What part of
"Can any Calvinist quote a single church father previous to Augustine who denied it?"
did you fail to understand
When Grace is not Grace
- Thread starter The Rogue Tomato
- Start date
"Can any Calvinist quote a single church father previous to Augustine who denied it?"
did you fail to understand
civic
Well-known member
more nonsense- the reformers didn't fall far from their mother church they left- the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
stuck in the past- one should always be learning and reforming their beliefs when confronted with the truth.
civic
Well-known member
oops
One should avoid that slippery slope which you are clearly on.more nonsense- the reformers didn't fall far from their mother church they left- the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
stuck in the past- one should always be learning and reforming their beliefs when confronted with the truth.
Actually the fountainhead of his theology Augustine was very much responsible for much of Catholic doctrinemore nonsense- the reformers didn't fall far from their mother church they left- the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.
stuck in the past- one should always be learning and reforming their beliefs when confronted with the truth.
When my orginal question to civic is addressed I will happily address yours.
Now get to work on my list. Please keep in mind. It's your claim, the burden of proof lies with you.
Yesoops
civic
Well-known member
I'm on the solid Rock which is Jesus teachings and the Authority He gave to His Apostles in Scripture- the foundation for the faith-
SOLA SCRIPTURA- why don't you believe it ?
not some creeds and courtrooms of depraved and uninspired men.
Really? So you agree with him in a lot of things then. Your much closer to the RC in beliefs than I am .
civic
Well-known member
yes his Augustine beliefs are really the formation of the RCC.
the doctrinally duped remain duped. The salve needs to be removed with some Jesus Mud and Spit All I need from you is a single church father previous to Augustine who denied free will
Clement of Rome (AD30-100)
“On account of his hospitality and godliness, Lot was saved out of Sodom when all the country round was punished by means of fire and brimstone, the Lord thus making it manifest that He does not forsake those that hope in Him, but gives up such as depart from Him to punishment and torture. For Lot’s wife, who went forth with him, being of a different mind from himself and not continuing in agreement with him [as to the command which had been given them], was made an example of, so as to be a pillar of salt unto this day. This was done that all might know that those who are of a double mind, and who distrust the power of God, bring down judgment on themselves? and become a sign to all succeeding generations.” (Clement, Epistle to the Corinthians, XI)
Ignatius (AD30-107)
“Seeing, then, all things have an end, and there is set before us life upon our observance [of God’s precepts], but death as the result of disobedience, and every one, according to the choice he makes, shall go to his own place, let us flee from death, and make choice of life. For I remark, that two different characters are found among men — the one true coin, the other spurious. The truly devout man is the right kind of coin, stamped by God Himself. The ungodly man, again, is false coin, unlawful, spurious, counterfeit, wrought not by God, but by the devil. I do not mean to say that there are two different human natures, but that there is one humanity, sometimes belonging to God, and sometimes to the devil. If any one is truly religious, he is a man of God; but if he is irreligious, he is a man of the devil, made such, not by nature, but by his own choice. The unbelieving bear the image of the prince of wickedness. The believing possess the image of their Prince, God the Father, and Jesus Christ,through whom, if we are not in readiness to die for the truth into His passion, His life is not in us.” (Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians, V)
Barnabas (AD100)
“The Lord will judge the world without respect of persons. Each will receive as he has done: if he is righteous, his righteousness will precede him; if he is wicked, the reward of wickedness is before him. Take heed, lest resting at our ease, as those who are the called [of God], we should fall asleep in our sins, and the wicked prince, acquiring power over us, should thrust us away from the kingdom of the Lord. And all the more attend to this, my brethren, when ye reflect and behold, that after so great signs and wonders were wrought in Israel, they were thus [at length] abandoned. Let us beware lest we be found [fulfilling that saying], as it is written, “Many are called, but few are chosen.” (Epistle of Barnabas, IV)
Justin Martyr (AD 110-165)
“But lest some suppose, from what has been said by us, that we say that whatever happens, happens by a fatal necessity, because it is foretold as known beforehand, this too we explain. We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments, and chastisements, and good rewards, are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions. Since if it be not so, but all things happen by fate, neither is anything at all in our own power. For if it be fated that this man, e.g., be good, and this other evil, neither is the former meritorious nor the latter to be blamed. And again, unless the human race have the power of avoiding evil and choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions, of whatever kind they be. But that it is by free choice they both walk uprightly and stumble, we thus demonstrate. We see the same man making a transition to opposite things. Now, if it had been fated that he were to be either good or bad, he could never have been capable of boththe opposites, nor of so many transitions. But not even would some be good and others bad, since we thus make fate the cause of evil, and exhibit her as acting in opposition to herself; or that which has been already stated would seem to be true, that neither virtue nor vice is anything, but that things are only reckoned good or evil by opinion; which, as the true word shows, is the greatest impiety and wickedness. But this we assert is inevitable fate, that they who choose the good have worthy rewards, and they who choose the opposite have their merited awards. For not like other things, as trees and quadrupeds, which cannot act by choice, did God make man: for neither would he be worthy of reward or praise did he not of himself choose the good, but were created for this end; nor, if he were evil, would he be worthy of punishment, not being evil of himself, but being able to be nothing else than what he was made.” (Justin, First Apology, XLIII)
“For so we say that there will be the conflagration, but not as the Stoics, according to their doctrine of all things being changed into one another, which seems most degrading. But neither do we affirm that it is by fate that men do what they do, or suffer what they suffer, but that each man by free choice acts rightly or sins; and that it is by the influence of the wicked demons that earnest men, such as Socrates and the like, suffer persecution and are in bonds, while Sardanapalus, Epicurus, and the like, seem to be blessed in abundance and glory. The Stoics, not observing this, maintained that all things take place according to the necessity of fate. But since God in the beginning made the race of angels and men with free-will, they will justly suffer in eternal fire the punishment of whatever sins they have committed. and this is the nature of all that is made, to be capable of vice and virtue. For neither would any of them be praiseworthy unless there were power to turn to both (virtue and vice). And this also is shown by those men everywherewho have made laws and philosophized according to right reason, by their prescribing to do some things and refrain from others. Even the Stoic philosophers, in their doctrine of morals, steadily honour the same things, so that it is evident that they are not very felicitious in what they say about principles and incorporeal things. For if they say that human actions come to pass by fate, they will maintain either that God is nothing else than the things which are ever turning, and altering, and dissolving into the same things, and will appear to have had a comprehension only of things that are destructable, and to have looked on God Himself as emerging both in part and in whole in every wickedness; or that neither vice or virtue is anything; which is contrary to every sound idea, reason, and sense.” (Justin Second Apology, VII) “Could not God have cut off in the beginning the serpent, so that he exist not, rather than have said, ‘And I will put enmity between him and the woman, and between his seed and her seed?’ Could He not have at once created a multitude of men? But yet, since He knew that it would be good, He created both angels and men free to do that which is righteous, and He appointed periods of time during which He knew it would be good for them to have the exercise of free-will; and because He likewise knew it would be good, He made general and particular judgments; each one’s freedom of will, however, being guarded.” (Justin, Dialogue with Trypho, 102)
“I said briefly by anticipation, that God, wishing men and angels to follow His will, resolved to create them free to do righteousness; possessing reason, that they may know by whom they are created, and through whom they, not existing formerly, do now exist; and with a law that they should be judged by Him, if they do anything contrary to right reason: and of ourselves we, men and angels, shall be convicted of having acted sinfully, unless we repent beforehand. But if the word of God foretells that some angels and men shall becertainly punished, it did so because it foreknew that they would be unchangeably [wicked], but not because God had created them so. So that if they repent, all who wish for it can obtain mercy from God: and the Scripture foretells that they shall be blessed, saying, ‘Blessed is the man to whom the Lord imputeth not sin;’ that is, having repented of his sins, that he may receive remission of them from God; and not as you deceive yourselves, and some others who resemble you in this, who say, that even though they be sinners, but know God, the Lord will not impute sin to them.” (Justin, Dialogue with Trypho, 141)
“Here, then, is a proof of virtue, and of a mind loving prudence, to recur to the communion of the unity, and to attach one’s self to prudence for salvation, and make choice of the better things according to the free-will placed in man; and not to think that those who are possessed of human passions are lords of all, when they shall not appear to have even equal power with men.” (Justin, On the Sole Government of God, VI)
Irenaeus (AD120-202)
“This expression [of our Lord], “How often would I have gathered thy children together, and thou wouldest not,” set forth the ancient law of human liberty, because God made man a free [agent] from the beginning, possessing his own power, even as he does his own soul, to obey the behests (ad utendum sententia) of God voluntarily, and not by compulsion of God. For there is no coercion with God, but a good will [towards us] is present with Him continually. And therefore does He give good counsel to all. And in man, as well as in angels, He has placed the power of choice (for angels are rational beings), so that those who had yielded obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but preserved by themselves. On the other hand, they who have not obeyed shall, with justice, be not found in possession of the good, and shall receive condignpunishment: for God did kindly bestow on them what was good; but they themselves did not diligently keep it, nor deem it something precious, but poured contempt upon His super-eminent goodness. Rejecting therefore the good, and as it were spuing it out, they shall all deservedly incur the just judgment of God, which also the Apostle Paul testifies in his Epistle to the Romans, where he says, “But dost thou despise the riches of His goodness, and patience, and long- suffering, being ignorant that the goodness of God leadeth thee to repentance? But according to thy hardness and impenitent heart, thou treasurest to thyself wrath against the day of wrath, and the revelation of the righteous judgment of God.” “But glory and honor,” he says, “to every one that doeth good.” God therefore has given that which is good, as the apostle tells us in this Epistle, and they who work it shall receive glory and honor, because they have done that which is good when they had it in their power not to do it; but those who do it not shall receive the just judgment of God, because they did not work good when they had it in their power so to do.
“But if some had been made by nature bad, and others good, these latter would not be deserving of praise for being good, for such were they created; nor would the former be reprehensible, for thus they were made [originally]. But since all men are of the same nature, able both to hold fast and to do what is good; and, on the other hand, having also the power to cast it from them and not to do it, — some do justly receive praise even among men who are under the control of good laws (and much more from God), and obtain deserved testimony of their choice of good in general, and of persevering therein; but the others are blamed, and receive a just condemnation, because of their rejection of what is fair and good. And therefore the prophets used to exhort men to what was good, to act justly and to work righteousness, as I have so largely demonstrated, because it is in our power soto do, and because by excessive negligence we might become forgetful, and thus stand in need of that good counsel which the good God has given us to know by means of the prophets. … No doubt, if any one is unwilling to follow the Gospel itself, it is in his power [to reject it], but it is not expedient. For it is in man’s power to disobey God, and to forfeit what is good; but [such conduct] brings no small amount of injury and mischief. … But because man is possessed of free will from the beginning, and God is possessed of free will, in whose likeness man was created, advice is always given to him to keep fast the good, which thing is done by means of obedience to God.
“And not merely in works, but also in faith, has God preserved the will of man free and under his own control, saying, “According to thy faith be it unto thee; “ thus showing that there is a faith specially belonging to man, since he has an opinion specially his own. And again, “All things are possible to him that believeth;” and, “Go thy way; and as thou hast believed, so be it done unto thee.” Now all such expressions demonstrate that man is in his own power with respect to faith. And for this reason, “he that believeth in Him has eternal life while he who believeth not the Son hath not eternal life, but the wrath of God shall remain upon him.” In the same manner therefore the Lord, both showing His own goodness, and indicating that man is in his own free will and his own power, said to Jerusalem, “How often have I wished to gather thy children together, as a hen [gathereth] her chickens under her wings, and ye would not! Wherefore your house shall be left unto you desolate.”” (Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Bk. IV, 37)
The above passage is immediately followed by Irenaeus’ refutation of the Gnostic cults who “maintain the opposite to these conclusions.”
“Has the Word come for the ruin and for the resurrection of many? For the ruin, certainly, of those who do not believeHim, to whom also He has threatened a greater damnation in the judgment-day than that of Sodom and Gomorrah; but for the resurrection of believers, and those who do the will of His Father in heaven. If then the advent of the Son comes indeed alike to all, but is for the purpose of judging, and separating the believing from the unbelieving, since, as those who believe do His will agreeably to their own choice, and as, [also] agreeably to their own choice, the disobedient do not consent to His doctrine; it is manifest that His Father has made all in a like condition, each person having a choice of his own, and a free understanding; and that He has regard to all things, and exercises a providence over all, “making His sun to rise upon the evil and on the good, and sending rain upon the just and unjust.”
“And to as many as continue in their love towards God, does He grant communion with Him. But communion with God is life and light, and the enjoyment of all the benefits which He has in store. But on as many as, according to their own choice, depart from God, He inflicts that separation from Himself which they have chosen of their own accord. But separation from God is death, and separation from light is darkness; and separation from God consists in the loss of all the benefits which He has in store. Those, therefore, who cast away by apostasy these forementioned things, being in fact destitute of all good, do experience every kind of punishment. God, however, does not punish them immediately of Himself, but that punishment falls upon them because they are destitute of all that is good. Now, good things are eternal and without end with God, and therefore the loss of these is also eternal and never-ending. It is in this matter just as occurs in the case of a flood of light: those who have blinded themselves, or have been blinded by others, are for ever deprived of the enjoyment of light. It is not, [however], that the light has inflicted upon them the penalty of blindness, but it is that the blindness itself hasbrought calamity upon them: and therefore the Lord declared, “He that believeth in Me is not condemned,” that is, is not separated from God, for he is united to God through faith. On the other hand, He says, “He that believeth not is condemned already, because he has not believed in the name of the only-begotten Son of God;” that is, he separated himself from God of his own accord. “For this is the condemnation, that light is come into this world, and men have loved darkness rather than light. For every one who doeth evil hateth the light, and cometh not to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved. But he that doeth truth cometh to the light, that his deeds may be made manifest, that he has wrought them in God.” (Irenaeus, Against Heresies, Bk. V, XXVII)
Tatian (AD110-172)
“Why are you fated to grasp at things often, and often to die? Die to the world, repudiating the madness that is in it. Live to God, and by apprehending Him lay aside your old nature. We were not created to die, but we die by our own fault. Our free-will has destroyed us; we who were free have become slaves; we have been sold through sin. Nothing evil has been created by God; we Ourselves have manifested wickedness; but we, who have manifested it, are able again to reject it.” (Tatian, Address to the Greeks, XI)
Tertullian (AD145-220)
“Moreover, man thus constituted will be protected by both the goodness of God and by His purpose, both of which are always found in concert in our God. For His purpose is no purpose without goodness; nor is His goodness without a purpose, except forsooth in the case of Marcion’s God, who is purposelessly good, as we have shown. Well, then, it was proper that God should be known; it was no doubt a good and reasonable thing. Proper also was it that there should be something worthy of knowing God. What could be found so worthy as the image and likeness of God? This also wasundoubtedly good and reasonable. Therefore it was proper that (he who is) the image and likeness of God should be formed with a free will and a mastery of himself; so that this very thing — namely, freedom of will and self-command — might be reckoned as the image and likeness of God in him. For this purpose such an essence was adapted to man as suited this character, even the afflatus of the Deity, Himself free and uncontrolled. But if you will take some other view of the case, how came it to pass that man, when in possession of the whole world, did not above all things reign in self- possession — a master over others, a slave to himself? The goodness of God, then, you can learn from His gracious gift to man, and His purpose from His disposal of all things. At present, let God’s goodness alone occupy our attention, that which gave so large a gift to man, even the liberty of his will. God’s purpose claims some other opportunity of treatment, offering as it does instruction of like import. Now, God alone is good by nature. For He, who has that which is without beginning, has it not by creation, but by nature. Man, however, who exists entirely by creation, having a beginning, along with that beginning obtained the form in which he exists; and thus he is not by nature disposed to good, but by creation, not having it as his own attribute to be good, because, (as we have said,) it is not by nature, but by creation, that he is disposed to good, according to the appointment of his good Creator, even the Author of all good. In order, therefore, that man might have a goodness of his own, bestowed on him by God, and there might be henceforth in man a property, and in a certain sense a natural attribute of goodness, there was assigned to him in the constitution of his nature, as a formal witness of the goodness which God bestowed upon him, freedom and power of the will, such as should cause good to be performed spontaneously by man, as a property of his own, on the ground that no less than this would be required in the matterof a goodness which was to be voluntarily exercised by him, that is to say, by the liberty of his will, without either favor or servility to the constitution of his nature, so that man should be good just up to this point, if he should display his goodness in accordance with his natural constitution indeed, but still as the result of his will, as a property of his nature; and, by a similar exercise of volition, should show himself to be too strong in defense against evil also (for even this God, of course, foresaw), being free, and master of himself; because, if he were wanting in this prerogative of self- mastery, so as to perform even good by necessity and not will, he would, in the helplessness of his servitude, become subject to the usurpation of evil, a slave as much to evil as to good. Entire freedom of will, therefore, was conferred upon him in both tendencies; so that, as master of himself, he might constantly encounter good by spontaneous observance of it, and evil by its spontaneous avoidance; because, were man even otherwise circumstanced, it was yet his bounden duty, in the judgment of God, to do justice according to the motions of his will regarded, of course, as free. But the reward neither of good nor of evil could be paid to the man who should be found to have been either good or evil through necessity and not choice. In this really lay the law which did not exclude, but rather prove, human liberty by a spontaneous rendering of obedience, or a spontaneous commission of iniquity; so patent was the liberty of man’s will for either issue. Since, therefore, both the goodness and purpose of God are discovered in the gift to man of freedom in his will, it is not right, after ignoring the original definition of goodness and purpose which it was necessary to determine previous to any discussion of the subject, on subsequent facts to presume to say that God ought not in such a way to have formed man, because the issue was other than what was assumed to be proper for God. We ought rather, after duly considering that it behooved God soto create man, to leave this consideration unimpaired, and to survey the other aspects of the case. It is, no doubt, an easy process for persons who take offence at the fall of man, before they have looked into the facts of his creation, to impute the blame of what happened to the Creator, without any examination of His purpose. To conclude: the goodness of God, then fully considered from the beginning of His works, will be enough to convince us that nothing evil could possibly have come forth from God; and the liberty of man will, after a second thought, show us that it alone is chargeable with the fault which itself committed.” (Tertullian, Against Marcion, Bk. II, ch. vi)
“God put the question [to Adam – “where art thou”] with an appearance of uncertainty, in order that even here He might prove man to be the subject of a free will in the alternative of either a denial or a confession, and give to him the opportunity of freely acknowledging his transgression, and, so far, of lightening it. In like manner He inquires of Cain where his brother was, just as if He had not yet heard the blood of Abel crying from the ground, in order that he too might have the opportunity from the same power of the will of spontaneously denying, and to this degree aggravating, his crime; and that thus there might be supplied to us examples of confessing sins rather than of denying them: so that even then was initiated the evangelic doctrine, “By thy words thou shall be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.” (Tertullian, Against Marcion, Bk. II, xxv) “That rich man did go his way who had not “received” the precept of dividing his substance to the needy, and was abandoned by the Lord to his own opinion. Nor will “harshness” be on this account imputed to Christ, the Found of the vicious action of each individual free-will. “Behold,” saith He, “I have set before thee good and evil.” Choose that which is good: if you cannot, because you will not — for that you can if you will He has shown, because He has proposedeach to your free-will — you ought to depart from Him whose will you do not.” (Tertullian, On Monogamy, XIV) Clement of Alexandria (AD153-217)
“God, then, is good. And the Lord speaks many a time and oft before He proceeds to act. … For the Divine Being is not angry in the way that some think; but often restrains, and always exhorts humanity, and shows what ought to be done. And this is a good device, to terrify lest we sin. “For the fear of the Lord drives away sins, and he that is without fear cannot be justified,” says the Scripture. And God does not inflict punishment from wrath, but for the ends of justice; since it is not expedient that justice should be neglected on our account. Each one of us, who sins, with his own free-will chooses punishment, and the blame lies with him who chooses. God is without blame. “But if our unrighteousness commend the righteousness of God, what shall we say? Is God unrighteous, who taketh vengeance? God forbid.” … It is clear, then, that those who are not at enmity with the truth, and do not hate the Word, will not hate their own salvation, but will escape the punishment of enmity. “The crown of wisdom,” then as the book of Wisdom says, “is the fear of the Lord.” Very clearly, therefore, by the prophet Amos has the Lord unfolded His method of dealing, saying, “I have overthrown you, as God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah; and ye shall be as a brand plucked from the fire: and yet ye have not returned unto me, saith the LORD.” See how God, through His love of goodness, seeks repentance; and by means of the plan He pursues of threatening silently, shows His own love for man. “I will avert,” He says, “My face from them, and show what shall happen to them.” For where the face of the Lord looks, there is peace and rejoicing; but where it is averted, there is the introduction of evil. The Lord, accordingly, does not wish to look on evil things; for He is good. But on His looking away, evil arises spontaneously through human unbelief. “Behold, therefore,” says Paul, “thegoodness and severity of God: on them that fell severity; but upon thee, goodness, if thou continue in His goodness,” that is, in faith in Christ.” (Clement of Alexandria, The Instructor, Bk. I, viii)
Origen (AD185-254)
“This also is clearly defined in the teaching of the Church, that every rational soul is possessed of free-will and volition; that it has a stuggle to maintain with the devil and his angels, and opposing influences, because they strive to burden it with sins; but if we live rightly and wisely, we should endeavor to shake ourselves free of a burden of that kind. From which it follows, also, that we understand ourselves not to be subject to necessity, so as to be compelled by all means, even against our will, to do either good or evil. For if we are our own masters, some influences perhaps may impel us to sin, and others help us to salvation; we are not forced, however, by any necessity either to act rightly or wrongly, which those persons think is the case who say that the courses and movements of the stars are the cause of human actions, not only of those which take place beyond the influence of the freedom of the will, but also of those which are placed within our own power.” (Origen, De Principis, Preface)
“And for this reason we think that God, the Father of all things, in order to ensure the salvation of all His creatures through the ineffable plan of His word and wisdom, so arranged each of these, that every spirit, whether soul or rational existence, however called, should not be compelled by force, against the liberty of his own will, to any other course than that to which the motives of his own mind led him (lest by so doing the power of exercising free-will should seem to be taken away, which certainly would produce a change in the nature of the being itself); and that the varying purposes of these would be suitably and usefully adapted to the harmony of one world, by some of them requiring help,and others being able to give it, and others again being the cause of struggle and contest to those who are making progress, amongst whom their diligence would be deemed more worthy of approval, and the place of rank obtained after victory be held with greater certainty, which should be established by the difficulties of the contest.” (Origen, Bk. II ch. I)
Hippolytus (AD170-236)
“But man, from the fact of his possessing a capacity of self- determination, brings forth what is evil, that is, accidentally; which evil is not consummated except you actually commit some piece of wickedness. For it is in regard of our desiring anything that is wicked, or our meditating upon it, that what is evil is so denominated. Evil had no existence from the beginning, but came into being subsequently. Since man has free will, a law has been defined for his guidance by the Deity, not without answering a good purpose. For if man did not possess the power to will and not to will, why should a law be established? For a law will not be laid down for an animal devoid of reason, but a bridle and a whip; whereas to man has been given a precept and penalty to perform, or for not carrying into execution what has been enjoined. For man thus constituted has a law been enacted by just men in primitive ages.” (Hippolytus, Against all Heresies, Bk. X, ch. xxix)
Novatian (AD210-280)
“And lest, again, an unbounded freedom should fall into peril, He laid down a command, in which man was taught that there was no evil in the fruit of the tree; but he was forewarned that evil would arise if perchance he should exercise his free will, in the contempt of the
law that was given. For, on the one hand, it had behooved him to be free, lest the image of God should, unfittingly be in bondage; and on the other, the law was to be added, so that an unbridled liberty might not break forth even to a contemptof the Giver. So that he might receive as a consequence both worthy rewards and a deserved punishment, having in his own power that which he might choose to do, by the tendency of his mind in either direction: whence, therefore, by envy, mortality comes back upon him; seeing that, although he might escape it by obedience, he rushes into it by hurrying to be God under the influence of perverse counsel.” (Novatian, Trinity, ch. I)
Archelaus (AD277)
“This account also indicates that rational creatures have been entrusted with free-will, in virtue of which they also admit of conversions.” … “For all the creatures that God made, He made very good; and He gave to every individual the sense of free-will, in accordance with which standard He also instituted the law of judgment. To sin is ours, and that we sin not is God’s gift, as our will is constituted to choose either to sin or not to sin. … The judges said: He has given demonstration enough of the origin of the devil. And as both sides admit that there will be a judgment, it is necessarily involved in that admission that every individual is shown to have free-will; and since this is brought clearly out, there can be no doubt that every individual, in the exercise of his own proper power of will, may shape his course in whatever direction he pleases.” (Archelaus, The Acts of the Disputation)
Alexander of Alexandria (AD273-326)
“I will endeavor, with your assistance and favor, to examine carefully the position of those who are offended, and deny that we speak the truth, when we say that man is possessed of free-will, and prove that “They perish self-destroyed, By their own fault,” choosing the pleasant in preference to the expedient.” (Alexander, Banquet of the Ten Virgins, Discourse VIII, ch. xii)
Lactantius (AD260-330)
“When, therefore, the number of men had begun to increase,God in His forethought, lest the devil, to whom from the beginning He had given power over the earth, should by his subtilty either corrupt or destroy men, as he had done at first, sent angels for the protection and improvement of the human race; and inasmuch as He had given these a free will, He enjoined them above all things not to defile themselves with contamination from the earth, and thus lose the dignity of their heavenly nature.”(Lactantius, Divine Institutes, Bk. II, ch. xv)
There seems to have been no exceptions among early Christian writers to the orthodox teaching that man has been granted by God a free will to choose his destiny, and that salvation is available to all. The opposing view, that man is controlled by fate, could only be found in the Greek philosophical schools, Gnosticism, and Eastern mysticism during the first 300 years of Christianity. It is no wonder that the man who introduced Greek fatalism into Christianity should come from a Gnostic and Neo-Platonic background. Augustine’s theory differed from the Greek philosophers mainly by naming the CAUSE of fate — God’s mysterious will which must not be questioned, and cannot be understood by mortals. The impact of Augustine’s teaching probably would not have been nearly so great if Pelagius had not gone to the opposite extreme in renouncing Augustine.
While those of the Reformed persuasion are right to reject the Latin heresies of Rome, they have been lax to recognize the Greek heresies introduced before the Latin era, which are equally contrary to the truth of the Christian Faith “once for all delivered to the saints” by the Apostles of Jesus Christ. They seem to hold a higher opinion of philosophers, like Augustine, than of the Apostles themselves, and those to whom the Apostles entrusted the Apostolic tradition. [LINK] To Listen to the Podcast on the History of this Debate and the teachings of the earliest Church fathers: CLICK HERE
civic
Well-known member
They can't find one since it never existed until the heretic known as augustine taught those pagan concepts.
I believe in free will. No worries.They can't find one since it never existed until the heretic known as augustine taught those pagan concepts.
Another source
Ignatius (30-107 AD) was a disciple of the Apostle John.
“Seeing, then, all things have an end, and there is set before us life upon our observance [of
God’s precepts], but death as the result of disobedience, and every one, according to the
choice he makes, shall go to his own place, let us flee from death, and make choice of life.…
If anyone is truly religious, he is a man of God; but if he is irreligious, he is a man of the
devil, made such, not by nature, but by his own choice.” (Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians,
V)
Clement of Rome (35-99 AD) knew Peter and Paul personally. Tradition has identified him with the Clement who is mentioned in Philippians 4:3.
“For no other reason does God punish the sinner either in the present or future world, except because He knows that the sinner was able to conquer but neglected to gain the victory.” (Recognitions of Clement of Rome 111. 23, V. 8, IX. 30)
Justin Martyr (100-165 AD) was an early Christian apologist who produced works defending
and explaining Christianity.
“But lest some suppose, from what has been said by us, that we say that whatever happens,
happens by a fatal necessity, because it is foretold as known beforehand, this too we explain. We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments, and chastisements, and good rewards, are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions. Since if it be not so, but all things happen by fate, neither is anything at all in our own power. For if it be fated that this man, e.g., be good, and this other evil, neither is the former meritorious nor the latter to be blamed. And again, unless the human race have the power of avoiding evil and choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions, of whatever kind they be. But that it is by free choice they both walk uprightly and stumble, we thus demonstrate. We see the same man making a transition to opposite things. Now, if it had been fated that he were to be either good or bad, he could never have been capable of both the opposites, nor of so many transitions. (First Apology, ch. 42, p. 177)
“But this we assert is inevitable fate, that they who choose the good have worthy rewards,
and they who choose the opposite have their merited awards. For not like other things, as
trees and quadrupeds, which cannot act by choice, did God make man: for neither would he
be worthy of reward or praise did he not of himself choose the good, but were created for this end; nor, if he were evil, would he be worthy of punishment, not being evil of himself, but being able to be nothing else than what he was made. (First Apology, ch. 43, p. 177)
“We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments,
chastisements, and rewards are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions.
Otherwise, if all things happen by fate, then nothing is in our own power. For if it be
predestined that one man be good and another man evil, then the first is not deserving of
praise or the other to be blamed. Unless humans have the power of avoiding evil and
choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions-whatever they may
be…. For neither would a man be worthy of reward or praise if he did not of himself choose
the good, but was merely created for that end. Likewise, if a man were evil, he would not
deserve punishment, since he was not evil of himself, being unable to do anything else than
what he was made for.” (First Apology ch. 43)
“But neither do we affirm that it is by fate that men do what they do, or suffer what they
suffer, but that each man by free choice acts rightly or sins; and that it is by the influence of
the wicked demons that earnest men, such as Socrates and the like, suffer persecution and are in bonds, while Sardanapalus, Epicurus, and the like, seem to be blessed in abundance and glory. The Stoics, not observing this, maintained that all things take place according to the necessity of fate. But since God in the beginning made the race of angels and men with free-will, they will justly suffer in eternal fire the punishment of whatever sins they have
committed. And this is the nature of all that is made, to be capable of vice and virtue. For
neither would any of them be praiseworthy unless there were power to turn to both [virtue
and vice]. (Second Apology, Ch. 7, p. 190)
“…God, wishing men and angels to follow His will, resolved to create them free to do
righteousness; possessing reason, that they may know by whom they are created, and through whom they, not existing formerly, do now exist; and with a law that they should be judged by Him, if they do anything contrary to right reason: and of ourselves we, men and angels, shall be convicted of having acted sinfully, unless we repent beforehand. But if the word of God foretells that some angels and men shall be certainly punished, it did so because it foreknew that they would be unchangeably [wicked], but not because God had created them so. So that if they repent, all who wish for it can obtain mercy from God…” (Second Apology ch. 141)
“But that you may not have a pretext for saying that Christ must have been crucified, and
that those who transgressed must have been among your nation, and that the matter could not have been otherwise, I said briefly by anticipation, that God, wishing men and angels to
follow His will, resolved to create them free to do righteousness; possessing reason, that they may know by whom they are created, and through whom they, not existing formerly, do now exist; and with a law that they should be judged by Him, if they do anything contrary to right reason: and of ourselves we, men and angels, shall be convicted of having acted sinfully, unless we repent beforehand. But if the word of God foretells that some angels and men shallbe certainly punished, it did so because it foreknew that they would be unchangeably [wicked], but not because God had created them so. (Dialogue with Trypho, ch. 141, p. 269-270)
“Furthermore, I have proved in what has preceded, that those who were foreknown to be
unrighteous, whether men or angels, are not made wicked by God’s fault, but each man by
his own fault is what he will appear to be.” (Dialogue with Trypho, ch. 139, p. 269)
“Here, then, is a proof of virtue, and of a mind loving prudence, to recur to the communion of the unity, and to attach one’s self to prudence for salvation, and make choice of the better things according to the free-will placed in man; (On the Sole Government of God, ch. 6, p.293)
“Every created being is so constituted as to be capable of vice and virtue. For he can do
nothing praiseworthy, if he had not the power of turning either way.… unless we suppose
man has the power to choose the good and refuse the evil, no one can be accountable for any action whatever.” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa Mahan, p. 61)
“I have proved in what has been said that those who were foreknown to be unrighteous,
whether men or angels, are not made wicked by God’s fault. Rather, each man is what he will appear to be through his own fault.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 286)
“In the beginning, He made the human race with the power of thought and of choosing truth and doing right, so that all men are without excuse before God.” (A Dictionary of Early
Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
“Let some suppose, from what has been said by us, that we say that whatever occurs happens by a fatal necessity, because it is foretold as known beforehand, this too we explain. We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments, chastisements, and good rewards, are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions. Now, if this is not so, but all things happen by fate, then neither is anything at all in our own power. For if it is predetermined that this man will be good, and this other man will be evil, neither is the first one meritorious nor the latter man to be blamed. And again, unless the human race has the power of avoiding evil and choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
“The human race…from Adam had fallen under the power of death and the guile of the
serpent. Each one had committed personal transgression.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian
Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
“The whole human race will be found to be under a curse. For it is written in the Law of
Moses, ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things that are written in the book of
the Law and do them.’ And no one has accurately done them all.” (A Dictionary of Early
Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
Tatian the Assyrian (110-172 AD) was a writer and theologian of the 2nd century.
“We were not created to die. Rather, we die by our own fault. Our free will has destroyed us.
We who were free have become slaves. We have been sold through sin. Nothing evil has been created by God. We ourselves have manifested wickedness. But we, who have
manifested it, are able again to reject it.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 286)
“The Logos… before the creation of men, was the Framer of angels. And each of these two
orders of creatures was made free to act as it pleased, not having the nature of good, which
again is with God alone, but is brought to perfection in men through their freedom of choice,
in order that the bad man may be justly punished … but the just man be deservedly
praised.… Such is the constitution of things in reference to angels and men.” (Address to the
Greeks)
Irenaeus (120-202 AD) was a disciple of Polycarp who himself was a disciple of the Apostle
John.
“But man, being endowed with reason, and in this respect similar to God, having been made
free in his will, and with power over himself, is himself his own cause that sometimes he
becomes wheat, and sometimes chaff.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 286)
“This expression, ‘How often would I have gathered thy children together, and thou wouldst
not,’ set forth the ancient law of human liberty, because God made man a free (agent) from
the beginning, possessing his own soul to obey the behests of God voluntarily, and not by
compulsion of God. For there is no coercion with God, but a good will (toward us) is present
with Him continually. And therefore does He give good counsel to all. And in man as well as
in angels, He has placed the power of choice (for angels are rational beings), so that those
who had yielded obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but
preserved by themselves…” (God’s Strategy In Human History, p. 246)
“‘Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good deeds’… And ‘Why call
me, Lord, Lord, and do not do the things that I say?’… All such passages demonstrate the
independent will of man… For it is in man’s power to disobey God and to forfeit what is
good.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 287)
“Nor, again, does God exercise compulsion upon anyone unwilling to accept the exercise of
His skill.… They have been created free agents and possessed of power over themselves.”
(Vol. 1, p. 523)
“But as the sun, that creature of God, is one and the same throughout the whole world, so
also the preaching of the truth shineth everywhere, and enlightens all men that are willing to
come to a knowledge of the truth.” (Irenaeus, Against Heresies, p. 331)
“…there is no coercion with God, but a good will is present with Him continually. And
therefore does He give good counsel to all. And in man as well as in angels, He has placed
the power of choice (for angels are rational beings), so that that those who had yielded
obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but preserved by
themselves … If then it were not in our power to do or not to do these things, what reason
had the apostle, and much more the Lord Himself, to give us counsel to do some things and
to abstain from others? But because man is possessed of free-will from the beginning, and
God is possessed of free-will in whose likeness man was created, advise is always given to
him to keep fast the good, which thing is done by means of obedience to God.” (Irenaeus
Against Heresies, XXXVII)“
And in man, as well as in angels, [God] has placed the power of choice…so that those who
had yielded obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but preserved
by themselves. On the other hand, they who have not obeyed shall, with justice, be not found
in possession of the good, and shall receive condign punishment: for God did kindly bestow
on them what was good…but [they] poured contempt on His super-eminent goodness.”
(Against Heresies 5:37)
Irenaeus wrote that God sent His Son “as one who saves by persuasion, not compulsion, for
compulsion is no attribute of God.” (Epistle to Diognetus 7:4)
Melito of Sardis (Died 180 AD)
“There is, therefore, nothing to hinder you from changing your evil manner to life, because
you are a free man.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 286)
Theophilus of Antioch (Died 183-185 AD)
“If, on the other hand, he would turn to the things of death, disobeying God, he would
himself be the cause of death to himself. For God made man free, and with power of
himself.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 286)
Athenagoras of Athens (133-190 AD) was an Ante-Nicene church father. He was Christian
apologist who lived during the second half of the 2nd century.
“Just as with men, who have freedom of choice as to both virtue and vice, so it is among the
angels…Some free agents, you will observe, such as they were created by God, continued in
those things for which God had made and over which he had ordained them; but some
outraged both the constitution of their nature and the government entrusted to them.” (A Plea
for the Christians 24)
Clement of Alexandria (150-215 AD) was a Christian theologian and philosopher who taught at
the School of Alexandria. He mentored Origen and Alexander of Jerusalem.
“A man by himself working and toiling at freedom from sinful desires achieves nothing. But
if he plainly shows himself to be very eager and earnest about this, he attains it by the
addition of the power of God. God works together with willing souls. But if the person
abandons his eagerness, the spirit from God is also restrained. To save the unwilling is the act
of one using compulsion; but to save the willing, that of one showing grace.” Salvation of the
Rich Man chap. 21
“Neither praise nor condemnation, neither rewards nor punishments, are right if the soul does
not have the power of choice and avoidance, if evil is involuntary.” (Miscellanies, Bk. 1, Ch.
17)
“Nor shall he who is saved be saved against his will, for he is not inanimate; but he will
above all voluntarily and of free choice speed to salvation. Wherefore also man received the
commandments in order that he might be self-impelled, to whatever he wished of things to be
chosen and to be avoided. Wherefore God does not do good by necessity, but from His free
choice benefits those who spontaneously turn.” (Stromata, Bk 7 Ch.7)
“The Lord clearly shows sins and transgressions to be in our own power.” (A Dictionary of
Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 288)“Each one of us who sins with his own free will, chooses punishment. So the blame lies with
him who chooses. God is without blame.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 287)
“‘If thou wilt be perfect.’ Consequently he was not yet perfect. For nothing is more perfect
than what is perfect. And divinely the expression ‘if thou wilt’ showed the self-determination
of the soul holding converse with Him. For choice depended on the man as being free; but
the gift on God as the Lord. And He gives to those who are willing and are exceedingly
earnest, and ask, that so their salvation may become their own. For God compels not (for
compulsion is repugnant to God), but supplies to those who seek, and bestows on those who
ask, and opens to those who knock.” (Clement of Alexandria c. 195)
“Neither promises nor apprehensions, rewards, no punishments are just if the soul has not the
power of choosing and abstaining; if evil is involuntary.” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa
Mahan, p. 63)
“So in no respect is God the author of evil. But since free choice and inclination originate
sins…punishments are rightly inflicted.” (Stromata 1:17)
“This was the law from the first, that virtue should be the object of voluntary choice.”
(Stromata 7:2)
“To obey or not is in our own power, provided we do not have the excuse of ignorance.” (A
Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 287)
“We…have believed and are saved by voluntary choice.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian
Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 287)
Tertullian (160-225 AD) was an apologist for the Christian faith. He wrote a number of
polemics against heretical teachings of his day.
“But although we shall be understood, from our argument, to be only so affirming man’s
unshackled power over his will, that what happens to him should be laid to his own charge,
and not to God’s, yet that you may not object, even now, that he ought not to have been so
constituted, since his liberty and power of will might turn out to be injurious… Therefore it
was proper that (he who is) the image and likeness of God should be formed with a free will
and a mastery of himself;… At present, let God’s goodness alone occupy our attention, that
which gave so large a gift to man, even the liberty of his will.” (The Writings of Tertullian -
Volume 2, p. 92)
“I find, then, that man was constituted free by God. He was master of his own will and
power.… For a law would not be imposed upon one who did not have it in his power to
render that obedience which is due to law. Nor again, would the penalty of death be
threatened against sin, if a contempt of the law were impossible to man in the liberty of his
will… Man is free, with a will either for obedience of resistance.” (Ante-Nicene Fathers Vol.
3, pp. 300-301)
“No reward can be justly bestowed, no punishment can be justly inflicted, upon him who is
good or bad by necessity, and not by his own choice.” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa Mahan, p.
61)
Hippolytus of Rome (170-235 AD)“For man is able to both will and not will. He is endowed with power to do both.” (A
Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 288)
Origen (185-255 AD) is regarded as one of the most important Christian theologians of all time.
“The soul does not incline to either part out of necessity, for then neither vice nor virtue
could be ascribed to it; nor would its choice of virtue deserve reward; nor its declination to
vice punishment.… How could God require that of man which he [man] had not power to
offer Him?” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa Mahan, p. 62)
In his work Against Celsus, Origen responded to a claim that “whatever happens in the
universe, whether it be the work of God, of angels [or] of other demons…is regulated by the
law of the Most High God,” Origen wrote, “This is… incorrect; for we cannot say that
transgressors follow the law of God when they transgress; and Scripture declares that it is not only wicked men who are transgressors, but also wicked demons and wicked angels…When we say that ‘the providence of God regulates all things,’ we utter a great truth if we attribute to that providence nothing but what is just and right. But if we ascribe to the providence of God all things whatsoever, however unjust they may be, then it is no longer true that the providence of God regulates all things.” (Against Celsus 7:68)
Alexander of Alexandria (250-326 AD) was the leader of the opposition to Arianism at the
First Council of Nicaea. He was the mentor of Athanasius of Alexandria, who became one of the leading Church fathers.
“Natural will is the free faculty of ever intelligent nature, as having nothing involuntary
pertaining to its essence.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 293,
published by Hendrickson Publishers)
Archelaus Bishop of Carrhae (250-300 AD) held a public dispute with the heretic Manes —
followers of Mani — an account of which he published in Syriac. The work was soon translated both into Greek and into Latin.
“All the creatures that God made, He made very good. And He gave to every individual the
sense of free will, by which standard He also instituted the law of judgment…. And certainly
whoever will, may keep the commandments. Whoever despises them and turns aside to what is contrary to them, shall yet without doubt have to face this law of judgment…. There can be no doubt that every individual, in using his own proper power of will, may shape his course in whatever direction he pleases.” (Archelaus Disputation With Manes sees. 32, 33)
Methodius of Olympus (270-312 AD) was a bishop and author. He died as a martyr.
“Man was made with a free will … [with the] capacity of obeying or disobeying God. For
this was the meaning of the gift of free will.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by
David Bercot, p. 292)
“Those [pagans] who decide that man does not have free will, but say that he is governed by the unavoidable necessities of fate, are guilty of impiety toward God Himself, making Him out to be the cause and author of human evils.” (Methodius The Banquet of the Ten Virgins discourse 8, chap. 16)
“To do good or evil is in our own power”. (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 292)
Cyril of Jerusalem (313-386 AD).
“And you must know your soul to be endowed with free-will, and to be God’s fairest work in the image of himself. It is immortal in as far as God grants it immortality. It is a rational
living creature not subject to decay, because these qualities have been bestowed by God upon it. And it has the power to do what it chooses. For you do not sin because you were born that way, nor if you fornicate is it by chance. And do not take any notice of what some people say, that the conjunctions of the stars compel you to fall into unclean living. Why should you avoid acknowledging that you have done wrong by blaming it onto the stars that had nothing to do with it?” (Catechetical Lectures IV, 18)
“Learn this also, that before it came into this world, your soul had committed no sin, but we
come into the world unblemished, and, being here, sin of our own choice. Do not listen, I
say, to anyone who expounds ‘If then I do that which I would not, in the wrong sense, but
remember who says, ‘If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat of the good land; but if ye
refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword,’ and what follows.” (Catechetical
Lectures IV. 19)
Jerome (347-420 AD) was a contemporary of Augustine. He opposed Augustine on a number of issues including free will versus determinism.
“God has bestowed us with free will. We are not necessarily drawn either to virtue or vice.
For when necessity rules, there is no room left either for damnation or the crown.” (Doctrine
of the Will by Asa Mahan, p. 62)
John Chrysostom (349-407 AD) was a contemporary of Augustine. He also opposed
Augustine’s view of determinism.
“All is in God’s power, but so that our free-will is not lost… it depends therefore on us and
on Him. We must first choose the good, and then He adds what belongs to Him. He does not precede our willing, that our free-will may not suffer. But when we have chosen, then He affords much help … It is ours to choose beforehand and to will, but God’s to perfect and
bring to the end.” (John Chrysostom on Hebrews, Homily 12)
Ignatius (30-107 AD) was a disciple of the Apostle John.
“Seeing, then, all things have an end, and there is set before us life upon our observance [of
God’s precepts], but death as the result of disobedience, and every one, according to the
choice he makes, shall go to his own place, let us flee from death, and make choice of life.…
If anyone is truly religious, he is a man of God; but if he is irreligious, he is a man of the
devil, made such, not by nature, but by his own choice.” (Ignatius, Epistle to the Magnesians,
V)
Clement of Rome (35-99 AD) knew Peter and Paul personally. Tradition has identified him with the Clement who is mentioned in Philippians 4:3.
“For no other reason does God punish the sinner either in the present or future world, except because He knows that the sinner was able to conquer but neglected to gain the victory.” (Recognitions of Clement of Rome 111. 23, V. 8, IX. 30)
Justin Martyr (100-165 AD) was an early Christian apologist who produced works defending
and explaining Christianity.
“But lest some suppose, from what has been said by us, that we say that whatever happens,
happens by a fatal necessity, because it is foretold as known beforehand, this too we explain. We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments, and chastisements, and good rewards, are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions. Since if it be not so, but all things happen by fate, neither is anything at all in our own power. For if it be fated that this man, e.g., be good, and this other evil, neither is the former meritorious nor the latter to be blamed. And again, unless the human race have the power of avoiding evil and choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions, of whatever kind they be. But that it is by free choice they both walk uprightly and stumble, we thus demonstrate. We see the same man making a transition to opposite things. Now, if it had been fated that he were to be either good or bad, he could never have been capable of both the opposites, nor of so many transitions. (First Apology, ch. 42, p. 177)
“But this we assert is inevitable fate, that they who choose the good have worthy rewards,
and they who choose the opposite have their merited awards. For not like other things, as
trees and quadrupeds, which cannot act by choice, did God make man: for neither would he
be worthy of reward or praise did he not of himself choose the good, but were created for this end; nor, if he were evil, would he be worthy of punishment, not being evil of himself, but being able to be nothing else than what he was made. (First Apology, ch. 43, p. 177)
“We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments,
chastisements, and rewards are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions.
Otherwise, if all things happen by fate, then nothing is in our own power. For if it be
predestined that one man be good and another man evil, then the first is not deserving of
praise or the other to be blamed. Unless humans have the power of avoiding evil and
choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions-whatever they may
be…. For neither would a man be worthy of reward or praise if he did not of himself choose
the good, but was merely created for that end. Likewise, if a man were evil, he would not
deserve punishment, since he was not evil of himself, being unable to do anything else than
what he was made for.” (First Apology ch. 43)
“But neither do we affirm that it is by fate that men do what they do, or suffer what they
suffer, but that each man by free choice acts rightly or sins; and that it is by the influence of
the wicked demons that earnest men, such as Socrates and the like, suffer persecution and are in bonds, while Sardanapalus, Epicurus, and the like, seem to be blessed in abundance and glory. The Stoics, not observing this, maintained that all things take place according to the necessity of fate. But since God in the beginning made the race of angels and men with free-will, they will justly suffer in eternal fire the punishment of whatever sins they have
committed. And this is the nature of all that is made, to be capable of vice and virtue. For
neither would any of them be praiseworthy unless there were power to turn to both [virtue
and vice]. (Second Apology, Ch. 7, p. 190)
“…God, wishing men and angels to follow His will, resolved to create them free to do
righteousness; possessing reason, that they may know by whom they are created, and through whom they, not existing formerly, do now exist; and with a law that they should be judged by Him, if they do anything contrary to right reason: and of ourselves we, men and angels, shall be convicted of having acted sinfully, unless we repent beforehand. But if the word of God foretells that some angels and men shall be certainly punished, it did so because it foreknew that they would be unchangeably [wicked], but not because God had created them so. So that if they repent, all who wish for it can obtain mercy from God…” (Second Apology ch. 141)
“But that you may not have a pretext for saying that Christ must have been crucified, and
that those who transgressed must have been among your nation, and that the matter could not have been otherwise, I said briefly by anticipation, that God, wishing men and angels to
follow His will, resolved to create them free to do righteousness; possessing reason, that they may know by whom they are created, and through whom they, not existing formerly, do now exist; and with a law that they should be judged by Him, if they do anything contrary to right reason: and of ourselves we, men and angels, shall be convicted of having acted sinfully, unless we repent beforehand. But if the word of God foretells that some angels and men shallbe certainly punished, it did so because it foreknew that they would be unchangeably [wicked], but not because God had created them so. (Dialogue with Trypho, ch. 141, p. 269-270)
“Furthermore, I have proved in what has preceded, that those who were foreknown to be
unrighteous, whether men or angels, are not made wicked by God’s fault, but each man by
his own fault is what he will appear to be.” (Dialogue with Trypho, ch. 139, p. 269)
“Here, then, is a proof of virtue, and of a mind loving prudence, to recur to the communion of the unity, and to attach one’s self to prudence for salvation, and make choice of the better things according to the free-will placed in man; (On the Sole Government of God, ch. 6, p.293)
“Every created being is so constituted as to be capable of vice and virtue. For he can do
nothing praiseworthy, if he had not the power of turning either way.… unless we suppose
man has the power to choose the good and refuse the evil, no one can be accountable for any action whatever.” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa Mahan, p. 61)
“I have proved in what has been said that those who were foreknown to be unrighteous,
whether men or angels, are not made wicked by God’s fault. Rather, each man is what he will appear to be through his own fault.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 286)
“In the beginning, He made the human race with the power of thought and of choosing truth and doing right, so that all men are without excuse before God.” (A Dictionary of Early
Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
“Let some suppose, from what has been said by us, that we say that whatever occurs happens by a fatal necessity, because it is foretold as known beforehand, this too we explain. We have learned from the prophets, and we hold it to be true, that punishments, chastisements, and good rewards, are rendered according to the merit of each man’s actions. Now, if this is not so, but all things happen by fate, then neither is anything at all in our own power. For if it is predetermined that this man will be good, and this other man will be evil, neither is the first one meritorious nor the latter man to be blamed. And again, unless the human race has the power of avoiding evil and choosing good by free choice, they are not accountable for their actions.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
“The human race…from Adam had fallen under the power of death and the guile of the
serpent. Each one had committed personal transgression.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian
Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
“The whole human race will be found to be under a curse. For it is written in the Law of
Moses, ‘Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things that are written in the book of
the Law and do them.’ And no one has accurately done them all.” (A Dictionary of Early
Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 271)
Tatian the Assyrian (110-172 AD) was a writer and theologian of the 2nd century.
“We were not created to die. Rather, we die by our own fault. Our free will has destroyed us.
We who were free have become slaves. We have been sold through sin. Nothing evil has been created by God. We ourselves have manifested wickedness. But we, who have
manifested it, are able again to reject it.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 286)
“The Logos… before the creation of men, was the Framer of angels. And each of these two
orders of creatures was made free to act as it pleased, not having the nature of good, which
again is with God alone, but is brought to perfection in men through their freedom of choice,
in order that the bad man may be justly punished … but the just man be deservedly
praised.… Such is the constitution of things in reference to angels and men.” (Address to the
Greeks)
Irenaeus (120-202 AD) was a disciple of Polycarp who himself was a disciple of the Apostle
John.
“But man, being endowed with reason, and in this respect similar to God, having been made
free in his will, and with power over himself, is himself his own cause that sometimes he
becomes wheat, and sometimes chaff.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 286)
“This expression, ‘How often would I have gathered thy children together, and thou wouldst
not,’ set forth the ancient law of human liberty, because God made man a free (agent) from
the beginning, possessing his own soul to obey the behests of God voluntarily, and not by
compulsion of God. For there is no coercion with God, but a good will (toward us) is present
with Him continually. And therefore does He give good counsel to all. And in man as well as
in angels, He has placed the power of choice (for angels are rational beings), so that those
who had yielded obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but
preserved by themselves…” (God’s Strategy In Human History, p. 246)
“‘Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good deeds’… And ‘Why call
me, Lord, Lord, and do not do the things that I say?’… All such passages demonstrate the
independent will of man… For it is in man’s power to disobey God and to forfeit what is
good.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 287)
“Nor, again, does God exercise compulsion upon anyone unwilling to accept the exercise of
His skill.… They have been created free agents and possessed of power over themselves.”
(Vol. 1, p. 523)
“But as the sun, that creature of God, is one and the same throughout the whole world, so
also the preaching of the truth shineth everywhere, and enlightens all men that are willing to
come to a knowledge of the truth.” (Irenaeus, Against Heresies, p. 331)
“…there is no coercion with God, but a good will is present with Him continually. And
therefore does He give good counsel to all. And in man as well as in angels, He has placed
the power of choice (for angels are rational beings), so that that those who had yielded
obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but preserved by
themselves … If then it were not in our power to do or not to do these things, what reason
had the apostle, and much more the Lord Himself, to give us counsel to do some things and
to abstain from others? But because man is possessed of free-will from the beginning, and
God is possessed of free-will in whose likeness man was created, advise is always given to
him to keep fast the good, which thing is done by means of obedience to God.” (Irenaeus
Against Heresies, XXXVII)“
And in man, as well as in angels, [God] has placed the power of choice…so that those who
had yielded obedience might justly possess what is good, given indeed by God, but preserved
by themselves. On the other hand, they who have not obeyed shall, with justice, be not found
in possession of the good, and shall receive condign punishment: for God did kindly bestow
on them what was good…but [they] poured contempt on His super-eminent goodness.”
(Against Heresies 5:37)
Irenaeus wrote that God sent His Son “as one who saves by persuasion, not compulsion, for
compulsion is no attribute of God.” (Epistle to Diognetus 7:4)
Melito of Sardis (Died 180 AD)
“There is, therefore, nothing to hinder you from changing your evil manner to life, because
you are a free man.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 286)
Theophilus of Antioch (Died 183-185 AD)
“If, on the other hand, he would turn to the things of death, disobeying God, he would
himself be the cause of death to himself. For God made man free, and with power of
himself.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 286)
Athenagoras of Athens (133-190 AD) was an Ante-Nicene church father. He was Christian
apologist who lived during the second half of the 2nd century.
“Just as with men, who have freedom of choice as to both virtue and vice, so it is among the
angels…Some free agents, you will observe, such as they were created by God, continued in
those things for which God had made and over which he had ordained them; but some
outraged both the constitution of their nature and the government entrusted to them.” (A Plea
for the Christians 24)
Clement of Alexandria (150-215 AD) was a Christian theologian and philosopher who taught at
the School of Alexandria. He mentored Origen and Alexander of Jerusalem.
“A man by himself working and toiling at freedom from sinful desires achieves nothing. But
if he plainly shows himself to be very eager and earnest about this, he attains it by the
addition of the power of God. God works together with willing souls. But if the person
abandons his eagerness, the spirit from God is also restrained. To save the unwilling is the act
of one using compulsion; but to save the willing, that of one showing grace.” Salvation of the
Rich Man chap. 21
“Neither praise nor condemnation, neither rewards nor punishments, are right if the soul does
not have the power of choice and avoidance, if evil is involuntary.” (Miscellanies, Bk. 1, Ch.
17)
“Nor shall he who is saved be saved against his will, for he is not inanimate; but he will
above all voluntarily and of free choice speed to salvation. Wherefore also man received the
commandments in order that he might be self-impelled, to whatever he wished of things to be
chosen and to be avoided. Wherefore God does not do good by necessity, but from His free
choice benefits those who spontaneously turn.” (Stromata, Bk 7 Ch.7)
“The Lord clearly shows sins and transgressions to be in our own power.” (A Dictionary of
Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 288)“Each one of us who sins with his own free will, chooses punishment. So the blame lies with
him who chooses. God is without blame.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 287)
“‘If thou wilt be perfect.’ Consequently he was not yet perfect. For nothing is more perfect
than what is perfect. And divinely the expression ‘if thou wilt’ showed the self-determination
of the soul holding converse with Him. For choice depended on the man as being free; but
the gift on God as the Lord. And He gives to those who are willing and are exceedingly
earnest, and ask, that so their salvation may become their own. For God compels not (for
compulsion is repugnant to God), but supplies to those who seek, and bestows on those who
ask, and opens to those who knock.” (Clement of Alexandria c. 195)
“Neither promises nor apprehensions, rewards, no punishments are just if the soul has not the
power of choosing and abstaining; if evil is involuntary.” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa
Mahan, p. 63)
“So in no respect is God the author of evil. But since free choice and inclination originate
sins…punishments are rightly inflicted.” (Stromata 1:17)
“This was the law from the first, that virtue should be the object of voluntary choice.”
(Stromata 7:2)
“To obey or not is in our own power, provided we do not have the excuse of ignorance.” (A
Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 287)
“We…have believed and are saved by voluntary choice.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian
Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 287)
Tertullian (160-225 AD) was an apologist for the Christian faith. He wrote a number of
polemics against heretical teachings of his day.
“But although we shall be understood, from our argument, to be only so affirming man’s
unshackled power over his will, that what happens to him should be laid to his own charge,
and not to God’s, yet that you may not object, even now, that he ought not to have been so
constituted, since his liberty and power of will might turn out to be injurious… Therefore it
was proper that (he who is) the image and likeness of God should be formed with a free will
and a mastery of himself;… At present, let God’s goodness alone occupy our attention, that
which gave so large a gift to man, even the liberty of his will.” (The Writings of Tertullian -
Volume 2, p. 92)
“I find, then, that man was constituted free by God. He was master of his own will and
power.… For a law would not be imposed upon one who did not have it in his power to
render that obedience which is due to law. Nor again, would the penalty of death be
threatened against sin, if a contempt of the law were impossible to man in the liberty of his
will… Man is free, with a will either for obedience of resistance.” (Ante-Nicene Fathers Vol.
3, pp. 300-301)
“No reward can be justly bestowed, no punishment can be justly inflicted, upon him who is
good or bad by necessity, and not by his own choice.” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa Mahan, p.
61)
Hippolytus of Rome (170-235 AD)“For man is able to both will and not will. He is endowed with power to do both.” (A
Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 288)
Origen (185-255 AD) is regarded as one of the most important Christian theologians of all time.
“The soul does not incline to either part out of necessity, for then neither vice nor virtue
could be ascribed to it; nor would its choice of virtue deserve reward; nor its declination to
vice punishment.… How could God require that of man which he [man] had not power to
offer Him?” (Doctrine of the Will by Asa Mahan, p. 62)
In his work Against Celsus, Origen responded to a claim that “whatever happens in the
universe, whether it be the work of God, of angels [or] of other demons…is regulated by the
law of the Most High God,” Origen wrote, “This is… incorrect; for we cannot say that
transgressors follow the law of God when they transgress; and Scripture declares that it is not only wicked men who are transgressors, but also wicked demons and wicked angels…When we say that ‘the providence of God regulates all things,’ we utter a great truth if we attribute to that providence nothing but what is just and right. But if we ascribe to the providence of God all things whatsoever, however unjust they may be, then it is no longer true that the providence of God regulates all things.” (Against Celsus 7:68)
Alexander of Alexandria (250-326 AD) was the leader of the opposition to Arianism at the
First Council of Nicaea. He was the mentor of Athanasius of Alexandria, who became one of the leading Church fathers.
“Natural will is the free faculty of ever intelligent nature, as having nothing involuntary
pertaining to its essence.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David Bercot, p. 293,
published by Hendrickson Publishers)
Archelaus Bishop of Carrhae (250-300 AD) held a public dispute with the heretic Manes —
followers of Mani — an account of which he published in Syriac. The work was soon translated both into Greek and into Latin.
“All the creatures that God made, He made very good. And He gave to every individual the
sense of free will, by which standard He also instituted the law of judgment…. And certainly
whoever will, may keep the commandments. Whoever despises them and turns aside to what is contrary to them, shall yet without doubt have to face this law of judgment…. There can be no doubt that every individual, in using his own proper power of will, may shape his course in whatever direction he pleases.” (Archelaus Disputation With Manes sees. 32, 33)
Methodius of Olympus (270-312 AD) was a bishop and author. He died as a martyr.
“Man was made with a free will … [with the] capacity of obeying or disobeying God. For
this was the meaning of the gift of free will.” (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by
David Bercot, p. 292)
“Those [pagans] who decide that man does not have free will, but say that he is governed by the unavoidable necessities of fate, are guilty of impiety toward God Himself, making Him out to be the cause and author of human evils.” (Methodius The Banquet of the Ten Virgins discourse 8, chap. 16)
“To do good or evil is in our own power”. (A Dictionary of Early Christian Beliefs by David
Bercot, p. 292)
Cyril of Jerusalem (313-386 AD).
“And you must know your soul to be endowed with free-will, and to be God’s fairest work in the image of himself. It is immortal in as far as God grants it immortality. It is a rational
living creature not subject to decay, because these qualities have been bestowed by God upon it. And it has the power to do what it chooses. For you do not sin because you were born that way, nor if you fornicate is it by chance. And do not take any notice of what some people say, that the conjunctions of the stars compel you to fall into unclean living. Why should you avoid acknowledging that you have done wrong by blaming it onto the stars that had nothing to do with it?” (Catechetical Lectures IV, 18)
“Learn this also, that before it came into this world, your soul had committed no sin, but we
come into the world unblemished, and, being here, sin of our own choice. Do not listen, I
say, to anyone who expounds ‘If then I do that which I would not, in the wrong sense, but
remember who says, ‘If ye be willing and obedient, ye shall eat of the good land; but if ye
refuse and rebel, ye shall be devoured with the sword,’ and what follows.” (Catechetical
Lectures IV. 19)
Jerome (347-420 AD) was a contemporary of Augustine. He opposed Augustine on a number of issues including free will versus determinism.
“God has bestowed us with free will. We are not necessarily drawn either to virtue or vice.
For when necessity rules, there is no room left either for damnation or the crown.” (Doctrine
of the Will by Asa Mahan, p. 62)
John Chrysostom (349-407 AD) was a contemporary of Augustine. He also opposed
Augustine’s view of determinism.
“All is in God’s power, but so that our free-will is not lost… it depends therefore on us and
on Him. We must first choose the good, and then He adds what belongs to Him. He does not precede our willing, that our free-will may not suffer. But when we have chosen, then He affords much help … It is ours to choose beforehand and to will, but God’s to perfect and
bring to the end.” (John Chrysostom on Hebrews, Homily 12)
No you don't. You believe in compatibilism.
There was no compatibilism in the Fathers pre Augustine
civic
Well-known member
civic
Well-known member
Exactly.
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