All Claims of The Son's Deity

[Peterlag]

You’ve said Psa 45:6 refer to human being, where it state “Thy throne, O God is forever and ever” you can verify it to the original Hebrew of the Tanakh I’ve quoted.

The question is, if it did refer to the human king, where can we find the “forever and ever” throne of the human king in the New Testament?
As I understand “forever and ever” is perpetual or continous in existence per Bible lexicon definition.

Psa 45:7 כסאך H3678  אלהים H430  עולם H5769  ועד H5703  שׁבט H7626  מישׁר H4334  שׁבט H7626 
מלכותך׃ H4438

Psa 45:6 Thy throne, H3678  O God, H430  is for ever H5769  and ever: H5703  the sceptre H7626  of thy kingdom H4438  is a right H4334  sceptre. H7626

“Your throne is God forever” means that God is the authority, the “throne” of the king, and the king reigns with the authority of God. This king, and by extension the Messiah, the true king of Israel, has been graced and blessed by God (Psalms 45:2). In that light, it is appropriate that this king recognizes that God is the source of his kingly authority, which is the point of Psalm 45:9. Psalm 45 is a royal wedding psalm for a Davidic king, perhaps even Solomon, and by extension, some of it applies to the Messiah.

 

[Capbook]

“Your throne is God forever” means that God is the authority, the “throne” of the king, and the king reigns with the authority of God. This king, and by extension the Messiah, the true king of Israel, has been graced and blessed by God (Psalms 45:2). In that light, it is appropriate that this king recognizes that God is the source of his kingly authority, which is the point of Psalm 45:9. Psalm 45 is a royal wedding psalm for a Davidic king, perhaps even Solomon, and by extension, some of it applies to the Messiah.

Did you read the original rendering of Psa 45:6 (7 in the Tanakh)? It doesn’t say “Your throne is God”. And besides God is not a throne. I’ll post it again and be sure to compare it with KJV, both have Strong#, that says, “Thy throne O God”.
If we add words to the Bible we might be guilty of Rev 22:18.

Psa 45:7 כסאך H3678  אלהים H430  עולם H5769  ועד H5703  שׁבט H7626  מישׁר H4334  שׁבט H7626 
מלכותך׃ H4438 

Psa 45:6 Thy throne, H3678  O God, H430  is for ever H5769  and ever: H5703  the sceptre H7626  of thy kingdom H4438  is a right H4334  sceptre. H7626

 

[Peterlag]

Did you read the original rendering of Psa 45:6 (7 in the Tanakh)? It doesn’t say “Your throne is God”. And besides God is not a throne. I’ll post it again and be sure to compare it with KJV, both have Strong#, that says, “Thy throne O God”.
If we add words to the Bible we might be guilty of Rev 22:18.

Psa 45:7 כסאך H3678  אלהים H430  עולם H5769  ועד H5703  שׁבט H7626  מישׁר H4334  שׁבט H7626 
מלכותך׃ H4438 

Psa 45:6 Thy throne, H3678  O God, H430  is for ever H5769  and ever: H5703  the sceptre H7626  of thy kingdom H4438  is a right H4334  sceptre. H7626

I'm a KJV guy and therefore what I see is...

Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

And I believe the verse is referring to God and not Jesus who was not born yet.

 

[Capbook]

I'm a KJV guy and therefore what I see is...

Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: the sceptre of thy kingdom is a right sceptre.

And I believe the verse is referring to God and not Jesus who was not born yet.

First you refer it to the human being, now good that you accept that it refer to God Jesus in Heb 1:8, as the Father said to the Son, Your throne, O God is forever and ever. This is the throne that was mentioned in Psa 45:6.
Do you believe that the Father’s words are true?

 

[Peterlag]

First you refer it to the human being, now good that you accept that it refer to God Jesus in Heb 1:8, as the Father said to the Son, Your throne, O God is forever and ever. This is the throne that was mentioned in Psa 45:6.
Do you believe that the Father’s words are true?

My field is in the New testament concerning the resurrected Christ Jesus. I believe "Thy throne, O God, is forever" is referring to God and it tells us that right in the verse. Jesus is also a king that will govern from the authority of that throne. Psalm 45 is a royal wedding for a Davidic king, perhaps even Solomon. I don't see a trinity here.

 

[Capbook]

My field is in the New testament concerning the resurrected Christ Jesus. I believe "Thy throne, O God, is forever" is referring to God and it tells us that right in the verse. Jesus is also a king that will govern from the authority of that throne. Psalm 45 is a royal wedding for a Davidic king, perhaps even Solomon. I don't see a trinity here.

Not yet, I first to prove the Godship of Jesus.
You didn’t answer my question, do you believe that the Father’s words as truth in Heb 1:8?

 

[TomL]

Where am I wrong? The Jews thought like you and both of you are wrong on how you are taking that statement made by Jesus. John who wrote the book of Revelation saw the glory of Jesus in the second coming. Are we now supposed to believe John was there in the future? You guys are like little kids. It's revelation. God showing His Prophets stuff that was going to later come about.

You are ignoring the word of Christ and context

His word was

Before Abraham I am

The context shows the Jews questioned Jesus age

John 8:52–57 (NASB95) — 52 The Jews said to Him, “Now we know that You have a demon. Abraham died, and the prophets also; and You say, ‘If anyone keeps My word, he will never taste of death.’ 53 “Surely You are not greater than our father Abraham, who died? The prophets died too; whom do You make Yourself out to be?” 54 Jesus answered, “If I glorify Myself, My glory is nothing; it is My Father who glorifies Me, of whom you say, ‘He is our God’; 55 and you have not come to know Him, but I know Him; and if I say that I do not know Him, I will be a liar like you, but I do know Him and keep His word. 56 “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” 57 So the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?”


John 8:56–59 (NASB95) — 56 “Your father Abraham rejoiced to see My day, and he saw it and was glad.” 57 So the Jews said to Him, “You are not yet fifty years old, and have You seen Abraham?” 58 Jesus said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Abraham was born, I am.” 59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but Jesus hid Himself and went out of the temple.


Your theology is not based upon an exegetical handling of scripture. We are not addressing the book of revelation and you have not dealt with the context.

 

[TomL]

Show me where I said all Scripture. Not just the verse we were talking about. But all Scripture must have an article before the word God. Where? Where did I write that?

So, are you admitting Theos without the article does not require a translation of a god?

A simple yes or no will do.

 

[TomL]

I'm telling you... you guys can't read. Verse one says God. Verse two His son, whom He appointed. through whom He (God) made the world.

What part of God employing him to create can you not understand?

Hebrews 1:1–11 (NASB95) — 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they. 5 For to which of the angels did He ever say, “YOU ARE MY SON, TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN YOU”? And again, “I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME”? 6 And when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says, “AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.” 7 And of the angels He says, “WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS, AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.” 8 But of the Son He says, “YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. 9 “YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS.” 10 And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS; 11 THEY WILL PERISH, BUT YOU REMAIN; AND THEY ALL WILL BECOME OLD LIKE A GARMENT,

employing him to lay the foundation of the earth and the heavens which are the work of his hands

In addition, the Father addressed the son as oh God and lord.

Clearly, Christ was with the Father in the beginning and he was personal.

 

[synergy]

How did I just get nailed because you don't understand how the word "God" was used in their culture?

It's you who cannot understand how a Deity Person can be the God (the Father) and another Deity Person (the Word, Jesus) can be God in the Greek language. Your revulsion of the phrase "the Word was God" in John 1:1 is glaringly obvious to all.

Furthermore, you continue to be proud of your plot assassinations of John 8:56–59.

 

[Pancho Frijoles]

The Father had said to the Son, Your throne God, is forever and ever, and two word "God" can be read in the next verse. The first referred to Jesus and the other referred to the Father in support to the previous verse. (Heb 1:8-9)

It seems that David and the rest of the prophets, all the way to the scribes at the time of Jesus, didn’t get the memo.
If God wanted to communicate that the Messiah was God, He was an awful communicator, because nobody understood Him.

And so with John 1:18, NASB rendered Jesus as the only-begotten God, supported by the oldest manuscripts that contain almost the book of John, the papyrus 66, and papyrus 75. Other readings were from later manuscripts.

John 1:18
18 No man has seen God at any time; the only begotten God, who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him.
NASB

Jesus was SEEN by thousands. So Jesus is not God, because no man has seen God.
Look how absurd can things get when we cling to a handful of verses, specially poetic, metaphoric or ill translated verses, and ignore the abundant evidence, from the mouth of Jesus and his apostles, and prophets for 2000 years, that there is only One Personal True God: The Father

 

[Peterlag]

It's you who cannot understand how a Deity Person can be the God (the Father) and another Deity Person (the Word, Jesus) can be God in the Greek language. Your revulsion of the phrase "the Word was God" in John 1:1 is glaringly obvious to all.

Furthermore, you continue to be proud of your plot assassinations of John 8:56–59.

All Jesus was saying was I was what the whole Bible is about long before Abraham came around. And do you guys realize for doctrine you quote what the unbelievers say?

 

[Peterlag]

What part of God employing him to create can you not understand?

Hebrews 1:1–11 (NASB95) — 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they. 5 For to which of the angels did He ever say, “YOU ARE MY SON, TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN YOU”? And again, “I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME”? 6 And when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says, “AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.” 7 And of the angels He says, “WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS, AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.” 8 But of the Son He says, “YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. 9 “YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS.” 10 And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS; 11 THEY WILL PERISH, BUT YOU REMAIN; AND THEY ALL WILL BECOME OLD LIKE A GARMENT,

employing him to lay the foundation of the earth and the heavens which are the work of his hands

In addition, the Father addressed the son as oh God and lord.

Clearly, Christ was with the Father in the beginning and he was personal.

I don't see what you guys see. I hope I'm around in heaven assuming if you guys make it to hear you say to the Lord... What? You are not God? What about John 1:1? What about Philippians 2?

 

[Peterlag]

So, are you admitting Theos without the article does not require a translation of a god?

A simple yes or no will do.

I listed context, general principle, and evidence in red because you want me to see everything in either black or white. And life and the Bible is not either black or white. We have to look at context, evidence and a general principle.

John 10:33
Had the translators rendered the Greek text in verse 33 as they did in verse 34 and 35, then it would read, "...you, a man, claim to be a god." In the next two verses, John 10:34 and 35, the exact same word (theos, without the article) is translated as "god" and not "God." In Acts 12:22, Herod is called theos without the article, so the translators translate it "god." The same is true in Acts 28:6, when Paul had been bitten by a viper and the people expected him to die. When he did not die, "...they changed their minds and said he was a god." Since theos has no article, and since it is clear from the context that the reference is not about the true God, theos is translated "a god." It is a general principle that theos without the article should be "a god," or "divine." Since there is no evidence that Jesus was teaching that he was God anywhere in the context, and since the Pharisees would have never believed that this man was somehow Yahweh, it makes no sense that they would be saying that he said he was "God." Now since Jesus was clearly teaching that he was sent by God and was doing God's work. Thus, it makes perfect sense that the Pharisees would say he was claiming to be "a god" or "divine."

 

[Peterlag]

Not yet, I first to prove the Godship of Jesus.
You didn’t answer my question, do you believe that the Father’s words as truth in Heb 1:8?

I do not see what you see regarding Hebrews 1:8

 

[synergy]

All Jesus was saying was I was what the whole Bible is about long before Abraham came around. And do you guys realize for doctrine you quote what the unbelievers say?

Then why did the Pharisees question Jesus about his age? One need not be as old as the prophesy itself for a prophesy to be true. You make no sense. You continue to commit narrative assassination which you are so proud of.

 

[Peterlag]

Then why did the Pharisees question Jesus about his age? One need not be as old as the prophesy itself for a prophesy to be true. You make no sense. You continue to commit narrative assassination which you are so proud of.

Again, you're quoting the unbelieving possibly devil possessed Pharisees for doctrine.

 

[Peterlag]

The first red flag should have been that the Catholics also believe in the trinity. A group that has never been right about anything.

 

[dwight92070]

The Jews were being like you not understanding what Jesus was saying.

Actually they had more understanding than you do, knowing exactly what He was saying. They did not pretend that He was not saying what He actually said, like you do. On judgment day, I would rather be in their shoes than yours.

 

[synergy]

Again, you're quoting the unbelieving possibly devil possessed Pharisees for doctrine.

Did Jesus correct that thinking that you're taking exception to? No. So if Jesus didn't correct them then why are you correcting them? I'll tell you why. It's because you love highjacking narratives in order to imprint your beliefs into them.