Irresistible Grace

[brightfame52]

Ignoring scripture as usual

The word of Salvation is sent only to Abes Spiritual Seed, then Faith cometh by hearing, they hear because they are Spiritual. Read Acts 13:26

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

Notice that Paul qualifies the whosoever, to them among you that feareth God, whether jew or non jew, Anyone regenerated is a Spiritual Seed of Abraham regardless of ethnicity.

 

[TomL]

The word of Salvation is sent only to Abes Spiritual Seed, then Faith cometh by hearing, they hear because they are Spiritual. Read Acts 13:26

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

Notice that Paul qualifies the whosoever, to them among you that feareth God, whether jew or non jew, Anyone regenerated is a Spiritual Seed of Abraham regardless of ethnicity.

Duh context

Acts 13:16–28 (KJV 1900) — 16 Then Paul stood up, and beckoning with his hand said, Men of Israel, and ye that fear God, give audience. 17 The God of this people of Israel chose our fathers, and exalted the people when they dwelt as strangers in the land of Egypt, and with an high arm brought he them out of it. 18 And about the time of forty years suffered he their manners in the wilderness. 19 And when he had destroyed seven nations in the land of Chanaan, he divided their land to them by lot. 20 And after that he gave unto them judges about the space of four hundred and fifty years, until Samuel the prophet. 21 And afterward they desired a king: and God gave unto them Saul the son of Cis, a man of the tribe of Benjamin, by the space of forty years. 22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will. 23 Of this man’s seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: 24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel. 25 And as John fulfilled his course, he said, Whom think ye that I am? I am not he. But, behold, there cometh one after me, whose shoes of his feet I am not worthy to loose. 26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent. 27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him. 28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.

Paul is simply related what had previously happened. The message concerning Christ had first been sent to the Jews and religious proselytes

It has nothing at all in it limiting who the gospel is to be preached to today

 

[brightfame52]

Duh context

Acts 13:16–28 (KJV 1900) — 16 Then Paul stood up, and beckoning with his hand said, Men of Israel, and ye that fear God, give audience. 17 The God of this people of Israel chose our fathers, and exalted the people when they dwelt as strangers in the land of Egypt, and with an high arm brought he them out of it. 18 And about the time of forty years suffered he their manners in the wilderness. 19 And when he had destroyed seven nations in the land of Chanaan, he divided their land to them by lot. 20 And after that he gave unto them judges about the space of four hundred and fifty years, until Samuel the prophet. 21 And afterward they desired a king: and God gave unto them Saul the son of Cis, a man of the tribe of Benjamin, by the space of forty years. 22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will. 23 Of this man’s seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: 24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel. 25 And as John fulfilled his course, he said, Whom think ye that I am? I am not he. But, behold, there cometh one after me, whose shoes of his feet I am not worthy to loose. 26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent. 27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him. 28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.

Paul is simply related what had previously happened. The message concerning Christ had first been sent to the Jews and religious proselytes

It has nothing at all in it limiting who the gospel is to be preached to today

The word of Salvation is sent only to Abes Spiritual Seed, then Faith cometh by hearing, they hear because they are Spiritual. Read Acts 13:26

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

Notice that Paul qualifies the whosoever, to them among you that feareth God, whether jew or non jew, Anyone regenerated is a Spiritual Seed of Abraham regardless of ethnicity.

 

[TomL]

The word of Salvation is sent only to Abes Spiritual Seed, then Faith cometh by hearing, they hear because they are Spiritual. Read Acts 13:26

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

Notice that Paul qualifies the whosoever, to them among you that feareth God, whether jew or non jew, Anyone regenerated is a Spiritual Seed of Abraham regardless of ethnicity.

You ignored the context of the verse you quote

Duh context

Acts 13:16–28 (KJV 1900) — 16 Then Paul stood up, and beckoning with his hand said, Men of Israel, and ye that fear God, give audience. 17 The God of this people of Israel chose our fathers, and exalted the people when they dwelt as strangers in the land of Egypt, and with an high arm brought he them out of it. 18 And about the time of forty years suffered he their manners in the wilderness. 19 And when he had destroyed seven nations in the land of Chanaan, he divided their land to them by lot. 20 And after that he gave unto them judges about the space of four hundred and fifty years, until Samuel the prophet. 21 And afterward they desired a king: and God gave unto them Saul the son of Cis, a man of the tribe of Benjamin, by the space of forty years. 22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will. 23 Of this man’s seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: 24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel. 25 And as John fulfilled his course, he said, Whom think ye that I am? I am not he. But, behold, there cometh one after me, whose shoes of his feet I am not worthy to loose. 26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent. 27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him. 28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.

Paul is simply related what had previously happened. The message concerning Christ had first been sent to the Jews and religious proselytes

It has nothing at all in it limiting who the gospel is to be preached to today

and regeneration is not mentioned so you are reading your theology into the passage

 

[brightfame52]

You ignored the context of the verse you quote

Duh context

Acts 13:16–28 (KJV 1900) — 16 Then Paul stood up, and beckoning with his hand said, Men of Israel, and ye that fear God, give audience. 17 The God of this people of Israel chose our fathers, and exalted the people when they dwelt as strangers in the land of Egypt, and with an high arm brought he them out of it. 18 And about the time of forty years suffered he their manners in the wilderness. 19 And when he had destroyed seven nations in the land of Chanaan, he divided their land to them by lot. 20 And after that he gave unto them judges about the space of four hundred and fifty years, until Samuel the prophet. 21 And afterward they desired a king: and God gave unto them Saul the son of Cis, a man of the tribe of Benjamin, by the space of forty years. 22 And when he had removed him, he raised up unto them David to be their king; to whom also he gave testimony, and said, I have found David the son of Jesse, a man after mine own heart, which shall fulfil all my will. 23 Of this man’s seed hath God according to his promise raised unto Israel a Saviour, Jesus: 24 When John had first preached before his coming the baptism of repentance to all the people of Israel. 25 And as John fulfilled his course, he said, Whom think ye that I am? I am not he. But, behold, there cometh one after me, whose shoes of his feet I am not worthy to loose. 26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent. 27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him. 28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.

Paul is simply related what had previously happened. The message concerning Christ had first been sent to the Jews and religious proselytes

It has nothing at all in it limiting who the gospel is to be preached to today

and regeneration is not mentioned so you are reading your theology into the passage

The word of Salvation is sent only to Abes Spiritual Seed, then Faith cometh by hearing, they hear because they are Spiritual. Read Acts 13:26

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

Notice that Paul qualifies the whosoever, to them among you that feareth God, whether jew or non jew, Anyone regenerated is a Spiritual Seed of Abraham regardless of ethnicity.

 

[TomL]

The word of Salvation is sent only to Abes Spiritual Seed, then Faith cometh by hearing, they hear because they are Spiritual. Read Acts 13:26

26 Men and brethren, children of the stock of Abraham, and whosoever among you feareth God, to you is the word of this salvation sent.

Notice that Paul qualifies the whosoever, to them among you that feareth God, whether jew or non jew, Anyone regenerated is a Spiritual Seed of Abraham regardless of ethnicity.

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/irresistible-grace.340/post-66843

 

[brightfame52]

https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/irresistible-grace.340/post-66843

Same thing with Cornelius, a man that feared God, which denotes regeneration, and God sent Peter to preach the Gospel to him and his house as well. Very specific Acts 10:1-2

There was a certain man in Caesarea called Cornelius, a centurion of the band called the Italian band,

2 A devout man, and one that feared God with all his house, which gave much alms to the people, and prayed to God alway.

Peter later said God sent him to Cornelius the Gentile so he can hear[spiritually] and believe Acts 15:7

And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

Thats regeneration before and in order to hear and believe.

I already know you cant accept this truth, but maybe someone else can

 

[TomL]

Same thing with Cornelius, a man that feared God, which denotes regeneration, and God sent Peter to preach the Gospel to him and his house as well. Very specific Acts 10:1-2

There was a certain man in Caesarea called Cornelius, a centurion of the band called the Italian band,

2 A devout man, and one that feared God with all his house, which gave much alms to the people, and prayed to God alway.

Peter later said God sent him to Cornelius the Gentile so he can hear[spiritually] and believe Acts 15:7

And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

Thats regeneration before and in order to hear and believe.

I already know you cant accept this truth, but maybe someone else can

Sorry that is mere assumption and begging the question

Regeneration by definition is the impartation of life



The following verses show faith precedes life

John 5:24 (KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. John 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

John 20:31 (KJV)
31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

John 5:40 (KJV)
40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

Acts 11:18 (KJV)
18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

John 6:57 (KJV)
57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.

Regeneration makes one a child of God. Born of God -

One is made a child of God through faith

John 1:12 (KJV)
12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Galatians 3:26 (KJV)
26 For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus.

John 12:36 (KJV)
36 While ye have light, believe in the light, that ye may be the children of light. These things spake Jesus, and departed, and did hide himself from them.

Regeneration is a spiritual resurrection.



We are raised spiritually through faith

Colossians 2:12 (KJV)
12 Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead.

One is born again(regenerated) through faith in gospel

James 1:18 (KJV)
18 Of his own will begat he us with the word of truth, that we should be a kind of firstfruits of his creatures.

1 Peter 1:23 (KJV)
23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

1 Corinthians 4:15 (KJV)
15 For though ye have ten thousand instructors in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.


Regeneration is the mechanism of salvation

Titus 3:5 (KJV)
5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

Ephesians 2:5 (KJV)
5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved

it is through faith we are saved

EPH 2:8 (KJV)
Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

.

Regeneration is preceded by remission of sin

Colossians 2:13 (KJV)
13 And you, being dead in your sins and the uncircumcision of your flesh, hath he quickened together with him, having forgiven you all trespasses;

which requires both faith and repentance

Acts 10:43 (KJV)
43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

Luke 24:47 (KJV)
47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.

Acts 5:31 (KJV)
31 Him hath God exalted with his right hand to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Sorry that is mere assumption and begging the question

Regeneration by definition is the impartation of life


The following verses show faith precedes life

John 5:24 (KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. John 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.

John 20:31 (KJV)
31 But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

John 5:40 (KJV)
40 And ye will not come to me, that ye might have life.

Acts 11:18 (KJV)
18 When they heard these things, they held their peace, and glorified God, saying, Then hath God also to the Gentiles granted repentance unto life.

John 6:57 (KJV)
57 As the living Father hath sent me, and I live by the Father: so he that eateth me, even he shall live by me.

Why does one person believe and another not?

It has nothing to do with free will. Believing is not an act of will, free or otherwise.

Why does a child believe in Santa Claus? Because he has blind trust in the parent who tells him the story.

Why does an adult NOT believe in Santa Claus? Because we only believe what we are convinced to be true. Doubting Thomas had to feel the evidence for himself to believe it was Jesus resurrected. Then he was convinced it was true. It had nothing to do with an act of will, free or otherwise.

So the real question is, why is one person convinced the Gospel is true and another not convinced? You can't convince yourself of anything of your own free will. There must be another reason having nothing to do with will.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Why does one person believe and another not?

It has nothing to do with free will. Believing is not an act of will, free or otherwise.

Why does a child believe in Santa Claus? Because he has blind trust in the parent who tells him the story.

Oversimplification. We know Santa Claus isn't real because we know were the lie came from. Men blindly follow what they've been told because they are too lazy to know otherwise.

Why does an adult NOT believe in Santa Claus? Because we only believe what we are convinced to be true. Doubting Thomas had to feel the evidence for himself to believe it was Jesus resurrected. Then he was convinced it was true. It had nothing to do with an act of will, free or otherwise.

Skepticism teaches.,.... I realized that at an early age that I was being lied to. I've been a skeptic ever since. Liars tell lies frequently. They live in lies. You can easily tell who is a liar and who isn't. Just pay attention to them.

So the real question is, why is one person convinced the Gospel is true and another not convinced? You can't convince yourself of anything of your own free will. There must be another reason having nothing to do with will.

The will accepts lies or rejects them. That is all men's choices.

I have some advice. Don't listen to those who are inconsistent. Telling lies requires inconsistency.

 

[TomL]

Why does one person believe and another not?

It has nothing to do with free will. Believing is not an act of will, free or otherwise.

Why does a child believe in Santa Claus? Because he has blind trust in the parent who tells him the story.

Why does an adult NOT believe in Santa Claus? Because we only believe what we are convinced to be true. Doubting Thomas had to feel the evidence for himself to believe it was Jesus resurrected. Then he was convinced it was true. It had nothing to do with an act of will, free or otherwise.

So the real question is, why is one person convinced the Gospel is true and another not convinced? You can't convince yourself of anything of your own free will. There must be another reason having nothing to do with will.

Biblically, faith requires one to entrust oneself to the object of belief

You cannot entrust yourself without an act of the will.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Biblically, faith requires one to entrust oneself to the object of belief

You cannot entrust yourself without an act of the will.

You're talking about faith, not belief.

 

[john]

Why does one person believe and another not?

It has nothing to do with free will. Believing is not an act of will, free or otherwise.

Why does a child believe in Santa Claus? Because he has blind trust in the parent who tells him the story.

Why does an adult NOT believe in Santa Claus? Because we only believe what we are convinced to be true. Doubting Thomas had to feel the evidence for himself to believe it was Jesus resurrected. Then he was convinced it was true. It had nothing to do with an act of will, free or otherwise.

So the real question is, why is one person convinced the Gospel is true and another not convinced? You can't convince yourself of anything of your own free will. There must be another reason having nothing to do with will.

you can have your reformed salvation honestly there is nothing new its like a broken record keep repeating the same thing over and over .. it was the same thing in carm forum. Free will exist we are not robots or like play time sports teams. waiting to be picked . but never the less i am through you folks hash it out .i got better things to do

 

[Maurice]

you can have your reformed salvation honestly there is nothing new its like a broken record keep repeating the same thing over and over .. it was the same thing in carm forum. Free will exist we are not robots or like play time sports teams. waiting to be picked . but never the less i am through you folks hash it out .i got better things to do

There are a lot of other topics here that you could discuss John. Calvinism vs. Arminianism is always going to be this way. What's another topic that you like to discuss.

 

[john]

There are a lot of other topics here that you could discuss John. Calvinism vs. Arminianism is always going to be this way. What's another topic that you like to discuss.

anything but Calvinism its nothing more than a beating of the Church my doctrine is correct . i did this debate in the carm forum called false teacher and few other names . did a email correspondence with a man who had Parkinson's. we went back and forth for weeks every scripture he gave me, i countered it back. he tried so hard to win me over to Calvinism. he finally gave up. if you noticed i blew up at one after i got tired of his childish remarks . he is on ignore and will stay that way

 

[Maurice]

anything but Calvinism its nothing more than a beating of the Church my doctrine is correct . i did this debate in the carm forum called false teacher and few other names . did a email correspondence with a man who had Parkinson's. we went back and forth for weeks every scripture he gave me, i countered it back. he tried so hard to win me over to Calvinism. he finally gave up. if you noticed i blew up at one after i got tired of his childish remarks . he is on ignore and will stay that way

I don't blame you if someone's giving you a hard time putting them on ignore it's a good idea. I'll come here to have a good time not to argue with people. I enjoy sharing what I believe in gracious manner. And if other people have completely different ideas I'll listen to them as long as they're not rude. Anyway I hope you enjoy yourself here. If you start a thread on your favorite topic I'll be sure to drop by.

 

[TomL]

You're talking about faith, not belief.

Same Greek word Pistis

 

[brightfame52]

The Call of Grace is irresistible because its attended with power, like Paul's call and conversion Gal 1:15

But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,

It was a set time in purpose of God when Paul would be called, converted and put into the ministry. Also those like Paul who shall experience the irresistible call of Grace, they were separated from their mothers womb as well for this call of Grace.

 

[brightfame52]

On Gal 1:15 one writer states:

Gal 1:15 (KJB)But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace, Pleased - Delight in, approve, or consentSeparated - Set apart or having selected Here is an interesting verse stating that God was pleased when He had separated Paul or selected Him from his mother’s womb. God knows who His elect are even before they are born. God had chosen all His elect before the foundations of the world. (Eph 1:4 KJV) According as he hath chosen us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and without blame before him in love: Even though those of us who are saved, became saved at different times in our lives, yet, all the Elect of God were chosen before the foundation of the world. All of the Elect were set apart in our mother’s womb even if we do not get saved until later in life. This salvation is our calling by grace and grace alone. It is interesting that Paul injects that he was saved from his mother’s womb and I believe the reason is that the Judaizers had emphasized works to coincide with grace for salvation. If a person is in the womb, then what works can they do to facilitate their salvation? The answer is obvious, they can do none and this is why this verse is included because it shows that grace is the only vehicle by which a person can be saved, even in the womb where no works can be done. How could the Judaizers debate works with a person who was saved from the womb without works? This is the wisdom of the Scriptures.

Galatians 1:13-18

 

[TomL]

The Call of Grace is irresistible because its attended with power, like Paul's call and conversion Gal 1:15

But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb, and called me by his grace,

It was a set time in purpose of God when Paul would be called, converted and put into the ministry. Also those like Paul who shall experience the irresistible call of Grace, they were separated from their mothers womb as well for this call of Grace.

The gospel is the only call to salvation found in the bible


Gal 1:6I am astonished that you are so quickly deserting him who called you in the grace of Christ and are turning to a different gospel—

2 Thess 2:14To this he called you through our gospel, so that you may obtain the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.