The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
Same root word, not always meaning faith.
Irresistible Grace
- Thread starter civic
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Same root word, not always meaning faith.
civic
Well-known member
definitely not in any one of our 66 books of the bible.This is from the Book of BrightFame, Chapter 1 Verse 1.
brightfame52
Well-known member
You see 2 Thess 2:14 ? Thats irresistible grace, effectual call Illustrated. You see who is called by the Gospel in this context ? Look at Vs 13
13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
Its the elect. Paul told them earlier they evidenced of being Gods elect 1 Thess 1:3-4
4 Knowing, brethren beloved, your election of God.
5 For our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance; as ye know what manner of men we were among you for your sake.
God chose to save gentiles by sanctification of the Spirit and belief in the truth
nothing there about irresistible grace
Once again you read your theology into the passage
brightfame52
Well-known member
That call of the Gospel is effectual and its only to the elect. Election to salvation isnt based on ethnicity, the called come out of jew and gentile Rom 9:23-24
23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory,
24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?
brightfame52
Well-known member
@TomL
No different than jews, same sanctification of the Spirit 1 Pet 1:1-2
Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
They along with Gentiles were also effectually called 1 Pet 2:9
9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;
No different than jews, same sanctification of the Spirit 1 Pet 1:1-2
Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.
They along with Gentiles were also effectually called 1 Pet 2:9
9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;
Nothing about unconditional election there
Nonsense the gospel call goes out to many who do not respond,
brightfame52
Well-known member
When it goes out for Salvation purposes its only to the elect, however it serves as a savor of death to the non elect 2 Cor 2
14 Now thanks be unto God, which always causeth us to triumph in Christ, and maketh manifest the savour of his knowledge by us in every place.
15 For we are unto God a sweet savour of Christ, in them that are saved[regenerated], and in them that perish[unregenerate]:
16 To the one[unregenerate] we are the savour of death unto death; and to the other[elect regenerate] the savour of life unto life. And who is sufficient for these things?
Still nonsense
1 Timothy 4:10 (ESV) — 10 For to this end we toil and strive, because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe.
John 4:42 (ESV) — 42 They said to the woman, “It is no longer because of what you said that we believe, for we have heard for ourselves, and we know that this is indeed the Savior of the world.”
1 John 4:14 (ESV) — 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
brightfame52
Well-known member
You cant see it.
It is not there
1 Timothy 4:10 (ESV) — 10 For to this end we toil and strive, because we have our hope set on the living God, who is the Savior of all people, especially of those who believe.
John 4:42 (ESV) — 42 They said to the woman, “It is no longer because of what you said that we believe, for we have heard for ourselves, and we know that this is indeed the Savior of the world.”
1 John 4:14 (ESV) — 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world.
civic
Well-known member
Yes that book keeps popping up lol.This is from the Book of BrightFame, Chapter 1 Verse 1.
Rockson
Well-known member
If it was the way you say it there's no need for the word of Salvation. You have them regenerated before the gospel. Regenerated means bring brought back to LIFE. If they've been brought back to life they would have already be in that state of salvation. And now you say they need something to save them?
brightfame52
Well-known member
The word of Salvation informs the saved they are saved, duh. Would it be good news to you if you found out your sins have been , youve been Justified by the blood of Christ.
civic
Well-known member
Amen
Rockson
Well-known member
You've just blatantly admitted you don't know what the gospel is.
Let's just take this one line of yours....."Would it be good news to you if you found out your sins have been" ( I take it you mean forgiven) and you've been justified by the blood of Jesus.
My response: Yes that would be good to know. It would not however be necessary if all the gospel is to you is the knowledge that you have been saved. Why would it be necessary in your paradigm? The salvation message (the gospel) according to you eternal life had already been imparted. If someone filled the tank of your automobile full of gas just because you didn't know about it that wouldn't get you in trouble out on the road. So clearly your doctrine is really saying you don't REALLY need the gospel being preached. While to you you might say it's interesting information however not truly and absolutely needed.
That is NOT the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ! Men must hear the gospel and believe in order ----->to be saved. So the gospel you Calvinists bring IS NOT, I repeat IS NOT the gospel of the Lord Jesus Christ. It is that of another and not from God! To be fair I'm not even sure all Calvinist even believe what you're saying either. The others are wrong but sorry you're especially wrong.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Duh its the Gospel of their Salvation sent to them. Thats why its called the Gospel of their Salvation Eph 1:13
13 In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
You see that ? OF YOUR SALVATION The your means you are now in possession of Salvation, its Good News to you.
I can see you in the dark on this matter. Comes from years of false teaching.
Rockson
Well-known member
Sorry but you're reasoning here is extremely shallow.
For the reason that in writing to Christians he said the gospel or good news of your salvation in no way indicates or goes against the gospel or the good news not belonging to those who hadn't received.
Consider long and hard on this. When the Emancipation Proclamation took place some slaves didn't make use of the gospel or the good news of their salvation or legal deliverance. It was still the EP or the good news of their salvation whether they made use of it or not. So because someone writes a letter to those who did does not go to say it wasn't the gospel of salvation to those who didn't. To understand the gospel (good news) you have great need of understanding covenant more than you do. I can give other examples of this as well.
