The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
So far, you're following the parable. Then you wander off with your personal opinions which are irrelevant to the parable.
The Elect
- Thread starter The Rogue Tomato
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So far, you're following the parable. Then you wander off with your personal opinions which are irrelevant to the parable.
Those chosen put on the wedding garment
God chooses to save those that believe
1 Corinthians 1:21 (NASB 2020) — 21 For since in the wisdom of God the world through its wisdom did not come to know God, God was pleased through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe.
Bronson
Active member
Nobody's wandered off I'm right on track. What you fail to realize is everything posted on this forum except for quotes from the Bible are personal opinions.
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
The breath was from God. God formed Adam from the earth. Adam was dust from the beginning.
Rowan
Active member
Good point. I don't see how you could be a Christian and possibly believe that. Jesus made it pretty clear "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, and the truth, and the life: no one cometh unto the Father, but by me." John 14:6
"The thief cometh not but to steal and to kill and to destroy. I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly." John 10:10
Calvinists are like the Pharisees. They were the thieves and the robbers who were harming the sheep.
“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are. Matthew 23:15
For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven. Matthew 5:20
Rowan
Active member
It reminds me of my wife. She works from home and sometimes I hear her Speaking loudly on the phone phone "Representative". That's when I know not to bug her.Sounds like a cheap shot to me. I've fired off enough of them to know.And I'm thinking about changing my name To Miss Representation.
Calvinists frequently reject scripture because of their theology
Rowan
Active member
Sort of like the Pharisees rejected Jesus? They were so hung up on their trip they didn't recognize the Lord of Glory when he was right in front of them.
The first woe is, “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to” Matthew 23:13
The teachers of the Law and Pharisees were not truly seeking after God, though they acted as if they were. Their religion was empty, and it was preventing others from following the Messiah.
So yeah I see a lot of similarities between Calvinist and Pharisees. One last similarity If you don't go along with Calvinism they are quite unloving and ready to crucify you. The same attitude that Pharisees had toward Jesus.
It seems like I read something here about you experiencing that on another forum.
e v e
Well-known member
how does what you said relates to that God did not create these bodies, nor this (current) prison earth?
I was not taking about these made of dirt.
I was talking of the originals, in the other reality.
Yes, Others have as well
The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
The teachers of the law and Pharisees sought to be righteous because of what they did, that is, follow the law (including their own man-made laws). The wanted to take credit for their righteousness. Whether they know it or not, free-willers have simply replaced works of the law with free will. They want some of the credit for being saved because it was their free-will decision that made the difference. That's synergy - their salvation is part God, part them.
Monergists believe their salvation is entirely of God. God did all the work.
Luke 14:26
“If anyone comes to Me, and does not hate his own father and mother and wife and children and brothers and sisters, yes, and even his own life, he cannot be My disciple."
You can't hate your own life if you credit your own free will decision to be the hinge and turning point of your own salvation.
It's quite ironic that you would say that. This forum has one post after another insulting Calvinists, even claiming Calvinists believe they don't have to confess Christ as Lord. If you find what I say above as "unloving" toward free-willers, it's not. It's simply honoring God above man.
Rowan
Active member
I believe when it comes to this topic one can choose to pick one side of the other. But you're right I shouldn't be insulting to Calvinist.
As for the meaning of Luke 14:26 my concordance says:
In ancient times, however, the term “hate” was frequently employed idiomatically to denote simply the preference of one thing over another. For example, in Genesis 29:31 it is said that Jacob “hated” his wife Leah, and yet, the context makes it very clear that he merely loved his other wife Rachel “more than”
Accordingly, when Jesus demands that we must hate our family members, He is not suggesting that we must literally have ill feelings for them. Rather, the Lord is stressing that we must love Him more than all others, even those dearest to us. This is borne out by a comparison of Luke 14:26 with a parallel in Matthew 10:37, where Christ declares: “He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me ...”
Underline, therefore, the word “hateth” in Luke 14:26 and in your margin write: Literally, love less; see Genesis 29:29,30; Matthew 10:37.
Rockson
Well-known member
Sorry RT but someone an alcoholic or overweight can truly hate their own life and yes THEY make a decision to seek or accept help.
Hosanna
Well-known member
If you're not saved you have a sin problem. And a sin problem can definitely make you hate your life. Been there done that.
Your problem is with scripture
Romans 9:30–32 (NASB 2020) — 30 What shall we say then? That Gentiles, who did not pursue righteousness, attained righteousness, but the righteousness that is by faith; 31 however, Israel, pursuing a law of righteousness, did not arrive at that law. 32 Why? Because they did not pursue it by faith, but as though they could by works. They stumbled over the stumbling stone,
Romans 4:5 (NASB 2020) — 5 But to the one who does not work, but believes in Him who justifies the ungodly, his faith is credited as righteousness,
Behold
Well-known member
Posting half the verse to try to prove Calvin isn't a Devil?
You failed, again, and the next time also, @The Rogue Tomato .
See, "election" is based on becoming "IN CHRIST" which is the part that all lying Calvinists leave out of your verse, as that is the verse's context.
See, the Foreknowledge of God, is not pre-destined....its only KNOWN as Revelation by God's Foreknowledge.
God knows before we are born, not only when we will die but IF we will Give GOD our Faith in Christ.
He KNOWS this about us all but He does not cause it.
Its only KNOWN By God, regarding us all......as that is God's FORE-Knowledge, or "knowing everything that is going to happen BEFORE.... it happens".
This is just like the Bible showing you what is coming next.
The Bible shows you the end from the beginning .. but that is not the bible causing it....That is the Bible REVEALING IT.
And its the same with God's FORE-Knowledge.
So, everyone who Gives their Faith in Christ in God, is elected by This Faith, to become "born again"., as "In Christ".
Faith Elects not God.
God ACCEPTS.... your faith....... to bring the BELIEVER into Salvation, through Christ,... and that has an end result that occurs after you die or as you are Raptured.
The end result, = :"conformed into the image of Christ"....= THIS happens after you die, or happens as you are RAPTURED, = and that end result is to be : "conformed into the image of Christ".
See that CONFORMING? That is what is "pre-destined" to happen......>Not Salvation... As Salvation is based on our Faith, and that is based on our Choice to Believe in Christ or not....... which is our Free Will.
So, God accepts what we choose, and He does not choose for us as LYING CALVINISM teaches as a "doctrine of Devils".
Context
1 Thessalonians 1:2–8 (NIV) — 2 We always thank God for all of you and continually mention you in our prayers. 3 We remember before our God and Father your work produced by faith, your labor prompted by love, and your endurance inspired by hope in our Lord Jesus Christ. 4 For we know, brothers and sisters loved by God, that he has chosen you, 5 because our gospel came to you not simply with words but also with power, with the Holy Spirit and deep conviction. You know how we lived among you for your sake. 6 You became imitators of us and of the Lord, for you welcomed the message in the midst of severe suffering with the joy given by the Holy Spirit. 7 And so you became a model to all the believers in Macedonia and Achaia. 8 The Lord’s message rang out from you not only in Macedonia and Achaia—your faith in God has become known everywhere. Therefore we do not need to say anything about it,
Believers are elect in Christ
Ephesians 1:3–4 (NIV) — 3 Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ. 4 For he chose us in him before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. In love
praise_yeshua
Well-known member
You're appealing to the unknown. The breath of life from God animated these bodies of dust. That is all we know about.
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civic
Well-known member
Whether they know it or not, fatalists have simply replaced the gospel and faith and repentance with determinism . They want some of the unknown credit for being elect because it was their being special kind of sinner different from the rest of the sinners why they were chosen over others. That's Monergism - their salvation was not from hearing and believing the gospel they were the special chosen and saved ones from before creation . TULIP has replaced the gospel.
hope this helps !!!
