore God didn't die. First and Last doesn't mean someone is God.
Peterlag
Well-known member
There's no Scripture that says there's no trinity because there's no trinity. But now if you want Scripture on Jesus being the son of God. Then that we can do. Here's 10 verses...
The Bible says Jesus is an “heir” of God (Hebrew 1:2), and a “joint-heir” with us (Romans 8:17). But if Christ is a co-eternal “Person” in the “Godhead” then he cannot be an heir “of God” because being God would put him into a position to be a full owner of everything and that would mean there would be nothing he could “inherit” which is why Jesus cannot be God and an heir of God at the same time. The Bible says that Jesus Christ is the “image of God” Colossians 1:15; 2 Corinthians 4:4). If Christ is the image of God, then he cannot be God because a person cannot be himself and an image of himself at the same time. Jesus can be called the “image” of God because he always did the will of God, and because he was the image of God is why he could say you had seen the Father if you had seen him.
Ephesians 4:4-6 says there is one God and one Lord and one spirit. This verse teaches exactly what the Jews expected based on the Old Testament and what Jesus, Peter, Paul, and others taught: that there was one God, one Lord, and one spirit of God. 1 Corinthians 8:6 says “for us there is one God, the Father… and one Lord, Jesus Christ.” This simple and straightforward language elucidates that the Father is God and the Son is “Lord” making a clear differentiation between the two.
Jesus said: “…the Father is greater than I” (John 14:28). In contrast, the orthodox formula of the Trinity says the Father and the Son are “co-equal.” God is greater than Christ, just as Christ is greater than we are. 1 Corinthians 3:23 says “And ye are Christ’s; and Christ is God’s.” When the Bible says “you are Christ’s” it's saying “you belong to Christ” and many English versions say exactly that (i.e., CJB; HCSB; NASB; NET; NJB; NLT). So the verse is saying “and you belong to Christ; and Christ belongs to God” (NASB). It seems apparent that Jesus cannot be God and belong to God at the same time.
101G
Well-known member
GINOLJC, to all
your first ERROR of this day. Philippians 2:6 & 7 is also a teaching on Jesus is God, and God "ALONE", in the ECHAD of First and Last. and two 101G careless about Jews or the trinity. and no, G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') is inward form/Nature, and 3446. morphósis is outward Nature.
G3444 μορφή morphe (mor-fee') n.
1. form.
2. (intrinsically) fundamental nature.
[perhaps from the base of G3313 (through the idea of adjustment of parts)]
KJV: form
Root(s): G3313
See also: G3445, G3446, G4832
WHAT IS THE FUNDAMENTAL NATURE OF GOD? answer, Spirit, (see John 4:24a)
G3446 μόρφωσις morphosis (mor'-fō-sis) n.
1. formation.
2. (by implication) , appearance (semblance or (concretely) formula).
[from G3445]
KJV: form
Root(s): G3445
let 101G add one more so that you don't get confused.
G4976 σχῆμα schema (schee'-ma) n.
1. a figure (as a mode or circumstance).
2. (by implication) external condition.
[from the alternate of G2192]
KJV: fashion
Root(s): G2192
Pete you should have KNOWN this.
and there is the NATURE that is not NATURAL FLESH.... Mark 16:12 "After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country." ANOTHER FORM? NOT THE natural flesh, g2087 heteros expresses a qualitative difference and denotes "another of a different sort. (SMILE) .LOL, LOL, LOL, Oh my when will they ever learn.
Pete, Pete, do what Hebrews 5:12 say to do. "For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat." Hebrews 5:13 "For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe." Hebrews 5:14 "But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil."
in much GL.
101G
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101G
Well-known member
did you ... (smile) ... SAW the rest of the post? .........
YIKES!Hebrews 5:12 "For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat." Hebrews 5:13 "For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe." Hebrews 5:14 "But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil."
unitarianism is nothing but a dressed-up Pharisees belief that has gone astray ........ meaning LOST from reality.
in MUCH GL.
101G.
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Peterlag
Well-known member
Speaking of milk and strong meat. I have noticed we graduate from all the other subjects be it accounting, mechanics or dentistry. We study the books and complete the course that brings us to the required accomplished task which is the ability to know how to do something. We study a map to learn how to get someplace. Thus, our study ends with us able to get from point A to point B, fix a tooth, balance the financial numbers or build the car. How come we spend our entire lives studying the Bible and yet nobody seems to graduate?did you ... (smile) ... SAW the rest of the post? .........
Hebrews 5:12 "For when for the time ye ought to be teachers, ye have need that one teach you again which be the first principles of the oracles of God; and are become such as have need of milk, and not of strong meat." Hebrews 5:13 "For every one that useth milk is unskilful in the word of righteousness: for he is a babe." Hebrews 5:14 "But strong meat belongeth to them that are of full age, even those who by reason of use have their senses exercised to discern both good and evil."
unitarianism is nothing but a dressed-up Pharisees belief that has gone astray ........ meaning LOST form reality.
in MUCH GL.
101G.
101G
Well-known member
because one do not graduate from GOD, it a course of "EVER LEARNING, meaning one can STUDY all of the bible, but GOD must be REVEALED unto you. and there is no END to God....... got it now. so if one seek a diploma, or a degree, just keep on studying.......
in much GL.
101G
Peterlag
Well-known member
I graduated.because one do not graduate from GOD, it a course of "EVER LEARNING, meaning one can STUDY all of the bible, but GOD must be REVEALED unto you. and there is no END to God....... got it now. so if one seek a diploma, or a degree, just keep on studying.......
in much GL.
101G
101G
Well-known member
without God's approval. just as the scriptures states, Matthew 15:7 "Ye hypocrites, well did Esaias prophesy of you, saying," Matthew 15:8 "This people draweth nigh unto me with their mouth, and honoureth me with their lips; but their heart is far from me."
PAPER don't count. it is the Spirit that gives LIFE... KNOWLEDGE and UNDERSTANDING. .... (smile) ....
in MUCH GL.
101G.
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