Aeliana
Well-known member
Give it a try and let me know how that works out for you.
God is Love
- Thread starter civic
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101G
Well-known member
(smile) lol, lol, lol, you know you're wrong for that......Give it a try and let me know how that works out for you.
......101G.
Complete
Well-known member
'In (the) beginning God created the heaven and the earth.
And the earth was without form, and void;
and darkness was upon the face of the deep.
And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
(Gen. 1:1)
Hi @101G,
I remember reading that the wording of Gen. 1:1 is actually, 'in beginning', with no word, 'the,' attached. This makes a difference to my perspective at least. As you say there was no beginning as such, but God began a work at that point.
I must just comment on your words concerning the term, 'the sons of God', (Gen. 6:2 & 4, Job 1:6), for in the verses I have referred to here reference is being made to Angels who are called so, because created by God, as Adam was, in the generations of Christ. as, 'son of God' (Luke 3:38), also those who have been born from above, a new creation in Christ Jesus are called, 'sons of God' (John 1:12).
I don't want to divert the subject of the thread, so please don't begin a discussion on this here. I have created a thread should you want to do so:- https://berean-apologetics.community.forum/threads/sons-of-god-because-created-by-god.2470/
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
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101G
Well-known member
GINOLJC, to all.
First thanks for the reply. second, "in the" beginning, is our starting point of God's creation. God has no beginning or end. the "the" is for us, not God. it is our beginning. hope that helps.
there is no angel called a son of God anywhere in the bible. for Hebrews 1:5 clearly states, "For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?" not even a fallen angel. only men and women are sons of God. (if you like we can discuss these sons of God in Genesis and Job. as for the NT, your Luke 3:38 refer to the HUMAN "man" Adam. and as for John 1:12 "But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:" READ the two verses above and understand, John 1:10 "He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not." John 1:11 "He came unto his own, and his own received him not." his OWN", meaning humans. this is bared out in the regeneration, you have mention, 2 Corinthians 6:17 "Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you," 2 Corinthians 6:18 "And will be a Father unto you, and ye shall be my sons and daughters, saith the Lord Almighty."
sure 101G will go there.
again in MUCH G.L.
101G.
Complete
Well-known member
Thank you @101G
Hello @101G,
I am assured that the word, 'the' in Genesis 1:1, is not in the original writings. So it reads, 'In beginning', so not referring to a time, but an action.
The Lord Jesus Christ is God's Only Begotten Son (John 1:14, 18; 3:16, 18; Heb. 11:17;1 John 4:9). Those who believe the testimony that God has given concerning His Son the Lord Jesus Christ, now risen and glorified and sat at God's right hand, and are trusting in His one, all-sufficient sacrifice for sin, have received the spirit of adoption (Rom. 8:15), and are awaiting the redemption of their bodies by the resurrection out from among the dead (Romans 8:23) in which our adoption will be entered into. Praise God!
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
Hello @101G,
I am assured that the word, 'the' in Genesis 1:1, is not in the original writings. So it reads, 'In beginning', so not referring to a time, but an action.
The Lord Jesus Christ is God's Only Begotten Son (John 1:14, 18; 3:16, 18; Heb. 11:17;1 John 4:9). Those who believe the testimony that God has given concerning His Son the Lord Jesus Christ, now risen and glorified and sat at God's right hand, and are trusting in His one, all-sufficient sacrifice for sin, have received the spirit of adoption (Rom. 8:15), and are awaiting the redemption of their bodies by the resurrection out from among the dead (Romans 8:23) in which our adoption will be entered into. Praise God!
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
civic
Well-known member
The Hebrew word for angel in not used in the genesis 6 text. Thats an assumption made by many.
101G
Well-known member
GINOLJC, to all.
Hello Complete., please understand, A. Jesus the Christ is begotten, but not JESUS.. and B. know the difference between the Son of God and the Son of Man ok.
now to help you out, Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Isaiah 9:7 "Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the LORD of hosts will perform this."
Please note, , Isaiah 9:6 "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: see the difference now? that son, yes, that son which was given came from heaven, and dwelt in a body, (John 1:14 18 ... 3:16, and that Child, which came out of Mary, housed that son that came from heaven.
now as for the ONLY BEGOTTEN, is just as the FIRST BORN...... in what CONTEXT? here, Only as you posted in Hebrews 11:17 "By faith Abraham, when he was tried, offered up Isaac: and he that had received the promises offered up his only begotten son," well Isaac was NOT his only son... naturally, but by promise of God, YES. so check your context.... ok.
in MUCH G.L.
101G
101G
Well-known member
correct, and also may 101G add this. if it was angels who was in violation, why God punished all the men? was it not the .... so-called fallen angels and women whom they supposed to lay with was in violation according to some translations? why not punish the angels and the women that supposed to have sex in violation? Genesis 6:7 "And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them."
why not destroy the angels and the women who was responsible for these giants in the first place. so why destroy ... all men and all the animals? why? .... why every man? was it just the angels and the women who was in suppose violation? ... why every man must take the destruction? that's not a righteous God destroying all and every just for a few who supposed to violate his law. that don't make sense. why punish civic for what 101G did? no can't buy that. if 101G sin, then civic get punish? no, that aint right. we all must give an account as to what we did in our ... "OWN" bodies. not for someone else. so, correct, there was no angels in involvement.
101G
Complete
Well-known member
'That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair;
and they took them wives of all which they chose.'
(Gen 6:2)
Hello @civic,
No, it is not, but a distinction is made very clearly in Genesis 6:2, between these differing species, by the terms,'the sons of God', and 'the daughters of men', the same distinction is made in the prophets and the psalms, reference being made to, 'sons of men' (e.g., Prov. 8:31 & Eccl. 9:12. Jer. 32:19) and in the N.T. e.g., (Eph. 3:2). Here in Gen. 2, reference is made to 'sons of God', as in (Job 1:6; Dan. 3:25) spoken of angelic beings.
Please don't destroy the subject of the thread, by continuing this discussion here, when I have begun a new thread to do so.
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
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Complete
Well-known member
'And the Word was made flesh,
and dwelt among us,
(and we beheld His glory,
the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,)
full of grace and truth.'
(Joh 1:14)
Hello @101G,
The Lord Jesus Christ is both, 'Son of God,' and, 'Son of Man,' because born of God and also born of a woman. He is the Only Begotten, because He was begotten and not made, as Adam was. God was 'in' Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself.
In Christ Jesus
Chris
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Complete
Well-known member
'And GOD saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth,
and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
And it repented the LORD that He had made man on the earth,
and it grieved Him at His heart.
And the LORD said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth;
both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air;
for it repenteth me that I have made them.'
(Gen 6:5-7)
Hello @101G,
The verses above tells us why God destroyed all flesh in which was the breath of life,
And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth,
to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven;
and every thing that is in the earth shall die.'
(Gen 6:17)
Only Noah and his family was not destroyed, because only his pedigree had not been contaminated, and therefore only He could take the seed of the woman on to another generation (Gen. 6:9).
In Christ Jesus
Chris
101G
Well-known member
complete, 101G must disagree. let's look at your scriptures. Job 1:6 "Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the LORD, and Satan came also among them." just because Satan came among men, that don't make him a son. example, if 101G had a family reunion and complete came among us do that make you a family member of 101G's family? no, nor do it here in Job 1:6. for if you would have read Job 1:3 FIRST, you would have had your answer. "His substance also was seven thousand sheep, and three thousand camels, and five hundred yoke of oxen, and five hundred she asses, and a very great household; so that this man was the greatest of all the men of the east."
this term "MEN" here is the verse is the Hebrew term
H1121 בֵּן ben (bane) n-m.
בָּנִים baniym (ba-neem') [plural]
בְּנִי bniy (ben-ee') [possessive singular]
בָּנַי banay (baw-nah'ee) [possessive plural]
(used widely) a son (as a builder of the family name).
{in the widest sense of literal and figurative relationship, including grandson, subject, nation, quality or condition, etc., (like H1 H251, etc.).}
[from H1129]
KJV: + afflicted, age, (Ahoh-) (Ammon-) (Hachmon-) (Lev-)ite, (anoint-)ed one, appointed to, (+) arrow, (Assyr-) (Babylon-) (Egypt-) (Grec-)ian, one born, bough, branch, breed, + (young) bullock, + (young) calf, X came up in, child, colt, X common, X corn, daughter, X of first, + firstborn, foal, + very fruitful, + postage, X in, + kid, + lamb, (+) man, meet, + mighty, + nephew, old, (+) people, + rebel, + robber, X servant born, X soldier, son, + spark, + steward, + stranger, X surely, them of, + tumultuous one, + valiant(-est), whelp, worthy, young (one), youth.
Root(s): H1129
this is the same term use of "sons" in Genesis chapter 6. yes, the same term. question, why not use H376 אִישׁ 'iysh (eesh) n-m.?
H376 אִישׁ 'iysh (eesh) n-m.
אִישִׁים 'iysh (eesh) [plural]
a man as an individual or a male person.
{often used as an adjunct to a more definite term (and in such cases frequently not expressed in translation).}
[contracted for H582 (or perhaps rather from an unused root meaning to be extant)]
KJV: also, another, any (man), a certain, + champion, consent, each, every (one), fellow, (foot-, husband-)man, (good-, great, mighty) man, he, high (degree), him (that is), husband, man(-kind), + none, one, people, person, + steward, what (man) soever, whoso(-ever), worthy.
Root(s): H582
or why not use H582 אֱנוֹשׁ 'enowsh (en-oshe') n-m. do not both of these words describe a "Man" or "MEN?"
H582 אֱנוֹשׁ 'enowsh (en-oshe') n-m.
אֲנָשִׁים 'enowsh (en-oshe') [plural]
1. (properly) a mortal (and thus differing from the more dignified H120).
2. (hence) a man in general (singly or collectively).
{It is often unexpressed in the English versions, especially when used in apposition with another word.}
[from H605]
so, why use H1121 בֵּן ben (bane) n-m. for Job? answer, Job 1:1 "There was a man in the land of Uz, whose name was Job; and that man was perfect and upright, and one that feared God, and eschewed evil." this is why because he was "RIGHTIOUS" before God, meaning he was a "son of God"... oh this is too easy.
and in Dan. 3:25, the term is "son" which is the Hebrew word,
H1247 בַּר bar (bar) n-m.
1. a son.
2. a grandson, etc.
[(Aramaic) corresponding to H1121]
KJV: X old, son.
Root(s): H1121
the [(Aramaic) corresponding to H1121] so, who is H121? answer, the same term used for JOB. H1121 בֵּן ben (bane) n-m.but here used with the capital "S" indicating the Lord Jesus, God al mighty who was to come in flesh as, as, as, a man..... LIKE Job, perfect, and upright and eschewed evil. yes, that one.
H1121 בֵּן ben (bane) n-m.
בָּנִים baniym (ba-neem') [plural]
בְּנִי bniy (ben-ee') [possessive singular]
בָּנַי banay (baw-nah'ee) [possessive plural]
(used widely) a son (as a builder of the family name).
{in the widest sense of literal and figurative relationship, including grandson, subject, nation, quality or condition, etc., (like H1 H251, etc.).}
[from H1129]
KJV: + afflicted, age, (Ahoh-) (Ammon-) (Hachmon-) (Lev-)ite, (anoint-)ed one, appointed to, (+) arrow, (Assyr-) (Babylon-) (Egypt-) (Grec-)ian, one born, bough, branch, breed, + (young) bullock, + (young) calf, X came up in, child, colt, X common, X corn, daughter, X of first, + firstborn, foal, + very fruitful, + postage, X in, + kid, + lamb, (+) man, meet, + mighty, + nephew, old, (+) people, + rebel, + robber, X servant born, X soldier, son, + spark, + steward, + stranger, X surely, them of, + tumultuous one, + valiant(-est), whelp, worthy, young (one), youth.
Root(s): H1129
in MUCH G.L.
101G.
101G
Well-known member
again 101G cannot buy that, and here's why... LISTEN CAREFULLY. Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come." note, "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses" .... even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression. so did Noah and his family die in the flood? no, so then there was some who did not sin after the similitude of Adam's transgression... but yet died... maybe post flood? but was it do to their pedigree, no, don't think so. because they was NOT contaminated, according to Romans 5:14 .
101G
in Much G.L.
101G.
Complete
Well-known member
'Now there was a day when the sons of God came
to present themselves before the LORD,
and Satan came also among them.'
(Job 1:6)
'When the morning stars sang together,
and all the sons of God shouted for joy?
(Job 38:7)
Hello @101G,
Satan is an angelic being. and the term, 'the sons of God' in both these verses refer to angelic beings.
Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris
