All Claims of The Son's Deity

My point is Jesus is God referred in Psa 45:6.
Classic Jews interpret the "God" in Psa 45:6 as referred to their Jewish Messiah, but I believe they're still waiting for Him.
While God the Father revealed to Peter that Jesus is the Messiah, the one called "God" in Psa 45:6, Whose throne is forever and ever.
All of the Jewish people in the Bible, Jesus included, know the messiah is not God and any orthodox Jew who reads the New Testament will not have a problem with misunderstanding Jesus to be God. What Jews disagree with are people like you and other trinitarians who impose their beliefs on them using the Tanakh and New Testament. You guys are the main reason why Jews won't accept their New Covenant. You have deceived them into thinking the New Testament is allegedly about Jesus being God incarnate and most of them will not even bother reading the New Testament at this point in history.
 
It is important because that "forever and ever throne" appears in Hebrews 1:8.
It would mean that Psa 45:6 interpretation to refer to king Solomon, I believe is incorrect.
Classic Jews proves it.
Ok, I see your point. So if something is missing from the New Testament, or somewhere from the Bible, then that is important. Did you know there are no teachings about the Trinity in the Bible? I mean, there are not even descriptions, examples, or otherwise. No examples of there being prophecy of God incarnating. Actually, the word "incarnate" is not even in the Bible at all. No descriptions of an incarnation either. No examples of Jesus stating "I am God" in any clear or explicit language.

You're splitting hairs because you want to be right about something or anything for once. The New Testament doesn't need to say Solomon has an eternal throne because it's in the OT and it still stands as valid.

Anyway, Solomon has an eternal throne too. Now what? Did you know Melchizedek is also a priest forever just like the Son of God?

Hebrews 7
3Without father or mother or genealogy, without beginning of days or end of life, like the Son of God, he remains a priest for all time.
 
Great. The Trinity is building on the testimony of scripture. We ought not disregard that testimony of Jesus as God and likewise the Holy Spirit. It is not a pagan doctrine since this was known from the beginning and uses scripture from the OT and NT. Not sure why anyone would disregard those sources. Nor is there reason to fear the word "trinity" since it just means three. The word or number three appears in scripture and in the unitarian pocket dictionary I would assume.
The trinity isn't a valid doctrine about who God is. The Bible doesn't describe God that way.
 
All of the Jewish people in the Bible, Jesus included, know the messiah is not God and any orthodox Jew who reads the New Testament will not have a problem with misunderstanding Jesus to be God. What Jews disagree with are people like you and other trinitarians who impose their beliefs on them using the Tanakh and New Testament. You guys are the main reason why Jews won't accept their New Covenant. You have deceived them into thinking the New Testament is allegedly about Jesus being God incarnate and most of them will not even bother reading the New Testament at this point in history.
Messiah is God



Zechariah 2:8-13

For this is what the Lord Almighty says: "After he has honored me and has sent me against the nations that have plundered you — for whoever touches you touches the apple of his eye — 9 I will surely raise my hand against them so that their slaves will plunder them. Then you will know that the Lord Almighty has sent me.10 "Shout and be glad, O Daughter of Zion. For I am coming, and I will live among you," declares the Lord. 11 "Many nations will be joined with the Lord in that day and will become my people. I will live among you and you will know that the Lord Almighty has sent me to you. 12 The Lord will inherit Judah as his portion in the holy land and will again choose Jerusalem. 13 Be still before the Lord, all mankind, because he has roused himself from his holy dwelling."



Jeremiah 23:5-6
"The days are coming," declares the Lord,
"when I will raise up to David a righteous Branch,
a King who will reign wisely
and do what is just and right in the land.
6 In his days Judah will be saved
and Israel will live in safety.
This is the name by which he will be called:
The Lord Our Righteousness.


Isaiah 7:14
Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will be with child and will give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.



Isaiah 9:6-7
For to us a child is born,
to us a son is given,
and the government will be on his shoulders.
And he will be called
Wonderful Counselor, Mighty God,
Everlasting Father, Prince of Peace.
7 Of the increase of his government and peace
there will be no end.
He will reign on David's throne and over his kingdom,establishing and upholding it
with justice and righteousness
from that time on and forever.
The zeal of the Lord Almighty
will accomplish this.

Micah 5:2
"But as for you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
Too little to be among the clans of Judah,
From you One will go forth for Me to be ruler in Israel.
His goings forth are from long ago,
From the days of eternity."

Daniel 7:9-14
I kept looking Until thrones were set up,
And the Ancient of Days took His seat;
His vesture was like white snow,
And the hair of His head like pure wool.
His throne was ablaze with flames,
Its wheels were a burning fire.
10 "A river of fire was flowing
And coming out from before Him;
Thousands upon thousands were attending Him,
And myriads upon myriads were standing before Him;
The court sat,
And the books were opened.
11 "Then I kept looking because of the sound of the boastful words which the horn was speaking; I kept looking until the beast was slain, and its body was destroyed and given to the burning fire. 12 "As for the rest of the beasts, their dominion was taken away, but an extension of life was granted to them for an appointed period of time.13 "I kept looking in the night visions,
And behold, with the clouds of heaven

One like a Son of Man was coming,
And He came up to the Ancient of Days
And was presented before Him.
14 "And to Him was given dominion,
Glory and a kingdom,
That all the peoples, nations, and men of every language
Might serve Him.
His dominion is an everlasting dominion
Which will not pass away;
And His kingdom is one
Which will not be destroyed.

Malachi 3:1-3
"Behold, I am going to send My messenger, and he will clear the way before Me. And the Lord, whom you seek, will suddenly come to His temple; and the messenger of the covenant, in whom you delight, behold, He is coming," says the Lord of hosts. 2 "But who can endure the day of His coming? And who can stand when He appears? For He is like a refiner's fire and like fullers' soap. 3 "And He will sit as a smelter and purifier of silver, and He will purify the sons of Levi and refine them like gold and silver, so that they may present to the Lord offerings in righteousness.

Malachi 4:5-6
"Behold, I am going to send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and terrible day of the Lord. 6 "And he will restore the hearts of the fathers to their children, and the hearts of the children to their fathers, lest I come and smite the land with a curse."

Zechariah 12:1-10
This is the word of the Lord concerning Israel. The Lord, who stretches out the heavens, who lays the foundation of the earth, and who forms the spirit of man within him, declares: 2 "I am going to make Jerusalem a cup that sends all the surrounding peoples reeling. Judah will be besieged as well as Jerusalem. 3 On that day, when all the nations of the earth are gathered against her, I will make Jerusalem an immovable rock for all the nations. All who try to move it will injure themselves. 4 On that day I will strike every horse with panic and its rider with madness," declares the Lord. "I will keep a watchful eye over the house of Judah, but I will blind all the horses of the nations. 5 Then the leaders of Judah will say in their hearts, 'The people of Jerusalem are strong, because the Lord Almighty is their God.'6 "On that day I will make the leaders of Judah like a firepot in a woodpile, like a flaming torch among sheaves. They will consume right and left all the surrounding peoples, but Jerusalem will remain intact in her place.7 "The Lord will save the dwellings of Judah first, so that the honor of the house of David and of Jerusalem's inhabitants may not be greater than that of Judah. 8 On that day the Lord will shield those who live in Jerusalem, so that the feeblest among them will be like David, and the house of David will be like God, like the Angel of the Lord going before them. 9 On that day I will set out to destroy all the nations that attack Jerusalem.

10 "And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son.

Matthew 1:22-24
22 Now all this took place that what was spoken by the Lord through the prophet might be fulfilled, saying, 23 "Behold, the virgin shall be with child, and shall bear a Son, and they shall call His name Immanuel," which translated means, "God with us."
 
Great. The Trinity is building on the testimony of scripture. We ought not disregard that testimony of Jesus as God and likewise the Holy Spirit. It is not a pagan doctrine since this was known from the beginning and uses scripture from the OT and NT. Not sure why anyone would disregard those sources. Nor is there reason to fear the word "trinity" since it just means three. The word or number three appears in scripture and in the unitarian pocket dictionary I would assume.
There's no verse in the Bible that says we should believe or confess that Jesus is God.
 
My point is Jesus is God referred in Psa 45:6.
Classic Jews interpret the "God" in Psa 45:6 as referred to their Jewish Messiah, but I believe they're still waiting for Him.
While God the Father revealed to Peter that Jesus is the Messiah, the one called "God" in Psa 45:6, Whose throne is forever and ever.
Psalms 45:6 does not say Jesus is God. I have listed the verse below so you can see that it does not say God is Jesus...

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
 
There's no verse in the Bible that says we should believe or confess that Jesus is God.
Of course there is very little in scripture that is said a person has to be cognizant of. A person can become a Christian just hearing about the resurrection or about justification. But to vehemently deny well-recognized truths of scripture makes it questionable whether someone is a Christian. So you give a half-truth here.
 
Yeah and @mikesw posted it saying I was posting lies. And yet what he posted I clicked on and it said the trinity was formulated in the 4th century.
Boy. you go around in circles. You revealed how 2nd century Christians also knew of the Triune nature of God. Do you have a hard time remembering with the right brain what the left brain is saying?
 
The trinity isn't a valid doctrine about who God is. The Bible doesn't describe God that way.
That is just pure neglect of the testimony of scripture. If you can show how Jesus is not just a separate god of a pantheon of gods, explain it. We have seen there is just one God and that Jesus is of that God (John 1:1 and 18). You just keep pretending those verses do not exist or just give weak rejections of these scriptures.
 
No surprise that @mikesw has egg on his face (again) and lacks the humility and self-awareness to acknowledge it.
wow. you even glory in yourself when everything shared by the unitarians was nonsense. I think you are saying how a point on the trinity was held in the 2nd century but developed more fully in the 4th century. Totally amazing that more effort was needed to expose the heresies with more careful wording than in the first century.
But if false hope makes you feel better, I cannot stop you from having that mushy feeling
 
wow. you even glory in yourself when everything shared by the unitarians was nonsense. I think you are saying how a point on the trinity was held in the 2nd century but developed more fully in the 4th century. Totally amazing that more effort was needed to expose the heresies with more careful wording than in the first century.
But if false hope makes you feel better, I cannot stop you from having that mushy feeling
You commented on... “The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning a trinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.
Do you care to comment on the other 14? Or are they all wrong to?

"The doctrine of the Trinity is not a biblical doctrine... it's the product of theological reflection." - The Christian Doctrine of GodTrinitarian. E. Brunner, 1949, p. 236.

“Trinity is not a biblical doctrine" - New Bible Dictionary, J. Douglas, F. Bruce, 1982, p. 1298.

“Scholars generally agree that there is no doctrine of the Trinity as such in either the Old or the New Testament” - The Harper Collins Encyclopedia of Catholicism, 1995, p. 564.

“The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning a trinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.

“Three coequal partners in the Godhead cannot be clearly detected within the confines of the Bible. It's important to avoid reading the Trinity into places where it does not appear." -Oxford Companion to the Bible, Bruce Metzger, M. Coogan, p. 782-3.

“The doctrine of the Trinity is not present in biblical thought... it goes beyond, and even distorts, what the Bible says about God.” - A Contemporary Interpretation of the Trinity - God in Three Persons: Professor M. Erickson, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary,p. 12, 20.

“The belief (in a Trinity-God) was reached only in the 4th and 5th centuries AD and hence is not explicitly and formally a biblical belief." -Dictionary of the Bible, 1995, (trinitarian) J. Mckenzie, p. 899.

“The doctrine of the Trinity was formulated in the post-biblical period." - Harper’s Bible Dictionary, 1985.

“In the New Testament there is no direct suggestion of a doctrineof the Trinity." - An Encyclopedia of Religion, V. Ferm (ed.), 1945, p. 344.

“No passage of Scripture discusses the threeness of God." - The New International Version. Disciples Study Bible, p. 173, note for Mt. 3:16.

“The Bible does not state that there is one God who exists in three persons” - Basic Theology, Professor C. Ryrie, p. 89.

“The Bible does not teach the doctrine of the Trinity” -Christian Doctrine, Professor S. Guthrie, Columbia Theological Seminary, 1994,p. 92.

“The doctrine of the Trinity cannot be justified on the basis of Scripture. Indeed it's hard to imagine Jesus speaking in such terms" - An Outline of Biblical Theology, Professor M. Burrows, Yale DivinitySchool, p. 81.

“The doctrine of God as existing in three persons and one substance is not demonstrable by scriptural proofs." - Hastings Dictionary of theBible, 1898.

“There is in the Old Testament no indication of interior distinctions in the God-head. And there is no doctrine of the Trinity in the NewTestament” - The Known Bible and its Defense, Reverend M. Hembre, 1933, p. 25.

cc: @Runningman
 
You commented on... “The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning atrinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.
Do you care to comment on the other 14? Or are they all wrong to?

"The doctrine of the Trinity is not a biblical doctrine... it's the productof theological reflection." - The Christian Doctrine of GodTrinitarian. E. Brunner, 1949, p. 236.

“Trinity is not a biblical doctrine" - New Bible Dictionary, J. Douglas, F. Bruce, 1982, p. 1298.

“Scholars generally agree that there is no doctrine of theTrinity as such in either the Old or the New Testament” - TheHarper Collins Encyclopedia of Catholicism, 1995, p. 564.

“The Bible has no statements or speculations concerning atrinitary deity." - Encyclopedia Britannica, volume 12, p. 383, 1979.

“Three coequal partners in the Godhead cannot be clearlydetected within the confines of the Bible. It's important toavoid reading the Trinity into places where it does not appear." -Oxford Companion to the Bible, Bruce Metzger, M. Coogan, p. 782-3.

“The doctrine of the Trinity is not present in biblicalthought... it goes beyond, and even distorts, what the Bible says aboutGod.” - A Contemporary Interpretation of the Trinity - God in ThreePersons: Professor M. Erickson, Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary,p. 12, 20.

“Thebelief (in a Trinity-God) was reached only in the 4th and 5th centuriesAD and hence is not explicitly and formally a biblical belief." -Dictionary of the Bible, 1995, (trinitarian) J. Mckenzie, p. 899.

“The doctrine of the Trinity was formulated in the post-biblical period." - Harper’s Bible Dictionary, 1985.

“In the New Testament there is no direct suggestion of a doctrineof the Trinity." - An Encyclopedia of Religion, V. Ferm (ed.), 1945, p. 344.

“Nopassage of Scripture discusses the threeness of God." - The NewInternational Version. Disciples Study Bible, p. 173, note for Mt. 3:16.

“The Bible does not state that there is one God who exists in three persons” - Basic Theology, Professor C. Ryrie, p. 89.

“The Bible does not teach the doctrine of the Trinity” -Christian Doctrine, Professor S. Guthrie, Columbia Theological Seminary, 1994,p. 92.

“The doctrine of the Trinity cannot be justified on the basis ofScripture. Indeed it's hard to imagine Jesus speaking in such terms" - An Outline of Biblical Theology, Professor M. Burrows, Yale DivinitySchool, p. 81.

“The doctrine of God as existing in three persons and one substance isnot demonstrable by scriptural proofs." - Hastings Dictionary of theBible, 1898.

“There is in the Old Testament no indication of interior distinctions inthe God-head. And there is no doctrine of the Trinity in the NewTestament” - The Known Bible and its Defense, Reverend M. Hembre, 1933, p. 25.

cc: @Runningman
I noted a sampling since there was a trend happening. There hardly is need to address them all. There can be some scholars who even disagree with the Triune God. That is just the way the world is.
 
I asked AI for the Scripture that says Jesus is the son of God and it listed these...
  • Hebrews 1:5 – You are my Son; today I have become your Father.
  • Luke 1:35 – The holy one to be born will be called the Son of God.
  • John 1:49 – Rabbi, you are the Son of God; you are the king of Israel.
  • Galatians 2:20 – faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.
  • Matthew 16:16 – Peter answered, “You are the Messiah, the Son of the living God.
  • Luke 4:41 – Demons came out of many people, shouting, ‘You are the Son of God!
  • Mark 1:1 – The beginning of the good news about Jesus the Messiah, the Son of God.
  • Acts 9:20 – At once he began to preach in the synagogues that Jesus is the Son of God.
  • 1 John 4:15 – If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God.
  • Mark 3:11 – Whenever the impure spirits saw him, they fell down before him and cried out, You are the Son of God.
  • Romans 1:4 – and who through the Spirit of holiness was appointed the Son of God in power by his resurrection from the dead.

    I asked AI for the Scripture that says Jesus is God the son and it listed this...
The Bible doesn’t use the phrase “God the Son."
 
Psalms 45:6 does not say Jesus is God. I have listed the verse below so you can see that it does not say God is Jesus...

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
The one that had that forever and ever throne in the New Testament is Jesus.(Heb 1:8)
If you refer Psa 45:6 to others, you cannot find their throne in the New Testament.
 
The one that had that forever and ever throne in the New Testament is Jesus.(Heb 1:8)
If you refer Psa 45:6 to others, you cannot find their throne in the New Testament.
Hebrews 1:8 is not a teaching on the trinity or that we should believe or confess that Jesus is God. Hebrews is saying your throne oh God is forever. Not Jesus is forever. In Hebrews it's quoted referring to Jesus having the use ofthat throne.

Hebrews 1:8
But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

Psalms 45:6
Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.
 
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