I'm going to start asking for a dollar every time a calvinist says that. I'll be rich by the end of the year.
Faith precedes life !
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civic
Well-known member
so easy to see even my grandchildren can understand it 
brightfame52
Well-known member
There is no sense in continuing this, you dont listenWhat happens to an unregenerate who does not always cater to his fleshly desires but instead seeks the word of God?
Read Rom 10:8-13. Those verses prove that unregenerates can be saved when they confess and believe Christ. And that pleases God.
(Rom 10:8-13)
8 But what does it say? “The word is near you, in your mouth and in your heart” (that is, the word of faith which we preach):
9 that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in your heart that God has raised Him from the dead, you will be saved.
10 For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.
11 For the Scripture says, “Whoever believes on Him will not be put to shame.”
12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord over all is rich to all who call upon Him.
13 For “whoever calls on the name of the Lord shall be saved.”
Tell me something I don't know.
Rom 10:8-13 does prove that unregenerates can please God when they stop catering to their fleshly desires and start to confess and believe Christ. They are then saved by God.
If you don't listen to what Rom 10:8-13 says then there is no sense in continuing this.
brightfame52
Well-known member
They which are in the flesh cannot please God Rom 8:8 thats the unregenerate
Again, the audience of Rom 8:8 are regenerated believers. I can't help it if your comprehension of the English language is deficient. Go back to your English teachers and ask for your money back. They should be ashamed of themselves producing a student like you.
Also, you're running away from Rom 10:8-13 that proves that unregenerates can please God when they stop catering to their fleshly desires and start to confess and believe Christ. They are then saved by God.
MTMattie
Well-known member
Pray tell. Exactly what age does one ger regenerated according to you or any Calvin clone?
civic
Well-known member
Jay
Active member
Romans 8:8 tells us that those who are in the flesh cannot please God. This verse emphasizes that human effort alone is insufficient to please God, and that salvation is more than good behavior.
brightfame52
Well-known member
@brightfame52 ran away so fast from Rom 10:8-13 and Rom 8 that his shadow was left behind. I don't know if he'll return to face those passages again.
Jay
Active member
Paul makes it very clear in Galatians 5:16-24 that believers can indeed walk in the power of the flesh – even religious people.
Paul tells us that we should walk by the Spirit and not by the flesh. But, becoming a Christian does not mean the flesh is automatically dead. Rather, it means a struggle starts within for control of our life between the flesh and the newly revived human spirit.
Correct. There is a massive difference between our human flesh nature and fleshly desires.
It's our fleshly desires that are sinful and if we choose fleshly desires then we are no longer in the Spirit.
Our human flesh nature is not sinful because it comes straight from God who is Holy. He's not in the business of creating anything sinful. Another solid reason our human flesh nature is not sinful is because Jesus remained sinless after taking on human flesh nature.
Calvinists wrongly conflate fleshly desires with human flesh nature and make a total mess of things. They are Platonist Heretics that despise matter and the intrinsic value that matter possesses.
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civic
Well-known member
ditto
MTMattie
Well-known member
brightfame52 said:
You tend to be such a one track thinker.... but WOW.... Now, I understand....
If you were not just same old, same old...one or two sentence copy and paste type I guess you would be in fear of floating off or vanishing because you, who have no flesh, have nothing to hold your spirit and soul together.
You are grasping for straws where you should be grasping for the truth.
You tend to be such a one track thinker.... but WOW.... Now, I understand....
If you were not just same old, same old...one or two sentence copy and paste type I guess you would be in fear of floating off or vanishing because you, who have no flesh, have nothing to hold your spirit and soul together.
You are grasping for straws where you should be grasping for the truth.
Richard
Active member
Walking in the Spirit is not an automatic thing. We have a part in the process. Our part, however, is made possible by what happened at the cross.
When Christ died on the cross, He changed our relationship to sin. Before our salvation, we were slaves to sin.
20 For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.
21 But then what benefit did you get from the things of which you are now ashamed? None for the end of those things is death. Romans 6:20–21
It was as if Satan had a big collar around our necks with a leash on it. Whenever he pulled our leash, we followed. We might have fought back at times to show our independence, but eventually, he had his way. Practically speaking, we were slaves to certain of our natural desires.
When we trusted Christ as our Savior, we were placed into Christ. At that point in time we were set free from slavery to sin.
But now since you have been set free from sin and have become the slaves of God, you have your present reward in holiness and its end is eternal life. Romans 6:22
The leash was cut. We no longer had to give in to the temptations of Satan or the desires of our sinful flesh. But nobody told us! So when a temptation came along, what did we do? What we had always done—we gave in. But we felt guilty because the Holy Spirit was living in us. And He was grieved. That's Holy Spirit conviction.
To walk in the Spirit, you must come to grips with the fact that you are free from sin. Otherwise, you will assume that the tug of flesh is a tug you cannot resist. Your inclination will be to follow your flesh. After all, that’s the way you’ve always done it. And besides, nobody’s perfect.
You cannot follow two masters. You will follow either the lead of the Spirit or the desires of the flesh. But you can’t have it both ways. I believe many Christians follow their flesh because they really don’t believe they have any choice. They have lost the same battles so many times that they have given up. The least little temptation sends them scurrying after their flesh.
Satan can call to you. He can stir up your natural appetites. He can do anything he wants—from the sidelines. But he can’t touch you. His power over you is broken. You are a free agent:
Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body that you should obey its lusts … for sin shall not be master over you. Romans 6:11–14
You may feel the way you have always felt. You may desire the things you have always desired. But the fact is, you are free. Begin now renewing your mind to this transformational truth, for you will never walk in the Spirit until you are convinced of your freedom.
So don’t sit in neutral and wonder why the Christian life is not working for you. Pursue God. Devour the Word. Renew your mind. Starve your flesh and feed your spirit. Crucify your flesh and empower your spirit. Resist the world and the devil and embrace the Holy Spirit and your spiritual blessings in the heavenly places “in Christ.” Become accustomed to hearing and obeying the voice and leading of God.
By Terry Baxter: Cofounder of GoServ Global
When Christ died on the cross, He changed our relationship to sin. Before our salvation, we were slaves to sin.
20 For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness.
21 But then what benefit did you get from the things of which you are now ashamed? None for the end of those things is death. Romans 6:20–21
It was as if Satan had a big collar around our necks with a leash on it. Whenever he pulled our leash, we followed. We might have fought back at times to show our independence, but eventually, he had his way. Practically speaking, we were slaves to certain of our natural desires.
When we trusted Christ as our Savior, we were placed into Christ. At that point in time we were set free from slavery to sin.
But now since you have been set free from sin and have become the slaves of God, you have your present reward in holiness and its end is eternal life. Romans 6:22
The leash was cut. We no longer had to give in to the temptations of Satan or the desires of our sinful flesh. But nobody told us! So when a temptation came along, what did we do? What we had always done—we gave in. But we felt guilty because the Holy Spirit was living in us. And He was grieved. That's Holy Spirit conviction.
To walk in the Spirit, you must come to grips with the fact that you are free from sin. Otherwise, you will assume that the tug of flesh is a tug you cannot resist. Your inclination will be to follow your flesh. After all, that’s the way you’ve always done it. And besides, nobody’s perfect.
You cannot follow two masters. You will follow either the lead of the Spirit or the desires of the flesh. But you can’t have it both ways. I believe many Christians follow their flesh because they really don’t believe they have any choice. They have lost the same battles so many times that they have given up. The least little temptation sends them scurrying after their flesh.
Satan can call to you. He can stir up your natural appetites. He can do anything he wants—from the sidelines. But he can’t touch you. His power over you is broken. You are a free agent:
Even so consider yourselves to be dead to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus. Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body that you should obey its lusts … for sin shall not be master over you. Romans 6:11–14
You may feel the way you have always felt. You may desire the things you have always desired. But the fact is, you are free. Begin now renewing your mind to this transformational truth, for you will never walk in the Spirit until you are convinced of your freedom.
So don’t sit in neutral and wonder why the Christian life is not working for you. Pursue God. Devour the Word. Renew your mind. Starve your flesh and feed your spirit. Crucify your flesh and empower your spirit. Resist the world and the devil and embrace the Holy Spirit and your spiritual blessings in the heavenly places “in Christ.” Become accustomed to hearing and obeying the voice and leading of God.
By Terry Baxter: Cofounder of GoServ Global
Right on! Calvinists desecrate flesh, thinking it's inherently sinful. Their hardcore Platonism is just one more pillar to support their monergism. They have many other pillars all aligned to desecrate whatever good is in man such as us being images of God.
This is the epitome of false humility. They take the cake on false humility.
To be able to trust Christ as our Savior means that the devil did not have full command over us. That's why I wouldn't exactly say that he had a " big collar around our necks". Although it felt that way many times, satan was more of a temptor, as he showed in his encounter with Jesus in the desert.
