The Bible does not teach to pray to Jesus

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

Bahi is better than Trinitarianism at this point, given my available options in this thread. Why not just be a Christian? I will call on you if you do.

i had a hunch you might see it that way . Bad news my friend .
but that is what they wanted . they wanted the merger of all religoins and thus
they found a common love of the world to preach
and all the while they broke down the walls of true doctrine , removed The true image of CHRIST
and replaced it with one made liken in the image of humanity .
SO as they could place that image along side all other false religoins prophets .
Man have the people been decieved . You cannot place the alpah and omega the first and the last
along side them false idols .
Has it not been told , has it not been said , I AM ALPHA and OMEGA and besides ME there is no other god .
Rather interesting that JESUS said I am alpha and omega , the first and the last .
AND I JOHN saw no temple therein for the TEMPLE IS GOD AND THE LAMB .
And GOD did lighten it and the light is the Glory of GOD . GOD IS LIGHT
and take notice it says the LORD JESUS IS The Glory of God ............................many places
with many sayings are SURE SHOWING US SOMETHING . my advice , BIBLE UP and
The bahi , IS NO RELIGOIN anyone wants to keep company with either .

 

[Runningman]

Amen brother, let's check what we further have in common.

A bit of Plato first.

The Cycle of Opposites
The first argument is based on the cyclical interchange by means of which every quality comes into being from its own opposite. Hot comes from cold and cold from hot: that is, hot things are just cold things that have warmed up, and cold things are just hot things that have cooled off. Similarly, people who are awake are just people who were asleep but then woke up, while people who are asleep are just people who were awake but then dozed off.

That's very rational and I agree.

But then, by analogy, if good exist (God) evil (the opposite of God) must exist also.

Do you define God as a quality or character trait? I don't.

Moving to Scripture.
Gen 1:26 Then God said, “Let us make man in our image, after our likeness.
The us refers to various Scripture passages, Jesus (God the Son) being one with the Father (John 10:30), partaking together with the Father in creation (Col 1:16).

And God the Father and God the Son knew on beforehand by giving the creatures they were about to create with free will that evil (the opposite of them) sooner or later would rear its ugly head. God knew every outcome on beforehand and what evil would do to His creatures and to Himself by allowing free will.

And we know from the NT how the Father before He created mankind, how He decided to deal with with evil and sin, the Lamb slain, He asked His Son (the most precious God had, see John 17) to descend from his glory (John 3:13, 6,51) and become one of us with all its limitations, show us His Father, deal with the devil, deal with sin. What a question!? And Jesus (God the Son) wanted to do what the Father asked from Him and so God the Son became the Lamb slain before the foundation of the world, BEFORE Adam was even created.

Can you feel the love RM ?

So yes, praise God the Father, praise Jesus, worship God the Father, worship Jesus, they are ONE anyway.

Slow down a bit and lets take a few steps back before you continue.

There is no mention of a "God the Son" with God in the beginning or anywhere in the Old or New Testament. The only mention about who was with God in the Old Testament would be angels and his congregation. The best contextual guess would be God was referring to His congregation.

Psalm 82
1{A Psalm of Asaph.} God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.

Let's talk about this part.

 

[Runningman]

For being your Creator and God.

John 1:1-3
John 1:10
1 Cor 8:6
Hebrews 1:1-12
Colossians 1:15-18
Revelation 5:9-14

None of these say Jesus is the Creator.

Let's see if we can work this out. Do you believe God is the Creator? A simple yes or no will do.

 

[Runningman]

i had a hunch you might see it that way . Bad news my friend .
but that is what they wanted . they wanted the merger of all religoins and thus
they found a common love of the world to preach
and all the while they broke down the walls of true doctrine , removed The true image of CHRIST
and replaced it with one made liken in the image of humanity .
SO as they could place that image along side all other false religoins prophets .
Man have the people been decieved . You cannot place the alpah and omega the first and the last
along side them false idols .
Has it not been told , has it not been said , I AM ALPHA and OMEGA and besides ME there is no other god .
Rather interesting that JESUS said I am alpha and omega , the first and the last .
AND I JOHN saw no temple therein for the TEMPLE IS GOD AND THE LAMB .
And GOD did lighten it and the light is the Glory of GOD . GOD IS LIGHT
and take notice it says the LORD JESUS IS The Glory of God ............................many places
with many sayings are SURE SHOWING US SOMETHING . my advice , BIBLE UP and
The bahi , IS NO RELIGOIN anyone wants to keep company with either .

I don't know, but it's pretty bad when someone who isn't even a Christian gets what I am trying to tell you people, but you all don't. Regardless of his religion, he actually gets the Bible as evidenced by the things he has repeatedly said. I respect that immensely.

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

None of these say Jesus is the Creator.

Let's see if we can work this out. Do you believe God is the Creator? A simple yes or no will do.

Do i beleive GOD is the creator . YOU BET . HE SPOKE and it was .
WHEN GOD said let there be light , THERE WAS LIGHT .
Its that simple .
Notice when he said let there be light , LIGHT was , trees didnt appear , grass didnt grow , ONLY LIGHT .
Are you catching on yet .
GOD didnt create something and then tell that something let there be light .
HE SIMPLY SPOKE and it was . JESUS IS HIS WORD HE IS HIS SPIRIT . GOD IS HIS WORD , HE IS HIS OWN ESSENCE .
NO MORE talk about denying the divinity of the alpha and omega . IF YOU continue to do so
you alone shall bear the fruit of your own works and blasphemy .
GOD IS HIS WORD , HE IS HIS SPIRIT and HIS WORD DID BECOME FLESH .

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

I don't know, but it's pretty bad when someone who isn't even a Christian gets what I am trying to tell you people, but you all don't. Regardless of his religion, he actually gets the Bible as evidenced by the things he has repeatedly said. I respect that immensely.

You have just spoken words that prove Your own fault . AND i do agree ITS DARN BAD when folks WHO AINT CHRISTAIN
sure SEEM TO AGREE WITH YOUR VIEW . BINGO buddy . I hiave no argument with you on this .
YOUR WORDS HAVE PROVEN YOUR OWN DELUSION .
And yeah ITS PRETTY BAD INDEED . but you go and learn what that means .
DO YOU wanna know what you and all false religoins have in common .
NOT A ONE OF THEM , including an athiest sees JESUS as GOD . YOU HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF SUPPORT MY FRIEND .
BUT It sure aint FROM GOD , its from the WORLD .

 

[Runningman]

You have just spoken words that prove Your own fault . AND i do agree ITS DARN BAD when folks WHO AINT CHRISTAIN
sure SEEM TO AGREE WITH YOUR VIEW . BINGO buddy . I hiave no argument with you on this .
YOUR WORDS HAVE PROVEN YOUR OWN DELUSION .
And yeah ITS PRETTY BAD INDEED . but you go and learn what that means .
DO YOU wanna know what you and all false religoins have in common .
NOT A ONE OF THEM , including an athiest sees JESUS as GOD . YOU HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF SUPPORT MY FRIEND .
BUT It sure aint FROM GOD , its from the WORLD .

Plenty people agree with me about this, including Christians on this board and elsewhere, but not in this thread. I would take Pancho over any of you any day. At least he is a genuine truth seeker and clearly has a hunger for it.

 

[Runningman]

Do i beleive GOD is the creator . YOU BET . HE SPOKE and it was .
WHEN GOD said let there be light , THERE WAS LIGHT .
Its that simple .
Notice when he said let there be light , LIGHT was , trees didnt appear , grass didnt grow , ONLY LIGHT .
Are you catching on yet .
GOD didnt create something and then tell that something let there be light .
HE SIMPLY SPOKE and it was . JESUS IS HIS WORD HE IS HIS SPIRIT . GOD IS HIS WORD , HE IS HIS OWN ESSENCE .
NO MORE talk about denying the divinity of the alpha and omega . IF YOU continue to do so
you alone shall bear the fruit of your own works and blasphemy .
GOD IS HIS WORD , HE IS HIS SPIRIT and HIS WORD DID BECOME FLESH .

Jesus is a human. You think a man created the universe?

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

That's very rational and I agree.


Do you define God as a quality or character trait? I don't.

Slow down a bit and lets take a few steps back before you continue.

There is no mention of a "God the Son" with God in the beginning or anywhere in the Old or New Testament. The only mention about who was with God in the Old Testament would be angels and his congregation. The best contextual guess would be God was referring to His congregation.

Psalm 82
1{A Psalm of Asaph.} God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.

Let's talk about this part.

On my worst day i would not point to plato as any kind of example . BUT YOU SURE SEEMED To love that example .
You and the bahis and the false religoins all sure seem to have FOUND A HUGE COMMON GROUND .
AINT A ONE of you all believes JESUS IS GOD . but man its not good when the world agrees with ya .
BETTER we have sought out GOD and see what HE says and not rather what man says .
Are ya learning yet . DO NOT DENY the ONE WHO SAID I AM ALPHA and OMEGA , FIRST and the last
FOR IF YOU DENY ONE who said such words , WELL YA DENIED THE ALPHA and OMEGA .
HEY buddy the ONLY ALPHA and OMEGA , teh ONLY FIRST and LAST , IS GOD . lets not DENY HIM .

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

Jesus is a human. You think a man created the universe?

what a joke . YOU mean To say rather THE WORD , same word THAT IS GOD
became flesh . TRY learning truth and not rather what men say is truth .
Go on keep running to Bahi , to muslims , to hindus , to any other religoin to atheist
I AM DARN SURE they gonna everyone of them as well as even a lot of christendom AGREE WITH YOU .
the only problem is , THEY DECIEVED and KNOW NOT GOD .
I SUGGEST BIBLE TIME .

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

Plenty people agree with me about this, including Christians on this board and elsewhere, but not in this thread. I would take Pancho over any of you any day. At least he is a genuine truth seeker and clearly has a hunger for it.

If he be such a truth seeker , why did his truth lead him to BAHI . again YOU HAVE FAILED .

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

Plenty people agree with me about this, including Christians on this board and elsewhere, but not in this thread. I would take Pancho over any of you any day. At least he is a genuine truth seeker and clearly has a hunger for it.

man you sure have well spoken when you said MANY people do agree with you . I SURE cannot call you a liar for saying that .
EVERY FALSE Religoin sure do agree with you .
Every atheist sure do agree with your view .
But it aint about men agreeing with us , RATHER ITS DO WE AGREE WITH GOD and do what we believe AGREE WITH HIM .
YOU GO and learn that well . FOr the world is in your corner and holds your view .
BUT GOD SURE DONT , HIS WORD SURE DONT .

 

[ProDeo]

That's very rational and I agree.

Cool...

Do you define God as a quality or character trait? I don't.

And now you lost me.

This is what I wrote - But then, by analogy, if good exist (God) evil (the opposite of God) must exist also.

When God created the angels, do you think that He did not know in advance that the devil would rebel? That He did not know in advance that A&E would fall?

That's what I meant, that by giving His creatures free will, the side effect of free will, the opposite of good (Him) would reveal itself, to begin with the devil and his angels.

God knew in advance.

Are we in agreement now?

Slow down a bit and lets take a few steps back before you continue.

No, let's take a break instead.

I am pretty new here, but what I have read so far, many posters have given excellent Scripture that "The Word" (John 1:1) became flesh (1:14) and thus that Jesus was God descended from heaven. Plenty of Scriptural evidence has been offered.

And so I gave you a different perspective, of course with the same outcome.

How did God -- in advance -- deal with the side effect of free will?

The Lamb slain, right?

God the Son.

God (in His love) took responsibility for His choice to give all His creatures free will including the nasty side effect it would have. The Lamb slain was decided before A&E were created, God the Father and God the Son agreed on the Lamb slain, Jesus, God the Son.

Seriously, do you really think that God would leave this in the hand, -- and it got out of hand -- of a mere human?

That God would take any risk with mankind who so easily fell for the lies of the devil?

That millions of Jews, all of them, during 1500 years, failed His law?

That a mere man could defeat the devil?

No, all of this is God's business, Jesus could not fail because He was God the Son, the blameless Lamb.

No one else could.

No one else could live a life without sin, no one was able, not one of the millions of His chosen people.

Only God the Son.

God knew that in advance before He created us.

 

[DavidTree]

None of these say Jesus is the Creator.

Let's see if we can work this out. Do you believe God is the Creator? A simple yes or no will do.

They ALL do.

Refusal of the TRUTH causes hardness of heart and blindness.

 

[DavidTree]

Jesus is a human. You think a man created the universe?

Jesus the man did not create all things.

The WORD that was GOD created all things = John 1:1-5

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
He was with God in the beginning.
Through Him all things were made, and without Him nothing was made that has been made.
In Him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The Light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.

 

[Runningman]

They ALL do.

Refusal of the TRUTH causes hardness of heart and blindness.

All of the verses that speak of Jesus and creation refer to the primary actor as God doing the creating through Jesus with Jesus being used in the sense of instrumentality as like a channel. As far as creating the church, yes I 100% agree that Jesus created the church with God being the primary actor who supplied all of the doctrines, teachings, anointings, and power. As far as creation of the universe, God did not create the universe through Jesus. Read John 1:1-3, Hebrews 1:1,2, Acts 4:23-31, Acts 17:25, etc.

One of the best ways to explain this I think may just be to show you. The Father is the Lord of heaven and earth and Jesus isn't because he was never called that in the Bible. However, God is the Lord of heaven and earth who created all things and gives life to all people. The Bible is clear that God doesn't even need humans yet Jesus is a human. Think about it.

Matthew 11
25At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children;

Acts 17
24The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man, 25nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything.

 

[Runningman]

Cool...


And now you lost me.

This is what I wrote - But then, by analogy, if good exist (God) evil (the opposite of God) must exist also.

When God created the angels, do you think that He did not know in advance that the devil would rebel? That He did not know in advance that A&E would fall?

That's what I meant, that by giving His creatures free will, the side effect of free will, the opposite of good (Him) would reveal itself, to begin with the devil and his angels.

God knew in advance.

Are we in agreement now?

Yes we agree. So do you believe Jesus denied being God?

Mark 10
18And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.

No, let's take a break instead.

I am pretty new here, but what I have read so far, many posters have given excellent Scripture that "The Word" (John 1:1) became flesh (1:14) and thus that Jesus was God descended from heaven. Plenty of Scriptural evidence has been offered.

And so I gave you a different perspective, of course with the same outcome.

How did God -- in advance -- deal with the side effect of free will?

The Lamb slain, right?

God the Son.

God (in His love) took responsibility for His choice to give all His creatures free will including the nasty side effect it would have. The Lamb slain was decided before A&E were created, God the Father and God the Son agreed on the Lamb slain, Jesus, God the Son.

Seriously, do you really think that God would leave this in the hand, -- and it got out of hand -- of a mere human?

That God would take any risk with mankind who so easily fell for the lies of the devil?

That millions of Jews, all of them, during 1500 years, failed His law?

That a mere man could defeat the devil?

No, all of this is God's business, Jesus could not fail because He was God the Son, the blameless Lamb.

No one else could.

No one else could live a life without sin, no one was able, not one of the millions of His chosen people.

Only God the Son.

God knew that in advance before He created us.

Yes you're new here and welcome. I like talking to you. It's nice to have someone new to talk to. To be fair, Jesus didn't describe his descension from heaven as God who became flesh. He described himself as the son of man who came down from heaven. Son of man means someone is a human in the Bible right?

John 3
13No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

John 6
62Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?

 

[mikesw]

Yes we agree. So do you believe Jesus denied being God?

Mark 10
18And Jesus said to him, “Why do you call me good? No one is good except God alone.

You treat the question as a denial when neither Mark nor Jesus denies the divinity of Christ in the Godhead.

Yes you're new here and welcome. I like talking to you. It's nice to have someone new to talk to.

Sure. Everyone else has pointed out the flaws of your approach too much, so it helps for you to repeat the same failed views to some new people.

To be fair, Jesus didn't describe his descension from heaven as God who became flesh. He described himself as the son of man who came down from heaven. Son of man means someone is a human in the Bible right?

Nah. Jesus had to convey his divinity in the Godhead in a special way that Runningman would agree as saying that.

John 3
13No one has ascended into heaven except he who descended from heaven, the Son of Man.

John 6
62Then what if you were to see the Son of Man ascending to where he was before?

Until you make sense of the descent from heaven, you do not even have a horse in the race.

 

[DavidTree]

All of the verses that speak of Jesus and creation refer to the primary actor as God doing the creating through Jesus with Jesus being used in the sense of instrumentality as like a channel. As far as creating the church, yes I 100% agree that Jesus created the church with God being the primary actor who supplied all of the doctrines, teachings, anointings, and power. As far as creation of the universe, God did not create the universe through Jesus. Read John 1:1-3, Hebrews 1:1,2, Acts 4:23-31, Acts 17:25, etc.

One of the best ways to explain this I think may just be to show you. The Father is the Lord of heaven and earth and Jesus isn't because he was never called that in the Bible. However, God is the Lord of heaven and earth who created all things and gives life to all people. The Bible is clear that God doesn't even need humans yet Jesus is a human. Think about it.

Matthew 11
25At that time Jesus declared, “I thank you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, that you have hidden these things from the wise and understanding and revealed them to little children;

Acts 17
24The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man, 25nor is he served by human hands, as though he needed anything, since he himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything.

The WORD was GOD = Genesis chapter 1

 

[Runningman]

You treat the question as a denial when neither Mark nor Jesus denies the divinity of Christ in the Godhead.

Sure. Everyone else has pointed out the flaws of your approach too much, so it helps for you to repeat the same failed views to some new people.


Nah. Jesus had to convey his divinity in the Godhead in a special way that Runningman would agree as saying that.


Until you make sense of the descent from heaven, you do not even have a horse in the race.

Jesus denied being the one who is God in Mark 10:18. I also like talking to new people. No one ever put new wine into old wineskins... most of you simply are not ready to take what Jesus said at face value or believe in his teachings. That doesn't mean I'll stop trying.