Why I don’t believe or accept the trinity.

nothing but your presuppositions above void of Scripture as evidence it happened prior to pentecost.

I posted Scriptures, but you refuse to consider them. This is because you are here to promote your specific adopted religious philosophy, not seek God's Truth or Righteousness. Just like the Calvinists that you harp on all the time. You promote falsehoods no different than them. Just a different Falsehoods.

Zacharias, Simeon, Anna and the Wise Men all knew the Christ, even before John the Baptist. Even before HE was born they understood the Scriptures that Jesus opened up to His Disciples.

Luke 24: 25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: 26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory? 27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Zacharias, Simeon, Anna already knew all these things before Jesus was even born. At least according to Scriptures. This is because they were "Learned of the Father" and were "obedient" to God and received the Holy Spirit that God gives to them that obey Him. (Acts 5:32) I know you won't go there, but I'm posting it to show where my understanding comes from.

I have posted the Scriptures to you already that show this. But you completely ignored them and are now lying to everyone on this forum by telling them my understanding on this matter is "void of Scriptures".

I will post them again, and you will ignore them again. But my understand of God and His Son, is "because" I believe all that is written in the holy scriptures, not "because" of a sermon by some random self-proclaimed "minister of righteousness" on a u-tube video.

Luke 1: 5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth. 6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

67 And his father Zacharias was "filled with the Holy Ghost", and prophesied, saying, 68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

69 And hath "raised up" an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David; (Tribe of Judah, not Levi)70 As he spake by the mouth of "his holy prophets", which have been since the world began:

And again;

Luke 2:25 And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was "just and devout", waiting for the consolation of Israel: and "the Holy Ghost" was upon him. 26 And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen "the Lord's Christ".

27 And he came by the Spirit into the temple: and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him after the custom of the law, 28 Then took he him up in his arms, and blessed God, and said, 29 Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace, according to thy word: 30 For mine eyes have seen "thy salvation", 31 Which thou hast prepared "before the face of all people"; 32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.
35 (Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.

Clearly these men, the remnant, these Just men of Faith, who were in "The generation of the Righteous" who God is in, received the Spirit of Truth before the Church of God under HIS Prophesied High Priest, kept their first true Pentecost.

I have provided well over a dozen proving it happened at Pentecost not before.

You have only proved that you only believe the Scriptures that you can use to promote the religious philosophies of your specific religious business.

It is ignorant to the point of wickedness to preach to others that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth owned and given to others by the God and Father of the Lord's Christ, didn't exist before God's Church under HIS New Priesthood honored Him by observing the Feasts of the Lord, Passover, Feast of Unleavened Bread, and Pentecost.

So why then, do you, the Pharisees, the Calvinists, and many other religious sects and businesses of this world, promote falsehoods about God and His Son? While Zacharias, Simeon, Abraham and the Church of God who kept Pentecost in Acts, all had the Holy Spirit of Truth? What was the difference between Zacharias, Simeon, who had been given the Spirit of Truth, and the Pharisees who professed to know God, but wasn't given by Him His spirit of Truth?

What is the difference between the Church of God in Acts, and this world's religions that you have adopted.

It's really simple and Peter spells it out in a way that even a child can understand.

Acts 5: 27 And when they had brought them, they set them before the council: (Mainstream religion of that time) and the high priest asked them,

28 Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? (Like you are doing to me even now) and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.

29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men. (And because I believe this, you call me a Legalist/Judaizer and preach to others that I don't honor God, and my Savior that HE sent for me.)

30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

31 Him hath God exalted "with his right hand" to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also "the Holy Ghost", (That was on Zacharias, Simeon, Anna, and the Wise Men) whom God hath given to them that obey him.

This is why your religion promotes its philosophy which is different than the Calvinists that promote their philosophy, which is different than the JW's which promote their philosophy which is different from the Pharisees which promoted their philosophy and on and on and on. The ONE THING you all have in common is, as the Jesus "of the bible" teaches "Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition". It's Babylon Civic. Come out of her.

If you would humble yourself to the God of the bible, as Jesus did, you might understand. But until then, you are just another of the "many"
"that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools".
 
I posted Scriptures, but you refuse to consider them. This is because you are here to promote your specific adopted religious philosophy, not seek God's Truth or Righteousness. Just like the Calvinists that you harp on all the time. You promote falsehoods no different than them. Just a different Falsehoods.

Zacharias, Simeon, Anna and the Wise Men all knew the Christ, even before John the Baptist. Even before HE was born they understood the Scriptures that Jesus opened up to His Disciples.

Luke 24: 25 Then he said unto them, O fools, and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken: 26 Ought not Christ to have suffered these things, and to enter into his glory? 27 And beginning at Moses and all the prophets, he expounded unto them in all the scriptures the things concerning himself.

Zacharias, Simeon, Anna already knew all these things before Jesus was even born. At least according to Scriptures. This is because they were "Learned of the Father" and were "obedient" to God and received the Holy Spirit that God gives to them that obey Him. (Acts 5:32) I know you won't go there, but I'm posting it to show where my understanding comes from.

I have posted the Scriptures to you already that show this. But you completely ignored them and are now lying to everyone on this forum by telling them my understanding on this matter is "void of Scriptures".

I will post them again, and you will ignore them again. But my understand of God and His Son, is "because" I believe all that is written in the holy scriptures, not "because" of a sermon by some random self-proclaimed "minister of righteousness" on a u-tube video.

Luke 1: 5 There was in the days of Herod, the king of Judaea, a certain priest named Zacharias, of the course of Abia: and his wife was of the daughters of Aaron, and her name was Elisabeth. 6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.

67 And his father Zacharias was "filled with the Holy Ghost", and prophesied, saying, 68 Blessed be the Lord God of Israel; for he hath visited and redeemed his people,

69 And hath "raised up" an horn of salvation for us in the house of his servant David; (Tribe of Judah, not Levi)70 As he spake by the mouth of "his holy prophets", which have been since the world began:

And again;

Luke 2:25 And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was "just and devout", waiting for the consolation of Israel: and "the Holy Ghost" was upon him. 26 And it was revealed unto him by the Holy Ghost, that he should not see death, before he had seen "the Lord's Christ".

27 And he came by the Spirit into the temple: and when the parents brought in the child Jesus, to do for him after the custom of the law, 28 Then took he him up in his arms, and blessed God, and said, 29 Lord, now lettest thou thy servant depart in peace, according to thy word: 30 For mine eyes have seen "thy salvation", 31 Which thou hast prepared "before the face of all people"; 32 A light to lighten the Gentiles, and the glory of thy people Israel.
35 (Yea, a sword shall pierce through thy own soul also,) that the thoughts of many hearts may be revealed.

Clearly these men, the remnant, these Just men of Faith, who were in "The generation of the Righteous" who God is in, received the Spirit of Truth before the Church of God under HIS Prophesied High Priest, kept their first true Pentecost.



You have only proved that you only believe the Scriptures that you can use to promote the religious philosophies of your specific religious business.

It is ignorant to the point of wickedness to preach to others that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth owned and given to others by the God and Father of the Lord's Christ, didn't exist before God's Church under HIS New Priesthood honored Him by observing the Feasts of the Lord, Passover, Feast of Unleavened Bread, and Pentecost.

So why then, do you, the Pharisees, the Calvinists, and many other religious sects and businesses of this world, promote falsehoods about God and His Son? While Zacharias, Simeon, Abraham and the Church of God who kept Pentecost in Acts, all had the Holy Spirit of Truth? What was the difference between Zacharias, Simeon, who had been given the Spirit of Truth, and the Pharisees who professed to know God, but wasn't given by Him His spirit of Truth?

What is the difference between the Church of God in Acts, and this world's religions that you have adopted.

It's really simple and Peter spells it out in a way that even a child can understand.

Acts 5: 27 And when they had brought them, they set them before the council: (Mainstream religion of that time) and the high priest asked them,

28 Saying, Did not we straitly command you that ye should not teach in this name? (Like you are doing to me even now) and, behold, ye have filled Jerusalem with your doctrine, and intend to bring this man's blood upon us.

29 Then Peter and the other apostles answered and said, We ought to obey God rather than men. (And because I believe this, you call me a Legalist/Judaizer and preach to others that I don't honor God, and my Savior that HE sent for me.)

30 The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree.

31 Him hath God exalted "with his right hand" to be a Prince and a Saviour, for to give repentance to Israel, and forgiveness of sins.

32 And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also "the Holy Ghost", (That was on Zacharias, Simeon, Anna, and the Wise Men) whom God hath given to them that obey him.

This is why your religion promotes its philosophy which is different than the Calvinists that promote their philosophy, which is different than the JW's which promote their philosophy which is different from the Pharisees which promoted their philosophy and on and on and on. The ONE THING you all have in common is, as the Jesus "of the bible" teaches "Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition". It's Babylon Civic. Come out of her.

If you would humble yourself to the God of the bible, as Jesus did, you might understand. But until then, you are just another of the "many"
"that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools".
yet another DODGE as I'm taking about the 12 disciples of Jesus.

next
 
View attachment 812 OK... I see the problem. Reading comprehension.

13 Then Jesus *arrived from Galilee at the Jordan coming to John, to be baptized by him.

14 But John tried to prevent Him, saying, “I have need to be baptized by You, and do You come to me?”

15 But Jesus answering said to him, “Permit it at this time; for in this way it is fitting for us to fulfill all righteousness.” Then he *permitted Him.

16 After being baptized, Jesus came up immediately from the water; and behold, the heavens were opened, and [i]he saw the Spirit of God descending as a dove and [j]lighting on Him,

17 and behold, a voice out of the heavens said, “This is [k]My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased.”

First. the Holy Spirit came and lit on Jesus.

Next. The voice that said "My beloved Son" yada yada... came from... (repeat after me) HEAVEN.

With your twisted view you again make it to seem as if the Holy Spirit is actually Jesus' father.

I don't think it's a twisted view to believe in the Jesus "of the Bibles" Words that the God and Father of the Lord's Christ that HE teaches men to pray to, is in heaven.

"After this manner therefore pray ye: "Our Father" which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.

The "Our Father" would be my Father, and Jesus' Father, my God and Jesus' God, Yes?

Nor is it a twisted view to believe that the God and Father of the Lord's Christ is a Spirit.

John 4: 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

I also don't believe it is a twisted view to believe that God is Holy. "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy."

So it's not surprising to me that God's Voice "came from heaven". Nor is it surprising to me that God Gave His Son, the man Jesus, His Holy Spirit. Is this not what Jesus means when HE says, "The Father is in me"? Isn't it written that God gives the Holy Spirit to those who Obey Him?

So I certainly don't want to have a twisted view of Scriptures. Can you show me where my reading comprehension is a problem?

So think long and hard on that implication.

You... with your belief system simply cannot rationalize what is right in from of your eyes.

How so?

Mr. Anti-trin man.... if there is no trinity.... then making that suggestion of "would this voice not be the Holy Spirit?" Keeps YHWH out of the equation altogether..... I would be very careful of that teaching.

While it is true that "Many" who come in Christ's Name, might not believe that the God and Father of the Lord's Christ is Holy, and they preach that HE places impossible laws, or as they preach, a "Yoke of Bondage" on the necks of men who humble themselves to Him. And then slaughter them when they can't keep His impossible for man to keep commandments. These religions might not believe that God, "A Spirit" according to His Son, the Jesus "of the Bible", is Holy.

But I believe God is a Spirit, and a Holy Spirit at that.

I am debating a self-proclaimed "minister of righteousness" who is promoting the falsehood that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth, which is in the God and Father of the Lord's Christ who is in heaven, didn't exist until the Church of God under God's New High Priest, observed God's Holy Feast, "Pentecost".

I am pointing out the many Scriptures which show that God has given His Spirit of Truth to Faithful men since Abel.
 
yet another DODGE as I'm taking about the 12 disciples of Jesus.

next

No, here is what you are preaching.

"I have proven from the teaching of Jesus that no one was born again until Pentecost which is why He had them with until that Day when He would pour out His spirit upon them causing the new birth and indwelling of the Holy Spirit as taught in Acts."

The Holy Spirit given to the Christ "of the bible", was from His Father. At least this is what the Scriptures teach.

How long did Jesus "Tarry" in Jerusalem before being anointed by a True Levite Priest, and receiving the Holy Spirit as it is written? it was 30 years before His Ministry started Civic. These are just more Biblical Truths you must ignore in order for your religious philosophy to stand.

Now if you were to edit your statement a little, it wouldn't be false.

"I have proven from the teaching of the Jesus "of the Bible" that the Disciples were not born again until Pentecost which is why He had them wait and count the days until Pentecost when His Father would give them His Holy Spirit of Truth, that HE gives to everyone who obeys Him, causing the scales to fall off their eyes to enable them to "Put on" the New Man, "Which after GOD, is created in Righteousness and True Holiness, like Paul, and Abraham and Caleb did, through belief His Son for the remission of their sins, who Zacharias, Simeon and Anna, all knew sacrificed Himself for them."
 
No, here is what you are preaching.

"I have proven from the teaching of Jesus that no one was born again until Pentecost which is why He had them with until that Day when He would pour out His spirit upon them causing the new birth and indwelling of the Holy Spirit as taught in Acts."

The Holy Spirit given to the Christ "of the bible", was from His Father. At least this is what the Scriptures teach.

How long did Jesus "Tarry" in Jerusalem before being anointed by a True Levite Priest, and receiving the Holy Spirit as it is written? it was 30 years before His Ministry started Civic. These are just more Biblical Truths you must ignore in order for your religious philosophy to stand.

Now if you were to edit your statement a little, it wouldn't be false.

"I have proven from the teaching of the Jesus "of the Bible" that the Disciples were not born again until Pentecost which is why He had them wait and count the days until Pentecost when His Father would give them His Holy Spirit of Truth, that HE gives to everyone who obeys Him, causing the scales to fall off their eyes to enable them to "Put on" the New Man, "Which after GOD, is created in Righteousness and True Holiness, like Paul, and Abraham and Caleb did, through belief His Son for the remission of their sins, who Zacharias, Simeon and Anna, all knew sacrificed Himself for them."
None of those OT saints you mentioned were born again.

You assume they were when the text never says or implied they were.

It’s called eisegesis something you do all of the time. Read your doctrine into the text
 
yet another DODGE as I'm taking about the 12 disciples of Jesus.

next
@Studyman posted below is TRUTH from the WORD that was God BEFORE the world was!

Studyman says: "Zacharias, Simeon, Anna and the Wise Men all knew the Christ, even before John the Baptist. Even before HE was born they understood the Scriptures that Jesus opened up to His Disciples."

EVIDENCE: 1 Peter 1:22-25

Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, because

“All flesh is as grass,
And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass.
The grass withers,
And its flower falls away,
But the [o]word of the Lord endures forever.”
Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.

Baptist theology has many lies interwoven in their teachings for they despise the Baptism of the Holy Spirit and call the "gifts" the work of the devil.

Sound familiar? = Matthew 12:25-30
 
None of those OT saints you mentioned were born again.

You assume they were when the text never says or implied they were.

It’s called eisegesis something you do all of the time. Read your doctrine into the text
Turn away from the lies and BELIEVE the TRUTH = Luke 2:25-32

And behold, there was a man in Jerusalem whose name was Simeon, and this man was just and devout, waiting for the Consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him. And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not see death before he had seen the Lord’s Christ. So he came by the Spirit into the temple. And when the parents brought in the Child Jesus, to do for Him according to the custom of the law,
he took Him up in his arms and blessed God and said:

“Lord, now You are letting Your servant depart in peace,
According to Your word;
For my eyes have seen Your salvation
Which You have prepared before the face of all peoples,
A light to bring revelation to the Gentiles,
And the glory of Your people Israel.”
 
None of those OT saints you mentioned were born again.

You assume they were when the text never says or implied they were.

It’s called eisegesis something you do all of the time. Read your doctrine into the text
Turn away from unbelief and believe the TRUTH: Luke 2:36-38

Now there was one, Anna, a prophetess, the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Asher. She was of a great age, and had lived with a husband seven years from her virginity; and this woman was a widow of about eighty-four years, who did not depart from the temple, but served God with fastings and prayers night and day. And coming in that instant she gave thanks to the Lord, and spoke of Him to all those who looked for redemption in Jerusalem.
 
None of those OT saints you mentioned were born again.

You assume they were when the text never says or implied they were.

It’s called eisegesis something you do all of the time. Read your doctrine into the text
Turn away from religion and turn to the TRUTH: Luke 7:24-28

When the messengers of John had departed, He began to speak to the multitudes concerning John: “What did you go out into the wilderness to see? A reed shaken by the wind? But what did you go out to see? A man clothed in soft garments? Indeed those who are gorgeously appareled and live in luxury are in kings’ courts. But what did you go out to see? A prophet? Yes, I say to you, and more than a prophet. This is he of whom it is written:

‘Behold, I send My messenger before Your face,
Who will prepare Your way before You.’
For I say to you, among those born of women there is not a greater prophet than John the Baptist; but he who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he.”

Feed on the Truth and you will be strong in the TRUTH
feed on religion and you will be as the religion you feed on
 
and? this still do not change 101G original question.

well yes or no?

101G.
YES ... Emphatically YES!!!!!

Same claim applies to SALVATION.

ONLY GOD saves.
ONLY Jesus saves.
So is the JESUS who saves, the GOD who saves?

The Jews understood perfectly and kept trying to STONE HIM for it!
So Jesus is GOD or a LIAR. I say JESUS IS GOD!!!

One can reject the "trinity" if one wants to get pedantic, but to reject the Deity of Christ is to worship an idol made by men and a false gospel.
THERE IS ONLY ONE NAME BY WHICH MEN ARE SAVED ... Jesus (God made flesh)!
 
Turn away from the lies and BELIEVE the TRUTH = Luke 2:25-32

And behold, there was a man in Jerusalem whose name was Simeon, and this man was just and devout, waiting for the Consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him. And it had been revealed to him by the Holy Spirit that he would not see death before he had seen the Lord’s Christ. So he came by the Spirit into the temple. And when the parents brought in the Child Jesus, to do for Him according to the custom of the law,
he took Him up in his arms and blessed God and said:

“Lord, now You are letting Your servant depart in peace,
According to Your word;
For my eyes have seen Your salvation
Which You have prepared before the face of all peoples,
A light to bring revelation to the Gentiles,
And the glory of Your people Israel.”
the H.S. was upon him, not indwelling him. That's the difference
 
None of those OT saints you mentioned were born again.

In the religion you have adopted and are now promoting, this might be true. But not according to Scriptures.

You assume they were when the text never says or implied they were.

I posted the very Words of the Jesus "of the Bible" who said Abraham and the Prophets will enter the Kingdom of God. And also the Same Christ's Words which said no man can even see the Kingdom of God unless they are born again.

I get that you have your religion to defend and promote, and therefore you are not allowed by your master's to consider other Scriptures which you can't use to justify the philosophies of your adopted religion.

Nevertheless, it is good to consider "ALL" that is written, in my view.

It’s called eisegesis something you do all of the time. Read your doctrine into the text

It's called "Projection" when you accuse others of the same unsavory practices you yourself engage in. There is a treatment for this psychological condition. Peter speaks to this treatment should you seek help.

1 Pet. 5: 6 Humble yourselves therefore under the mighty hand of God, that he may exalt you in due time:
 
Yeah.. OT prophets and others testified of Jesus. Whether foretelling them or as pre incarnate.

Jesus talked about searching the scriptures 'for in them think ye have eternal life'

That's the Old Testament mentioned by Jesus.

Truly Zacharias believed the Scriptures, and he knew the Christ before John the Baptist was even born. It's interesting to note how the Jesus "of the bible" felt about Moses and the Prophets.

Luke 16: 28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment.

29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; "let them hear them".

30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them "from the dead", they will repent.

31 And he said unto him, If they "hear not" Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead.

In my view, this explains the difference between Zacharias and the Pharisees. And also explains the difference between modern religions, who call Jesus Lord, Lord, and the first Church of God under HIS New High Priest, in Acts.

I would say also people were born again before Pentecost.

I certainly agree. We all are to partake of the Exodus from sin and deception, to the New man "Which after God is created in righteousness and true Holiness". Truly Abraham, Caleb, Meshak and other examples of Faithful man, embarked on this same journey.
 
the H.S. was upon him, not indwelling him. That's the difference
ABSOLUTELY = Now dwell on that in the LIGHT of NT Scripture beginning in the Gospel of John

He was SAVED by the WORD that endures Forever! = by faith in the Word(Grace & Truth) we are SAVED, "not of works lest any man should boast"

He was not BAPTIZED in the HOLY SPIRIT which is ONLY for New Covenant Saints = the 2nd Promise of the FATHER = Acts ch1

My BROTHER in Christ = "believe every word that proceeds from the Mouth of God", "for they are Spirit and they are LIFE"

Let us, together in Christ, allow us both, to be sanctified in and by the Truth = John 17:14-19

SHALOM to all who hold to these things
 
the H.S. was upon him, not indwelling him. That's the difference
is not he, Jesus the Lord the Holy Spirit in flesh? that was in him and upon him at his baptism? again, Luke 2:25 "And, behold, there was a man in Jerusalem, whose name was Simeon; and the same man was just and devout, waiting for the consolation of Israel: and the Holy Ghost was upon him." this term "consolation" is the Holy Spirit in "SHARED EQUALLY" in FLESH, because he was G2758 κενόω kenoo (ke-no-ō'). hence the reason for the EMPOWERMENT with the Holy Spirit at his baptism.
"consolation": G3874 παράκλησις paraklesis (pa-ra'-klee-sis) n.
1. an imploration, entreaty (urgent request (for mercy or help)).
2. an exhortation (urgent counsel, encouragement, or caution).
3. a comfort, solace.

[from G3870]
KJV: comfort, consolation, exhortation, intreaty
Root(s): G3870

one who gives "Comfort" is a ..... COMFORTER. ... BINGO.

101G
 
I don't think it's a twisted view to believe in the Jesus "of the Bibles" Words that the God and Father of the Lord's Christ that HE teaches men to pray to, is in heaven.

"After this manner therefore pray ye: "Our Father" which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name.

The "Our Father" would be my Father, and Jesus' Father, my God and Jesus' God, Yes?

Nor is it a twisted view to believe that the God and Father of the Lord's Christ is a Spirit.

John 4: 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

I also don't believe it is a twisted view to believe that God is Holy. "Because it is written, Be ye holy; for I am holy."

So it's not surprising to me that God's Voice "came from heaven". Nor is it surprising to me that God Gave His Son, the man Jesus, His Holy Spirit. Is this not what Jesus means when HE says, "The Father is in me"? Isn't it written that God gives the Holy Spirit to those who Obey Him?

So I certainly don't want to have a twisted view of Scriptures. Can you show me where my reading comprehension is a problem?



How so?



While it is true that "Many" who come in Christ's Name, might not believe that the God and Father of the Lord's Christ is Holy, and they preach that HE places impossible laws, or as they preach, a "Yoke of Bondage" on the necks of men who humble themselves to Him. And then slaughter them when they can't keep His impossible for man to keep commandments. These religions might not believe that God, "A Spirit" according to His Son, the Jesus "of the Bible", is Holy.

But I believe God is a Spirit, and a Holy Spirit at that.

But "THE" Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit of the TRinity?

Why in the world , once Jesus was preparing to leave mortal life and "finish" what He came to do... would he have said

“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you. John 14:26

Surely you do not entertain the idea that once Jesus was off the earth it was the Father, himself, who would come, for it sounds as if that is how you are leaning in this last statement of yours above


I am debating a self-proclaimed "minister of righteousness" who is promoting the falsehood that the Holy Spirit, the Spirit of Truth, which is in the God and Father of the Lord's Christ who is in heaven, didn't exist until the Church of God under God's New High Priest, observed God's Holy Feast, "Pentecost".

I am pointing out the many Scriptures which show that God has given His Spirit of Truth to Faithful men since Abel.
 
But "THE" Holy Spirit? The Holy Spirit of the TRinity?

Why in the world , once Jesus was preparing to leave mortal life and "finish" what He came to do... would he have said

“But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you. John 14:26

Surely you do not entertain the idea that once Jesus was off the earth it was the Father, himself, who would come, for it sounds as if that is how you are leaning in this last statement of yours above
Yes Jesus said that the Holy Spirit ( He used personal pronouns He, Him, His etc ) would be with them and in them and they would be better off having Him ( the Holy Spirit ) with them , in them permanently.
 
Yes Jesus said that the Holy Spirit ( He used personal pronouns He, Him, His etc ) would be with them and in them and they would be better off having Him ( the Holy Spirit ) with them , in them permanently.
is not him the Holy Spirit, the Lord Jesus? John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;" John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you." John 14:18 "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you."

and did he not come to them on Pentecost?

101G
 
is not him the Holy Spirit, the Lord Jesus? John 14:16 "And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;" John 14:17 "Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you." John 14:18 "I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you."

and did he not come to them on Pentecost?

101G

Jesus used personal pronouns when referring to the Holy Spirit:

"But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. "And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me; and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me; and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged. "I have many more things to say to you, but you cannot bear them now. "But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. "He will glorify Me, for He will take of Mine and will disclose it to you. "All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said that He takes of Mine and will disclose it to you. "(John 16:7-15).

The Holy Spirit below does things that only a person can do,

1-He leads (Matt. 4:1).
2-He is called God (Acts 5:3-4).
3-He helps and comforts (John 14:16, 16:7).
4-He convicts of sin (John 16:17).
5-He gives testimony of Jesus (John 15:26).
6-He teaches, guides and brings to remembrance (John 14:26, 16:13).
7-He speaks and instructs (Acts 8:29; 10:19; John 16:13).
8-He hears and speaks (John 16:13, Acts 28:25-27).
9-He can be lied to and tested (Acts 5:3-4,9).
10-He sends and gives life (Acts 13:4, John 3:6, Gen 1:3).
11-He is a witness (Acts 5:32)
12-He restrains (2 Thess. 2:7).
13-He prevents (Acts 16:6-7).
14-The Spirit "said" to Philip and Peter(Acts 8:29, 10:19).
15-Peter said he was "told" by the Spirit (Acts 11:12).
16-The Holy Spirit "solemnly testifies" (Acts 20:23).
17-He made some of the early Christians overseers to shepherd the Church. (Acts 20:28).
18-He wills (Acts 13:2).
19-He interprets our prayers (Rom. 8:26).
20-He knows and communicates (1 Cor. 2:11; Rom. 8:27).
21-He reveals (Eph. 3:5).
22-He has a will-He decides, chooses and distributes the Gifts to the church (1 Cor. 12:11).
23-He can be grieved (Eph. 4:30).
24-He can be stifled, quenched ( 1 Thess 5:19)
25-He contends with man ( Gen 6:3 )

hope this helps !!! :)
 
Back
Top Bottom