Faith precedes life !

I'm asking because I've yet to hear a Calvinist admit to his own repentance. Many of them talk about a sudden conversion experience. My best understanding of their experience is as if they were zapped by Thor's lightning bolt. Repentance ends up being a overlooked afterthought for them.
I just touched a bit on that in #279.

I agree I never hear of any talking about repentance...

I do, and I have even embellished some of me elsewhere . When I got the Holy spirit he hit me not with lightening but as if to tell me...
"I am not fooling around this time". And it has not always been easy.

I do not think a Calvinist would admit that because I have a hunch they feel separate from ... Ill say me, so no one will say I am accusing of wrongdoing... or maybe they feel
priviledged. I notice few will use Calvin's reprobate not making it... so either they have not read or heard or they don't believe.

But then if They receive Gods grace then immediately receive their faith... maybe they simply feel they dont need to?
 
I dont want to take time for all that, you havent even grasped the most simple truth, the unregenerate person cannot please God
Then I am not pleasing God and I am headed for hell. There, are you happy.

Now, can I go live my life any old way because I am unregenerated.

BTW.... I did say this......

(no idea how you fit repentance into this).

And unless you have clearly repented you are not regenerated...... So be a good boy and tell those folks how repentance fits into your
beliefs.
 
Quit going in circles, been there done that
Just as I predicted. You want to bail out. That's ok. I hope it was as fun for you as it was for me. We identified several calvinist idiotic beliefs such as:
  1. "Unless God takes you out of your flesh, you are stuck with his displeasure" (credit: MTMattie)
  2. "Calvinists, the Twice Saved".
There's alot more idiotic calvinist beliefs that I can add to this list (like the Living Dead) but this list will suffice to brand calvinism as heresy.
 
Just as I predicted. You want to bail out. That's ok. I hope it was as fun for you as it was for me. We identified several calvinist idiotic beliefs such as:
  1. "Unless God takes you out of your flesh, you are stuck with his displeasure" (credit: MTMattie)
  2. "Calvinists, the Twice Saved".
There's alot more idiotic calvinist beliefs that I can add to this list (like the Living Dead) but this list will suffice to brand calvinism as heresy.
They which are in the flesh cannot please God, no way around it
 
They which are in the flesh cannot please God, no way around it
Faith does please God. There's no way around it.

Faith comes by hearing and believing the word of God. Our ears and mind are part of our flesh. There's no way around that either.

(Rom 10:17) So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
 
@synergy

Faith does please God. There's no way around it.

Okay

Faith comes by hearing and believing the word of God. Our ears and mind are part of our flesh. There's no way around that either.

okay

(Rom 10:17) So then faith comes by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.

Okay

Now, they which are in the flesh cannot please God Rom 8:8

8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

There's no way around this, yet you keep going in circles
 
You starting to sound bizarre now, Rom 8:8
It's bizarre to you because you refuse to acknowledge the fact that Rom 8 is talking about regenerates, not unregenerates.

Let's look at Rom 8 again. Tell me, to who are the "those", "me", "who", "you", "we", "many" pronouns pointing to? Regenerates or unregenerates? Your refusal to answer will be taken as an acknowledgement that calvinism is heresy.

(Rom 8:1-17)
1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus, who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.
3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.
5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
6 For to be carnally minded is death, but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be.
8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.
9 But you are not in the flesh but in the Spirit, if indeed the Spirit of God dwells in you. Now if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not His.
10 And if Christ is in you, the body is dead because of sin, but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.
11 But if the Spirit of Him who raised Jesus from the dead dwells in you, He who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through His Spirit who dwells in you.
12 Therefore, brethren, we are debtors--not to the flesh, to live according to the flesh.
13 For if you live according to the flesh you will die; but if by the Spirit you put to death the deeds of the body, you will live.
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, these are sons of God.
15 For you did not receive the spirit of bondage again to fear, but you received the Spirit of adoption by whom we cry out, "Abba, Father."
16 The Spirit Himself bears witness with our spirit that we are children of God,
17 and if children, then heirs--heirs of God and joint heirs with Christ, if indeed we suffer with Him, that we may also be glorified together.
 
Have you fixed your glasses issue yet because you're going to need them.

Let's look at what Mark 1:15 says and not what Calvinists say. Mark 1:15 records the following from Christ:

15 and saying, “The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand. Repent, and believe (πιστεύετε) in the gospel.”

The Greek word πιστεύετε (believe) is an imperative active verb. That's pretty salvific, wouldn't you say? Christ implores/exhorts us to actively believe. That's our active part. There is nothing passive about it. That's Synergism in full bloom.
Nothing about SALVATION being a cooperative effort there. Repeating yourself is not helping make your case.
 
You are talking about initial salvation and TOTALLY ignore sanctification-cutting out synergism which is biblical




And you completely misunderstand the Scriptures.
Ephesians 2:8-9 – Salvation by Grace Through Faith (Human Response Required)
Greek and Morphology Analysis
τῇ γὰρ χάριτί ἐστε σεσῳσμένοι διὰ πίστεως· καὶ τοῦτο οὐκ ἐξ ὑμῶν, θεοῦ τὸ δῶρον· οὐκ ἐξ ἔργων, ἵνα μή τις καυχήσηται.

ἐστε σεσῳσμένοι (este sesōsmenoi) – Perfect Passive Participle of σῴζω (sōzō, "to save")

The perfect tense signifies a completed action with continuing results.

The passive voice shows that salvation originates from God.

διὰ πίστεως (dia pisteōs, "through faith") – πίστις (pistis, "faith") in the genitive case functions as the means or instrument of salvation.

This excludes automatic regeneration because faith is the necessary response.

Dana & Mantey (p. 103) confirm that διά with the genitive denotes means, not cause—faith is the channel, not the origin.

οὐκ ἐξ ἔργων (ouk ex ergōn, "not of works") – This excludes meritorious actions but does not nullify the necessity of faith as a response.

BDAG (p. 818) emphasizes that ἔργα (erga, "works") in Pauline thought generally refers to the Law, not the exercise of faith itself.

Synergistic Implication
Faith (πίστις) is necessary for the realization of salvation. If faith were automatically given after regeneration (monergism), Paul would not say that salvation is "through faith." Instead, salvation is by grace, through the means of faith, necessitating human response.

Paul explicitly teaches that confession and faith precede salvation, contradicting monergism. If salvation were entirely unilateral, Paul would have written, "You will be saved, and then you will confess and believe." Instead, confession and belief are prerequisites, making salvation synergistic.


Joh_1:12 "But as many as received Him" This shows humanity's part in salvation (cf. Joh_1:16). Humans must respond to God's offer of grace in Christ (cf. Joh_3:16; Rom_3:24; Rom_4:4-5; Rom_6:23; Rom_10:9-13; Eph_2:8-9). God is certainly sovereign, yet in His sovereignty He has initiated a conditional covenant relationship with fallen humanity. Fallen mankind must repent, believe, obey, and persevere in faith.
This concept of "receiving" is theologically parallel to "believing" and "confessing," which denoted a public profession of faith in Jesus as the Christ (cf. Mat_10:32; Luk_12:8; Joh_9:22; Joh_12:42; 1Ti_6:12; 1Jn_2:23; 1Jn_4:15). Salvation is a gift that must be received and acknowledged.
Those who "receive" Jesus (Joh_1:12) receive the Father who sent Him (cf. Joh_13:20; Mat_10:40). Salvation is a personal relationship with the Triune God!
Utley.


"through faith" Faith receives God's free gift in Christ (cf. Rom_3:22; Rom_3:25; Rom_4:5; Rom_9:30; Gal_2:16; Gal_3:24; 1Pe_1:5). Mankind must respond to God's offer of grace and forgiveness in Christ (cf. Joh_1:12; Joh_3:16-17; Joh_3:36; Joh_6:40; Joh_11:25-26; Rom_10:9-13).
God deals with fallen mankind by means of a covenant. He always takes the initiative (cf. Joh_6:44; Joh_6:65) and sets the agenda and the boundaries (cf. Mar_1:15; Act_3:16; Act_3:19; Act_20:21). He allows fallen mankind to participate in their own salvation by responding to His covenant offer. The mandated response is both initial and continuing faith. It involves repentance, obedience, service, worship, and perseverance.
The term "faith" in the OT is a metaphorical extension of a stable stance. It came to denote that which is sure, trustworthy, dependable, and faithful. None of these describe even redeemed fallen mankind. It is not mankind's trustworthiness, or faithfulness, or dependability, but God's. We trust in His trustworthy promises, not our trustworthiness! Covenant obedience flows from gratitude! The focus has always been on His faithfulness, not the believers' faith! Faith cannot save anyone. Only grace saves, but it is received by faith. The focus is never on the amount of faith (cf. Mat_17:20), but on its object (Jesus).
Utley


J.
Salvation and sanctification are two different things.

It's through faith, faith is the means, not because of faith.
 
Its not about that, its about the one in the flesh cant please God, and faith pleases God, believing in the Son is pleasing to God
YOU stop going in circles and define who it is with faith that pleases God, and who believes in the Son is pleasing to God.

You keep talking about this flesh thing but you refuse to explain how one has God pleasing faith , because even though many have
answered you on this ALL YOU EVER SAY IS THOSE IN THE FLESH CANNOT PLEASE GOD.

So according to you so long as one is living, they cannot please God for unless you are spiritually dissembled from the body God gave you you cannot please him.

And if you are meaning the rotten sinning that man does with his flesh... granted that will never please God. No one said any different.

Now if you are one of those able to leave his body.... lets talk about that.

Otherwise... get off the flesh thing for you accuse , condemn and judge... yet were not given that authority
 
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