All the Verses That Show Us Salvation Can Occur Without Water Baptism

[dwight92070]

There were NONE in the OT how had the indwelling of the Spirit, because the indwelling had not been given before Jesus was glorified (John 7:39). The OT saints had the empowerment of the Spirit, but they did not have Him living within their hearts.

The Spirit was ON, or WITH Moses, but He was not within him.

Yes, the OT saints were regenerated through the retroactive power of Jesus' blood that God foreordained to cleanse all sin for all time.

But the empowering Spirit of God could (and still can) come and go from people at the Spirit's discretion. He came upon and then left King Saul. He came upon and then left and then again came upon Samson, just for a couple of examples.

What you are saying here makes sense, and I am coming to a new (for me) thought here, so bear with me as I develop this thought. Looking at what you are saying, it appears that one of the lessons we learn from Cornelius is that a person who was saved under the Old Covenant and lived through the transition into the New Covenant needed to hear about and exhibit faith in Jesus to remain saved under the New Covenant. I think Cornelius was saved under the Old Covenant (he lived according to the Law), but God sent Peter to him to bring him into knowledge of the New Covenant, and Jesus' part in removing our sins.

So you may be right that Nicodemus could have been born again right there (under the OT), but then he would need salvation in Christ ((continued) repentance, confession of Jesus as Lord, and baptism) in order to be saved under the NT, just as Cornelius apparently did.

Okay, maybe back to 95%. You also could be right about the kings and the priests. However Peter speaks of the prophets in 1 Peter 1:11:

"Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ WHICH WAS IN THEM DID SIGNIFY, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow."

Maybe the Spirit of Christ is not necessarily the same as the Holy Spirit.

One thing is obvious here - the Holy Spirit is tough to pin down. Jesus said, "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

 

[Doug Brents]

Okay, maybe back to 95%.

LOL, I'll take what I can get.

You also could be right about the kings and the priests. However Peter speaks of the prophets in 1 Peter 1:11:

"Searching what, or what manner of time the Spirit of Christ WHICH WAS IN THEM DID SIGNIFY, when it testified beforehand the sufferings of Christ, and the glory that should follow."

Maybe the Spirit of Christ is not necessarily the same as the Holy Spirit.

One thing is obvious here - the Holy Spirit is tough to pin down. Jesus said, "The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."

It is very true that the Holy Spirit is hard to pin down. He is God, and He does not fit in any container man would put Him in.

I think that the Spirit of Christ and the Holy Spirit are the same, but I do not believe that the prophets were indwelt, they were simply empowered (as the kings, judges, and priests were empowered) by the Spirit. I don't think that the Spirit "that was in them" means the same as the indwelling of the Spirit we know today. I could be wrong, but John 7:39 seems to indicate that the indwelling did not exist before Jesus' death and resurrection. But He is God, and so He can do whatever it is He chooses to do, and NONE can restrain Him.

 

[MTMattie]

Excellent point, my friend.

Good points. However, it has always been my understanding that the only ones in the Old Covenant, who had the Holy Spirit indwelling them were prophets, priests and kings. (There may have been some exceptions, such as when the Lord took some of the Spirit that was on Moses and gave Him to the seventy, to relieve Moses of such a great burden.) David was the 2nd King of Israel. He was anointed by the Holy Spirit years before he was actually able to sit on the throne. When he asked God to create in him a clean heart, etc., he was repenting of his sin with Bathsheba. At that time he also implored God that He would not take His Holy Spirit from him. Apparently God answered that prayer, allowing him to keep his anointing. So I don't think I would call that being born again.

You mentioned Nicodemus. Jesus told him that unless one is born again, he cannot see or enter into the kingdom of God. But was Jesus withholding the "truth" that if Nicodemus wanted this experience, he would have to wait until after Jesus was raised from the dead? Or was Jesus telling Nicodemus that he could receive that experience right then? I tend to believe the latter, but with a caveat. Maybe Nicodemus could have been born again right then, but instead of receiving the indwelling Holy Spirit, he would receive the abiding presence of the Holy Spirit, again as Jesus told His disciples - He (the Holy Spirit) is with you but will be in you. So that later, after Jesus rose from the dead, he and all Jesus' disciples could receive the indwelling Holy Spirit. John 20:22

Continued from #1:

Romans 4:7 "Blessed are those whose lawless deeds have been forgiven, and whose sins have been covered." BNR (Baptism Not Required)
Romans 4:8 "Blessed is the man whose sin the Lord will not take into account." BNR
(Paul says that both of these verses speak of the blessing on the man whom God credits righteousness apart from works, such as baptism. (See 4:6)

Romans 4:11"and he received the sign of circumcision, a seal of the righteousness of the faith which he had while uncircumcised, so that he might be THE FATHER OF ALL WHO BELIEVE WITHOUT BEING CIRCUMCISED, that RIGHTEOUSNESS MIGHT BE CREDITED TO THEM,"
(That's US GENTILE BELIEVERS - WE BELIEVE WITHOUT BEING CIRCUMCISED - OR BAPTIZED) BNR

Romans 4:12 "and the father of circumcision to those who not only are of the circumcision, but WHO ALSO FOLLOW IN THE STEPS OF THE FAITH OF OUR FATHER ABRAHAM WHICH HE HAD WHILE UNCIRCUMCISED.
(That's JEWISH BELIEVERS - THEY HAD THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM EVEN BEFORE THEY WERE CIRCUMCISED - OR BAPTIZED) BNR

Romans 4:13 "For the promise to Abraham or to his descendants (seed) that he would be heir of the world (which obviously includes salvation) was not through the Law (or baptism), BUT THROUGH THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF FAITH." BNR

Romans 4:14 "For IF THOSE WHO ARE OF THE LAW (OR BAPTISM) ARE HEIRS, FAITH IS MADE VOID AND THE PROMISE IS NULLIFIED; BNR

Romans 4:16 "FOR THIS REASON IT IS BY FAITH (NOT BAPTISM), IN ORDER THAT IT MAY BE IN ACCORDANCE WITH GRACE, SO THAT THE PROMISE WILL BE GUARANTEED TO ALL THE DESCENDANTS (SEED), NOT ONLY TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE LAW, BUT ALSO TO THOSE WHO ARE OF THE FAITH OF ABRAHAM, WHO IS THE FATHER OF US ALL." BNR

Romans 4:22 "THEREFORE IT (HIS FAITH, NOT BAPTISM) WAS ALSO CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS. BNR
Romans 4:23-24 "NOW NOT FOR HIS SAKE ONLY WAS IT WRITTEN THAT IT WAS CREDITED TO HIM, BUT FOR OUR SAKE ALSO, TO WHOM IT WILL BE CREDITED, AS THOSE WHO (GET BAPTIZED? NO!) BELIEVE IN HIM WHO RAISED JESUS OUR LORD FROM THE DEAD, ..." BNR

Romans 5:1 "THEREFORE HAVING BEEN JUSTIFIED BY FAITH, WE HAVE PEACE WITH GOD THROUGH OUR LORD JESUS CHRIST." BNR
Romans 5:2 "through whom also we have obtained OUR INTRODUCTION BY FAITH (NOT BY BAPTISM) INTO THIS GRACE IN WHICH WE STAND;" BNR

To be continued:

IMPORTANT NOTE: I do NOT list these verses to, in any way, discourage water baptism. AFTER we believe, we should ALL obey Jesus and be water baptized as He commanded. These are listed to show us clearly that water baptism is NOT REQUIRED IN ORDER TO BE SAVED or we could say "water baptism will NOT save us".

I wont. Just want it for backup because of those who insist that Water baptism "saves"

 

[synergy]

Could you please explain what do you mean by "regenerated"?
We may be discussing things with different concepts in mind.

Christian regeneration, also known as being "born again," refers to the spiritual transformation of a person by the Holy Spirit. This process involves moving from spiritual death to spiritual life (Ephesians 2:4-5) and being made a new creation in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17). It is the foundation of salvation and the beginning of a restored relationship with God.

What Must One Do to Be Regenerated?

Regeneration is ultimately the work of God, not something a person can achieve through their own effort. However, Scripture outlines conditions for receiving this gift:

1. Repentance: Turning away from sin and acknowledging one’s need for God’s forgiveness (Acts 2:38, Luke 13:3).

2. Faith in Jesus Christ: Trusting in Jesus as Lord and Savior is essential (John 3:16, Romans 10:9-10). Faith is both a response to God’s grace and evidence of the Spirit’s work in the heart.

3. Obedience: Responding to God’s call through actions such as baptism (Acts 2:38, Acts 22:16), though the physical act of baptism alone does not save—it is an outward expression of inward faith.

How Does the Holy Spirit Regenerate?

Regeneration is an act of the Holy Spirit, involving several transformative works:

1. Conviction of Sin: The Spirit convicts individuals of their sin, pointing them to their need for Christ (John 16:8-11).

2. New Birth: As Jesus explained to Nicodemus, one must be born of water and the Spirit to enter the Kingdom of God (John 3:5-8). The Spirit gives spiritual life, enabling believers to live in relationship with God.

3. Renewal of the Heart: The Spirit replaces the "heart of stone" with a "heart of flesh" (Ezekiel 36:26-27), empowering believers to love and obey God.

4. Union with Christ: Through the Spirit, believers are united with Christ, sharing in His death and resurrection (Romans 6:4-5).

Regeneration and Baptism

The relationship between regeneration and baptism has been understood in different ways across Christian traditions:

1. Sacramental View: Catholic, Orthodox, and some Protestant traditions teach that baptism is a means of grace through which the Holy Spirit regenerates. In this view, baptism is the moment when one is cleansed of sin and spiritually reborn (Acts 2:38, Titus 3:5).

2. Symbolic View: Many evangelical and Reformed traditions see baptism as an outward symbol of an inward reality. Regeneration occurs when the Spirit awakens faith, which may happen before baptism (Ephesians 2:8-9).

3. Integrated View: Some hold that regeneration and baptism are closely linked but emphasize the necessity of faith and the Spirit’s work in both.

Jesus’ Baptism and the Holy Spirit

Jesus’ baptism (Matthew 3:13-17, Mark 1:9-11) was not about repentance or regeneration, as He was sinless (Hebrews 4:15). Instead, it marked:

1. His Identification with Humanity: Jesus was baptized to identify with sinners and fulfill all righteousness (Matthew 3:15).

2. Anointing by the Holy Spirit: At His baptism, the Holy Spirit descended like a dove, empowering Him for His public ministry (Luke 3:21-22, Acts 10:38).

3. Revelation of the Trinity: The event revealed the Trinity: the Father’s voice, the Son’s baptism, and the Spirit’s descent.

Jesus’ baptism underscores the importance of the Holy Spirit in Christian life. While believers’ baptism often involves the Spirit’s regenerative work, Jesus’ baptism inaugurated His mission and demonstrated the Spirit’s empowering presence.

Conclusion

Christian regeneration is a spiritual rebirth initiated by the Holy Spirit. It requires repentance, faith, and often involves baptism, which symbolizes and expresses the transformation God brings. Jesus’ baptism, while unique, highlights the Spirit’s essential role in empowering and affirming believers in their walk with God.

 

[dwight92070]

Romans 5:9 "Much more then, HAVING NOW BEEN JUSTIFIED BY HIS BLOOD (NOT BY BAPTISM), WE SHALL BE SAVED FROM THE WRATH OF GOD THROUGH HIM." BNR

Romans 5:10 "For if while we were enemies WE WERE RECONCILED TO GOD THROUGH THE DEATH OF HIS SON (NOT through baptism), much more, HAVING BEEN RECONCILED, WE SHALL BE SAVED BY HIS LIFE." BNR

Romans 5:11 "And not only this, but we also exult in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, THROUGH WHOM (NOT THROUGH BAPTISM) WE HAVE NOW RECEIVED THE RECONCILIATION." BNR

Romans 5:15 "But the FREE GIFT ... MUCH MORE DID THE GRACE OF GOD AND THE GIFT BY THE GRACE OF THE ONE MAN (NOT OUR WORK OF BAPTISM), JESUS CHRIST, ABOUND TO THE MANY." BNR

Romans 5:16 " ... but on the other hand THE FREE GIFT (NOT OUR WORK OF BAPTISM) AROSE FROM MANY TRANSGRESSIONS RESULTING IN JUSTIFICATION." BNR

Romans 5:17 " ... much more THOSE WHO RECEIVE THE ABUNDANCE OF GRACE AND OF THE GIFT OF RIGHTEOUSNESS (NOT BECAUSE WE WERE BAPTIZED) WILL REIGN IN LIFE THROUGH THE ONE, JESUS CHRIST." BNR

Romans 5:18 " ... even so THROUGH ONE ACT OF RIGHTEOUSNESS (NOT BAPTISM) THERE RESULTED JUSTIFICATION OF LIFE TO ALL MEN." BNR

Romans 5:19 " ... even so THROUGH THE OBEDIENCE OF THE ONE (JESUS DYING FOR US - NOT OUR WATER BAPTISM) THE MANY WILL BE MADE RIGHTEOUS." BNR

Romans 5:21 " ... even so GRACE WOULD REIGN THROUGH RIGHTEOUSNESS (HIS RIGHTEOUSNESS, NOT OUR WATER BAPTISM) TO ETERNAL LIFE THROUGH JESUS CHRIST OUR LORD." BNR

Romans 6: 3-4 " ... ALL OF US WHO HAVE BEEN BAPTIZED INTO CHRIST JESUS (1 CORINTHIANS 12:13 - NOT WATER BAPTISM. BUT BEING PUT INTO THE BODY OF CHRIST) HAVE BEEN BAPTIZED INTO HIS DEATH? (SALVATION) Therefore we have been buried with Him through (water) baptism into death (REPRESENTING HIS DEATH), SO THAT AS CHRIST WAS RAISED FROM THE DEAD THROUGH THE GLORY OF THE FATHER, SO WE TOO MIGHT WALK IN NEWNESS OF LIFE."(BEING BORN AGAIN) NBR (NOT FOR SALVATION)

Romans 6:5 "FOR IF WE HAVE BECOME UNITED WITH HIM IN THE LIKENESS OF HIS DEATH (BY FAITH, NOT BY WATER BAPTISM), CERTAINLY WE SHALL BE ALSO IN THE LIKENESS OF HIS RESURRECTION." NBR

Romans 6:6 " ... THAT OUR OLD SELF WAS CRUCIFIED WITH HIM (BY FAITH, NOT BY BAPTISM) IN ORDER THAT OUR BODY OF SIN MIGHT BE DONE AWAY WITH (BY FAITH), SO THAT WE WOULD NO LONGER BE SLAVES TO SIN, FOR HE WHO HAS DIED IS FREED FROM SIN." NBR

To be continued:

 

[dwight92070]

Romans 6:17-18 "THOUGH YOU WERE SLAVES TO SIN, YOU BECAME OBEDIENT FROM THE HEART (NOT THE OUTWARD OBEDIENCE OF WATER BAPTISM WHICH OCCURS LATER, RATHER IT IS THE OBEDIENCE OF FAITH SEE ROMANS 1:5 AND ROMANS 16:26) TO THAT FORM OF TEACHING TO WHICH YOU WERE COMMITTED, AND HAVING BEEN FREED FROM SIN, YOU BECAME SLAVES OF RIGHTEOUSNESS." NBR

Romans 6:22-23 "BUT NOW HAVING BEEN FREED FROM SIN AND ENSLAVED TO GOD, YOU DERIVE YOUR BENEFIT, RESULTING IN SANCTIFICATION, AND THE OUTCOME, ETERNAL LIFE. NBR
FOR THE WAGES OF SIN IS DEATH, BUT THE FREE GIFT OF GOD (NOT EARNED BY BEING BAPTIZED) IS ETERNAL LIFE IN CHRIST JESUS OUR LORD." NBR

Romans 7:4 " ...YOU ALSO WERE MADE TO DIE TO THE LAW THROUGH THE BODY OF CHRIST, TO THAT YOU MIGHT BE JOINED TO ANOTHER, TO HIM WHO WAS RAISED FROM THE DEAD, IN ORDER THAT WE MIGHT (BE BAPTIZED? NO!) BEAR FRUIT FOR GOD. NBR

Romans 7:6 "BUT NOW WE HAVE BEEN RELEASED FROM THE LAW, HAVING DIED TO THAT WHICH WE WERE BOUND, SO THAT WE SERVE IN NEWNESS OF THE SPIRIT AND NOT IN OLDNESS OF THE LETTER." NBR

Romans 8:2 "FOR THE LAW OF THE SPIRIT OF LIFE IN CHRIST JESUS HAS SET YOU FREE FROM THE LAW OF SIN AND DEATH." NBR

Romans 8:3 "FOR WHAT THE LAW (OR BAPTISM) COULD NOT DO, WEAK AS IT WAS THROUGH THE FLESH, GOD DID; SENDING HIS OWN SON IN THE LIKENESS OF SINFUL FLESH AND AS AN OFFERING FOR SIN, HE CONDEMNED SIN IN THE FLESH, NBR

Romans 8:4 "SO THAT THE REQUIREMENT OF THE LAW (NOT BAPTISM) MIGHT BE FULFILLED IN US, WHO DO NOT WALK ACCORDING TO THE FLESH BUT ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT." NBR

Romans 8:10 "IF CHRIST IS IN YOU, THOUGH THE BODY IS DEAD BECAUSE OF SIN, YET THE SPIRIT IS ALIVE BECAUSE OF RIGHTEOUSNESS." NBR

Romans 8:11 "BUT IF (YOU GET BAPTIZED? NO!) THE SPIRIT OF HIM WHO RAISED JESUS FROM THE DEAD DWELLS IN YOU, HE WHO RAISED CHRIST JESUS FROM THE DEAD WILL ALSO GIVE LIFE TO YOUR MORTAL BODIES THROUGH HIS SPIRIT WHO DWELLS IN YOU." NBR

Romans 9:8 "That is, IT IS NOT (THOSE WHO ARE BAPTIZED) THE CHILDREN OF THE FLESH WHO ARE CHILDREN OF GOD, BUT THE CHILDREN OF THE PROMISE ARE REGARDED AS DESCENDANTS (SEED). NBR

To be continued:

 

[dwight92070]

Romans 9:30 " ...THAT GENTILES, WHO DID NOT PURSUE RIGHTEOUSNESS, ATTAINED RIGHTEOUSNESS, EVEN THE RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH IS BY FAITH; (DID YOU NOTICE THAT PAUL DID NOT ADD ANOTHER REQUIREMENT TO FAITH? - YES, HE IS SAYING "FAITH ALONE".

Romans 9:31-32 " ...BUT ISRAEL, PURSUING A LAW OF RIGHTEOUSNESS, DID NOT ARRIVE AT THAT LAW. WHY? BECAUSE THEY DID NOT PURSUE IT BY FAITH, BUT AS THOUGH IT WERE BY WORKS. THEY STUMBLED OVER THE STUMBLING STONE.," (DID YOU NOTICE THAT PAUL SAYS HERE THAT NO WORKS COULD HAVE BROUGHT RIGHTEOUSNESS TO ISRAEL? -ONLY FAITH COULD DO IT. WHAT IS THAT CALLED? FAITH ALONE!!!)

Romans 10:4 "For CHRIST IS THE END OF THE LAW FOR RIGHTEOUSNESS TO EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES." (DID YOU NOTICE THAT PAUL SAYS THAT THERE IS ONLY ONE THING THAT WILL BRING RIGHTEOUSNESS TO A PERSON? BELIEVING OR FAITH. WHAT IS THAT CALLED? FAITH ALONE!!!)

Romans 10:9 "THAT IF YOU CONFESS WITH YOUR MOUTH JESUS AS LORD, AND BELIEVE IN YOUR HEART THAT GOD RAISED HIM FROM THE DEAD , YOU WILL BE SAVED; " (DID YOU NOTICE THAT PAUL DOESN'T EVEN MENTION BAPTISM HERE?)

Romans 11:6 "BUT IF IT IS BY GRACE, IT IS NO LONGER ON THE BASIS OF WORKS, OTHERWISE GRACE IS NO LONGER GRACE." (SO IF BAPTISM SAVES, THEN OUR SALVATION IS NO LONGER BY GRACE, IT IS BY WORKS.)

Romans 11:20 "QUITE RIGHT, THEY WERE BROKEN OFF FOR THEIR UNBELIEF, BUT YOU STAND BY YOUR FAITH." (DID YOU NOTICE THAT THE JEWS WERE NOT BROKEN OFF BECAUSE THEY WERE NOT BAPTIZED? - RATHER IT WAS BECAUSE OF THEIR UNBELIEF. ALSO THE GENTILES STOOD ONLY BY THEIR FAITH, NOT BAPTISM.)

Romans 11:23 "AND THEY ALSO, IF THEY DO NOT CONTINUE IN THEIR UNBELIEF, WILL BE GRAFTED IN, FOR GOD IS ABLE TO GRAFT THEM IN AGAIN," (DID YOU NOTICE THAT IF THE JEWS RETURN TO HAVING FAITH, NOT TO BEING BAPTIZED, GOD WILL GRAFT THEM IN AGAIN?)

Romans 16:26 " ... according to the commandment of the eternal God, has been made known to all nations, LEADING TO OBEDIENCE OF FAITH;" (DID YOU NOTICE THAT HAVING FAITH IS THE OBEDIENCE TO GOD THAT IS REQUIRED FOR SALVATION, NOT BAPTISM?)

To be continued:

 

[dwight92070]

1 Corinthians 1:17 "FOR CHRIST DID NOT SEND ME TO BAPTIZE (BECAUSE THAT DOESN'T SAVE ANYONE) , but to preach the gospel (THIS DOES SAVE MANY), not in cleverness of speech, so that the cross of Christ would not be made void." (DID YOU NOTICE THAT PAUL DIFFERENTIATES BAPTISM FROM PREACHING THE GOSPEL?)

1 Corinthians 1:18 "FOR THE WORD OF THE CROSS IS FOOLISHNESS TO THOSE WHO ARE PERISHING, BUT TO US WHO ARE BEING SAVED IT IS THE POWER OF GOD." (NOTICE IT IS THE GOSPEL MESSAGE RECEIVED IN FAITH THAT SAVES, NOT BAPTISM) NBR (NO BAPTISM REQUIRED)

1 Corinthians 1:21 " ... GOD WAS WELL-PLEASED THROUGH THE FOOLISHNESS OF THE MESSAGE PREACHED TO SAVE THOSE WHO BELIEVE."
NBR

1 Corinthians 1:30 "BUT BY HIS DOING YOU ARE IN CHRIST JESUS (NOT BY YOUR BAPTISM), WHO BECAME TO US WISDOM FROM GOD, AND RIGHTEOUSNESS AND SANCTIFICATION, AND REDEMPTION." NBR

1 Corinthians 2:5 "SO THAT YOUR FAITH WOULD NOT REST ON THE WISDOM OF MEN (NOR ON YOUR BAPTISM), BUT ON THE POWER OF GOD. NBR

1 Corinthians 3:5 "WHAT THEN IS APOLLOS? AND WHAT IS PAUL? SERVANTS THROUGH WHOM YOU BELIEVED ..." (NOT THROUGH WHOM YOU WERE BAPTIZED)

1 Corinthians 6:11 "SUCH WERE SOME OF YOU; BUT YOU WERE WASHED, BUT YOU WERE SANCTIFIED, BUT YOU WERE JUSTIFIED IN THE NAME OF THE LORD JESUS CHRIST AND IN THE SPIRIT OF OUR GOD. (NO BAPTISM REQUIRED HERE)

1 Corinthians 12:13 "FOR BY ONE SPIRIT WE WERE ALL BAPTIZED INTO ONE BODY ... AND WE WERE ALL MADE TO DRINK OF ONE SPIRIT." (THE HOLY SPIRIT BAPTIZES US INTO ONE BODY - THIS IS NOT WATER BAPTISM, WHERE A MAN DOES THE BAPTIZING AFTER THE PERSON HAS ALREADY BEEN SAVED AND ENTERED INTO THE BODY OF CHRIST) (NOTICE THAT IMMEDIATELY AFTER COMING INTO THE BODY OF CHRIST, WE DRINK OF THE HOLY SPIRIT, I.E. THE HOLY SPIRIT ENTERS INTO US) NBR

1 Corinthians 15:1-4 "NOW I MAKE KNOWN TO YOU, THE GOSPEL, WHICH I PREACHED TO YOU, WHICH ALSO YOU RECEIVED, IN WHICH ALSO YOU STAND, BY WHICH ALSO YOU ARE SAVED ... THAT CHRIST DIED FOR OUR SINS ...THAT HE WAS BURIED, AND THAT HE WAS RAISED ON THE THIRD DAY ACCORDING TO THE SCRIPTURE." (DID YOU NOTICE NO MENTION IS MADE OF BAPTISM IN PAUL'S GOSPEL MESSAGE?) (IF BAPTISM WAS NECESSARY TO BE SAVED, PAUL SURELY WOULD HAVE INCLUDED IT HERE AND NOW - BUT HE DIDN'T!)

To be continued:

 

[Complete]

'And these all, having obtained a good report through faith,
received not the promise:
God having provided some better thing for us,
that they without us should not be made perfect.
(Heb 11:39-40)

Hello @dwight92070 ,

My mind goes to Hebrews 11, and the list given there of the men and women commended for their faith, that lived during the days of the Old Testament. It was the grace of God that saved them, through faith, and gave them a glorious hope and expectation, yet to be realised, in resurrection glory,

Praise God!

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[dwight92070]

Please note that many of these verses IMPLY faith or are an expression of Paul's faith, even though the word "faith" may not always be used. It is obvious that Paul's life demonstrated his FAITH IN GOD, NOT IN BAPTISM. In fact , if baptism played a NECESSARY ROLE IN OUR SALVATION, PAUL WOULD BE MENTIONING IT OFTEN. But compared to his expressions of faith in God and in Jesus, his expressions of the need to be baptized are PRACTICALLY ZERO.

1 Corinthians 15:17 "and if Christ has not been raised, your faith is worthless (NOTICE PAUL DID NOT SAY YOUR BAPTISM IS WORTHLESS); you are still in your sins." Implying the opposite: If Christ has been raised (and He has),YOUR FAITH IS WORTH MUCH,(NOT YOUR BAPTISM); you are no longer in your sins."

1 Corinthians 15:56-57 "The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law; but thanks be to God, who gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ (NOT THROUGH BAPTISM)."

1 Corinthians 16:13 "Be on the alert, STAND FIRM IN THE FAITH (NOT IN YOUR BAPTISM), act like men, be strong."

1 Corinthians 16:22 "If anyone does not (GET BAPTIZED? NO!) love the Lord, he is to be accursed. Maranatha."

2 Corinthians 1:9 "indeed, we had the sentence of death within ourselves, so that we would not trust in ourselves (OR OUR BAPTISM), but in God who raises the dead;"

2 Corinthians 1:10 "God ... will deliver us, He on whom we have set our hope (NOT ON BAPTISM)."

2 Corinthians 1:14 " ... that we are your reason to be proud (NOT BAPTISM) as you also are ours, in the day of the Lord Jesus."

2 Corinthians 1:20 "For as many as are the promises of God, in Him they are yes; therefore also through (BAPTISM? NO!) HIM is our Amen to the glory of God through us."

2 Corinthians 1:21-22 "Now He who establishes us with you (IN BAPTISM? NO!) IN CHRIST AND ANOINTED US IS GOD, WHO ALSO SEALED US AND GAVE US THE SPIRIT IN OUR HEARTS AS A PLEDGE."

2 Corinthians 1:24 " ... FOR IN YOUR FAITH (NOT IN YOUR BAPTISM) YOU ARE STANDING FIRM."

2 Corinthians 2:14 "But thanks be to God, who always leads us in triumph (IN OUR BAPTISM? NO!) IN CHRIST, ..."

2 Corinthians 3:2-3 "You are our letter, written in our hearts, known and read by all men; being manifested that your are a letter of Christ, cared for by us, written not with ink (NOR WITH BAPTISM) but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone, but on tablets of human hearts. "

To be continued:

 

[Complete]

Subject Heading:- All the Verses That Show Us Salvation Can Occur Without Water Baptism


'For Christ sent me not to baptize,
but to preach the gospel:
not with wisdom of words,
lest the cross of Christ
should be made of none effect.'
(1Cor, 1:17)

 

[Complete]

'I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you
that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called,
With all lowliness and meekness,
with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;
Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace.
There is =
one body, and
.. one Spirit, even as ye are called in
.... one hope of your calling;
...... One Lord,
........ one faith,
.......... one baptism,
............God and Father of all,
Who is above all, and through all, and in you all.'
(Eph 4:1-6)

Hello there,

* During the period covered by the Acts of the Apostles, of approx. 40 years, there were two baptisms in operation. baptism in water and baptism of the Holy Spirit. Within that period, the epistles of Paul to the Corinthians Galatians, Hebrews, Thessalonians, Romans were written, so it is to be expected that reference to water baptism be made within them.

* Yet, following the events of Acts 28, in the first of the letters written by Paul, while imprisoned we are told that there is to be just ONE BAPTISM. John the baptist gives us an indication of which baptism is to be perpetuated when he said:-

'John answered, saying unto them all,
I indeed baptize you with water;
but one mightier than I cometh,
the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose:
He shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost ... ... '
(Luk 3:16)

* This is believer's baptism: and happens the moment we believe on the Lord Jesus Christ to the saving of our souls. The Holy Spirit identifies us with the Lord Jesus Christ, in His death, burial, quickening, resurrection (see Romans 5:12-8:39) and ascension to God's right hand. We are sealed until the day of redemption. Our life is hid with Christ in God, and we await His appearing in glory, when we too will appear there with Him there. (Colossians 3:4).

* All is of and by the Holy Spirit, there is nothing for the flesh to glory in. save Christ Jesus their risen and glorified Saviour, Lord and Head.

Praise God!

In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[101G]

Addressing the OP. What do the (NBR) say on Mark 16:16? and also Luke 20:1 "And it came to pass, that on one of those days, as he taught the people in the temple, and preached the gospel, the chief priests and the scribes came upon him with the elders," Luke 20:2 "And spake unto him, saying, Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things? or who is he that gave thee this authority?" Luke 20:3 "And he answered and said unto them, I will also ask you one thing; and answer me:" Luke 20:4 "The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?" Luke 20:5 "And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then believed ye him not?" Luke 20:6 "But and if we say, Of men; all the people will stone us: for they be persuaded that John was a prophet." Luke 20:7 "And they answered, that they could not tell whence it was."

was John's Baptism from heaven or men to obey? also was the Gospel was it from Heaven or men? this is the two witness, the Gospel, (Jesus the Christ), and water Baptism, (John the Baptist).

101G.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Christian regeneration, also known as being "born again," refers to the spiritual transformation of a person by the Holy Spirit. This process involves moving from spiritual death to spiritual life (Ephesians 2:4-5) and being made a new creation in Christ (2 Corinthians 5:17). It is the foundation of salvation and the beginning of a restored relationship with God.

What Must One Do to Be Regenerated?

Regeneration is ultimately the work of God, not something a person can achieve through their own effort. However, Scripture outlines conditions for receiving this gift:

1. Repentance: Turning away from sin and acknowledging one’s need for God’s forgiveness (Acts 2:38, Luke 13:3).

2. Faith in Jesus Christ: Trusting in Jesus as Lord and Savior is essential (John 3:16, Romans 10:9-10). Faith is both a response to God’s grace and evidence of the Spirit’s work in the heart.

3. Obedience: Responding to God’s call through actions such as baptism (Acts 2:38, Acts 22:16), though the physical act of baptism alone does not save—it is an outward expression of inward faith.

How Does the Holy Spirit Regenerate?

Regeneration is an act of the Holy Spirit, involving several transformative works:

1. Conviction of Sin: The Spirit convicts individuals of their sin, pointing them to their need for Christ (John 16:8-11).

2. New Birth: As Jesus explained to Nicodemus, one must be born of water and the Spirit to enter the Kingdom of God (John 3:5-8). The Spirit gives spiritual life, enabling believers to live in relationship with God.

3. Renewal of the Heart: The Spirit replaces the "heart of stone" with a "heart of flesh" (Ezekiel 36:26-27), empowering believers to love and obey God.

4. Union with Christ: Through the Spirit, believers are united with Christ, sharing in His death and resurrection (Romans 6:4-5).

Regeneration and Baptism

The relationship between regeneration and baptism has been understood in different ways across Christian traditions:

1. Sacramental View: Catholic, Orthodox, and some Protestant traditions teach that baptism is a means of grace through which the Holy Spirit regenerates. In this view, baptism is the moment when one is cleansed of sin and spiritually reborn (Acts 2:38, Titus 3:5).

2. Symbolic View: Many evangelical and Reformed traditions see baptism as an outward symbol of an inward reality. Regeneration occurs when the Spirit awakens faith, which may happen before baptism (Ephesians 2:8-9).

3. Integrated View: Some hold that regeneration and baptism are closely linked but emphasize the necessity of faith and the Spirit’s work in both.

Jesus’ Baptism and the Holy Spirit

Jesus’ baptism (Matthew 3:13-17, Mark 1:9-11) was not about repentance or regeneration, as He was sinless (Hebrews 4:15). Instead, it marked:

1. His Identification with Humanity: Jesus was baptized to identify with sinners and fulfill all righteousness (Matthew 3:15).

2. Anointing by the Holy Spirit: At His baptism, the Holy Spirit descended like a dove, empowering Him for His public ministry (Luke 3:21-22, Acts 10:38).

3. Revelation of the Trinity: The event revealed the Trinity: the Father’s voice, the Son’s baptism, and the Spirit’s descent.

Jesus’ baptism underscores the importance of the Holy Spirit in Christian life. While believers’ baptism often involves the Spirit’s regenerative work, Jesus’ baptism inaugurated His mission and demonstrated the Spirit’s empowering presence.

Conclusion

Christian regeneration is a spiritual rebirth initiated by the Holy Spirit. It requires repentance, faith, and often involves baptism, which symbolizes and expresses the transformation God brings. Jesus’ baptism, while unique, highlights the Spirit’s essential role in empowering and affirming believers in their walk with God.

Well said!

I would add. To me, the Baptism of Jesus indicates the sealing of the Holy Spirit to the Person and work of Jesus Christ during His advent. It also was a coronation ceremony that represented the Eternal nature of Christ's Kingdom to humanity. King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

 

[Complete]

Addressing the OP. What do the (NBR) say on Mark 16:16? and also Luke 20:1 "And it came to pass, that on one of those days, as he taught the people in the temple, and preached the gospel, the chief priests and the scribes came upon him with the elders," Luke 20:2 "And spake unto him, saying, Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things? or who is he that gave thee this authority?" Luke 20:3 "And he answered and said unto them, I will also ask you one thing; and answer me:" Luke 20:4 "The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?" Luke 20:5 "And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then believed ye him not?" Luke 20:6 "But and if we say, Of men; all the people will stone us: for they be persuaded that John was a prophet." Luke 20:7 "And they answered, that they could not tell whence it was."

was John's Baptism from heaven or men to obey? also was the Gospel was it from Heaven or men? this is the two witness, the Gospel, (Jesus the Christ), and water Baptism, (John the Baptist).

101G.

Subject Heading:- All the Verses That Show Us Salvation Can Occur Without Water Baptism

'He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.'
(Mar 16:16)

'And it came to pass, that on one of those days,
as He taught the people in the temple,
and preached the gospel,
the chief priests and the scribes came upon Him with the elders,
And spake unto Him, saying,
"Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things?" or
"who is he that gave thee this authority?"
And He answered and said unto them,
"I will also ask you one thing; and answer me:
The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?
And they reasoned with themselves, saying,
If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then believed ye him not?
But and if we say, 'Of men'; all the people will stone us:
for they be persuaded that John was a prophet.
And they answered, that they could not tell whence it was.
And Jesus said unto them,
"Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things."
(Luke 20:1-8)

Hello @101G,

Miles Coverdale gives the following guide when reading the Scriptures, which in regard to the subject in hand, and the verses you referenced from Mark 18 and Luke 20, (above), is worth taking into account:-

'It will greatly help you to understand Scripture if you note -
not only what is spoken and written,
but of whom
and to whom,
with what words,
at what time,
where, to what intent,
with what circumstances,
considering what goes before
and what follows.'

Within the love of Christ our Saviour,
our Lord and Head.
Chris

 

[dwight92070]

Addressing the OP. What do the (NBR) say on Mark 16:16? and also Luke 20:1 "And it came to pass, that on one of those days, as he taught the people in the temple, and preached the gospel, the chief priests and the scribes came upon him with the elders," Luke 20:2 "And spake unto him, saying, Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things? or who is he that gave thee this authority?" Luke 20:3 "And he answered and said unto them, I will also ask you one thing; and answer me:" Luke 20:4 "The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?" Luke 20:5 "And they reasoned with themselves, saying, If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then believed ye him not?" Luke 20:6 "But and if we say, Of men; all the people will stone us: for they be persuaded that John was a prophet." Luke 20:7 "And they answered, that they could not tell whence it was."

was John's Baptism from heaven or men to obey? also was the Gospel was it from Heaven or men? this is the two witness, the Gospel, (Jesus the Christ), and water Baptism, (John the Baptist).

101G.

If you have paid attention to what I have always said, NBR (no baptism required) refers ONLY to salvation. I have ALWAYS acknowledged that water baptism is a command of Jesus that all who HAVE BEEN BORN AGAIN should submit to, as I myself did after I was saved in 1970.

 

[101G]

Subject Heading:- All the Verses That Show Us Salvation Can Occur Without Water Baptism

'He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved;
but he that believeth not shall be damned.'
(Mar 16:16)

'And it came to pass, that on one of those days,
as He taught the people in the temple,
and preached the gospel,
the chief priests and the scribes came upon Him with the elders,
And spake unto Him, saying,
"Tell us, by what authority doest thou these things?" or
"who is he that gave thee this authority?"
And He answered and said unto them,
"I will also ask you one thing; and answer me:
The baptism of John, was it from heaven, or of men?
And they reasoned with themselves, saying,
If we shall say, From heaven; he will say, Why then believed ye him not?
But and if we say, 'Of men'; all the people will stone us:
for they be persuaded that John was a prophet.
And they answered, that they could not tell whence it was.
And Jesus said unto them,
"Neither tell I you by what authority I do these things."
(Luke 20:1-8)

Hello @101G,

Miles Coverdale gives the following guide when reading the Scriptures, which in regard to the subject in hand, and the verses you referenced from Mark 18 and Luke 20, (above), is worth taking into account:-

'It will greatly help you to understand Scripture if you note -
not only what is spoken and written,
but of whom
and to whom,
with what words,
at what time,
where, to what intent,
with what circumstances,
considering what goes before
and what follows.'

In Christ Jesus
Chris

the bible is speaking to all his children in "TIME", "PLACE", "ORDER" and "RANK".....

101G

 

[101G]

If you have paid attention to what I have always said, NBR (no baptism required) refers ONLY to salvation. I have ALWAYS acknowledged that water baptism is a command of Jesus that all who HAVE BEEN BORN AGAIN should submit to, as I myself did after I was saved in 1970.

great, so why bring up what the NBR had to say... (or not say?).

101G

 

[Complete]

the bible is speaking to all his children in "TIME", "PLACE", "ORDER" and "RANK".....

101G

Hello @101G,

Please don't disregard the guide given by Miles Coverdale, for it is worth taking into consideration in regard to what is said and when. I am a dispensationalist, so take note of the changes in administration that take place within Scripture, and necessitate change. and this, re. baptism, is one thing that does change.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

 

[101G]

Hello @101G,

Please don't disregard the guide given by Miles Coverdale, for it is worth taking into consideration in regard to what is said and when. I am a dispensationalist, so take note of the changes in administration that take place within Scripture, and necessitate change. and this, re. baptism, is one thing that does change.

Thank you
In Christ Jesus
Chris

thanks for the reply, but in dispensation, the word is the same for...... Because of this verse, Romans 15:4 "For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope."

and when ONE learns, EITHER WHAT WAS WRITTEN ... AUDIENCE RELEVANT, or to a GROUP or SEGMENT of PEOPLE, if it for our learning then it for us also to understand in the TIME, PLACE, ORDER, or RANK ... that the LEARNER is in

thanks for the response.

101G.