How are God and Jesus the same, but different?

[Matthias]

“Tritheism rejects the idea of one God. In Tritheism God the Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit are three separate gods. … This view is often stated as though it is what Trinitarians believe. But this is not the case.“

https://www.blueletterbible.org/faq/don_stewart/don_stewart_340.cfm

 

[Diserner]

Find me one systematic theology used in seminary that supports God is 3 beings.

I don't think the point I made logically necessitates finding that.

So it would be a waste of time either way.

 

[Diserner]

“Tritheism rejects the idea of one God. In Tritheism God the Father, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit are three separate gods. … This view is often stated as though it is what Trinitarians believe. But this is not the case.“

The way I would create a clear differentiation, is to say there is no unity of essence.

As long you don't go there, you are not a Tritheist in my book.

 

[civic]

I don't think finding that logically necessitates the point I made.

So it would be a waste of time either way.

I can guarantee you there is no catholic or protestant systematic theology that would eve say 3 beings is acceptable instead of 1 Being.

 

[Diserner]

I can guarantee you there is no catholic or protestant systematic theology that would eve say 3 beings is acceptable instead of 1 Being.

I don't really care, and it doesn't touch on the point I made.

Except that we should strive to use technical definitions, and I already made that point anyway.

 

[martin]

I find Trinitarians too skittish to emphasis the differentiation of Persons.

Many go so far as to say God has one will, which violates the definition of Person.

We have a lot of Semi-Modalism in Trinitarian theology.

What constitutes the One being with God ?

What makes the Persons distinct ?

 

[Matthias]

yes its huge its 3 gods.

It surely is.

Are you surprised that a trinitarian ministry has this article, written by one of their editorial staff, posted on their website?

This trinitarian ministry is, for reasons unknown to me, teaching those who come to their website in search of Bible study tools, that the Trinity is three gods.

I find that ironic. But more than ironic, alarming.

I recall that you said previously that you aren’t your brother’s keeper.

If this ministry was unitarian rather than trinitarian [is it really trinitarian? Their statement of faith would lead me to believe that it is] would you be outraged enough to say something to them about it? (If I was a trinitarian, I would.)

Trinitarians are often accused of worshipping three gods. A trinitarian ministry posting an article promoting a belief in three gods, under the guise of being trinitarian, doesn’t help the trinitarian apology.

I wonder - if someone brought the matter to the attention of this ministry, would they review the article and post a retraction? If they did, wouldn’t that be in the best interest of trinitarianism?

 

[Matthias]

I can guarantee you there is no catholic or protestant systematic theology that would eve say 3 beings is acceptable instead of 1 Being.

My support probably doesn’t mean much but, fwiw, I agree with you about that.

 

[Diserner]

What constitutes the One being with God ?

What makes the Persons distinct ?

Excellent questions.

The attributes of God constitute the one being of God.

The distinction of the person is an actual differentiation in the personal experience of God into three.

 

[Diserner]

My support probably doesn’t mean much but, fwiw, I agree with you about that.

Appeal to authority fallacy is just silly when talking about strictly logic.

But hey.

Never stopped anyone before, lol.

 

[Diserner]

A trinitarian ministry posting an article promoting a belief in three gods, under the guise of being trinitarian, doesn’t help the trinitarian apology.

I guarantee you aren't scouring the internet writing objection letters to every Unitarian you have disagreements with.

But hey, double standards are really easy, aren't they.

 

[civic]

It surely is.

Are you surprised that a trinitarian ministry has this article, written by one of their editorial staff, posted on their website?

This trinitarian ministry is, for reasons unknown to me, teaching those who come to their website in search of Bible study tools, that the Trinity is three gods.

I find that ironic. But more than ironic, alarming.

I recall that you said previously that you aren’t your brother’s keeper.

If this ministry was unitarian rather than trinitarian [is it really trinitarian? Their statement of faith would lead me to believe that it is] would you be outraged enough to say something to them about it? (If I was a trinitarian, I would.)

Trinitarians are often accused of worshipping three gods. A trinitarian ministry posting an article promoting a belief in three gods, under the guise of being trinitarian, doesn’t help the trinitarian apology.

I wonder - if someone brought the matter to the attention of this ministry, would they review the article and post a retraction? If they did, wouldn’t that be in the best interest of trinitarianism?

I understand your concern but I would be talking to the wall. They don’t care since it’s on their website. We have a website too where we have stated Christian doctrine as far as what we believe is true to Christianity. It’s just 2 of us who post that material. I can only influence where I have influence and it’s not on their website. I have influence with my family , friends and church and here. They need to address that internally. It’s like many Protestant churches that are caving to the culture and leaving sound biblical and historical doctrine. You have to be a member or leader within to have influence not an outsider.

 

[civic]

I guarantee you aren't scouring the internet writing objection letters to every Unitarian you have disagreements with.

But hey, double standards are really easy, aren't they.

Ditto

 

[Matthias]

I guarantee you aren't scouring the internet writing objection letters to every Unitarian you have disagreements with.

You might have me on a technicality, but I have written objection letters to some unitarian ministries that I have disagreements with. More I often, I‘ve met with them in person.

In the unlikely event that I ever learn about a unitarian ministry that is teaching that unitarians believe in three gods, I’ll be on them like hair on a gorilla!

But hey, double standards are really easy, aren't they.

 

[Matthias]

I understand your concern but I would be talking to the wall. They don’t care since it’s on their website. We have a website too where we have stated Christian doctrine as far as what we believe is true to Christianity. It’s just 2 of us who post that material. I can only influence where I have influence and it’s not on their website. I have influence with my family , friends and church and here. They need to address that internally. It’s like many Protestant churches that are caving to the culture and leaving sound biblical and historical doctrine. You have to be a member or leader within to have influence not an outsider.

Let it ride then. I may write to them myself. I love irony, and I often find myself defending trinitarianism against “trinitarians”. Somewhere, my trinitarian professors are smiling, and groaning.

It shouldn’t fall on the shoulders of a Jewish monotheist to defend trinitarianism. But it does.

 

[Matthias]

Do I need to bring up any of the other shocking things said about the Trinity in this “trinitarian“ article? Or is this a wrap?

 

[civic]

Do I need to bring up any of the other shocking things said about the Trinity in this “trinitarian“ article? Or is this a wrap?

go ahead

 

[Matthias]

go ahead

What good do you think it would do?

 

[civic]

What good do you think it would do?

To see if they are off on other aspects or not.

 

[Matthias]

To see if they are off on other aspects or not.

I’ve already seen that they are. Wouldn’t it be better if others saw it for themselves?

Another whack at a dead trinitarian horse by a Jewish monotheist isn’t going to be pretty, or persuasive.