The Bible does not teach to pray to Jesus

[civic]

This calls for a thread devoted to our Great God and Savior Jesus Christ and that He is worthy of our prayers and worship

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/praying-to-jesus.2061/

 

[David Koberstein]

@Runningman

Your signature is meaningless relative to your position. You refuse to serve Jesus.

At your service,
Brother Runningman

Your not at my service. Most Unitarian Christians belong and are affiliated with the National Council of Unitarian and Universalists. This is what they don't tell you.

Shalom

 

[Runningman]

Ridiculous. Do you even know English?

Master = a man who has people working for him, especially servants or slaves.

Lord = a man of noble rank or high office; a peer.

Jesus is your Master. You're His slave. You're the Master of no one.

The Greek of John 13:13 is more along the lines of Teacher and master. Many versions translate this verse the way I am telling you about.

 

[Runningman]

@Runningman

Your signature is meaningless relative to your position. You refuse to serve Jesus.

At your service,
Brother Runningman

Ironic you actually use his real name Yeshua in your handle. It means YHWH Saves. Jesus isn't YHWH according to Scripture.

 

[Runningman]

You made my case as the Father is not the one Lord in that passage it’s Jesus

How is the Father not the One Lord when the Bible says He is? Ephesians 4:4-6 says the Father is the one Lord over all. That's what it say. Yes, Jesus is Lord, but a Lord over those he belongs to and the Father is Lord over Jesus and over all.

1 Corinthians 3
23and you belong to Christ, and Christ belongs to God.

 

[Runningman]

That confirms Christ alone is the One Lord.


1 Cor 8:6
and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.

Why didn't you include the whole verse?

1 Corinthians 8
6yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we exist.

Eph 4:5
one Lord, one faith, one baptism

Context, proves only the Father is the only Lord and God.

Ephesians 4
4There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism; 6one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Rom 10:9-13
1 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."

Look up the OT verses from which Paul cited. You'll find that this only proves that God (YHWH) is not Jesus.

1 Cor 1:2
To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

Look at the next verse:

1 Cor. 1
3Grace and peace to you from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Jude 4
and deny our only Master and Lord, Jesus Christ.

Amen, but he isn't God.

 

[Runningman]

In the bible, there are many examples of people praying directly to Jesus.

• As Stephen is being killed in the book of Acts, he prays, “Lord Jesus, receive my spirit” (Acts 7:59).
• The penultimate verse in the Bible is a prayer to Jesus: “Amen. Come, Lord Jesus” (Rev 22:20).
• The apostle Paul himself prayed to “the Lord” (see 2 Cor 12:8, a title Paul frequently applied to Jesus).

Examples like this give us a precedent for doing the same – it is good, right, and proper to pray to Jesus.

christianity.com

Please point to the word prayer in those verses. No one else has found it yet.

 

[Runningman]

Great!

Not only this but it is Jesus who answers prayers.

Joh 14:14 If ye shall ask any thing in my name, I will do it.

Matthew 6:6,9 Jesus taught us Christians to only pray to the Father. Some believe, some don't.

 

[Runningman]

Yes exactly, why is it so hard for Runningman to understand this? I can tolerate small differences in Scripture with believers, but major differences in biblical doctrine and major tenets of Scripture to me is nonnegotiable.

Whoever said we are negotiating? I am not asking you, I am telling you what the Bible says. Why does John 17:1-3 say the Father is the only true God?

 

[David Koberstein]

Whoever said we are negotiating? I am not asking you, I am telling you what the Bible says. Why does John 17:1-3 say the Father is the only true God?

First of all you are not in a position to telling me anything. During these discussions you have shown a very limited knowledge of Scripture. And what you don't know you distort with Scripture. You ought to change your line of work to being a politician. They seem to have those same attributes and best of all they seem to fool people with their rhetoric. Maybe you can do the same.
Shalom

 

[TomL]

You're still here and you haven't provided any example(s) of praying to Jesus. This is embarrassing. Page 1 has been a fiasco for you.

Based on all of the prior precedents about praying to the Father, Acts 1:24-25 is about praying to the Father. The Father is the Lord of heaven and earth according to Jesus in Matthew 11:25. Do you deny they prayed to the Father in Acts 1:24-25?

Matthew 11
25At that time Jesus declared, “I praise You, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because You have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.

Acts 1
24And they prayed, “Lord, You know everyone’s heart. Show us which of these two You have chosen 25to take up this ministry and apostleship, which Judas abandoned to go to his rightful place.”

Um

Acts 7:59–60 (KJV 1900) — 59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit. 60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.


1 Corinthians 1:2 (NASB 2020) — 2 To the church of God which is in Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

If there is embarrassment her it should be yours

 

[civic]

Look up the OT verses from which Paul cited. You'll find that this only proves that God (YHWH) is not Jesus.

To Confess





NT:3670 ‎o(mologe/w ‎homologeo (hom-ol-og-eh'-o);

Strong's Concordance

homologeó: to speak the same, to agree

Original Word: ὁμολογέω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: homologeó
Phonetic Spelling: (hom-ol-og-eh'-o)
Definition: to speak the same, to agreeUsage: (a) I promise, agree, (b) I confess, (c) I publicly declare, (d) a Hebraism, I praise, celebrate.

3670 homologéō (from 3674 /homoú, "together" and 3004 /légō, "speak to a conclusion") – properly, to voice the same conclusion, i.e. agree ("confess"); to profess (confess) because in full agreement; to align with (endorse)


Joel 2:32
32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Will be delivered;
For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem
There will be those who escape,
As the Lord has said,
Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.



Here we see Paul quote this OT passage about YHWH and apply it to Jesus who is the one and only Lord according to the N.T.


Rom 10:9-13

9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."



So a person must confess Jesus is YHWH(Lord) to be saved. Confess means to agree with so the person confessing Jesus is Lord is in agreement that He is YHWH. Whoever will call upon the name of the Lord ( YHWH) will be saved.

hope this helps !!!

 

[Runningman]

First of all you are not in a position to telling me anything. During these discussions you have shown a very limited knowledge of Scripture. And what you don't know you distort with Scripture. You ought to change your line of work to being a politician. They seem to have those same attributes and best of all they seem to fool people with their rhetoric. Maybe you can do the same.
Shalom

I'm not going to ignore Matthew 6:6,9 for you. It's sola scriptura. Your "pray to Jesus" doctrine isn't.

 

[Runningman]

Um

Acts 7:59–60 (KJV 1900) — 59 And they stoned Stephen, calling upon God, and saying, Lord Jesus, receive my spirit. 60 And he kneeled down, and cried with a loud voice, Lord, lay not this sin to their charge. And when he had said this, he fell asleep.


1 Corinthians 1:2 (NASB 2020) — 2 To the church of God which is in Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:

If there is embarrassment her it should be yours

It doesn't say it's a prayer.

 

[Runningman]

To Confess





NT:3670 ‎o(mologe/w ‎homologeo (hom-ol-og-eh'-o);

Strong's Concordance

homologeó: to speak the same, to agree

Original Word: ὁμολογέω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: homologeó
Phonetic Spelling: (hom-ol-og-eh'-o)
Definition: to speak the same, to agreeUsage: (a) I promise, agree, (b) I confess, (c) I publicly declare, (d) a Hebraism, I praise, celebrate.

3670 homologéō (from 3674 /homoú, "together" and 3004 /légō, "speak to a conclusion") – properly, to voice the same conclusion, i.e. agree ("confess"); to profess (confess) because in full agreement; to align with (endorse)


Joel 2:32
32 "And it will come about that whoever calls on the name of the Lord
Will be delivered;
For on Mount Zion and in Jerusalem
There will be those who escape,
As the Lord has said,
Even among the survivors whom the Lord calls.



Here we see Paul quote this OT passage about YHWH and apply it to Jesus who is the one and only Lord according to the N.T.


Rom 10:9-13

9 that if you confess with your mouth Jesus as Lord, and believe in your heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved; 10 for with the heart a person believes, resulting in righteousness, and with the mouth he confesses, resulting in salvation. 11 For the Scripture says, "WHOEVER BELIEVES IN HIM WILL NOT BE DISAPPOINTED." 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, abounding in riches for all who call on Him; 13 for "WHOEVER WILL CALL ON THE NAME OF THE LORD WILL BE SAVED."



So a person must confess Jesus is YHWH(Lord) to be saved. Confess means to agree with so the person confessing Jesus is Lord is in agreement that He is YHWH. Whoever will call upon the name of the Lord ( YHWH) will be saved.

hope this helps !!!

But Jesus' name isn't YHWH. Yeshua, Immanuel, etc. None of those names are YHWH, but YHWH is called Father, not Son. YHWH is the Father of Yeshua... hmm... you putting the pieces together yet?

Isaiah 64
8But now, O LORD, You are our Father;
we are the clay, and You are the potter;
we are all the work of Your hand.

 

[David Koberstein]

It doesn't say it's a prayer.

It doesn't say it not. Move on you lost this argument in flames. Have another ham sandwich. Don't forget to wear your pager.

 

[David Koberstein]

I'm not going to ignore Matthew 6:6,9 for you. It's sola scriptura. Your "pray to Jesus" doctrine isn't.

But we are going to ignore you and your vain ramblings. Don't you have a 'woke' meeting to attend?

 

[David Koberstein]

Not much to comment on due to sheer lack of supporting verses. One may argue to the contrary, but there are no explicit examples where someone taught to pray to Jesus in the Bible. There are no examples of the word "pray" or "prayer" being used in conjunction with communicating to Jesus.

The Bible teaches to pray to God the Father. That's it.

Matthew 6​

6But when you pray, go into your inner room, shut your door, and pray to your Father, who is unseen. And your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you.​

​

9So then, this is how you should pray:​

‘Our Father in heaven,​

hallowed be Your name.​

This is heresy is in the first degree. These Unitarian/universalists are people to be avoided at all costs. They disrespect Scripture with their falsehoods. They make Yeshua out to be a glorified Rabbi, rather than a member of the Godhead with absolute power and glory forever.

Shalom

 

[Runningman]

It doesn't say it not. Move on you lost this argument in flames. Have another ham sandwich. Don't forget to wear your pager.

Thanks for at least being entertaining. I do enjoy your dark sense of humor, but try to lighten up a bit. You come off as bitter.

 

[Runningman]

This is heresy is in the first degree. These Unitarian/universalists are people to be avoided at all costs. They disrespect Scripture with their falsehoods. They make Yeshua out to be a glorified Rabbi, rather than a member of the Godhead with absolute power and glory forever.

Shalom

Matthew 6:6,9 is a Biblical Unitarian teaching. It has nothing to do with universalism or Unitarian Universalism. Try to at least speak the truth or get educated.