Favoritism in Unconditional Election

[brightfame52]

If faith is a work, then you worked for yours.

Are you really that lost in this?

There is no scenario where faith becomes a work. By definition. Faith is never a work.

If its of conditions you must meet, its no longer grace ! Its works

 

[praise_yeshua]

What is wrong with you?

You stated that he was being restricted when he wasn't. That is what is wrong with you.

 

[praise_yeshua]

If its of conditions you must meet, its no longer grace ! Its works

What I thought....

 

[praise_yeshua]

Why do you continually make things about the person to whom you are responding?

Because it is always relative. In this particular case, you're saying it is already accomplished when it is nothing more than prejudged.

I would think you should be able to recognize it because you are doing it yourself.

You and your friend are just going in circles. You're making circular arguments. Nothing you're saying is establishing the realty of your conclusions.

 

[brightfame52]

What I thought....

Take heed friend

 

[civic]

If its of conditions you must meet, it’s no longer grace ! Its works. See works and conditions are the same, synonyms

Fallacy alert faith is not a work but somehow only Calvinists make faith a work- how ironic

Next

 

[praise_yeshua]

Joh 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Joh 12:47 And if any man hear my words, and believe not, I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world, but to save the world.

46 I a light to the world have come, that every one who is believing in me -- in the darkness may not remain; 47 and if any one may hear my sayings, and not believe, I -- I do not judge him, for I came not that I might judge the world, but that I might save the world. 48 `He who is rejecting me, and not receiving my sayings, hath one who is judging him, the word that I spake, that will judge him in the last day, 49 because I spake not from myself, but the Father who sent me, He did give me a command, what I may say, and what I may speak, 50 and I have known that His command is life age-during; what, therefore, I speak, according as the Father hath said to me, so I speak.'

 

[brightfame52]

Fallacy alert faith is not a work but somehow only Calvinists make faith a work- how ironic

Next

If its of conditions you must meet, it’s no longer grace ! Its works. See works and conditions are the same, synonyms.

 

[praise_yeshua]

46 I a light to the world have come, that every one who is believing in me -- in the darkness may not remain; 47 and if any one may hear my sayings, and not believe, I -- I do not judge him, for I came not that I might judge the world, but that I might save the world. 48 `He who is rejecting me, and not receiving my sayings, hath one who is judging him, the word that I spake, that will judge him in the last day, 49 because I spake not from myself, but the Father who sent me, He did give me a command, what I may say, and what I may speak, 50 and I have known that His command is life age-during; what, therefore, I speak, according as the Father hath said to me, so I speak.'

I knew all the verses before I posted vs 47. I shared vs 47 because it is relative. Posting all the verses doesn't change anything. Jesus came not to judge but to save.

You're selling deception. Nothing you've said matches the verses you posted here.

 

[praise_yeshua]

46 I a light to the world have come, that every one who is believing in me -- in the darkness may not remain; 47 and if any one may hear my sayings, and not believe, I -- I do not judge him, for I came not that I might judge the world, but that I might save the world. 48 `He who is rejecting me, and not receiving my sayings, hath one who is judging him, the word that I spake, that will judge him in the last day, 49 because I spake not from myself, but the Father who sent me, He did give me a command, what I may say, and what I may speak, 50 and I have known that His command is life age-during; what, therefore, I speak, according as the Father hath said to me, so I speak.'

Oh. BTW. Confirmation of PREJUDGED.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Fallacy alert faith is not a work but somehow only Calvinists make faith a work- how ironic

Next

Anything you do is a work. The word in Greek that is translated "to do" is the same word that is translated "work".

When Philippians 2:13 says "to will and to do" the words "to do" are literally "to work".

12 So that, my beloved, as ye always obey, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, with fear and trembling your own salvation work out, 13 for God it is who is working in you both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

So if faith is something you must do, it is a work.

 

[Johann]

46 I a light to the world have come, that every one who is believing in me -- in the darkness may not remain; 47 and if any one may hear my sayings, and not believe, I -- I do not judge him, for I came not that I might judge the world, but that I might save the world. 48 `He who is rejecting me, and not receiving my sayings, hath one who is judging him, the word that I spake, that will judge him in the last day, 49 because I spake not from myself, but the Father who sent me, He did give me a command, what I may say, and what I may speak, 50 and I have known that His command is life age-during; what, therefore, I speak, according as the Father hath said to me, so I speak.'

And the context--

In this section of John's Gospel, Jesus is speaking to a crowd of people in Jerusalem shortly before His crucifixion. He declares Himself to be the light of the world (John 12:46), emphasizing that His coming brings illumination and salvation to those who believe in Him. He contrasts belief in Him with remaining in darkness, indicating that faith in Him leads to deliverance from spiritual darkness and condemnation.

Jesus then addresses the response of those who hear His words but do not believe. He states that He does not judge them (John 12:47) because His primary purpose in coming into the world was not to condemn but to save (John 3:17). However, He acknowledges that there will be judgment for those who reject Him and His teachings. He asserts that His words will serve as the basis for judgment on the last day (John 12:48), indicating that those who reject Him are ultimately judged by the truth of His message.

Jesus emphasizes the authority of His message by stating that His words are not His own but come from the Father who sent Him (John 12:49). He affirms His obedience to the Father's command, recognizing that His words are the source of eternal life (John 12:50). Thus, Jesus speaks with divine authority, conveying the Father's message of salvation to humanity.

In summary, this passage highlights Jesus' role as the light of the world and emphasizes the importance of belief in Him for salvation. It also underscores the accountability of those who hear His message but reject it, as they will be judged based on the truth of His words on the last day.

 

[praise_yeshua]

And the context--

In this section of John's Gospel, Jesus is speaking to a crowd of people in Jerusalem shortly before His crucifixion. He declares Himself to be the light of the world (John 12:46), emphasizing that His coming brings illumination and salvation to those who believe in Him. He contrasts belief in Him with remaining in darkness, indicating that faith in Him leads to deliverance from spiritual darkness and condemnation.

Jesus then addresses the response of those who hear His words but do not believe. He states that He does not judge them (John 12:47) because His primary purpose in coming into the world was not to condemn but to save (John 3:17). However, He acknowledges that there will be judgment for those who reject Him and His teachings. He asserts that His words will serve as the basis for judgment on the last day (John 12:48), indicating that those who reject Him are ultimately judged by the truth of His message.

Jesus emphasizes the authority of His message by stating that His words are not His own but come from the Father who sent Him (John 12:49). He affirms His obedience to the Father's command, recognizing that His words are the source of eternal life (John 12:50). Thus, Jesus speaks with divine authority, conveying the Father's message of salvation to humanity.

In summary, this passage highlights Jesus' role as the light of the world and emphasizes the importance of belief in Him for salvation. It also underscores the accountability of those who hear His message but reject it, as they will be judged based on the truth of His words on the last day.

You can certainly copy and paste rather quickly.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Oh. BTW. Confirmation of PREJUDGED.

Yes, it is prejudged, or judged permanently in the past, because by default we are all deserving of judgement. It is only those God births from above according to His mercy who are exempted from judgement.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

And the context--

In this section of John's Gospel, Jesus is speaking to a crowd of people in Jerusalem shortly before His crucifixion. He declares Himself to be the light of the world (John 12:46), emphasizing that His coming brings illumination and salvation to those who believe in Him. He contrasts belief in Him with remaining in darkness, indicating that faith in Him leads to deliverance from spiritual darkness and condemnation.

Jesus then addresses the response of those who hear His words but do not believe. He states that He does not judge them (John 12:47) because His primary purpose in coming into the world was not to condemn but to save (John 3:17). However, He acknowledges that there will be judgment for those who reject Him and His teachings. He asserts that His words will serve as the basis for judgment on the last day (John 12:48), indicating that those who reject Him are ultimately judged by the truth of His message.

Jesus emphasizes the authority of His message by stating that His words are not His own but come from the Father who sent Him (John 12:49). He affirms His obedience to the Father's command, recognizing that His words are the source of eternal life (John 12:50). Thus, Jesus speaks with divine authority, conveying the Father's message of salvation to humanity.

In summary, this passage highlights Jesus' role as the light of the world and emphasizes the importance of belief in Him for salvation. It also underscores the accountability of those who hear His message but reject it, as they will be judged based on the truth of His words on the last day.

Also, it is important to note "is rejecting" and "not receiving", which are states of being, just as "is believing" is a state.

 

[civic]

Anything you do is a work. The word in Greek that is translated "to do" is the same word that is translated "work".

When Philippians 2:13 says "to will and to do" the words "to do" are literally "to work".

12 So that, my beloved, as ye always obey, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, with fear and trembling your own salvation work out, 13 for God it is who is working in you both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

So if faith is something you must do, it is a work.

Nope and faith without works is dead.

So you just admitted your faith is a dead faith.

Next

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Nope and faith without works is dead.

So you just admitted your faith is a dead faith.

Next

You are applying something required after you are saved to something before you are saved. If you claim to have faith (saved) but have no works, then your faith is dead.

That has nothing to do with saying faith is something you must do in order to be saved. That makes it a work, which nullifies grace.

 

[The Rogue Tomato]

Nope and faith without works is dead.

So you just admitted your faith is a dead faith.

Next

Again, you are making it about the person to whom you are responding. We're discussing scripture, not each other.

 

[Johann]

Anything you do is a work. The word in Greek that is translated "to do" is the same word that is translated "work".

When Philippians 2:13 says "to will and to do" the words "to do" are literally "to work".

12 So that, my beloved, as ye always obey, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, with fear and trembling your own salvation work out, 13 for God it is who is working in you both to will and to work for His good pleasure.

So if faith is something you must do, it is a work.

Brother-let's see if you agree here-
In the context of salvation, faith is often distinguished from works in Scripture, particularly in passages such as Ephesians 2:8-9, where it is emphasized that salvation is "by grace... through faith" and "not by works." However, there are some passages where faith is described in terms that could be interpreted as "work." Here are a few:

John 6:28-29 (NIV): "Then they asked him, 'What must we do to do the works God requires?' Jesus answered, 'The work of God is this: to believe in the one he has sent.'" In this passage, Jesus equates believing in Him with the work of God. While faith is not typically considered a "work" in the sense of meritorious human effort, Jesus here presents it as an action required by God.

1 Thessalonians 1:3 (NIV): "We remember before our God and Father your work produced by faith, your labor prompted by love, and your endurance inspired by hope in our Lord Jesus Christ." In this verse, Paul commends the Thessalonian believers for their work produced by faith. While faith itself is not a "work" in the sense of human effort to earn salvation, it can lead to works of obedience and service in the Christian life.

James 2:14, 17-18 (NIV): "What good is it, my brothers and sisters, if someone claims to have faith but has no deeds?... In the same way, faith by itself, if it is not accompanied by action, is dead. But someone will say, 'You have faith; I have deeds.' Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds."

here presents a view of faith that is inseparable from works. While faith itself is not a "work" in the sense of earning salvation, genuine faith will naturally result in actions that demonstrate its reality.

These passages emphasize the relationship between faith and action, highlighting the importance of a living, active faith that produces fruit in the life of the believer. While faith itself is not a "work" in the sense of meritorious human effort, it is often described in terms of action or response to God's grace.

Hebrews 11:6 (NIV): "And without faith it is impossible to please God, because anyone who comes to him must believe that he exists and that he rewards those who earnestly seek him." This verse emphasizes the necessity of faith in approaching God and receiving His rewards. While faith itself is not a "work" in the sense of earning salvation, it is presented here as an active pursuit of God, requiring effort and earnest seeking.

Galatians 5:6 (NIV): "For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love." In this verse, Paul emphasizes that what matters is not outward rituals or observances, but faith that is expressed through love. While faith itself is not a "work" in the sense of meritorious human effort, it is described here as active and dynamic, leading to expressions of love and obedience.

These passages underscore the active nature of faith and its role in the life of the believer. While faith is not a "work" in the sense of human effort to earn salvation, it is often described in terms of action, response, and expression in the Christian life.

God bless.