Eternal Justification !

[brightfame52]

First knock it off by creating our own bible verses. The closest I could find to a phrase with the words "in vain" is And if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain. 1 Cor 15:14

And now there's this "By whom also we have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand,

Of course you believe the opposite of the Bible. You don't believe by faith one enters into God's grace. You believe God's salvation grace was imparted before faith.

If No Justification from Eternity ? Then what ? 2

Then we have not been Justified by Faith, and our faith is in vain ! Now Justified by Faith in Time means that we by Faith receive the knowledge of what is already known by God; That is why Faith is stated here as Heb 11:1

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

For Faith cannot be the substance and evidence of a thing that does not previously exist ! That which it is a evidence of must substantially exist before God ! Ones act of faith in time cannot actualize something to exist and have substance before the Eternal God, that's nonsensical and insulting to the Eternal I AM ! Now what is it that is revealed to God given Faith ? Why its the very Righteousness of God via the Gospel Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Notice that it is revealed which means :

I.to uncover, lay open what has been veiled or covered up

II.to make known, make manifest, disclose what before was unknown

It makes known to those Justified by Christ's Work and own Righteousness to them that have it charged to them from Everlasting. Dan 9:24

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Its Everlasting because it has no beginning or ending before the Law and Justice of God, Its an Eternal Righteousness all whom had been Chosen in Christ had to their credit before the world began !

Some deem it the "or "the righteousness of ages" , of ages past; Or it can be, bring in Everlasting Justification. Now this is what is revealed in the Gospel ! So how can one deny Eternal Justification before God based on the Merits of Christ's Righteousness and have the Faith of God's Elect ? Its impossible !

 

[Rockson]

If No Justification from Eternity ? Then what ? 2

Then we have not been Justified by Faith, and our faith is in vain ! Now Justified by Faith in Time means that we by Faith receive the knowledge of what is already known by God; That is why Faith is stated here as Heb 11:1

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

For Faith cannot be the substance and evidence of a thing that does not previously exist ! That which it is a evidence of must substantially exist before God ! Ones act of faith in time cannot actualize something to exist and have substance before the Eternal God, that's nonsensical and insulting to the Eternal I AM ! Now what is it that is revealed to God given Faith ? Why its the very Righteousness of God via the Gospel Rom 1:16-17

16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek.

17 For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith.

Notice that it is revealed which means :

I.to uncover, lay open what has been veiled or covered up

II.to make known, make manifest, disclose what before was unknown

It makes known to those Justified by Christ's Work and own Righteousness to them that have it charged to them from Everlasting. Dan 9:24

24 Seventy weeks are determined upon thy people and upon thy holy city, to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy.

Its Everlasting because it has no beginning or ending before the Law and Justice of God, Its an Eternal Righteousness all whom had been Chosen in Christ had to their credit before the world began !

Some deem it the "or "the righteousness of ages" , of ages past; Or it can be, bring in Everlasting Justification. Now this is what is revealed in the Gospel ! So how can one deny Eternal Justification before God based on the Merits of Christ's Righteousness and have the Faith of God's Elect ? Its impossible !

So what's your motive for doing this? To ruin a web site whereby much of this stuff has already been addressed. Seems like it to me.

 

[Rockson]

If No Justification from Eternity ? Then what ? 2

Then we have not been Justified by Faith, and our faith is in vain ! Now Justified by Faith in Time means that we by Faith receive the knowledge of what is already known by God; That is why Faith is stated here as Heb 11:1

Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Sorry but this is just nonsensical mumbo jumbo. And you didn't quote much of the Heb 11 passage. Read on it says for by faith the elders obtained a good report. Why? Because when God said things like to Noah to build the Ark for a flood was coming he considered that word was substantial and he moved with fear to build the Ark He believed this with no evidence of a flood coming . Others looked to the future as well for the promised blessings. It has nothing to do with God giving them knowledge that they were saved as your belief would like to assert.

For Faith cannot be the substance and evidence of a thing that does not previously exist

Nonsense it most certainly can be in many applications. If a wealthy and honest man makes it clear through his words he's going eg. to build a building that is a substantial sure thing. There's many other ways one can say this as well.

 

[brightfame52]

The Eternal Justification of God's Elect is foundationed upon Christ's Eternal Suretyship, and we know He was an Surety of a better Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Ps 103:17

17 But the mercy of the Lord is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear him, and his righteousness unto children's children;

John Gill writes of this verse :

By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament. Or "covenant", for the word signifies both; and what is intended may be called both a testament and a covenant; a testament, because it is founded in the good will and pleasure of God, and respects an inheritance bequeathed by God the Father to his children, which was confirmed and comes to them by the death of Christ the testator; and a covenant, it being a compact or agreement made by the Father with Christ, as the representative of all the elect; in which promises and blessings of all sorts are provided and secured for them in him; and is called in Scripture a covenant of life and peace, because these are things concerned in it; and is commonly by men called the covenant of grace, because it springs from the grace of God, the subject matter of it is grace, and the end of it is the glory of God's grace: now this is better than the covenant of works broken by man, and which exposes him to the curse and condemnation of the law; or than the covenant of the Levitical priesthood, by which was no perfection; and the form of administration of it under the Gospel dispensation is better than that under the law, for it is now revealed more clearly, and administered without types, shadows, and sacrifices; and the extent of its administration is larger, reaching to Gentiles as well as Jews; and besides, it is now actually ratified and confirmed by the blood of Christ, which is therefore called the blood of the everlasting covenant: and of this testament or covenant Christ is the "surety"; the word signifies one that draws nigh: Christ drew nigh to his Father in the council of peace, and undertook to be the Saviour and Redeemer of his people he substituted himself in their place and stead; he interposed between the creditor and the debtor, and became surety for the payment of the debts of the latter, and so stood engaged for them, and in their room: Christ is not the surety for the Father to his people, but for them to the Father; as to satisfy for their sins, to work out a righteousness for them, to preserve and keep them, and make them happy; which is an instance of matchless love.

Now let us look at the word surety, its the word eggyos:

I.a surety, a sponsor

Now what is a sponser ? Its defined as:

a person who vouches or is responsible for a person or thing. or it can be in the plural as for persons !

I believe it was in the Everlasting Covenant, a Covenant formed by the Triune God before the World began, that the Son of God was made Surety of God's People of the Elect Heb 13:20, and in this Eternal Suretyship, the Sins and Condemnation of the Elect were agreed upon to be His responsibility to Satisfy all of their Violations of God's Law, and so, by this agreement, as far as God's Law and Justice was concerned, they were Justified from all their sins and free from any punishment due to them personally, but it would be meted out in the Person and Work of their Surety, and they were Justified from all sin then !
6

 

[TomL]

The Eternal Justification of God's Elect is foundationed upon Christ's Eternal Suretyship, and we know He was an Surety of a better Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Ps 103:17

17 But the mercy of the Lord is from everlasting to everlasting upon them that fear him, and his righteousness unto children's children;

John Gill writes of this verse :


Now let us look at the word surety, its the word eggyos:

I.a surety, a sponsor

Now what is a sponser ? Its defined as:

a person who vouches or is responsible for a person or thing. or it can be in the plural as for persons !

I believe it was in the Everlasting Covenant, a Covenant formed by the Triune God before the World began, that the Son of God was made Surety of God's People of the Elect Heb 13:20, and in this Eternal Suretyship, the Sins and Condemnation of the Elect were agreed upon to be His responsibility to Satisfy all of their Violations of God's Law, and so, by this agreement, as far as God's Law and Justice was concerned, they were Justified from all their sins and free from any punishment due to them personally, but it would be meted out in the Person and Work of their Surety, and they were Justified from all sin then !
6

Is an unbiblical heresy

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

 

[brightfame52]

Is an unbiblical heresy

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

 

[TomL]

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Eternal justification remains a heresy

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

 

[brightfame52]

Eternal justification remains a heresy

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

 

[TomL]

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

Still teaching heresy

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

 

[brightfame52]

Still teaching heresy

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

 

[TomL]

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

except scripture shows they were not justified

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

 

[brightfame52]

except scripture shows they were not justified

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

 

[TomL]

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

except scripture shows they were not justified

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

and all you can do is ignore it

 

[brightfame52]

except scripture shows they were not justified

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

and all you can do is ignore it

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

 

[TomL]

Covenant from here Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

The question is when did this take place ? I believe it reaches as far back as from Everlasting Micah 5:2

But thou, Bethlehem Ephratah, though thou be little among the thousands of Judah, yet out of thee shall he come forth unto me that is to be ruler in Israel; whose goings forth have been from of old, from everlasting.

why were these not justified?

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

 

[brightfame52]

why were these not justified?

Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

They were Justified, thats just you saying they weren't Justified because they were sinners. Jesus was still their Surety, and all that sinning they were doing was charged to Christ, not them.

 

[TomL]

They were Justified, thats just you saying they weren't Justified because they were sinners. Jesus was still their Surety, and all that sinning they were doing was charged to Christ, not them.

read the text
'
Ephesians 2:11–12 (NASB 2020) — 11 Therefore remember that previously you, the Gentiles in the flesh, who are called “Uncircumcision” by the so-called “Circumcision” which is performed in the flesh by human hands—12 remember that you were at that time separate from Christ, excluded from the people of Israel, and strangers to the covenants of the promise, having no hope and without God in the world.

they were without hope or God

 

[brightfame52]

Eternal Justification of the Elect !

Just as important as the Elect's Justification before God by the death of Christ alone before any Gospel Obedience by the Justified, just as true and factual was their Justification from the Punishment of their sins by Christ's Suretyship engagement for them in the Everlasting Covenant, when He was constituted their Surety from Everlasting Heb 7:22

22 By so much was Jesus made a surety of a better testament.

Now even though He did not actually die in Eternity past, He did in Eternity Past become responsible for our guilt, as Surety, hence their punishment due to them was due unto Him instead of them because of Surety Responsibility. This Eternal Surety was based upon what He would do in for them enduring their wrath and punishment, after having been made of a women and under the Law Gal 4:4-5

4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.

Since His Death of Redemption was appointed for the before the foundation 1 Pet 1:18-20

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

20 It is true that He was chosen and foreordained (destined and foreknown for it) before the foundation of the world, but He was brought out to public view (made manifest) in these last days (at the end of the times) for the sake of you. AMP

So this being True, so did they have Justification before God's Law and Justice from the Punishment of their sins before the foundation of the world ! 6

 

[brightfame52]

Denying Eternal Justification is quite serious !

Denying Eternal Justification is quite serious in that it disregards God as a Judge, also it disregards what is from scripture, an obvious Judgment of God from before the foundation, this we know from scriptures like Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain[In Eternal Purpose Eph 3:11] from the foundation of the world.

1 Pet 1:20

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

Foreordained for what Purpose ? 1 Pet 1:18-19

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

Foreordained for certain foreknown Elect Individuals 1 Pet 1:2 to be redeemed by the Precious blood of the Lamb, which was slain from the foundation Rev 13:8 !

Now by this it is very clear that God the Judge has already decided that the sins of the Elect foreknown should be laid on Christ, thus He should be slain for them and again raised for their Justification Rom 4:25, for this obviously He had already decided as Judge before all worlds.

Now when a case of a person has been thus decided for that individual, their Justification or condemnation, that official decision stands from the date thereof . Now when was the date of God's decision on redeeming His Elect by the Blood of Christ ? 1 Pet 1:18-20

18 Forasmuch as ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, as silver and gold, from your vain conversation received by tradition from your fathers;

19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot:

20 Who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you,

He was manifest in time for specifically these 1 Pet 1:2

2 Elect according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through sanctification of the Spirit, unto obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: Grace unto you, and peace, be multiplied.

Peter was very specific on this, for He wrote manifested FOR YOU !

Now this also means that God before the foundation had Judged and determined not to impute the transgressions of the elect upon them, but instead on Christ the Lamb for them, and by virtue of the Divine Reckoning, Christ was a slain Lamb from the foundation, slain for the sins of specific foreknown individuals, and these foreknown Individuals were recorded in the Lambs Book of Life Rev 13:8;17:8, and His coming to accomplish the Work Heb 10:7,9 ; Ps 40:6-8, and those whose names that had been written in the Book of Life, also had imputed to them, based upon the coming of Christ for them, Justification of Life, so if their Names were written in the Lambs Book of Life before the foundation, then also was God's Judging them to Justification of Life ! Denying this is very serious and anti gospel !

 

[brightfame52]

Christ was slain from the foundation of the World !

Rev 13:8

8 And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

When Preaching about Christ died for our sins 1 Cor 15:3 we cannot shun the whole counsel of it. 1 Cor 15:3 is only part of a whole, with many more sublime Truths accompanying it, such as He being slain from or before the foundation of the World ! Now because of this, those Christ died for as the Lamb slain before the foundation, they never had their sins and condemnation, which He was slain for, charged directly on them, which fact means their Justification from them and its condemnation. In the Eternal Purpose of Christ Jesus Eph 3:11

11 According to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord:

God had predetermined / decreed that Christ should be charged with and die for their sins and condemnation, even though He had not actually died until in Time at the Cross in the fulness of time.

When those who had been chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4, He also before the foundation received with them their liability/ and Suretyship, for their sins and condemnation in the Eternal Purpose in Christ Jesus, again though He did not die before the foundation, He did receive the sentence of Death for their sins before the foundation, to be carried out at an Hour set in Time, and in fact that was the foundation for His Incarnation Heb 10:5-10,14

5 Wherefore when he cometh into the world, he saith, Sacrifice and offering thou wouldest not, but a body hast thou prepared me:

6 In burnt offerings and sacrifices for sin thou hast had no pleasure.

7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

8 Above when he said, Sacrifice and offering and burnt offerings and offering for sin thou wouldest not, neither hadst pleasure therein; which are offered by the law;

9 Then said he, Lo, I come to do thy will, O God. He taketh away the first, that he may establish the second.

10 By the which will we are sanctified through the offering of the body of Jesus Christ once for all.

14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. 6