Thomas... My Lord and my God

[brightfame52]

Let's stay on this though. So is flesh a thing? Is it made of atoms, elements, miscellaneous compounds? Yes? That's just like everything else in the physical universe. So Jesus was created, not incarnated. You know it's true!

Jesus was Created in His Manhood as Mediator, Head of the Church, but in His Person as the Word Jn 1:1 He is God, uncreated, unbegotten, and Self Existent !

 

[Peterlag]

That is an ignorant rejection of the divinity of Christ. You may be have heard that Trinitarians recognize Jesus' humanity. This is the testimony of Jesus both in a divine sense and a human sense. There is no twisting necessary, only the testimony of scripture.

There is no debate possible with you trinity folks because you get to have it both ways. You get to...

1.) Make Jesus God when you think it fits the Bible verse.
2.) Make Jesus a man when you think it needs to fit the Bible verse.

God could not pretend to be a man to redeemed us. The devil would have called Him out on it if a man was required to redeem us and God tried to sneak in pretending to be a man.

 

[mikesw]

There is no debate possible with you trinity folks because you get to have it both ways. You get to...

1.) Make Jesus God when you think it fits the Bible verse.
2.) Make Jesus a man when you think it needs to fit the Bible verse.

God could not pretend to be a man to redeemed us. The devil would have called Him out on it if a man was required to redeem us and God tried to sneak in pretending to be a man.

Amazing what God can do-- much more than a unitarian's one-dimensional idea of God.

You then seem to focus on what Satan would do but perhaps it was not in the devil's self-interest to go beyond the temptations and reveal who Jesus is. Satan obviously knew who Jesus was when coming to Jesus to tempt him. Also, Satan actually ended up acting unknowingly of what Christ would achieve. Overall then it is hard to imagine what a unitarian's goal is in rejecting all these important details.

 

[synergy]

28:20 God you've got to understand that that Greek word teknon is never once used in
28:26 the New Testament to describe Jesus as the Son of God because we all agree...
28:31 Unitarians Muslims Christians the Quran and the Bible... all agree God does not
28:36 have sex. he does not have a wife a girlfriend or babies and I think Ken would agree with that. okay.
28:42 so the second Greek word that describes the Son and English would be huios. it
28:49 means the same nature as and you can see this in Luke 10 6 where it describes the
28:54 son of peace it means that you have the nature of peace you see in Ephesians 5:6

Good catch, differentiating teknon from huios.

Jesus is the only Son (huios) of Man whose Ascension to the Father was prophesied in Dan 7:13-14.

 

[Runningman]

Good catch, differentiating teknon from huios.

Jesus is the only Son (huios) of Man whose Ascension to the Father was prophesied in Dan 7:13-14.

What are agreeing on is false. So it's a bad catch. When Jesus was taken to heaven, that was his rapture. Which is the very same rapture the other Sons (huios) of Men will experience.

1 Thessalonians 4
14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.
15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep. 16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise. 17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

Trinitarian bloopers:

1. thinks that the Word incarnated, contrary to Scripture explicitly stating that the flesh of Jesus came into being.
2. desperately wants the word "became" to not mean what it means, so he weaponizes Scripture against itself to distort it to mean something bad about Jesus.
3. erroneously thinks Jesus is the only son of man who will be taken to heaven.


Edit by Adim. Please do not discuss other members

 

[Runningman]

Jesus was Created in His Manhood as Mediator, Head of the Church, but in His Person as the Word Jn 1:1 He is God, uncreated, unbegotten, and Self Existent !

Does the Bible ever say God is not a man? Yes? Does the Bible ever say God will become a man? No? You are running out of excuses.

Numbers 23
19God is not a man, that He should lie,
or a son of man, that He should change His mind.
Does He speak and not act?
Does He promise and not fulfill?

Hosea 11
9I will not execute the full fury of My anger;
I will not destroy Ephraim again.
For I am God and not man—
the Holy One among you—
and I will not come in wrath.

 

[brightfame52]

Does the Bible ever say God is not a man? Yes? Does the Bible ever say God will become a man? No? You are running out of excuses.

Numbers 23
19God is not a man, that He should lie,
or a son of man, that He should change His mind.
Does He speak and not act?
Does He promise and not fulfill?

Hosea 11
9I will not execute the full fury of My anger;
I will not destroy Ephraim again.
For I am God and not man—
the Holy One among you—
and I will not come in wrath.

There is no relevance here.

 

[Runningman]

There is no relevance here.

Since the Bible says God is not a man, yet Jesus is a man, then Jesus isn't God nor a God Man. Check mate.

 

[brightfame52]

Since the Bible says God is not a man, yet Jesus is a man, then Jesus isn't God nor a God Man. Check mate.

I dont see any relevance. I have shown from scripture, Jesus is a Man and God.

 

[Runningman]

I dont see any relevance. I have shown from scripture, Jesus is a Man and God.

According to Hosea 11:9, it is a direct quote by God. Assuming that is true, then God explicitly stated He is not a man and never provided a different description of Himself after that. I believe that. You're free to disagree with God if you wish. I am just not surprised anymore.

 

[Peterlag]

Amazing what God can do-- much more than a unitarian's one-dimensional idea of God.

You then seem to focus on what Satan would do but perhaps it was not in the devil's self-interest to go beyond the temptations and reveal who Jesus is. Satan obviously knew who Jesus was when coming to Jesus to tempt him. Also, Satan actually ended up acting unknowingly of what Christ would achieve. Overall then it is hard to imagine what a unitarian's goal is in rejecting all these important details.

The devil would not have even tried to tempt God because he knows that's imposible. This must be when you pull out your "Get Out of Jail Free" card and make Jesus a man again for the temptation. The idea that God can limit what He knows or experiences as God is not taught or explained in Scripture.

 

[brightfame52]

According to Hosea 11:9, it is a direct quote by God. Assuming that is true, then God explicitly stated He is not a man and never provided a different description of Himself after that. I believe that. You're free to disagree with God if you wish. I am just not surprised anymore.

Jesus is both God and Man according to scripture. Hos 11:9 doesnt change that

 

[mikesw]

The devil would not have even tried to tempt God because he knows that's imposible. This must be when you pull out your "Get Out of Jail Free" card and make Jesus a man again for the temptation. The idea that God can limit what He knows or experiences as God is not taught or explained in Scripture.

You probably have the detail right that Satan did not know the divinity of Christ but only that Jesus was here as the promised Messiah. But indeed we have to recognize that God is not prohibited from doing incarnation. You do not simply deny this because you do not understand how God does this.
The problems of the unitarians includes faulty explanations of the pre-existence verses, the obvious mistreatment of John 1:1-18. We see John 1:18 also speaks of the divinity of Jesus in the earlier manuscript evidence.

 

[Peterlag]

You probably have the detail right that Satan did not know the divinity of Christ but only that Jesus was here as the promised Messiah. But indeed we have to recognize that God is not prohibited from doing incarnation. You do not simply deny this because you do not understand how God does this.
The problems of the unitarians includes faulty explanations of the pre-existence verses, the obvious mistreatment of John 1:1-18. We see John 1:18 also speaks of the divinity of Jesus in the earlier manuscript evidence.

Satan did not know the divinity of Christ? Yeah Right.

 

[mikesw]

Satan did not know the divinity of Christ? Yeah Right.

Oops. I did not think you would say that Satan knew the divinity of Christ while you do not.