Wrangler
Well-known member
Since the trinity is not in the Bible, what you claim is proof is false in its face.
Even in John 1, Jesus is not God
- Thread starter Wrangler
- Start date
Wrangler
Well-known member
This is not God’s name and you know it.
Wrangler
Well-known member
Huh? Not one verse claims the servant of God is equal to God. Where are you claiming this in Luke 2:11?
Wrangler
Well-known member
I’ve often thought about this regarding the Lord’s Prayer.
Hallowed by thy name. That would have been an excellent place to articulate again just what is this name to be kept holy.
Nonetheless, the eternal divine name is known by all Jews.
I am Yahweh, and there is none else. Besides me, there is no God.
Isaiah 45:5 (REV)
EclipseEventSigns
Well-known member
Did you actually read the proof right there in my post?
EclipseEventSigns
Well-known member
Not even true.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Yes....Exactly!
101G is "careless."
" not giving sufficient attention or thought to avoiding harm or errors."
" (of an action or its result) showing or caused by a lack of attention. "
What's a careless person?
adjective. If you are careless, you do not pay enough attention to what you are doing, and so you make mistakes,
or cause harm or damage.
Maybe the Holy Spirit made you confess the truth about how you think with the Word of God?
Wrangler
Well-known member
Obviously there is doubt since John 1:1 does not even refer to Jesus.
Funny that you did not even watch the vid in the OP and merely re-iterate as prove what the OP vid easily refuted. And so the intellectual dishonesty continues.
GeneZ
Well-known member
.................................... "I AM."
The Greek and Hebrew tenses declares it to be rendered.... "eternally existing."
Only God is eternally existing!
The ancients interchanged the word "Name" for also meaning "Title."
...... You got to hit the books before its too late!(before the Lord throws the book at you!!!)
.........
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EclipseEventSigns
Well-known member
It does not refute anything. As I gave ACTUAL proof in the text. You haven't even read my posts.
You'll never accept anything that disagrees with your opinion anyway. But the evidence is there for anyone to check out for themselves.
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GeneZ
Well-known member
Really?
You will not find the word "degenerate" in the Bible!
According to your logic?
Romans 1:18-27 can not be speaking about degenerates ...
The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness
of men, who suppress the truth by their wickedness, since what may be known about God is
plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. For since the creation of the world
God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen,
being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.
For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their
thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. Although they claimed to be wise,
they became fools and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a
mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.
Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the
degrading of their bodies with one another. They exchanged the truth about God for a lie,
and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural
sexual relations for unnatural ones. In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations
with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with
other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.
They can not be degenerates according to "Wrangler 101." .............
101G
Well-known member
And? .... as said discuss scriptures, not what or what not 101G is....Yes....Exactly!
101G is "careless."
" not giving sufficient attention or thought to avoiding harm or errors."
" (of an action or its result) showing or caused by a lack of attention. "
What's a careless person?
adjective. If you are careless, you do not pay enough attention to what you are doing, and so you make mistakes,
or cause harm or damage.
Maybe the Holy Spirit made you confess the truth about how you think with the Word of God?
.... (smile) ... lol.... Oh dear.NOW, can you please tell us why king David said, "My Lord", per Psalms 110:1. when the "LORD", per Deut. 6:4 is our God. can "careless" respond to that?
101G.
101G
Well-known member
GINOLJC,
if the Word is God, (which he is), and there is only "ONE" person who is God, why then do you believe in a trinity?
101G.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Let me get one thing straight, please.. so I do not keep believing you may be a robot poster.And? .... as said discuss scriptures, not what or what not 101G is....
NOW, can you please tell us why king David said, "My Lord", per Psalms 110:1. when the "LORD", per Deut. 6:4 is our God. can "careless" respond to that?
101G.
Is English a second language for you?
TibiasDad
Well-known member
Kinda reminds me of the Mormons showing up in their tidy shirts, short cut hair and clean shaven smiling faces, but in a studio type setting and computer graphics. The end result is the same; errant messaging.
First of all; if his argument that “the what God was, the word was” is true, and I don’t think it is a necessarily bad argument, it would actually prove the Trinitarian argument.
First, he is correct that there is a qualitative essence to the import of God, without the article, so this means that the qualities that God (the Father) was possessing, the Word was equally possessing.
So the question now is what are the “qualities” of being God that is the “what God was”?
All of the “omni” factors must certainly be included, and this is evident in that the Word is already existing in the beginning, which is the point of the creation process commencing, if not a reference to all eternity past up to that point of reference. Thus, when it continues to say “the Word was with God” it establishes not only eternal existence, but eternal co-existence with the Father, and distinction of personality.
The Word and the Father are not the same person, but possess the same qualities of being, thus the use of God in reference to the Father establishes the point of reference for the third clause equating the qualitative aspects of the two persons, the Word and the Father.
John 1:2-3 continues to both re-emphasize the co-eternal existence, and to add another irrefutable element of “quality”, that being Creator.
But the qualitative argument also logically that the qualities referred to, are the qualities that establish God as God! Thus, if the Father is God because of these qualities, and the Word is also these qualities, especially the ones characterized in John’s opening words, then the pre-incarnate Word, is possessive of those qualities that establish the Father as God, and thus must also be God!
God is a description of being, of type of existence. We are human, temporal beings, yet you and I exist together in a particular context. Therefore, Doug and Wrangler are distinct together in the same context and pout of reference and we are of the same qualitative nature of being, ie, human!
Doug was on BAM, and Doug was with Wrangler, and the qualities of being that Wrangler has, Doug also has.
Trinitarianism doesn’t say Doug and Wrangler are the same person, but that we are the type of being. The Word and the Father are not the same person, but they share the same qualities of being; they are eternal, coexistent, rational, personal beings with the power to create all things that have ever been created!
The Word was and is God and always has been! The Word took on flesh and became the man Jesus! Jesus the man is the Word in flesh and his now exalted to the highest place, the God/man who perfectly meditates for the one, to, and on behalf of the other.
Doug
GeneZ
Well-known member
Jesus is an unique union of both a human soul and Deity.
Yes... His soul is not God.
Yes.. His Deity is not a soul.
His Deity in isolation? Can not be man.
His humanity in isolation? Can not be God.
So, one can mistakenly make an argument that He is not God while citing passages that He was expressing Himself as the man He needed to become. . A man that He had to make Himself to become.
Why did He have to become as a man?
Because, He had to die in our place as a man, for all men.
As, God He would have never qualified to go to the Cross.
Add to that.. He remained as a man up until He proclaimed the words.. "It is Finished!"
After that was fulfilled?
He no longer had to remain functioning as a man.
Thank you for your time......
Yes... His soul is not God.
Yes.. His Deity is not a soul.
His Deity in isolation? Can not be man.
His humanity in isolation? Can not be God.
So, one can mistakenly make an argument that He is not God while citing passages that He was expressing Himself as the man He needed to become. . A man that He had to make Himself to become.
Why did He have to become as a man?
Because, He had to die in our place as a man, for all men.
As, God He would have never qualified to go to the Cross.
Add to that.. He remained as a man up until He proclaimed the words.. "It is Finished!"
After that was fulfilled?
He no longer had to remain functioning as a man.
Thank you for your time......
Johann
Well-known member
The one who became a man is self-existing. The language John uses in chapter 1 makes a distinction between the one eternally existing as the Word and his becoming at a point in time, a man. The Word already existed '...in the beginning', reflecting the words of Genesis 1:1 but the Word became human and lived a human life. Yet he claimed something which the religious leaders saw as blasphemy. In John 8:58 he used a phrase which is applied to God in Isaiah (אני הוא - Isaiah 43:13 et al) and is related to Exodus 3:14. 'I am' in this context was a claim to being eternal and only God is eternal. They certainly got his gist.
John 1:2 says that οὗτος (he) was in the beginning with God. Throughout John οὗτος is both personal and refers to a person. All things were created 'through him'. John states that he 'beheld' the glory of the λόγος in the person of Jesus. John's testimony of Jesus was that he existed before him, as the unique God who manifests the Father to the world.
The paradox is mind blowing. The eternal becomes temporal. The divine becomes a man - completely... but without ceasing to be self-existent. The immortal becomes mortal. The omniscient becomes limited. The omnipresent becomes focused in time and place. Yet God remains God. We see this throughout Tanakh. The one who fills all things and is present in all time is manifest in one place and time. The God who is one is sender and yet sent. ““This is eternal life, that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent.” (John 17:3)
“And we know that the Son of God has come, and has given us understanding so that we may know Him who is true; and we are in Him who is true, in His Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life.” (1 John 5:20) “οἴδαμεν δὲ ὅτι ὁ υἱὸς τοῦ θεοῦ ἥκει καὶ δέδωκεν ἡμῖν διάνοιαν ἵνα γινώσκωμεν τὸν ἀληθινόν, καὶ ἐσμὲν ἐν τῷ ἀληθινῷ, ἐν τῷ υἱῷ αὐτοῦ Ἰησοῦ Χριστῷ. οὗτός ἐστιν ὁ ἀληθινὸς θεὸς καὶ ζωὴ αἰώνιος.”
To be in the Son is to be in God. In fact he is the true God.
Problematic if you are not believing in the Triune Godhead.
APAK
Active member
And Johann recycles the same incorrect interpretations of scripture. I think I will pass on answering his Exodus 'I AM' pronouncement. Gets old...
101G
Well-known member
where do it say this in the bible, "The Lord Jesus has a Human Soul?' did he not have a soul before he came in flesh?
101G.
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