The Trinity and all of its supporting doctrines are all circular in reasoning

[Runningman]

Nope never once is that ever said in the Bible.

Quote the verse where the Bible says:

“ God is one person “

The circular reasoning is what you are guilty of , oh the irony.

Next fallacy

Hebrews 1:3 bluntly states God is a singular person. Now think back to John 17:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6, Ephesian 4:6 and the myriad of other verses that plainly state God is a singular person.

Hebrews 1
3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

 

[Runningman]

Circular image of the Trinity

View attachment 2288

This image means that if the "Father, Son, and Spirit" are not each other then they are not God also. God is a separate and distinct item in this graphic. Try again.

 

[Runningman]

The One Person that walked with Adam & Eve and appeared to Moses is The WORD that was God and became JESUS.

No one comes to the FATHER but thru ME = LORD JESUS CHRIST

You're literally just making things up at this point.

 

[Runningman]

Elohim is defined as THREE beginning in Genesis chapter 1 and then portrayed in allegorical form in Abraham/Isaac/Jacob

Really. Show me where then. Quote it please.

 

[civic]

Hebrews 1:3 bluntly states God is a singular person. Now think back to John 17:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6, Ephesian 4:6 and the myriad of other verses that plainly state God is a singular person.

Hebrews 1
3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

Wrong again

hupostasis: Substance, assurance, confidence, essence, reality

hypóstasis(from 5259 /hypó, "under" and 2476 /hístēmi, "to stand") – properly, (to possess) standing under a guaranteed agreement ("title-deed"); (figuratively) "title" to a promise or property, i.e. a legitimate claim (because it literally is, "under a legal-standing") – entitlingsomeone to what is guaranteed under the particular agreement

 

[civic]

Taking down the Unitarian arguments are so easily done.

 

[DavidTree]

Even that passage really isn't terribly clear in proving Jesus' divinity is it? I mean, it could have been much clearer.

And here's the thing:

God is clear on many claims in the Bible. He could also have been extremely clear about the truth of the trinity. He could have said "God is composed of three parts: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. All three are God. Yet all three are One." It would still be a bit mysterious, but at least it would be clear.

But he didn't. Why? Is AaronH from a message board on the internet more capable of revealing a doctrine than God? Of course not!

At the very least, the Trinity doctrine is not central to the bible. Not even close. If you want to believe it, go ahead, but it's not central.

Your conclusions are FAR removed from the Holy words of God.

 

[360watt]

Even that passage really isn't terribly clear in proving Jesus' divinity is it? I mean, it could have been much clearer.

And here's the thing:

God is clear on many claims in the Bible. He could also have been extremely clear about the truth of the trinity. He could have said "God is composed of three parts: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. All three are God. Yet all three are One." It would still be a bit mysterious, but at least it would be clear.

But he didn't. Why? Is AaronH from a message board on the internet more capable of revealing a doctrine than God? Of course not!

At the very least, the Trinity doctrine is not central to the bible. Not even close. If you want to believe it, go ahead, but it's not central.

How could all the fullness of the Godhead dwell in someone that wasn't God, just a mortal man?

This is the thing I find with not believing Jesus is God. If He isn't God.. He had power to forgive sin, raise dead, heal sickness etc.. He said what could be done on the Sabaath, that were laws set by God.. and He superceded them by His authority.

A mortal man, can do that?

Because if He isn't God.. He can't be some other kind of deity.. if you believe in Monotheism. If you believe mortal man can become God.. then that isn't the bible you are learning from.

 

[dwight92070]

Wrong again

hupostasis: Substance, assurance, confidence, essence, reality

hypóstasis(from 5259 /hypó, "under" and 2476 /hístēmi, "to stand") – properly, (to possess) standing under a guaranteed agreement ("title-deed"); (figuratively) "title" to a promise or property, i.e. a legitimate claim (because it literally is, "under a legal-standing") – entitlingsomeone to what is guaranteed under the particular agreement

Hebrews 1:3 bluntly states God is a singular person. Now think back to John 17:3, 1 Corinthians 8:6, Ephesian 4:6 and the myriad of other verses that plainly state God is a singular person.

You mean like Genesis 1:26 and Genesis 11:7 where God says "Let Us" and "Let Us"?

Hebrews 1
3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

 

[dwight92070]

Civic is correct.

 

[FreeInChrist]

The One Person that walked with Adam & Eve and appeared to Moses is The WORD that was God and became JESUS.

No one comes to the FATHER but thru ME = LORD JESUS CHRIST

You are talking to a person who does not believe the bible that you and I read.

 

[FreeInChrist]

Even that passage really isn't terribly clear in proving Jesus' divinity is it? I mean, it could have been much clearer.

And here's the thing:

God is clear on many claims in the Bible. He could also have been extremely clear about the truth of the trinity.

Why should He be. It is clear in the pages of the bible. Oh ye of little faith.... Sound famioliar... out eternity depends on what we believe and trust and not on knowing every last detail of God,s mind... if we could.

He could have said "God is composed of three parts: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit.

Stop and think about this. Why would Jesus, when he was alive , in Matt 28:19 say "“Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,"

WHY? Up to this point they were baptizing in Jesus name only. In fact it The practice of baptizing in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as instructed by Jesus in Matthew 28:19, became more widely adopted in the early church during the second century. Prior to that, baptisms were primarily performed in the name of Jesus, as recorded in the Acts of the Apostles.
But there had to be a reason Jesus added the other two to the name of our Savior in baptism..... even though it too a long time to take effect.
Consider this. It is what I believe biut has been suscinctly worded here by AI and I cannot improve on it.....
"to emphasize the unity and authority of the Triune God in the process of salvation. This reflects the belief that all three persons of the Trinity work together in harmony for the redemption of believers."
And tells me all I need to know. We are baptized into the names of the Trinity.
Now... why God did not spell it out for everyone in the bible, I cannot answer other then suggest the Trinity is a mystery
that our individual faiths honor, or deny. God has done a lot of "mystery" teachings in the Holy Book.
Nicodemus' questioning Jesus about how to be saved, and not understanding Jesus when it was explained as clear
as anything.
But that is my opinion. I am sticking with it.

All three are God. Yet all three are One." It would still be a bit mysterious, but at least it would be clear.

What if God does not want it to be clear? Every debate that goes on in these forums is over something that someone else does not see as clear as their opponent.

But he didn't. Why? Is AaronH from a message board on the internet more capable of revealing a doctrine than God? Of course not!

You are capable of expressing what your read, and understand what you read. But every anti-trin on here also capable of expressing what they read, and understand what they read.

I have no suggestions other then the less it is spelled out for us the more we read and study. And learn.

At the very least, the Trinity doctrine is not central to the bible. Not even close. If you want to believe it, go ahead, but it's not central.

HOWEVER. THE TRINITY AS THE FACT THAT THERE IS THE FATHER, SON, AND HOLY SPIRIT IS!!!!!!!!!!

 

[DavidTree]

Why should He be. It is clear in the pages of the bible. Oh ye of little faith.... Sound famioliar... out eternity depends on what we believe and trust and not on knowing every last detail of God,s mind... if we could.


Stop and think about this. Why would Jesus, when he was alive , in Matt 28:19 say "“Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit,"

WHY? Up to this point they were baptizing in Jesus name only. In fact it The practice of baptizing in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, as instructed by Jesus in Matthew 28:19, became more widely adopted in the early church during the second century. Prior to that, baptisms were primarily performed in the name of Jesus, as recorded in the Acts of the Apostles.
But there had to be a reason Jesus added the other two to the name of our Savior in baptism..... even though it too a long time to take effect.
Consider this. It is what I believe biut has been suscinctly worded here by AI and I cannot improve on it.....
"to emphasize the unity and authority of the Triune God in the process of salvation. This reflects the belief that all three persons of the Trinity work together in harmony for the redemption of believers."
And tells me all I need to know. We are baptized into the names of the Trinity.
Now... why God did not spell it out for everyone in the bible, I cannot answer other then suggest the Trinity is a mystery
that our individual faiths honor, or deny. God has done a lot of "mystery" teachings in the Holy Book.
Nicodemus' questioning Jesus about how to be saved, and not understanding Jesus when it was explained as clear
as anything.
But that is my opinion. I am sticking with it.


What if God does not want it to be clear? Every debate that goes on in these forums is over something that someone else does not see as clear as their opponent.


You are capable of expressing what your read, and understand what you read. But every anti-trin on here also capable of expressing what they read, and understand what they read.

I have no suggestions other then the less it is spelled out for us the more we read and study. And learn.

HOWEVER. THE TRINITY AS THE FACT THAT THERE IS THE FATHER, SON, AND HOLY SPIRIT IS!!!!!!!!!!

What if God does not want it to be clear?

BINGO

 

[DavidTree]

Taking down the Unitarian arguments are so easily done.

as easy as 1,2,3

as easy as A,B,C

Abba
Boy
Christ

 

[civic]

As easy as 1,2,3

It sure is see here too.

Post in thread 'Dismantling the Unitarians definition of One'

Yesterday at 6:05 AM

@Runningman @Studyman @Keiw1 @Peterlag

• civic

• 

 

[AaronH]

It is a fallacious human expectation that God provides all knowledge of him either through the scripture or readily discerned through the scripture. I think a proverb mentions that the king searches out the deep understanding and sayings.

Proverbs 25:2 "It is the glory of God to conceal a matter; but the glory of kings is to search out a matter."

Unitarians just scratch the surface and say they know God.

I 100% agree there are things about God and his ways that we as mere humans will never fully understand. And if the trinity were true, I'd fully expect it to be mysterious in some fashion because (try as we may) all analogy of it in the world we live in falls short. No argument from me so far.

But whether or not a trinity exists should not be nearly so difficult to communicate. Do you follow what I'm saying?

Electricity if a difficult thing to fully grasp with the human mind. It's difficult if not impossible to explain it fully. But whether electricity exists or not is very easy to communicate. Electricity does exist.

If God wanted to communicate whether the trinity exists, he could easily have done so, rather than use only phrases that are rather roundabout (if you will) such as "...was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God," or "in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily."

 

[mikesw]

I 100% agree there are things about God and his ways that we as mere humans will never fully understand. And if the trinity were true, I'd fully expect it to be mysterious in some fashion because (try as we may) all analogy of it in the world we live in falls short. No argument from me so far.

But whether or not a trinity exists should not be nearly so difficult to communicate. Do you follow what I'm saying?

It is not difficulty to communicate that God is a Triune God. I just noted it.

Electricity if a difficult thing to fully grasp with the human mind. It's difficult if not impossible to explain it fully. But whether electricity exists or not is very easy to communicate. Electricity does exist.

If God wanted to communicate whether the trinity exists, he could easily have done so, rather than use only phrases that are rather roundabout (if you will) such as "...was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God," or "in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily."

You wholly missed what I shared. God leaves stuff for people to search the ideas out. You are asking for fast food.

 

[Runningman]

Wrong again

hupostasis: Substance, assurance, confidence, essence, reality

hypóstasis(from 5259 /hypó, "under" and 2476 /hístēmi, "to stand") – properly, (to possess) standing under a guaranteed agreement ("title-deed"); (figuratively) "title" to a promise or property, i.e. a legitimate claim (because it literally is, "under a legal-standing") – entitlingsomeone to what is guaranteed under the particular agreement

Wow. You all dog pile on a lexicon when the literal text definition helps you. Why do you ignore everything else the Bible literally says, such as the only true God being the Father? Because it buries the trinity?

 

[Runningman]

Even that passage really isn't terribly clear in proving Jesus' divinity is it? I mean, it could have been much clearer.

And here's the thing:

God is clear on many claims in the Bible. He could also have been extremely clear about the truth of the trinity. He could have said "God is composed of three parts: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. All three are God. Yet all three are One." It would still be a bit mysterious, but at least it would be clear.

But he didn't. Why? Is AaronH from a message board on the internet more capable of revealing a doctrine than God? Of course not!

At the very least, the Trinity doctrine is not central to the bible. Not even close. If you want to believe it, go ahead, but it's not central.

Correct. The fact that the trinity isn't even mentioned in the Bible means that it isn't important. Yet the Bible is very specific about the one and only true God being the Father. Nice to meet a fellow Unitarian who understands the truth. May God bless you.

 

[FreeInChrist]

I 100% agree there are things about God and his ways that we as mere humans will never fully understand. And if the trinity were true, I'd fully expect it to be mysterious in some fashion because (try as we may) all analogy of it in the world we live in falls short. No argument from me so far.

But whether or not a trinity exists should not be nearly so difficult to communicate. Do you follow what I'm saying?

I do not because you have not once tried to explain why Jesus sent them out to baptise in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

WHY?

Original baoptisms were in Jesus name only.... WHY did Jesus say to add the other two.

Why did there Need to be three, as instructed by Jesus.

Electricity if a difficult thing to fully grasp with the human mind. It's difficult if not impossible to explain it fully. But whether electricity exists or not is very easy to communicate. Electricity does exist.

If God wanted to communicate whether the trinity exists, he could easily have done so, rather than use only phrases that are rather roundabout (if you will) such as "...was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God," or "in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily."