How are God and Jesus the same, but different?

[praise_yeshua]

His body was dead -> you

He was dead -> scripture

Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

I can read the Scriptures. You are wrong. As @Fred has mentioned. Jesus gave up "his spirit".

Joh 19:30 When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, “It is finished,” and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.

Jewish monotheism -> There is no God besides the God and Father of the Messiah. Everything else is idolatry.

You believe Jesus is God.

 

[civic]

Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

I can read the Scriptures. You are wrong. As @Fred has mentioned. Jesus gave up "his spirit".

Joh 19:30 When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, “It is finished,” and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.


You believe Jesus is God.

Yes like Stephen who upon his own death called out to God ( Christ ) receive my spirit- absent with the body, present with the Lord. Exactly what Jesus said/taught- into you hands ( Father ) I commit My spirit.

 

[Matthias]

Eph 4:9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth?

I can read the Scriptures. You are wrong. As @Fred has mentioned. Jesus gave up "his spirit".

When a person gives up his or her spirit, he or she is dead.

Joh 19:30 When Jesus had received the sour wine, he said, “It is finished,” and he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.

When he did, he became as dead as a door nail.

You believe Jesus is God.

So?

 

[Fred]

When he did, he became as dead a door nail.

Luke 23:43

 

[civic]

When a person gives up his or her spirit, he or she is dead.



When he did, he became as dead as a door nail.



So?

yikes soul sleep

 

[praise_yeshua]

When a person gives up his or her spirit, he or she is dead.



When he did, he became as dead as a door nail.



So?

I see that you're ignoring the Scriptures posted. Are you going to appeal to Trinitarian commentary to dispute what I said?

 

[Matthias]

I see that you're ignoring the Scriptures posted.

You’ve seen no such thing. As I said, we use the same scripture. We don’t interpret / understand them the same way.

Are you going to appeal to Trinitarian commentary to dispute what I said?

Would it persuade you to change your mind if I did?

 

[praise_yeshua]

You’ve seen no such thing. As I said, we use the same scripture. We don’t interpret / understand them the same way.

You did. You ignored Eph 4:9 and the fact that the Jesus Christ gave up the Spirit.

Would it persuade you to change your mind if I did?

It didn't stop you last time from insisting that it is necessary.

 

[Matthias]

Meanwhile, orthodoxy is still teaching us that Jesus is not a human person.

Not many are listening, not many are believing what orthodoxy is teaching about the person of Jesus the Christ, but millions are sitting in her congregation.

 

[Matthias]

You did. You ignored Eph 4:9 and the fact that the Jesus Christ gave up the Spirit.

I’ve already addressed your comment.

It didn't stop you last time from insisting that it is necessary.

I didn’t say that it is necessary. I have said that it is one of my best weapons.

Do you know of any trinitarians who disagree with your understanding / belief about what happens when we die?

 

[Matthias]

What would people who believe “Jesus is God” - in the highest sense of the word - say if the trinitarian author of the article linked in the OP had titled her article -> “How are God and God the same, but different?”

 

[praise_yeshua]

I’ve already addressed your comment.

Nope. "Hand waves" don't count.

I didn’t say that it is necessary. I have said that it is one of my best weapons.

You've consistently given the impression that you insist Orthodoxy is YOUR choice. In fact, I believe you didn't realize that someone would call you out on your contradiction. You got trapped in your own words.

Do you know of any trinitarians who disagree with your understanding / belief about what happens when we die?

I haven't shared everything I believe about death with most Trinitarians. You're forcing a subjective response here. You should narrow your request.

 

[Matthias]

You've consistently given the impression that you insist Orthodoxy is YOUR choice.

My choice for what?

In fact, I believe you didn't realize that someone would call you out on your contradiction. You got trapped in your own words.

I don’t know what you’re talking about.

I haven't shared everything I believe about death with most Trinitarians. You're forcing a subjective response here. You should narrow your request.

I’m not forcing any response at all. I just asked you if you knew any trinitarians who disagreed with your understanding of what happens to us when we die. I was looking for a simple yes, no, or no answer to the question.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Orthodoxy comes from man, not from God.

Yup - it's like "Morals", which are nothing more that the "Majority opinion du jour" about things.

HOWEVER, there IS an ABSOLUTE ORTHODOXY which DOES originate with God, and is reflected in the REAL "One true Church of Jesus CHrist". No earthly church organization is the "One true church". Some are closer to it than others, and it's members can be found in different levels of concentration in most "Visible church organizations".

 

[civic]

I see that you're ignoring the Scriptures posted. Are you going to appeal to Trinitarian commentary to dispute what I said?

No surprises there my friend

 

[praise_yeshua]

Yup - it's like "Morals", which are nothing more that the "Majority opinion du jour" about things.

HOWEVER, there IS an ABSOLUTE ORTHODOXY which DOES originate with God, and is reflected in the REAL "One true Church of Jesus CHrist". No earthly church organization is the "One true church". Some are closer to it than others, and it's members can be found in different levels of concentration in most "Visible church organizations".

Orthodoxy reflected by the Scriptures.

 

[APAK]

Well I may as well add my 2 cents into this Thread, especially since the self-styled Trini Gang (SS-TG) have split for now.

So where/how is God and Jesus the same and also different.

A couple of clear examples: they are same in perfect union in purpose (the Father and I are one). This became completely fused in power after Yahshua's baptism.

They are completely different in spirit, personality, and being. Jesus is not the source and author of life, the Father God is this source and giver of all life. Jesus could not perform, then and today, and tomorrow, miracles w/o the power of the Father God's Spirit and word that works within him.

I wonder if the SS-TG can really define what/who is a person/personality, a being, especially as these entities pertain and are crucial to their model of worship.

And then how can these persons/being(s)/form(s) become integrated/inter-formed/transformed/in-synchronization as, and into the same triune God?

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Orthodoxy reflected by the Scriptures.

Absolutely - BUT NOT necessarily in "Denominational paradigms" about the Scriptures.

 

[Behold]

They are completely different in spirit, personality, and being.

"God is A Spirit'
"Jesus is That Spirit".

Each Believer is the "temple of the Holy Spirit", and that is "Christ IN YOU, the Hope of Glory". which is.. "He that hath not the Spirit of God (in you) is none of God's).

"God raised Jesus from the Dead".. = Jesus said, "I have the power to lay down my life and i have the Power to take it up again". (Resurrection).
= "Jesus is the Resurrections and the Life".
Jesus said "all that believe in me i give unto you ETERNAL Life".
Jesus said, "i came to give you LIFE, and that more abundantly", = not just power over sin but Eternal Life, itself., because Jesus who is "Christ in you" is "The Way , The Truth, and The LIFE".

Jesus is not the source and author of life,

= "Jesus is the Resurrections and the Life".
Jesus said "all that believe in me i give unto you ETERNAL Life".
Jesus said, "i came to give you LIFE, and that more abundantly", = not just power over sin but Eternal Life, itself., because Jesus who is "Christ in you" is "The Way , The Truth, and The LIFE".