An Article on free will

[Jim]

I'm only answering this post since he posted to your question already #6,366.

Jim, Adam sinned using his free will. Sin is as the word of God said~a transgression against the law of God.

1st John 3:4​

“Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.”

God’s inspired definition of sin – the violation of God’s moral code for human conduct. The only true difference in the two clauses here is the use of also in the first. See above. Nearly a restatement of the first clause, John by the Spirit wrote to paint sin accurately. Any laws other than God’s might be questioned in nature or degree, but not God’s.

We sin, because of having inherit from Adam our sinful nature. We are born in captivity to sin, and the devil himself.

The transgression of the law is a choice. It is something that one does. If there is no free will, then there is no choice to either obey or disobey. That is simply the definition.

 

[Kermos]

yet this "god of love" predestines most of his creation to hell without ever giving them any way to escape their fatal end. Your fatalism is unloving just like the god you follow who has no love for most of mankind he created.

your view of john 3:16 is as follows:

for the god of fatalism so loved the whole world that he only will save those he predestined whom he gave his son to die for and those he died for caused them to believe and the other caused them not to believe in the son and never receive eternal life like the others.

hope this helps !!!

As a blessed Christian, I believe in and follow Lord Jesus Christ, who is the Truth (John 14:6), so you calling me a follower of "fatalism" means that you are calling my Leader Jesus your wicked "fatal", a.k.a. "death", and no Christian applies death to Lord Jesus Christ. Lord Jesus Christ is Life!

The Word of God is absolute Truth (John 14:6)! I believe in Lord Jesus Christ!

My brother Paul wrote "it does not depend on the man who wills or the man who runs, but on God who has mercy" (Romans 9:16).

The Apostle Paul is very clear about who causes what in Romans 9:18-23 and for what purpose - see the crucial concepts of "prepared" and "beforehand".

Your statements, civic, parallels the mocker's "Why did you make me like this" (Romans 9:20) where the Apostle Paul wrote:

18 He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.

19 You will say to me then, “Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?” 20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, “Why did you make me like this,” will it? 21Or does not the Potter have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for common use? 22 What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? 23 And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory
(Romans 9:18-23)
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So, faithful, glorious, and graceful Lord and God Jesus Christ fills us vessel of mercy with God's works of mercy which God prepared beforehand for glory!

IN TRUTH, PAUL CONVEYS THAT MAN CANNOT RESIST GOD'S WILL (ROMANS 9:19-20)!

You believe you buy your way into heaven with your fleshly free-will faith payment in your "apart from Christ, I chose to believe Christ so Christ must profit me with salvation", yet the Christ of us Christians declares "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5) and "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God" (John 3:3) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19, includes salvation) and “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “It is the Spirit who gives Life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are Spirit and are Life” (John 6:63), so you believe falsehood (2 Peter 2:1, 2 Peter 2:9-10).

Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men (Matthew 15:9).

In Truth (John 14:6), the Almighty God is Sovereign (Genesis 1:1) in man's salvation and affairs of man (Daniel 4:34-35)! PRAISE KING JESUS CHRIST OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD!!!

 

[Jim]

IN TRUTH, PAUL CONVEYS THAT MAN CANNOT RESIST GOD'S WILL (ROMANS 9:19-20)!

That is certainly a true statement. What, specifically, in the lives of each individual can be assigned to or constrained by God's will is an open question. It certainly is not absolutely everything as you seem to imply. For most it may actually be absolutely nothing.

You believe you buy your way into heaven with your fleshly free-will faith payment in your "apart from Christ, I chose to believe Christ so Christ must profit me with salvation", yet the Christ of us Christians declares "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5) and "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God" (John 3:3) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19, includes salvation) and “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “It is the Spirit who gives Life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are Spirit and are Life” (John 6:63), so you believe falsehood (2 Peter 2:1, 2 Peter 2:9-10).

Believing that one can buy his way into heaven with his fleshly free-will faith payment is a really nasty red herring. The only ones who would even think that way are those who reject God's will, ability and action of creating mankind with free-will to choose to obey or disobey. The very idea that God would establish the Law and then not give the vast majority the ability to obey that Law and then condemn them for disobeying the Law is not only ludicrous, it is an affront to God.

You err in assigning John 15:16,19 to anyone other than the twelve to whom and about whom Jesus was speaking. The entire discourse of John 13-17 was at the last supper with the twelve. It is important to differentiate between Jesus' teaching concerning the twelve and His teaching concerning followers of Christ, generally. The subject of choosing in John 15:16,19 is clearly spoken to the twelve specifically with no indication there that it was spoken of the rest of us.

Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men (Matthew 15:9).

Free-will is a critical defining trait of mankind versus animals in general. Animals have only instinctive behavior as their guiding principles. Man, on the other hand, have limited instinctive behavior and are blessed with free-will to control behavior. It is the reactions of man based upon that free-will which separates those whom God chooses to elect and those He chooses not to elect. That I believe is the very reason that God has created this physical universe and mankind. That is the message of the written one-line response to Cain by God concerning Cain's anger at God's lack of regard for Cain's offering. And that is the message of all of humanity throughout the ages from the very beginning.

Gen 4:7 If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door. Its desire is for you, but you must rule over it."

That statemen by God to Cain is unintelligible in the absence of free-will. It absolutely emphasizes personal responsibility in choosing righteousness over sin. It describes the power of choice in our spiritual lives to obey God.

 

[Kermos]

However, in the meantime, Your thinking that the references in John 15 are for you is rather humorous. Those were spoken to and about the twelve. You ain't one of them.

Let us behold the audience of Lord Jesus Christ saying "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (John 15:16) and "I chose you out of the world" (John 15:19, includes salvation).

By the time Jesus bestows these blessings to all believers in all time, Judas Iscariot departed, so that leaves 11, not your "Those were spoken to and about the twelve", but truly the eleven,, so you are in confusion. Lord Jesus' word of see (righteously perceive) resounds true "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God" (John 3:3) about you, Jim, but more about John 3:3 in post 2 of this series.

At the time Jesus bestows these blessings to all believers in all time, Joseph called Barsabbas (who was also called Justus), and Matthias (Acts 1:21-23) were also present, not your "the twelve apostles", but truly a minimum of 13 persons is contextually established,, so you are in confusion.

At the time Jesus bestows these blessings to all believers in all time (see John 15:16-19), the Lord explained "If they persecuted Me, they will also persecute you" (John 15:20) JUST ONE VERSE AFTER JOHN 15:19, so this word of Christ's is in context with the manner the world persecutes Christians as Christ's words recorded in Mark 13:1-37 including "What I say to you I say to all" (Mark 13:37) THUS CONTEXT EXISTS BETWEEN JOHN 15:16, JOHN 15:19, JOHN 15:20, AND MARK 13:37, so you are in confusion.

You do not keep Lord Jesus Christ!s words recorded in John 15:16-19 because you think that this Word of God is inapplicable to Christians today! Lord Jesus has something to say about people who do not keep Lord Jesus Christ's words "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words" (John 14:23-24).

Friend Of Jesus (John 15:15) Relation To Exclusive Choice By Jesus (John 15:16)​

Lord Jesus immediately adjacently joins persons chosen by Jesus with selfsame persons being friends of Friend Jesus (John 15:15-16).

""I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard from My Father I have made known to you. You did not choose Me but I chose you" (John 15:15-16) says Lord Jesus.
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A friend of Jesus does not choose Jesus, but Jesus does choose the friend of Jesus (John 15:15-16), and a friend of Jesus does what Jesus commands (John 15:14) by the appointment of Jesus (John 15:16) thus being a friend of Jesus by the Christ's choosing (John 15:14-16).
FREE-WILLIANS DISAVOW CHRIST'S WORDS OF "YOU DID NOT CHOOSE ME" (JOHN 15:16) FOR THEMSELVES WHILE AT THE SAME TIME DECLARING THE WORDS AS EXCLUSIVELY APPLICABLE TO THE APOSTLES; THEREFORE, FREE-WILLIANS DENY BEING A FRIEND OF JESUS WHICH JESUS COVERS IN THE SAME SAYINGS OF JESUS.

A friend of Jesus marvels at the glorious exclusive work of God's salvation of man; on the other hand, an enemy of Jesus steals the exclusive glory of man's salvation from God by saying things like "I chose Jesus" or "I accepted Jesus" resulting in the following implications to free-willian philosophy:

• the enemy of Jesus rejects Jesus * Who says Who He is, and Jesus declares Himself Sovereign, the exclusive Controller, in man's salvation.
• the enemy of Jesus does not receive the sayings of Jesus * for the enemy disavows Jesus' sayings about God's exclusive choosing of man (John 15:16, John 15:19 includes salvation).
• the enemy of Jesus thinks the enemy compels God to provide salvation; in other words, the enemy of Jesus thinks that God must obey man's command for salvation to enter the heart of man, also without a man's affirming decision (choosing of Jesus) there is no salvation for the man.
• the enemy of Jesus gets the glory, yet God does not give His glory to another (Isaiah 42:8).

* "He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day" (John 12:48).
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In their hearts self-willed persons (2 Peter 2:9-10) in effect remove themselves from being friends of Jesus.

By the Power of God, for God's glory (Isaiah 42:8), the friend of Jesus bears good fruit/works because apart from Jesus a person can do nothing (John 15:5).

By the Power of God, by God's grace, for God's glory (Isaiah 42:8), the friend of Jesus is saved from the wrath of God because Jesus, Lord and God (John 20:28), says "I chose you out of the world" (John 15:19).

We Christians believe the Christ exclusively chooses persons unto salvation:

• "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:16), so God chooses people to be friends (John 15:15, the prior verse) and to believe (John 6:29) and to be born again (John 3:3-8) and for righteous works (John 3:21, John 15:5) and to repent (Matthew 11:25) and to love (John 13:34) and unto salvation (John 15:19 the same passage).
• "I chose you out of the world" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:19, includes salvation), so God exclusively chooses people unto salvation.
• "What I say to you I say to all" (Lord Jesus Christ, Mark 13:37 - Jesus had taken the Apostles Peter, Andrew, James, and John aside in private and said this), so all the blessings of God mentioned above are to all believers in all time.

The only way for free-willian philosophers to acheive free-will is for free-willians to add to the Word of God, and it is written "do not add to His words or He will reprove you, and you will be proved a liar" (Proverbs 30:6).

We Christians are blessed of God to be chosen by Lord Jesus without exception because the Word of God says "you did not choose Me, but I chose you" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:16) and "I chose you out of the world" (Lord Jesus Christ, John 15:19, includes salvation)!

This first post in series is the introduction to a complete examination of all that you composed in your post.

Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men (Matthew 15:9).

In Truth (John 14:6), the Almighty God is Sovereign (Genesis 1:1) in man's salvation and affairs of man (Daniel 4:34-35)! PRAISE THE ESTABLISHER OF GODLY FRIENDSHIP!!!

 

[Kermos]

And your interpretation of the word "see" in John 3:3 is a bit off. The kingdom of heaven is not something to be visually observed. It is to be experienced. The "see" in verse 3 and the enter in verse 5 both speak of the same thing.

You call Lord Jesus your liar with your words there, Jim, because the results of your expressed thoughts are expressed as the traditions of men on the left side below while the righteous side expresses divine right:

The traditions of men		The Holy Word of God
Truly, truly, I say to you, before one is born again he can see the Kingdom of God[ (Jim 3:3)		Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God (Lord Jesus Christ, John 3:3)

The true Lord Jesus declares that a person cannot righteously perceive King Jesus of the Kingdom of God without God birthing the person anew in the exchange:

Lord Jesus:		"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God." (John 3:3)
Nicodemus:		"How can someone be born when they are old?" "Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!" (John 3:4)
Lord Jesus:		“Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the Kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not be amazed that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’ The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit” (John 3:5-8)

This second post in series is the continuation of a complete examination of all that you composed in your post.

Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men (Matthew 15:9).

In Truth (John 14:6), the Almighty God is Sovereign (Genesis 1:1) in man's salvation and affairs of man (Daniel 4:34-35)! PRAISE THE FATHER OF US CHILDREN OF GOD AND CREATOR OF ALL CREATION!!!

 

[Kermos]

With respect to John 6:29, that is Jesus' answer to those in the crowd asking, "What must we do, to be doing the works of God?" He didn't try to deceive them. He answered them truthfully and told them what they must do. He told them "you must believe in God". Believing is work. It is not a work of law but is certainly was stated as something that they must do.

But your confusion as to the meaning of so much is obvious.

Again, your words portray Lord Jesus Christ as a liar because your heart's treasure (Matthew 15:16-19, Matthew 6:21) is on the wrong side, the left side, while the righteous Word of God is on the right side:

Jim's heart treasure		The Lovely Word of God
This is not the work of God but this is the work of man, that you believe in Him whom He has sent (Jim 6:29)		This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent (Lord Jesus Christ, John 6:29)

Lord Jesus Christ means exactly what he said when he said that that you believe in Him whom He has sent is the work of God!

This third post in series is the continuation of a complete examination of all that you composed in your post.

Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men leading to worship in vain (Matthew 15:9).

In Truth (John 14:6), the Almighty God is Sovereign (Genesis 1:1) in man's salvation and affairs of man (Daniel 4:34-35)! PRAISE THE AUTHOR AND PERFECTER OF THE FAITH!!!

 

[Kermos]

I am waiting for you to define sin without free will.

So, back to my question; if there is no free will what is sin?

This fourth post in series concludes a complete examination of all that you composed in your post.

God caused me to address your statement in the post to which you responded, but the Word of God applies to you "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God" (John 3:3), yet the response to your inquiry follows.

As to your heart's treasure (Matthew 15:16-19, Matthew 6:21) that sin requires the existence of free-will, no Word of God states man was imparted a free-will, so free-will is unbiblical.

Next as to your heart's treasure, "the spiritual is not first, but the natural; then the spiritual" (1 Corinthians 15:46); therefore, man initially has a self-will for it is written "daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties" (2 Peter 2:9-10), so self-will is Biblical.

Finally, as to your heart's treasure, the definition of sin is as follows.

Sin: not a part, missing the mark.

hamartía (a feminine noun derived from 1 /A "not" and 3313 /méros, "a part, share of") – properly, no-share ("no part of"); loss (forfeiture) because not hitting the target; sin (missing the mark) (definition from ἁμαρτία - Strong's 266 - hamartia HELPS Word-studies section on BibleHub.com).
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Sin is "not a part" of God, or said another way, sin is man "missing the mark" established by God, like missing the bull's eye of a target, sin is when a self-willed person does not do as God commands whether ignorantly or not.

Jim, you believe you buy your way into heaven with your fleshly free-will faith payment in your "apart from Christ, I chose to believe Christ so Christ must profit me with salvation", yet the Christ of us Christians declares "I am the vine, you are the branches; he who abides in Me and I in him, he bears much fruit, for apart from Me you can do nothing" (John 15:5) and "Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the Kingdom of God" (John 3:3) and “you did not choose Me, but I chose you” (John 15:16) and “I chose you out of the world” (John 15:19, includes salvation) and “This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent” (John 6:29) and “It is the Spirit who gives Life; the flesh profits nothing; the words that I have spoken to you are Spirit and are Life” (John 6:63), so you believe falsehood (2 Peter 2:1, 2 Peter 2:9-10).
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Your heart makes false statements about God and man. Free-will is a conjured concept of the traditions of men leading to worship in vain (Matthew 15:9).

In Truth (John 14:6), the Almighty God is Sovereign (Genesis 1:1) in man's salvation and affairs of man (Daniel 4:34-35)! PRAISE THE LORD, MY SALVATION!!!