Pauls use of Predestination

Presby02 said:
Again, what occurred that was not part of predestined, determined or that His hand brought about?? Were parts of the plan left to chance?

It's not about who, it's about what occurred. Good try.

See how simple that question is?
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I've already stated that the evil within men was not purposed by God.
 
civic said:
You mean one single and unique prophesied event which the entire Bible is about ?

So much for your argument eh ?

That cannot and does not apply to everything. That was easy to refute.

hope this helps !!!
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Calvinism must assume what it will to live
 
civic said:
Paul uses predestination in Romans 8:29-30 and Ephesians 1:5;11 to those who are already saved. Paul does not use the word for unbelievers who are predestined before the world ( false teaching of augustine, calvin ).

What Paul says we believers are predestined to is adoption, to be conformed to the image of Christ, those predestined to be conformed are those who He called, justified and glorified. Notice its believers, not unbelievers who are predestined. There is nothing about unbelievers being predestined before the world. Those who believe in Christ are those who are predestined to be conformed to Christ and adoption as sons.

No one is ever predestined to believe in Christ. Those who are already in Christ are the ones predestined to be conformed into His image and adoption as sons. The bible never says anyone that is not saved were predestined before they were saved. No one is predestined to be saved.

hope this helps !!!
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Such a good beginning, @civic,
What a shambles it has become!

😞
 
praise_yeshua said:
Interesting how you ignore the Scriptures.

Ecc 9:11 I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all.

Do you really want a list?

Admit your appeal to "all things" is contrary to Scripture.
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I thought we were talking about Acts 4 and my question your dodging? What part of the plan was left to chance?
 
Presby02 said:
I thought we were talking about Acts 4 and my question your dodging? What part of the plan was left to chance?
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I'm not dodging anything. You claimed all and you're wrong. Just admit it. I rightfully recognize that "chance" happens to men at various times.

Admit you're wrong and I'll move on but not till you do.
 
praise_yeshua said:
You certainly haven't establish your claim. You made the argument based upon the false claim that Acts 4 is talking about "all things that happened".

Withdraw your claim and we can move on.
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Nope. It does need the word all if you cannot provide the part that was left to chance.

So what part was left to chance?
 
praise_yeshua said:
I'm not dodging anything. You claimed all and you're wrong. Just admit it. I rightfully recognize that "chance" happens to men at various times.

Admit you're wrong and I'll move on but not till you do.
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Nothing involves chance from God's perspective. God is omniscient remember? So what part of His plan in Acts 4 was left to chance?
 
Presby02 said:
What part was left to chance? I will simply keep asking until you step up.
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LOL, I made no mistake if you can not tell me what was left to chance. If you can't then all was the appropriate word to use.

Now, if your so anxious to answer questions then try this one. What part of the plan was left to chance??
 
Complete said:
Such a good beginning, @civic,
What a shambles it has become!

😞
Click to expand...
The problem is the Calvinists position and the way the meaning of words get changed. I did the same thing for decades as a Calvinist. In a sense there are blinders that prevent one from seeing things differently.

If a person were to read the scriptures as if it were the first time they would reject the Calvinist view of scripture. Most every single Calvinist started out as a non Calvinist until they started listening to a Calvinist preacher/ teacher and were persuaded to leave their current beliefs and replace them with tulip.
 
Presby02 said:
What part was left to chance? I will simply keep asking until you step up.
Click to expand...

I know you will. Calvinists never rightfully recognize their mistakes. Never. They just move on.....

Do you rightfully recognize "chance" in any circumstance? If so, you need to define chance relative to your position. I will then answer.
 
praise_yeshua said:
I know you will. Calvinists never rightfully recognize their mistakes. Never. They just move on.....

Do you rightfully recognize "chance" in any circumstance? If so, you need to define chance relative to your position. I will then answer.
Click to expand...
What part of the plan is left to chance? We're listening
 
civic said:
The problem is the Calvinists position and the way the meaning of words get changed. I did the same thing for decades as a Calvinist. In a sense there are blinders that prevent one from seeing things differently.

If a person were to read the scriptures as if it were the first time they would reject the Calvinist view of scripture. Most every single Calvinist started out as a non Calvinist until they started listening to a Calvinist preacher/ teacher and were persuaded to leave their current beliefs and replace them with tulip.
Click to expand...

They live in ambiguity in their self serving statements and then fold when you rightfully recognize their "mistakes".
 

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