Christendom's Trinity: Where Did It Come From?

[amazing grace]

They are one in the nature of being God amazing grace.
The word "God" is not the personal name of the Father, it is His divine nature. (Rom 1:20, Acts 17:29)

The testimony of TWO people is true . . . Jesus is one who bears witness about himself and the Father who sent him bears witness about him . . . If Jesus is God and the Father is God and here they are referenced as two separate and distinct individuals does that equal two gods? If not, why not?

So, we are to understand John 8:16-18 as reading/meaning "the testimony of TWO 'in nature of being God' is true . . . . I, Jesus, bear witness about myself ----- my nature and the nature of my Father bears witness about me."

What about the law from the OT which Jesus is referencing? A single witness shall not suffice against a person for any crime or for any wrong in connection with any offense that he has committed. Only on the evidence of two witnesses or of three witnesses shall a charge be established. Is it meant in the same manner, i.e. in reference of 'divine nature'? Is that how the Jews would have understood this law? Did Paul also have this same understanding when he referenced this in 2 Cor. 13:1 - I don't believe so.

 

[Runningman]

Classical Jews do interpret Psalms 45 refers to the Jewish Messiah Runningman, see Wikipedia below.

According to classical Jewish sources, Psalm 45 refers to the Jewish Messiah. According to Metzudot, a classical Jewish commentary, the king mentioned in verse 2 is the Jewish Messiah. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psalm_45.

If the one called "God" in that verses is king Solomon, do you believe that he is really God Runningman?

There are too many Jewish commentaries to quote where they believe Psalm 45:6,7 is about king Solomon

[Psalms 45:6] THY THRONE, O GOD, IS FOR EVER AND EVER: THE SCEPTRE OF THY KINGDOM IS A RIGHT SCEPTRE.
<<THY THRONE, O GOD>>: This is also explained from the Hebrew as referring to the Messiah whose throne is like the throne of God just as the throne of King Solomon was called the throne of God.
"THEN SOLOMON SAT ON THE THRONE OF THE LORD AS KING INSTEAD OF DAVID HIS FATHER, AND PROSPERED; AND ALL ISRAEL OBEYED HIM" [1-Chronicles 29:23].

source: https://britam.org/psalms/psalms45.html

Jews don't translate Psalm 45:6 (Psalm 45:7 in the Jewish Bible) as a reference to a god because Trinitarians have confused the issue with their translation: https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16266/jewish/Chapter-45.htm

Tehillim (Psalms) - Chapter 45
7Your throne, O judge, [will exist] forever and ever; the scepter of equity is the scepter of your kingdom.
8You loved righteousness and you hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, anointed you with oil of joy from among your peers.

 

[Capbook]

So, we are to understand John 8:16-18 as reading/meaning "the testimony of TWO 'in nature of being God' is true . . . . I, Jesus, bear witness about myself ----- my nature and the nature of my Father bears witness about me."

Yes, that Father bears witness to the Son as God.
How many "God" you can read in Heb 1:9 then?
Is the Almighty God the Father calling Jesus as "God" believable as true or not?

If we understand the verses below through context, that would mean if Jesus testifies about Himself outside verse 30, His testimony would not be true.

Joh 5:30 "I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I do not seek My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
Joh 5:31 "If I alone testify about Myself, My testimony is not true.
Joh 5:32 "There is another who testifies of Me, and I know that the testimony which He gives about Me is true.

What about the law from the OT which Jesus is referencing? A single witness shall not suffice against a person for any crime or for any wrong in connection with any offense that he has committed. Only on the evidence of two witnesses or of three witnesses shall a charge be established. Is it meant in the same manner, i.e. in reference of 'divine nature'? Is that how the Jews would have understood this law? Did Paul also have this same understanding when he referenced this in 2 Cor. 13:1 - I don't believe so.

Well, I believe our discussion is about Jesus in the nature of God not about a crime that needs two witnesses.

 

[Capbook]

There are too many Jewish commentaries to quote where they believe Psalm 45:6,7 is about king Solomon

[Psalms 45:6] THY THRONE, O GOD, IS FOR EVER AND EVER: THE SCEPTRE OF THY KINGDOM IS A RIGHT SCEPTRE.
<<THY THRONE, O GOD>>: This is also explained from the Hebrew as referring to the Messiah whose throne is like the throne of God just as the throne of King Solomon was called the throne of God.
"THEN SOLOMON SAT ON THE THRONE OF THE LORD AS KING INSTEAD OF DAVID HIS FATHER, AND PROSPERED; AND ALL ISRAEL OBEYED HIM" [1-Chronicles 29:23].

source: https://britam.org/psalms/psalms45.html

Jews don't translate Psalm 45:6 (Psalm 45:7 in the Jewish Bible) as a reference to a god because Trinitarians have confused the issue with their translation: https://www.chabad.org/library/bible_cdo/aid/16266/jewish/Chapter-45.htm

Tehillim (Psalms) - Chapter 45
7Your throne, O judge, [will exist] forever and ever; the scepter of equity is the scepter of your kingdom.
8You loved righteousness and you hated wickedness; therefore God, your God, anointed you with oil of joy from among your peers.

If Psa 45:6 refers to King Solomon Runningman, then again where in the New Testament the forever and ever throne of King Solomon be found?
And I know that Unitarians can read the word "God" in Heb 1:8,9, twice mentioned in reference to Jesus, and no word about "human."
Apostle Paul had warned us to learn not to exceed to what is written so that we will not become arrogant.

1Co 4:6 Now these things, brethren, I have figuratively applied to myself and Apollos for your sakes, so that in us you may learn not to exceed what is written, so that no one of you will become arrogant in behalf of one against the other.

 

[amazing grace]

Yes, that Father bears witness to the Son as God.

That is NEITHER section of scripture John 5:31-34 nor John 8:16-18 say anything or witness anyone equal to or the same as God. In fact if you read John 8:16-18 which speaks of the testimony of two people being true - one person being Jesus whom you say is 'God' and the other person identified as the Father whom we know is God . . . you have two Gods.

How many "God" you can read in Heb 1:9 then?

One. ---- therefore God, your God.

Is the Almighty God the Father calling Jesus as "God" believable as true or not?

Scripture does call Jesus 'God' in a couple if places; Moses was also called 'God', judges and kings were called 'God' ---- none were the LORD God Almighty. Jesus called Peter 'Satan' [Matt. 16:23] was Peter Satan?

If we understand the verses below through context, that would mean if Jesus testifies about Himself outside verse 30, His testimony would not be true.

Joh 5:30 "I can do nothing on My own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and My judgment is just, because I do not seek My own will, but the will of Him who sent Me.
Joh 5:31 "If I alone testify about Myself, My testimony is not true.
Joh 5:32 "There is another who testifies of Me, and I know that the testimony which He gives about Me is true.

Well, I believe our discussion is about Jesus in the nature of God not about a crime that needs two witnesses.

Yep, the testimony of two ---- Jesus' Father who is God - the one who sent him - gives testimony of his Son, Jesus Christ.------

For the works that the Father has given me to accomplish, the very works that I am doing, bear witness about me that the Father has sent me. [John 5:36b]