Easily Dispelling The Trinity

Wrangler

Wrangler

Well-known member
Here, the bulwark against the inherently contradictory and anti-Biblical doctrine of the trinity will be presented. These ABC’s (OT) and 123’s (NT) will easily demonstrate the monotheist text of Scripture, the perspective through which one ought to view trinitarians vain attempt to impose their tri-une exegesis interpretation.

Consider the emphatic way God communicated to Moses, by putting his commands in stone. This represents the ultimate way of explicit communication in all of human history. By contrast, trinitarian’s sad attempt to read contradictory doctrine into monotheist text ridiculous and cannot hold up to scrutiny. This is why they disregard what follows and try to rationalize their doctrine with complexity of artificial synthesis.

ABC’s (OT)
  • Only YHWH is God.
    • Deut 6:4 (NOG). Listen, Israel: Yahweh is our Elohim. Yahweh is the only God.
  • YHWH is God’s only and eternal name – for all generations.
    • Ex 3:15 (NLT). Yahweh, the God of your ancestors—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you. This is my eternal name, my name to remember for all generations.
  • 1C, You shall have no other gods but YHWH – including the trinity god.
    • Ex 20:3 (NLT) You must not have any other god but me.

123’s (NT)
  • All the Gospels proclaim Jesus is God’s Anointed. None claim Jesus is YHWH incarnate.
    • Matthew 1:1 (VOICE) This is the family history, the genealogy, of Jesus the Anointed, the coming King.
    • Mark 1:1 (VOICE). This is the beginning of the good news of Jesus, the Anointed One, the Liberating King, the Son of God.
    • Luke 1:4 I want you to know that you can fully rely on the things you have been taught about Jesus, God’s Anointed One.
    • John 20:31 (VOICE). These accounts are recorded so that you, too, might believe that Jesus is the Anointed, the Liberating King, the Son of God, because believing grants you the life He came to share.

  • God made Jesus and gave Jesus authority – but not over God, Himself.
    • Acts 2:36 (CEV). God has made Jesus both Lord and Christ
    • 1 Corinthians 15:27 “God has put all things under his authority.”[a] (Of course, when it says “all things are under his authority,” that does not include God himself, who gave Christ his authority.

  • Jesus has a God, who we relate to as Father, who is the only true God.
    • John 17:1-3 (NLT) Father … And this is the way to have eternal life—to know you, the only true God.
    • John 20:17 ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

  • Salvation Depends on Believing God raised Jesus from the dead.
    • Roman 10:9 (Not "the Father" but God.) If you openly declare that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
  • The resurrected Jesus, sitting on God’s throne in heaven is STILL not God.
    • Rev 1:1 (NLT). This is a revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him.
    • Rev 3:12. Jesus invokes his God 4 times in 1 sentence.
 
Wrangler said:
Here, the bulwark against the inherently contradictory and anti-Biblical doctrine of the trinity will be presented. These ABC’s (OT) and 123’s (NT) will easily demonstrate the monotheist text of Scripture, the perspective through which one ought to view trinitarians vain attempt to impose their tri-une exegesis interpretation.

Consider the emphatic way God communicated to Moses, by putting his commands in stone. This represents the ultimate way of explicit communication in all of human history. By contrast, trinitarian’s sad attempt to read contradictory doctrine into monotheist text ridiculous and cannot hold up to scrutiny. This is why they disregard what follows and try to rationalize their doctrine with complexity of artificial synthesis.

ABC’s (OT)
  • Only YHWH is God.
    • Deut 6:4 (NOG). Listen, Israel: Yahweh is our Elohim. Yahweh is the only God.
  • YHWH is God’s only and eternal name – for all generations.
    • Ex 3:15 (NLT). Yahweh, the God of your ancestors—the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob—has sent me to you. This is my eternal name, my name to remember for all generations.
  • 1C, You shall have no other gods but YHWH – including the trinity god.
    • Ex 20:3 (NLT) You must not have any other god but me.
Click to expand...
There was a transformation between God's name of "Eli" or "I AM" denoting existence to God's name of "θεω" denoting His nature that He imparts at Pentecost through the Holy Spirit. The Old Testament (Joel 2:28) prophesied that God would pour out his spirit and He did that at Pentecost (Acts 2:16-47). It is His Divine Nature that He imparts to man.

God is most definitely triune, three persons with one common nature. It is God's nature that is one. As a matter of fact, the Greek word for “God” (θεω) has an energy word structure (an “ω” at the end of the word) as do other Greek energy verbs such as “run” (τρέχω), “see” (διαβλέπω), or “burn” (κατακαίω). The word Greek word “God” itself is an energy word, signifying how we relate to God, through his Divine Energies. The Greek NT is chalk full of the Greek word energia (energy) and its derivatives. I can list out all those verses if one is interested.
Wrangler said:
123’s (NT)
  • All the Gospels proclaim Jesus is God’s Anointed. None claim Jesus is YHWH incarnate.
    • Matthew 1:1 (VOICE) This is the family history, the genealogy, of Jesus the Anointed, the coming King.
    • Mark 1:1 (VOICE). This is the beginning of the good news of Jesus, the Anointed One, the Liberating King, the Son of God.
    • Luke 1:4 I want you to know that you can fully rely on the things you have been taught about Jesus, God’s Anointed One.
    • John 20:31 (VOICE). These accounts are recorded so that you, too, might believe that Jesus is the Anointed, the Liberating King, the Son of God, because believing grants you the life He came to share.

  • God made Jesus and gave Jesus authority – but not over God, Himself.
    • Acts 2:36 (CEV). God has made Jesus both Lord and Christ
    • 1 Corinthians 15:27 “God has put all things under his authority.”[a] (Of course, when it says “all things are under his authority,” that does not include God himself, who gave Christ his authority.

  • Jesus has a God, who we relate to as Father, who is the only true God.
    • John 17:1-3 (NLT) Father … And this is the way to have eternal life—to know you, the only true God.
    • John 20:17 ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’”

  • Salvation Depends on Believing God raised Jesus from the dead.
    • Roman 10:9 (Not "the Father" but God.) If you openly declare that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.
  • The resurrected Jesus, sitting on God’s throne in heaven is STILL not God.
    • Rev 1:1 (NLT). This is a revelation from Jesus Christ, which God gave him.
    • Rev 3:12. Jesus invokes his God 4 times in 1 sentence.
Click to expand...
Because Jesus humbled Himself down to being a human, Jesus could not go around declaring Himself to everyone that He is the Great "I Am". Nevertheless, He did pick His spots and He did so when He declared to the Pharisees that He was the "I Am". They were so stunned that they wanted to stone Him on the spot. Jesus definitely has God's Divine Nature by virtue of the fact that He is the uncreated Word of God, as clearly revealed and manifested in Revelations.
 
A unitarian god cannot know or experience love as a solitary person. A unitarian god cannot know or experience love as a solitary person. That god is incapable of love for the scriptures declare that God is love. It is impossible for that god to love for there was nothing to love before creation. This god would need created beings to love him out of something lacking within his very nature. For someone to love there must be another to share in that love.

God is love because He loves within His own nature. God could not love if He was only one person. God would be contradicting Himself if He was not self sufficient. God is Love means that He has this ability to love within Himself. This is only possible if He is a tri-personal God whom the scriptures declare to be The Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. That is impossible. It is an oxymoron.

The only viable answer to Gods love and that He is love is for God to be Triune in nature which would explain why and how God is love. A false god who is only a solitary person cannot know what love is as there is no one to love. That god is void of love by nature. The only viable answer to Gods love and that He is love is for God to be Triune in nature which would explain why and how God is love.

God is a personal, relational being by His very essence or nature. There are roles within the Godhead that have to do with the tri-personal nature of His being. The Father sends the Son, The Son submits to the Father. The Holy Spirit speaks of and honors the Father and the Son. Jesus said I and the Father are one. We clearly see the relationship of the Triune Godhead in the 14th-16th chapters of John.

Now it is very interesting that when we begin with God(Trinity) we see that He has designed not only man, but the family and the Church to represent and reflect His very own nature. God has designed this order and is clearly seen back in Genesis 1-2.

When God created the first 6 days He declared everything "was good". We read the only time in creation where God said otherwise was when He created man (who was made in His very own image). He used the plural form by saying LET US make man in OUR image after OUR likeness.

But God did not stop there. He said it was NOT GOOD for man to be alone. Why did God say this ? Man was created to be a relational being just like God (trinity). God created woman so that man would not be alone as God is not alone. The two would become ONE just as the Father and the Son are ONE.

Man was to procreate and have a family. Within the family unit Man is the head of the woman. The woman submits to the man. The Son submits to the Father. The Holy Spirit honors both the Father and the Son. The children are to honor their Mother and their Father. This reflects the very nature of God.

Now the same is true of the Church. Christ is the Head of the body. The body consists of Leaders(elder, pastors, teachers etc...)and the flock. The leaders submit to Christ and the flock is to submit to the leaders.

In the above we see the family(husband, wife and children) and the Church(Christ,leaders and the flock) are all designed to reflect the triune nature of God by the relationships and order of these institutions.

conclusion: God is love and cannot be a solitary Person because He loves within His own nature. God could not love if He was only one person. God would be contradicting Himself if He was not self sufficient. God is Love means that He has this ability to love within Himself. This is only possible if He is a tri-personal God.

hope this helps !!!
 
The man-is-god thesis is where the passion for the trinity is. Yet, the easiest way to dispel the trinity is the so-called, 3rd, "person."
  • No name.
    • The importance of a person's name is found throughout Scripture. That the Holy Spirit has no name is a dead give away that "it" (attribute of God) is not a person.
  • No equality or authority.
    • Jesus was given all authority in heaven and Earth. That does not leave much authority and certainly no equality.
  • Salvation does not depend on believing in the trinity or in the 3rd person.
    • Romans 10:9 If you openly declare that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. (Note: No reference to the HS).
 
civic said:
A unitarian god cannot know or experience love as a solitary person.
Click to expand...
What Scripture verse says this?

The very fact that trinitarians require dozens of paragraphs to make a point proves the OP correct. Such IDOLATRY puts hope in complexity to rationalize what is not true.
 
Wrangler said:
What Scripture verse says this?

The very fact that trinitarians require dozens of paragraphs to make a point proves the OP correct. Such IDOLATRY puts hope in complexity to rationalize what is not true.
Click to expand...
My love argument with facts and definitions is better than your 1 cannot be 3 argument:)
 
Wrangler said:
ABC’s (OT)
  • Only YHWH is God.
    • Deut 6:4 (NOG). Listen, Israel: Yahweh is our Elohim. Yahweh is the only God.
Click to expand...


  • Jesus dealt with this when the Pharisees of His day had the same attitude you display here.

    Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
    Joh 10:34 Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
    Joh 10:35 If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
    Joh 10:36 Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
    Joh 10:37 If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.
    Joh 10:38 But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

    So what work did Jesus do that didn't reflect the Father?
 
In the beginning, there was the voice, the voice was with God and was God. The same voice was in the beginning with God.

And they heard the voice of the Lord God walking in the garden during the cool of the day.

The voice was made flesh and lived among us, full of grace and truth.

I.e. Jesus is God.
 
Wrangler said:
The man-is-god thesis is where the passion for the trinity is. Yet, the easiest way to dispel the trinity is the so-called, 3rd, "person."
  • No name.
    • The importance of a person's name is found throughout Scripture. That the Holy Spirit has no name is a dead give away that "it" (attribute of God) is not a person.
Click to expand...
  • He teaches – John 14:26
  • He testifies – John 15:26
  • He guides – Rom. 8:14
  • He speaks – 1 Cor. 2:13
  • He enlightens – John 16:13
  • He strives – Gen. 6:3
  • He commands – Acts 8:28
  • He intercedes – Rom. 8:26
  • He sends workers – Acts 13:4
  • He calls – Rev. 22:17
  • He comforts – John 16:7
  • He works – 1 Cor. 12:11
The above actions cannot be accomplished by a mere (object), influence or force. Only a rational, emotional, and active person could do all that the Scriptures teach the Holy Spirit accomplishes. Source: "https://www.biblesprout.com/articles/god/holy-spirit/holy-spirit-person-attributes/"

He has the characteristics of a person. He acts like a person. He is treated as a person. He has the ministry of a person. He is mentioned in connection with other persons. He is the Third Person of the Trinity, and therefore, is personal. Any Jehovah Witness attempt to reduce the Holy Spirit down to a mere object "it" is quickly dispelled by those who read the Bible.
Wrangler said:
  • No equality or authority.
    • Jesus was given all authority in heaven and Earth. That does not leave much authority and certainly no equality.
Click to expand...
The Holy Spirit does in fact have authority. Read John 3:8.

John 3:8 The Spirit breathes where He desires, and you hear His voice, but you do not know from where He comes, and where He goes; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit.

There are many more instances of the Holy Spirit exercising authority such as affirming the Jerusalem Council (Acts15:28).....
Wrangler said:
  • Salvation does not depend on believing in the trinity or in the 3rd person.
    • Romans 10:9 If you openly declare that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. (Note: No reference to the HS).
Click to expand...
How does salvation actually occur? Read Titus 3:5-6.

(Titus 3:5) not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to His mercy He saved us, through the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,
(Titus 3:6) whom He poured out on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Savior,

Any one who reads the Bible will automatically know that it is impossible to be saved apart from God the Holy Spirit.

Conclusion: This OP, far from easily dispelling the Trinity, is actually Easily Dispelling Jehovah Witness hatred of the Trinity.
 
dizerner said:
god ≠ person

No Bible verse makes them equal in meaning.
Click to expand...
Exactly! As I said before, the Greek word "θεω" denotes His nature, not His person. That is verified by the fact that the Greek word for “God” (θεω) has an energy word structure (an “ω” at the end of the word) as do other Greek energy verbs such as “run” (τρέχω), “see” (διαβλέπω), or “burn” (κατακαίω). The word Greek word “God” itself is an energy word, signifying how we relate to God, through his Divine Nature (Divine Energies, to be more exact). The Greek NT is chalk full of the Greek word energia (energy) and its derivatives. I can list out all those verses if one is interested. Jay Dyer gets into that fact in one of his youtube video. I can supply that address for those interested.
 
dizerner said:
god ≠ person

No Bible verse makes them equal in meaning.
Click to expand...
Lu 3:38 Which was the son of Enos, which was the son of Seth, which was the son of Adam, which was the son of God.

Ge1:27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.
 
dizerner said:
Again, I ask for a Bible verse to prove person = God.

I get one that disproves it, can compares two persons to one God.
Click to expand...

There is a English definition for Person that specifically appeals to the Theology of the Trinity.

CHRISTIAN THEOLOGY
each of the three modes of being of God, namely the Father, the Son, or the Holy Spirit, who together constitute the Trinity.

The etymology of "person" comes from the 13th century Latin "one of the persons of the Trinity, extend through the 14c in meaning "one's physical being, the living body" and "external appearance".

www.etymonline.com

person | Etymology, origin and meaning of person by etymonline

PERSON Meaning: "an individual, a human being," from Old French persone "human being, anyone, person" (12c., Modern… See origin and meaning of person.
www.etymonline.com www.etymonline.com

As far as a verse denoting such, which may have already been mentioned ( I didn't read back through the thread) is....

1Ti 3:16 And we all agree, our religion contains amazing revelation: He was revealed in the flesh, vindicated by the Spirit, seen by angels, proclaimed among Gentiles, believed on in the world, taken up in glory. NET

The translation word of choice here is "revealed". Which I believe fits well with the work of the Person of Jesus Christ in revealing God Incarnate.
 

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