Introducing the Spirit of our Father God: his power and presence in our lives
- Thread starter APAK
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Wrangler
Well-known member
I've often wondered if such personification is backwards; it is us humans who have these God-like attributes and emotions such as possessing a will, being grieved, being sorrowful etc.
9 years ago I got 2 dogs from one liter. 3 years later, one of the dogs escaped and was killed on a dirt trail where kids rode motor bikes. We brought her sister to retrieve the body. There was not the expression of sorrowful that I thought might be observed.
APAK
Active member
Yes, I agree that we have god-like attributes over the animal kingdom indeed. I notice that with squirrels in my backyard. When with a mate is dead. One dies the other goes over to find it, sniffs at it them moves on. They are made in their own image and kind, designed with a different set of species attributes for their life and survival, by our Creator.
This threat here is not a perfect study by a long shot. I am not so picky on crossing all the Tees and dotting all the iiiii, as long as the story or plot is easily told and seen in these bubble on this diagram.
That the HS of the Father is part of his composition and he uses it, extends this intelligent energy and power for his purpose into creation.
When it comes down to knowing the minutia, the entire composition of the energies and spirits comprising the the entire Spirit structure of the Father, this undertaking is beyond our complete understanding. We can experience ii in forms and levels in our lives of course as we cannot science it, or understand it as a science project. Modelling it if you will...and being of a science and engineering background I'm tempted indeed.
Wrangler
Well-known member
The Greek uses the word πνεῦμα which translates in English to Spirit, not wind. Wind does not have its own will. Wind is a product of pressure differential that is outside the control of the air that results as a wind.
Legally and judicially, your personified witness comments have no merit. You would be laughed out of court.
Historically, the only objects that were promoted as knowing the things of God were graven images. Do you esteem objects that way?
e v e
Well-known member
God has male and female attributes ...
His hands
His Spirit per OT is feminine...
and His Son is Christ..
and we are made in their image ..
thank you for not ignoring me APAK.
APAK
Active member
I agree with your assessment....there's a lot more detail involved of course and a topic not usually discussed that much. God is a balanced and neutrally charged and attractive spirit indeed if I can use some EM/power jargon
e v e
Well-known member
the evil realm, because of adam, copied every eden concept, and that will end now. So I would not say 'neutral' (see below about the ITs as to why) but lightning's a good analogy you made. the EM plasma torus related to the current reality however is the evil realm's copy, being the mimic realm.
the enemy realm has a concept of the soul as an IT (without any signature of a he or she or individual qualities - souless)... and transferred their type soul concept to God... That is the nature of demons: having no signature.
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e v e
Well-known member
what i said in previous post - it's a topic that is not allowed in adam's church = modern christianity....
the last thing adam and his esaus want is for souls to go Home.. so. esau, as pastors, misled souls.
APAK
Active member
For those, or one, that I see might be a little confused, between a personification of the Spirit of God and an analogy of it, here is the same example I already gave and logged.
(Joh 3:8) The wind blows where it wills, and you hear its sound, but do not know from where it comes and where it goes. So is every one that is born of the Spirit. (NEV)
The use of the term 'wind' with a few of its characteristics given by Jesus in this verse is an analogy for the Spirit (of God) and not a personification of human traits for the Spirit of God as there is none given in this example.
The wind is uncontrollable to us, invisible, felt or experienced and yet its course and source is unknown or not readily apparent - as with the Spirit of God. One invisible 'it' or thing is used to analogize another invisible 'it.' Logical and well understood. Believers experience this spiritual wind of the Father God every moment of their lives, whether sensed or not, registered or not, from or via the spirit of the Son within their human spirit, right into and through their heart. Talk about a spiritual bonding action.
Now I wonder why a brief basic science/physics explanation for how wind forms was requires at all. It is irrelevant here. Is someone trying to show off....?
If this person wants a lesson in that department I can give it, in a different forum, as my background was in Aerospace and Astronautical engineering. I hope this person understands boundary layer theory, thermodynamics, heat transfer and aerodynamics, with gradients at various temperatures. And maybe chuck in the Coriolis effect that influences much higher altitude forms of air movements. Why not give the entire picture for free....
Now an example of the personification of the Spirit, and there are many in scripture OT and NT
(Eph 5:18) And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit. (NEV)
Fill up and get drunk on the Spirit rather that wine. The Spirit is associated with a human activity of getting drunk. Personification...
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And with this one openly defiant soul, at least, that defies the truth and does not even consider that the Spirit of God is not an independent 'person.' that cannot be logically concluded within scripture. 'It' this Spirit, this holy and divine Spirit, is part of the Father God. Loud ridicule and stomping ones feet is all that is done to try and deafen the truth from the ears. Good luck with that....This is no cure for this spiritual disease.
---oh well what else is new--------------
(Joh 3:8) The wind blows where it wills, and you hear its sound, but do not know from where it comes and where it goes. So is every one that is born of the Spirit. (NEV)
The use of the term 'wind' with a few of its characteristics given by Jesus in this verse is an analogy for the Spirit (of God) and not a personification of human traits for the Spirit of God as there is none given in this example.
The wind is uncontrollable to us, invisible, felt or experienced and yet its course and source is unknown or not readily apparent - as with the Spirit of God. One invisible 'it' or thing is used to analogize another invisible 'it.' Logical and well understood. Believers experience this spiritual wind of the Father God every moment of their lives, whether sensed or not, registered or not, from or via the spirit of the Son within their human spirit, right into and through their heart. Talk about a spiritual bonding action.
Now I wonder why a brief basic science/physics explanation for how wind forms was requires at all. It is irrelevant here. Is someone trying to show off....?
If this person wants a lesson in that department I can give it, in a different forum, as my background was in Aerospace and Astronautical engineering. I hope this person understands boundary layer theory, thermodynamics, heat transfer and aerodynamics, with gradients at various temperatures. And maybe chuck in the Coriolis effect that influences much higher altitude forms of air movements. Why not give the entire picture for free....
Now an example of the personification of the Spirit, and there are many in scripture OT and NT
(Eph 5:18) And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit. (NEV)
Fill up and get drunk on the Spirit rather that wine. The Spirit is associated with a human activity of getting drunk. Personification...
------------------------------------------
And with this one openly defiant soul, at least, that defies the truth and does not even consider that the Spirit of God is not an independent 'person.' that cannot be logically concluded within scripture. 'It' this Spirit, this holy and divine Spirit, is part of the Father God. Loud ridicule and stomping ones feet is all that is done to try and deafen the truth from the ears. Good luck with that....This is no cure for this spiritual disease.
---oh well what else is new--------------
Let's see from how many truths of the Holy Spirit you run away from:
John 3:8 uses the word πνεῦμα which translates in English to Spirit, not wind. Wind does not have its own will. Wind is a product of pressure differential that is outside the control of the air that results as a wind. You run away from all that and just talk about the Holy Spirit's invisible attributes which is a non sequitur.
Legally and judicially, your personified witness comments about Acts 5:32 have no merit. Only an actual person qualifies as a witness, not a personalized object. You would be laughed out of court.
1 Cor 2:11 says that the Spirit of God knows the things of God. Historically, the only objects that were promoted as knowing the things of God were graven images. Are you into esteeming objects that way?
You need to address and stop running away from your deficient Greek linguistic, legal, judicial, and historical misunderstandings.
APAK
Active member
Update: scripture that supports the omnipresence of the Father via his Spirit.
(Psa 139:7) Where could I go from Your Spirit? Or where could I flee from Your presence?
(Psa 139:8) If I ascend up into heaven, You are there. If I make my bed in Sheol, behold, You are there!
No extra-scriptural person called the Holy Spirit here, except for the Father's Spirit....
(Psa 139:7) Where could I go from Your Spirit? Or where could I flee from Your presence?
(Psa 139:8) If I ascend up into heaven, You are there. If I make my bed in Sheol, behold, You are there!
No extra-scriptural person called the Holy Spirit here, except for the Father's Spirit....
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APAK
Active member
Edit by admin
John 3:8 is not the typical verse where πνεῦμα (pneuma) is used. Think man, think....
John 3:8 N-NNS
GRK: τὸ πνεῦμα ὅπου θέλει
NAS: The wind blows where
KJV: The wind bloweth where
INT: The wind where it wills
John 3:34 N-ANS
GRK: δίδωσιν τὸ πνεῦμα
NAS: for He gives the Spirit without
KJV: giveth not the Spirit by measure
INT: he gives the Spirit
Yes, the majority of time it is translated as spirit. How would it sound if Jesus said :
(Joh 3:8) The spirit blows where it wills, and you hear its sound, but do not know from where it comes and where it goes. So is every one that is born of the Spirit. (NEV)
Do you want to change this verse with spirit instead of wind. Nuts!
Now go get an ice cream and stop annoying this thread and me with your annoying whine. Try to be more productive and a team player of say an opposing side if you wish.
You can differ and communicate it with some class and finesse doing it... that may be Greek to you as well...and they you lack these Greek skills...
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Carry on with thinking that it's the wind and not the Spirit that has its own will. Edit by adminEdit by admin
John 3:8 is not the typical verse where πνεῦμα (pneuma) is used. Think man, think....
John 3:8 N-NNS
GRK: τὸ πνεῦμα ὅπου θέλει
NAS: The wind blows where
KJV: The wind bloweth where
INT: The wind where it wills
John 3:34 N-ANS
GRK: δίδωσιν τὸ πνεῦμα
NAS: for He gives the Spirit without
KJV: giveth not the Spirit by measure
INT: he gives the Spirit
Yes, the majority of time it is translated as spirit. How would it sound if Jesus said :
(Joh 3:8) The spirit blows where it wills, and you hear its sound, but do not know from where it comes and where it goes. So is every one that is born of the Spirit. (NEV)
Do you want to change this verse with spirit instead of wind. Nuts!
Now go get an ice cream and stop annoying this thread and me with your annoying whine. Try to be more productive and a team player of say an opposing side if you wish.
You can differ and communicate it with some class and finesse doing it... that may be Greek to you as well...and they you lack these Greek skills...
Furthermore, you continue to run away from Acts 5:32 and 1 Cor 2:11.
Legally and judicially, your personified witness comments about Acts 5:32 have no merit. Only an actual person qualifies as a witness, not a personified object. You would be laughed out of court.
1 Cor 2:11 says that the Spirit of God knows the things of God. Historically, the only objects that were promoted as knowing the things of God were graven images. Are you into esteeming objects that way?
You need to address and stop running away from your deficient aerodynamic, Greek, legal, judicial, and historical misunderstandings.
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civic
Well-known member
Jesus makes His case on the 3 witnesses principle in John 5- the Father, Holy Spirit, John the Baptist and Moses.
Obviously Jesus is calling the Holy Spirit a person above as a witness just like the Father, John and Moses are witnesses and not each other but distinct witnesses.
This is called nothing but eisegesis reading ones own ideas/theology into scripture.
We are using EXEGESIS letting the Bible interpret itself and building our Theology through Gods plain meaning in the text
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Edit I admin is willing to sacrifice our judicial witness system, our anti graven images beliefs, and his aerodynamic training all on the altar of unitarianism. Wow!
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