Christendom's Trinity: Where Did It Come From?

[FreeInChrist]

John 1:1 at Clause #1 is with reference to the beginning of creation. Jesus Christ aka "the Word," is a created being. John 1:1 at clause #1 informs the reader that Jesus/the Word had a beginning. This is confirmed at John 1:18 where it describes Jesus/the Word as "begotten."

Go to Post 167 for a fuller explanation where I provided scriptural quotations as well as the definition of the word "begotten" from Merriam-Webster's dictionary. Below is the link to that post.

Post in thread 'Christendom's Trinity: Where Did It Come From?'

Dec 23, 2025

atpollard:

John 1:1 has three independent clauses. Look at Clause #1. It says: "In the beginning was the Word...."

According to Christendom's Trinity, Jesus Christ aka "the Word" does not have a beginning.


Christendom's Trinity is defined as follows:
"There is but one living and true God, everlasting, without body, parts, or passions; of infinite power, wisdom, and goodness; the maker and preserver of all things both visible and indivisible. And in unity of this Godhead there be three persons, of ONE...

• Alter2Ego

In the beginning of creation who made creation happen?

NWT satys

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was a god.

2  This one was in the beginning with God.

3  All things came into existence through him and apart from him not even one thing came into existence.
What has come into existence

4  by means of him was life, and the life was the light of men.

Right here it says the Word was already in existence with God, In existence from the very beginning, all things came into existence through him......... apart from him not even one thing came into existence.

What you are saying is that He created Himself.

 

[Peterlag]

Since it's Christmas let's look at the history books...​

"The doctrine of the Trinity is not a biblical doctrine... it's the product of theological reflection." - The Christian Doctrine of God Trinitarian. E. Brunner, 1949, p. 236.

“Trinity is not a biblical doctrine" - New Bible Dictionary, J. Douglas, F. Bruce, 1982, p. 1298.

“Scholars generally agree that there is no doctrine of the Trinity as such in either the Old or the New Testament” - The Harper Collins Encyclopedia of Catholicism, 1995, p. 564.

“The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning a trinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.

“Three coequal partners in the Godhead cannot be clearly detected within the confines of the Bible. It's important to avoid reading the Trinity into places where it does not appear." - Oxford Companion to the Bible, Bruce Metzger, M. Coogan, p. 782-3.

“The doctrine of the Trinity is not present in biblical thought... it goes beyond, and even distorts, what the Bible says about God.” - A Contemporary Interpretation of the Trinity - God in Three Persons: Professor M. Erickson, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, p. 12, 20.

“The belief (in a Trinity-God) was reached only in the 4th and 5th centuries AD and hence is not explicitly and formally a biblical belief." - Dictionary of the Bible, 1995, (trinitarian) J. Mckenzie, p. 899.

“The doctrine of the Trinity was formulated in the post-biblical period." - Harper’s Bible Dictionary, 1985.

“In the New Testament there is no direct suggestion of a doctrine of the Trinity." - An Encyclopedia of Religion, V. Ferm (ed.), 1945, p. 344.

“No passage of Scripture discusses the threeness of God." - The New International Version. Disciples Study Bible, p. 173, note for Mt. 3:16.

“The Bible does not state that there is one God who exists in three persons” - Basic Theology, Professor C. Ryrie, p. 89.

“The Bible does not teach the doctrine of the Trinity” - Christian Doctrine, Professor S. Guthrie, Columbia Theological Seminary, 1994, p. 92.

“The doctrine of the Trinity cannot be justified on the basis of Scripture. Indeed it's hard to imagine Jesus speaking in such terms" - An Outline of Biblical Theology, Professor M. Burrows, Yale Divinity School, p. 81.

“The doctrine of God as existing in three persons and one substance is not demonstrable by scriptural proofs." - Hastings Dictionary of the Bible, 1898.

“There is in the Old Testament no indication of interior distinctions in the Godhead. And there is no doctrine of the Trinity in the New Testament” - The Known Bible and its Defense, Reverend M. Hembre, 1933, p. 25.

 

[civic]

Since it's Christmas let's look at the history books...​

"The doctrine of the Trinity is not a biblical doctrine... it's the product of theological reflection." - The Christian Doctrine of God Trinitarian. E. Brunner, 1949, p. 236.

“Trinity is not a biblical doctrine" - New Bible Dictionary, J. Douglas, F. Bruce, 1982, p. 1298.

“Scholars generally agree that there is no doctrine of the Trinity as such in either the Old or the New Testament” - The Harper Collins Encyclopedia of Catholicism, 1995, p. 564.

“The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning a trinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.

“Three coequal partners in the Godhead cannot be clearly detected within the confines of the Bible. It's important to avoid reading the Trinity into places where it does not appear." - Oxford Companion to the Bible, Bruce Metzger, M. Coogan, p. 782-3.

“The doctrine of the Trinity is not present in biblical thought... it goes beyond, and even distorts, what the Bible says about God.” - A Contemporary Interpretation of the Trinity - God in Three Persons: Professor M. Erickson, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, p. 12, 20.

“The belief (in a Trinity-God) was reached only in the 4th and 5th centuries AD and hence is not explicitly and formally a biblical belief." - Dictionary of the Bible, 1995, (trinitarian) J. Mckenzie, p. 899.

“The doctrine of the Trinity was formulated in the post-biblical period." - Harper’s Bible Dictionary, 1985.

“In the New Testament there is no direct suggestion of a doctrine of the Trinity." - An Encyclopedia of Religion, V. Ferm (ed.), 1945, p. 344.

“No passage of Scripture discusses the threeness of God." - The New International Version. Disciples Study Bible, p. 173, note for Mt. 3:16.

“The Bible does not state that there is one God who exists in three persons” - Basic Theology, Professor C. Ryrie, p. 89.

“The Bible does not teach the doctrine of the Trinity” - Christian Doctrine, Professor S. Guthrie, Columbia Theological Seminary, 1994, p. 92.

“The doctrine of the Trinity cannot be justified on the basis of Scripture. Indeed it's hard to imagine Jesus speaking in such terms" - An Outline of Biblical Theology, Professor M. Burrows, Yale Divinity School, p. 81.

“The doctrine of God as existing in three persons and one substance is not demonstrable by scriptural proofs." - Hastings Dictionary of the Bible, 1898.

“There is in the Old Testament no indication of interior distinctions in the Godhead. And there is no doctrine of the Trinity in the New Testament” - The Known Bible and its Defense, Reverend M. Hembre, 1933, p. 25.

thats known as the appeal to authority fallacy,

nice try

 

[civic]

Since it's Christmas let's look at the history books...​

"The doctrine of the Trinity is not a biblical doctrine... it's the product of theological reflection." - The Christian Doctrine of God Trinitarian. E. Brunner, 1949, p. 236.

“Trinity is not a biblical doctrine" - New Bible Dictionary, J. Douglas, F. Bruce, 1982, p. 1298.

“Scholars generally agree that there is no doctrine of the Trinity as such in either the Old or the New Testament” - The Harper Collins Encyclopedia of Catholicism, 1995, p. 564.

“The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning a trinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.

“Three coequal partners in the Godhead cannot be clearly detected within the confines of the Bible. It's important to avoid reading the Trinity into places where it does not appear." - Oxford Companion to the Bible, Bruce Metzger, M. Coogan, p. 782-3.

“The doctrine of the Trinity is not present in biblical thought... it goes beyond, and even distorts, what the Bible says about God.” - A Contemporary Interpretation of the Trinity - God in Three Persons: Professor M. Erickson, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, p. 12, 20.

“The belief (in a Trinity-God) was reached only in the 4th and 5th centuries AD and hence is not explicitly and formally a biblical belief." - Dictionary of the Bible, 1995, (trinitarian) J. Mckenzie, p. 899.

“The doctrine of the Trinity was formulated in the post-biblical period." - Harper’s Bible Dictionary, 1985.

“In the New Testament there is no direct suggestion of a doctrine of the Trinity." - An Encyclopedia of Religion, V. Ferm (ed.), 1945, p. 344.

“No passage of Scripture discusses the threeness of God." - The New International Version. Disciples Study Bible, p. 173, note for Mt. 3:16.

“The Bible does not state that there is one God who exists in three persons” - Basic Theology, Professor C. Ryrie, p. 89.

“The Bible does not teach the doctrine of the Trinity” - Christian Doctrine, Professor S. Guthrie, Columbia Theological Seminary, 1994, p. 92.

“The doctrine of the Trinity cannot be justified on the basis of Scripture. Indeed it's hard to imagine Jesus speaking in such terms" - An Outline of Biblical Theology, Professor M. Burrows, Yale Divinity School, p. 81.

“The doctrine of God as existing in three persons and one substance is not demonstrable by scriptural proofs." - Hastings Dictionary of the Bible, 1898.

“There is in the Old Testament no indication of interior distinctions in the Godhead. And there is no doctrine of the Trinity in the New Testament” - The Known Bible and its Defense, Reverend M. Hembre, 1933, p. 25.

Words/ Doctrines about God not found in the bible.

Words not found in the bible but are 100% truth and facts about God.

Omnipotent
Omnipresent
Omniscient
Immutable
Transcendent
Perichoresis
Immanence
Impeccable
Incorporeal
Incomprehensible
Aseity

conclusion: exact word fallacy argument doesn't make the word being used untrue.

 

[Peterlag]

Words/ Doctrines about God not found in the bible.

Words not found in the bible but are 100% truth and facts about God.

Omnipotent
Omnipresent
Omniscient
Immutable
Transcendent
Perichoresis
Immanence
Impeccable
Incorporeal
Incomprehensible
Aseity

conclusion: exact word fallacy argument doesn't make the word being used untrue.

So if there is no verse in the Scriptures stating God is “omniscient” meaning He knows the past, the present, and the future. Then why do so many Christians believe God is omniscient?
The answer is: Ancient Greek Mythology and Philosophy.

 

[civic]

So if there is no verse in the Scriptures stating God is “omniscient” meaning He knows the past, the present, and the future. Then why do so many Christians believe God is omniscient?
The answer is: Ancient Greek Mythology and Philosophy.

So you deny God is all knowing and all powerful ?

 

[Peterlag]

So you deny God is all knowing and all powerful ?

I do think God does not know the future. I did not say anything about powerful.

 

[FreeInChrist]

So if there is no verse in the Scriptures stating God is “omniscient” meaning He knows the past, the present, and the future. Then why do so many Christians believe God is omniscient?
The answer is: Ancient Greek Mythology and Philosophy.

Do you regard God as omniscient?

Enjoy your Ancient Greek Mythology and Philosophy.

 

[Selah]

Although Trinity is the most important doctrine within most of Christendom's 41,000 denominations, Trinitarians ignore the following facts:

1. There are no scriptures in the Judeo-Christian Bible in support of the dogma of a 3-in-1 god, in which there are three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Ghost) that are co-equal and co-eternal.

2. Neither Jesus Christ nor his disciples of the 1st century AD promoted the teaching that there are three persons within a godhead, all of whom are co-equal and co-eternal.

3. Trinity did not become official Christian teaching until the 4th century AD, some 300 years after Jesus Christ left the earthly scene and returned to heavenly life, and some 300 years after the last book of the Bible was written.

It would surprise some that there were trinity gods throughout the pagan world--for centuries before the idea of a 3-in-1 god was adopted by Christendom. Below are four such examples:

A. In the 2nd century BCE (two centuries before Jesus Christ came to the earth), Egypt had a triad of gods consisting of (1) Horus, (2) Osiris, and (3) Isis.


B. In the 2nd century B.C.E., Babylon had a triad of gods consisting of (1) Ishtar, (2) Sin, and (3) Shamash.


C. In the 1st century C.E., Palmyra, which was an ancient city in Syria, had a triune god which consisted of (1) moon god, (2) Lord of Heavens, and (3) sun god.


D. Even the Hindus in India have their own trinity of gods, as follows: (1) Brahma, (2) Vishnu, and (3) Shiva.



QUESTIONS FOR DISCUSSION:

1. If the teaching of a Trinity god is essential to Christianity, how is it that the doctrine is nowhere to be found in scriptures within Jehovah's inspired word, the Judeo-Christian Bible?


2. If Jesus Christ is part of a trinity in which he has the same power (co-equal) and the same eternity (co-eternal) as Jehovah the Father, how is it that the scriptures repeatedly inform us that Jesus Christ is subservient to Almighty God Jehovah (indicating inequality) and why is it that scripture tells us over and over again that Jesus Christ is "begotten" (indicating he had a beginning)?


3. Why did it take two Roman Emperors/politicians, neither of whom were Christians, to enforce the official Trinity dogma some 300 years after Jesus Christ left the earthly scene?

The Bible tells us in many places that there is only One God—As an example, consider in the book of Deuteronomy:

Deuteronomy 6:4-5 (KJV) 4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God [is] one LORD: 5 And thou shalt love the LORD thy God with all thine heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy might.

God tells simply that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all God.

Selah

 

[Peterlag]

THE WORD DID NOT SHED BLOOD.
THE WORD DID NOT DIE.
THE WORD WAS NOT RESURRECTED.
THE WORD DID NOT ASCEND TO "MY GOD AND YOUR GOD".
Christ Jesus did.
The words of GOD were with God.
The Word of God is not another God-person.
The words of God were sent to Mary and she believed the words of God by a messenger.
The words were spirit and life.

The WORDS were not a trinity.
The WORD was not three God-persons.
The WORDS were not a God man.
The WORDS of men deceive, grieve, and weave the lie.

 

[Grace ambassador]

about post: 3067 Judgment To Come...

 

[Peterlag]

Let's talk about the Holy Spirit...

God put His gift of the “holy spirit” or the “spirit” on as many people as He deemed necessary in the Old Testament, and we see this when we look at how God took the spirit that was upon Moses and put it upon the 70 elders of Israel. However, today everyone who makes Jesus Christ their Lord receives the gift of the holy spirit and that's why Peter on the Day of Pentecost quoted the prophecy in Joel that said God would “pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh." Many scholars admit the concept of the Trinity that also includes reference to the "Holy Spirit” as an independent “Person” cannot be found in the Old Testament. The Jews to whom the Old Testament was given did not recognize any such being. It's a well-known historical fact that “Hear, O Israel! Yahweh is our God, Yahweh alone,” was the cry of Israel. No verse or context openly states or even directly infers that there is a separate “Person” called “the Holy Spirit."

One of the ways we know that “pneuma hagion” often refers to the gift of God’s nature is that it “belongs” to God, who calls it “my” spirit. The spirit is called “God’s” spirit in many verses and King David understood the holy spirit belonged to God because he wrote “…do not take your holy spirit from me.” The Bible shows us that “the holy spirit” is under God’s authority and direction, which makes sense when we understand it's the gift of His nature that He gives to believers. The words “Messiah” in Hebrew (mashiyach מָשִׁיחַ) and “Christ” in Greek (christos Χριστός) both mean “anointed one.” Thus, the early Christians would have known him as “Jesus the anointed one.” God “anointed” Jesus Christ with the holy spirit and that's why Jesus was said to have been “anointed” (Acts 4:27; 10:38).

We have no evidence in the Bible that “the Holy Spirit” was ever used as a name because no one ever used it in a direct address. Many people spoke or prayed directly to God, starting out by saying “O Yahweh” (translated as “O LORD” in almost all English versions). Furthermore, the name “Jesus” is a Greek form of the name “Joshua” (in fact, the King James Version confuses “Joshua” and “Jesus” in Acts 7:45 and Hebrews 4:8) and many people spoke “to Jesus” in the Bible. But no one in the Bible ever used “the Holy Spirit” in a direct address because there's simply no actual name for any “Person” known as “the Holy Spirit” anywhere in the Bible.

The gift of the holy spirit that Christians have is a gift and thus an “it.” Jesus told the apostles that the spirit would be “in” them (John 14:17)—which is what happened on the Day of Pentecost when the holy spirit went from being with or “upon” people in the Old Testament and Gospels to being born “in” people on and after the Day of Pentecost. The spirit is sent by the Father (John 14:16-17) and Jesus (John 16:7). It does not speak on its own, but it speaks only what it hears (John 16:13). Thus, the gift of the holy spirit is directed by God and Jesus, which is what we would expect since it's God’s nature born in us. The gift of the holy spirit is the nature of God, and when it's born in us it becomes part of our very nature (2 Peter 1:4).

 

[civic]

Let's talk about the Holy Spirit...

God put His gift of the “holy spirit” or the “spirit” on as many people as He deemed necessary in the Old Testament, and we see this when we look at how God took the spirit that was upon Moses and put it upon the 70 elders of Israel. However, today everyone who makes Jesus Christ their Lord receives the gift of the holy spirit and that's why Peter on the Day of Pentecost quoted the prophecy in Joel that said God would “pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh." Many scholars admit the concept of the Trinity that also includes reference to the "Holy Spirit” as an independent “Person” cannot be found in the Old Testament. The Jews to whom the Old Testament was given did not recognize any such being. It's a well-known historical fact that “Hear, O Israel! Yahweh is our God, Yahweh alone,” was the cry of Israel. No verse or context openly states or even directly infers that there is a separate “Person” called “the Holy Spirit."

One of the ways we know that “pneuma hagion” often refers to the gift of God’s nature is that it “belongs” to God, who calls it “my” spirit. The spirit is called “God’s” spirit in many verses and King David understood the holy spirit belonged to God because he wrote “…do not take your holy spirit from me.” The Bible shows us that “the holy spirit” is under God’s authority and direction, which makes sense when we understand it's the gift of His nature that He gives to believers. The words “Messiah” in Hebrew (mashiyach מָשִׁיחַ) and “Christ” in Greek (christos Χριστός) both mean “anointed one.” Thus, the early Christians would have known him as “Jesus the anointed one.” God “anointed” Jesus Christ with the holy spirit and that's why Jesus was said to have been “anointed” (Acts 4:27; 10:38).

We have no evidence in the Bible that “the Holy Spirit” was ever used as a name because no one ever used it in a direct address. Many people spoke or prayed directly to God, starting out by saying “O Yahweh” (translated as “O LORD” in almost all English versions). Furthermore, the name “Jesus” is a Greek form of the name “Joshua” (in fact, the King James Version confuses “Joshua” and “Jesus” in Acts 7:45 and Hebrews 4:8) and many people spoke “to Jesus” in the Bible. But no one in the Bible ever used “the Holy Spirit” in a direct address because there's simply no actual name for any “Person” known as “the Holy Spirit” anywhere in the Bible.

The gift of the holy spirit that Christians have is a gift and thus an “it.” Jesus told the apostles that the spirit would be “in” them (John 14:17)—which is what happened on the Day of Pentecost when the holy spirit went from being with or “upon” people in the Old Testament and Gospels to being born “in” people on and after the Day of Pentecost. The spirit is sent by the Father (John 14:16-17) and Jesus (John 16:7). It does not speak on its own, but it speaks only what it hears (John 16:13). Thus, the gift of the holy spirit is directed by God and Jesus, which is what we would expect since it's God’s nature born in us. The gift of the holy spirit is the nature of God, and when it's born in us it becomes part of our very nature (2 Peter 1:4).

Sorry Jesus identifies the Holy Spirit as another person just like Himself whom He will send to His disciples in His absence.

Jesus used personal pronouns when referring to the Holy Spirit: He is God ! Acts 5:3-4


"But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. "And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me; and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me; and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged. "I have many more things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. "But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. "All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you. "(John 16:7-15).


The Holy Spirit below does things that only a person can do,


He leads (Matt. 4:1).
He is called God (Acts 5:3-4).
He helps and comforts (John 14:16, 16:7).
He convicts of sin (John 16:17).
He gives testimony of Jesus (John 15:26).
He teaches, guides and brings to remembrance (John 14:26, 16:13).
He speaks and instructs (Acts 8:29, 10:19; John 16:13).
He hears and speaks (John 16:13, Acts 28:25-27).
He guides ( John 16:13)
He discloses ( John 16:15)
He can be lied to and tested (Acts 5:3-4, 9).
He sends and gives life (Acts 13:4, John 3:6, Gen 1:3).
He is a witness (Acts 5:32)
He restrains (2 Thess. 2:7).
He prevents (Acts 16:6-7).
The Spirit "said" to Philip and Peter(Acts 8:29, 10:19).
Peter said he was "told" by the Spirit (Acts 11:12).
The Holy Spirit "solemnly testifies" (Acts 20:23).
He made some of the early Christians overseers to shepherd the Church. (Acts 20:28).
He wills (Acts 13:2).
He interprets our prayers (Rom. 8:26).
He knows and communicates (1 Cor. 2:11; Rom. 8:27).
He reveals (Eph. 3:5).
He has a will-He decides, chooses and distributes the Gifts to the church (1 Cor. 12:11).
He can be grieved (Eph. 4:30).

Conclusion: the Holy Spirit is a person who is God, not an it. Jesus said He would send another ( person ) in His place/ absence who would be with them and in them.

hope this helps !!!

 

[amazing grace]

about post: 3067 Judgment To Come...

Yes, there is Judgment coming ........ Just a few verses about being saved.

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. [John 3:16-18]

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life. [John 5:24]

because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance .” [Acts 17:31]

And the jailer called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas. Then he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.” [Acts 16:29-31]

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil. [2 Corinthians 5:10] Even every believer must appear before the judgment seat of Christ.

There is not a scripture in the whole of the Bible that says one must believe in a Triune God or a Trinity in order to be saved and I am talking about a CLEAR SUCCINCTLY STATED VERSE not something inferred, nor something ambiguous in meaning.

 

[civic]

Yes, there is Judgment coming ........ Just a few verses about being saved.

“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him. Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only Son of God. [John 3:16-18]

Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life. [John 5:24]

because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance .” [Acts 17:31]

And the jailer called for lights and rushed in, and trembling with fear he fell down before Paul and Silas. Then he brought them out and said, “Sirs, what must I do to be saved?” And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.” [Acts 16:29-31]

For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil. [2 Corinthians 5:10] Even every believer must appear before the judgment seat of Christ.

There is not a scripture in the whole of the Bible that says one must believe in a Triune God or a Trinity in order to be saved and I am talking about a CLEAR SUCCINCTLY STATED VERSE not something inferred, nor something ambiguous in meaning.

But one must believe Jesus is YHWH to be saved

 

[amazing grace]

But one must believe Jesus is YHWH to be saved

Did any of the verses I posted concerning salvation and I know I barely skimmed the surface - but do any say one must believe Jesus is YHWH? Where is the verse, JUST ONE as evidence that we are to believe Jesus is YHWH . . . As yet no one provided ONE single verse that clearly and succinctly teaches us that we must believe Jesus is God to be saved. I'm not talking about something taken as inference nor one which is ambiguous.

We are to believe in the Son of God, the anointed of God, the Lord's Messiah - Jesus of Nazareth, the man attested to us by God.

 

[civic]

Did any of the verses I posted concerning salvation and I know I barely skimmed the surface - but do any say one must believe Jesus is YHWH? Where is the verse, JUST ONE as evidence that we are to believe Jesus is YHWH . . . As yet no one provided ONE single verse that clearly and succinctly teaches us that we must believe Jesus is God to be saved. I'm not talking about something taken as inference nor one which is ambiguous.

We are to believe in the Son of God, the anointed of God, the Lord's Messiah - Jesus of Nazareth, the man attested to us by God.

Romans 10:9-14 where Paul says one must believe He is YHWH ( Lord) to be saved.

 

[amazing grace]

Romans 10:9-14 where Paul says one must believe He is YHWH ( Lord) to be saved.

No it does not --- Yes, Romans 10:13 is a direct quote from Joel 2:32 - It's nothing new for an OT verse which was in reference to God the Father to be brought into the NT in a different context to reference to His Son, Jesus Christ - it doesn't mean that Jesus is God - it means now we are to call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.

because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” [Romans 10:9-13]

To the church of God that is in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints together with all those who in every place call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, both their Lord and ours: [1 Cor. 1:2]

 

[civic]

No it does not --- Yes, Romans 10:13 is a direct quote from Joel 2:32 - It's nothing new for an OT verse which was in reference to God the Father to be brought into the NT in a different context to reference to His Son, Jesus Christ - it doesn't mean that Jesus is God - it means now we are to call upon the name of the Lord Jesus Christ.

because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved. For the Scripture says, “Everyone who believes in him will not be put to shame.” For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek; for the same Lord is Lord of all, bestowing his riches on all who call on him. For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.” [Romans 10:9-13]

To the church of God that is in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints together with all those who in every place call upon the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, both their Lord and ours: [1 Cor. 1:2]

Jesus is the ONLY Lord, the One Lord

 

[FreeInChrist]

Sorry Jesus identifies the Holy Spirit as another person just like Himself whom He will send to His disciples in His absence.

Jesus used personal pronouns when referring to the Holy Spirit: He is God ! Acts 5:3-4


"But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. "And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me; and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me; and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged. "I have many more things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. "But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. "All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you. "(John 16:7-15).


The Holy Spirit below does things that only a person can do,


He leads (Matt. 4:1).
He is called God (Acts 5:3-4).
He helps and comforts (John 14:16, 16:7).
He convicts of sin (John 16:17).
He gives testimony of Jesus (John 15:26).
He teaches, guides and brings to remembrance (John 14:26, 16:13).
He speaks and instructs (Acts 8:29, 10:19; John 16:13).
He hears and speaks (John 16:13, Acts 28:25-27).
He guides ( John 16:13)
He discloses ( John 16:15)
He can be lied to and tested (Acts 5:3-4, 9).
He sends and gives life (Acts 13:4, John 3:6, Gen 1:3).
He is a witness (Acts 5:32)
He restrains (2 Thess. 2:7).
He prevents (Acts 16:6-7).
The Spirit "said" to Philip and Peter(Acts 8:29, 10:19).
Peter said he was "told" by the Spirit (Acts 11:12).
The Holy Spirit "solemnly testifies" (Acts 20:23).
He made some of the early Christians overseers to shepherd the Church. (Acts 20:28).
He wills (Acts 13:2).
He interprets our prayers (Rom. 8:26).
He knows and communicates (1 Cor. 2:11; Rom. 8:27).
He reveals (Eph. 3:5).
He has a will-He decides, chooses and distributes the Gifts to the church (1 Cor. 12:11).
He can be grieved (Eph. 4:30).

Conclusion: the Holy Spirit is a person who is God, not an it. Jesus said He would send another ( person ) in His place/ absence who would be with them and in them.

hope this helps !!!

Amen, amen