All Claims of The Son's Deity

[Peterlag]

Actually they had more understanding than you do, knowing exactly what He was saying. They did not pretend that He was not saying what He actually said, like you do. On judgment day, I would rather be in their shoes than yours.

• Jesus was “one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin” (Hebrew 4:15), and yet the Bible is clear that God cannot be tempted: “for God cannot be tempted with evil” (James 1:13).

• Angels ministered to and strengthened Jesus at times of weakness or difficulty and we see this in Luke 22:43 that says “And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him” [in the garden of Gethsemane]. Humans need to be strengthened, but God does not need to be strengthened by angels or by anyone or anything.

• Scripture says very plainly that Jesus died. God cannot die. Romans 1:23and other verses say that God is immortal. Orthodox Christian doctrine teaches only the human side of Jesus died, but that assertion is based on assumptions because there's no verse of Scripture that says anything like“only the human side of the nature of Jesus died.”

• In John 14:12 Jesus told his disciples that “whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do.” If Jesus was God, then his statement would be a commission for us to do greater works than God—which is not possible.

• Part of the great hope that we Christians have is that in the future Jesus “will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body” (Philippians 3:21). So in the future we will have bodies that are like the body that Jesus has, which would hardly seem appropriate if Jesus is God in the flesh.

 

[TomL]

I listed context, general principle, and evidence in red because you want me to see everything in either black or white. And life and the Bible is not either black or white. We have to look at context, evidence and a general principle.

John 10:33
Had the translators rendered the Greek text in verse 33 as they did in verse 34 and 35, then it would read, "...you, a man, claim to be a god." In the next two verses, John 10:34 and 35, the exact same word (theos, without the article) is translated as "god" and not "God." In Acts 12:22, Herod is called theos without the article, so the translators translate it "god." The same is true in Acts 28:6, when Paul had been bitten by a viper and the people expected him to die. When he did not die, "...they changed their minds and said he was a god." Since theos has no article, and since it is clear from the context that the reference is not about the true God, theos is translated "a god." It is a general principle that theos without the article should be "a god," or "divine." Since there is no evidence that Jesus was teaching that he was God anywhere in the context, and since the Pharisees would have never believed that this man was somehow Yahweh, it makes no sense that they would be saying that he said he was "God." Now since Jesus was clearly teaching that he was sent by God and was doing God's work. Thus, it makes perfect sense that the Pharisees would say he was claiming to be "a god" or "divine."

Again I posted multiple verses where theos without the article is translated God

you would not affirm these as a god reading

John 1:6A man came, sent from a god, whose name was John.
John 1:13who were born not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of a husband, but of a god.
John 9:33If this man were not from a god, he would not be able to do anything!”
John 16:30Now we know that you know everything and do not need for anyone to ask you questions. By this we believe that you have come from a god.”

there is a lot more but these are examples I took from the book of John


And for the record verses 34 and 35 are not referencing Jesus

concerning verse 33

John 10:33
(MLV2021) The Jews answered him, saying, We do not stone you concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy, and because you being a man, are making* yourself God.

(ACV) The Jews answered him, saying, We stone thee not about a good work, but about blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, make thyself God.
(RHB16) The Jews answered Him, saying,
For a good work we stone Thee not; but for blasphemy,
and because that Thou, being a man, make Thyself God.
(RHB16TL) The Jews answered Him, saying,
For a good work we stone Thee not; but for blasphemy,
and because that Thou, being a man, make Thyself God.
(RHB18) The Jews answered Him, saying,
For a good work we stone Thee not; but for blasphemy,
and because that Thou, being a man, make Thyself God.
(RHB18TL) The Jews answered Him, saying,
For a good work we stone Thee not; but for blasphemy,
and because that Thou, being a man, make Thyself God.
(AFV) The Jews answered Him, saying, "We will not stone You for a good work, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a man, are making Yourself God."
(AKJV-R) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone you not; but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, make yourself God.
(ABU_NT) The Jews answered him: For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being man, makest thyself God.
(ARV 2005) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(ASV-2014) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(AUV) The Jews answered Him, are not stoning you for a good deed, but for your abusive speech [i.e., about God], and because you are claiming to be God, even though you are [only] a man.
(ALT) The Jews answered Him, saying, "Concerning a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a human being, are making Yourself God."
(Anderson) The Jews answered and said to him: We do not stone you for a good work, but for your impious words; and because you, being man, make yourself God.
(ASV) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(BBE) This was their answer: We are not stoning you for a good work but for evil words; because being a man you make yourself God.
(VW) The Jews answered Him, saying, For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a man, make Yourself God.
(Bishops) The Iewes aunswered hym, saying: For thy good workes [sake] we stone thee not, but for thy blasphemie, and because that thou beyng a man, makest thy selfe God.
(CEV) They answered, "We are not stoning you because of any good thing you did. We are stoning you because you did a terrible thing. You are just a man, and here you are claiming to be God!"
(CGV) The Judeans answered him, For a good work we don't stone you, but for slander; and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(CENT) The Jews answered him, "For a good work we do not stone you, but for blasphemy, and because you, being a man, make yourself God."
(cjb) The Judeans replied, "We are not stoning you for any good deed, but for blasphemy -- because you, who are only a man, are making yourself out to be God [Hebrew: Elohim]."
(Complete Apostles' Bible) The Jews answered Him, saying, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God."
(CLV) The Jews answered Him, "For an ideal act we are not stoning you, but for blasphemy, and that you, being a man, are making yourself God."
(CTBible) The Jews answered him saying, For a good work we are not about to stone thee, but for blasphemy, even because thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Darby) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Douay-Rheims) D:ModulesThe Jews answered him: For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy: and because that thou. being a, man, makest thyself God.
(DRB) The Jews answered him: For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy: and because that thou. being a, man, makest thyself God.
(EMTV) The Jews answered Him, saying, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God."
(JB2000) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we do not stone thee, but for blasphemy; and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(ERV) They answered, "We are not killing you for any good thing you did. But you say things that insult God. You are only a man, but you say you are the same as God! That is why we are trying to kill you!"
(ESV) The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, being a man, make yourself God.”
(ESV+) The Jews answered him, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but R23for blasphemy, because you, being a man, R24make yourself God.”
(FAA) The Jews answered him, and said, are not stoning you for a good work, but for blasphemy, and in that you, being a man, make yourself God.”
(FBV) The Jews replied, not stoning you for a good deed, but for blasphemy because you are just a man but youclaiming to be God.
(Geneva) The Iewes answered him, saying, For the good worke we stone thee not, but for blasphemie, and that thou being a man, makest thy selfe God.
(Noyes NT) The Jews answered him, Not for a good work do we stone thee, but for blasphemy, and because thou, who art a man, makest thyself God.
(GNB) They answered, "We do not want to stone you because of any good deeds, but because of your blasphemy! You are only a man, but you are trying to make yourself God!"
(GDBY_NT) The Jews responded to Him, We do not stone Thee for good work, but for blasphemy; because Thou, being a man, art making Thyself God.
(GSNT) The Jews answered, "We are not stoning you for doing anything good, but for your impious talk, and because you, a mere man, make yourself out to be God."
(GW) The Jews answered Jesus, "We're going to stone you to death, not for any good things you've done, but for dishonoring God. You claim to be God, although you're only a man."
(csb) "We aren't stoning You for a good work," the Jews answered, "but for blasphemy, and because You--being a man--make Yourself God."
(HNC-NT) They answered him, "We are going to throw rocks at you, not for any good work, but because you said some evil things against God! You are only a man, yet you are making yourself God."
(ISV) The Jews answered him, "We are not going to stone you for a good action, but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, are making yourself God!"
(Moffatt NT) The Jews retorted, "We mean to stone you, not for a good deed, but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, make yourself God."
(LITV-TSP) The Jews answered Him, saying, We do not stone you concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy; and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(JMNT) The Jews (= religious authorities) considered and answered Him, "We are not proceeding to stone you about beautiful works, but rather, about blasphemy (villainous, impious slander; defaming communication and misrepresentation [of God]) even because YOU (or: you yourself), being a human (a man), continue making yourself God (or: a god)."
(WORNT) The Jews answered Him, saying, We do not go about to stone thee for a good work, but for blasphemy; and because thou being a man makest thyself God.
(JUB) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we do not stone thee, but for blasphemy; and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(KJ2000) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone you not; but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, make yourself God.
(KJVCNT) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone you not; but for blasphemy; and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(KJ3) The Jews answered Him, saying, We do not stone You concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself God.
(AKJV+) The JewsG2453 answeredG611 him, saying,G3004 For a goodG2570 workG2041 we stoneG3034 you not; but for blasphemy;G988 and becauseG3754 that you, beingG5607 a man,G444 makeG4160 yourselfG4572 God.G2316
(AUV-NT) The Jews answered Him, “We are not stoning you for a good deed, but for your abusive speech [i.e., about God], and because you are claiming to be God, even though you are [only] a man.”
(ANT+) answerG611 himG846 TheG3588 JewsG2453 aboutG4012 goodG2570 workG2041 notG3756 [We] stoneG3034 youG4571 butG235 aboutG4012 profanityG988 {We stone you} andG2532 forG3754 YouG4771 ManG444 BeingG5607 makeG4160 yourselfG4572 {to be} godG2316
(BSV) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone you not; but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, make yourself God.
(BSB) “We are not stoning You for any good work,” said the Jews, “but for blasphemy, because You, who are a man, declare Yourself to be God.”
(BSB 1.2) “We are not stoning You for any good work,” said the Jews, “but for blasphemy, because You, who are a man, declare Yourself to be God.”
(BV) The Jewish people answered Him, "We are not attacking You with stones concerning a nice action, but concerning hurtful words and because You, being a man, make Yourself a god."
(Cepher) The Yahudiym answered him, saying, For a good work we stone you not; but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, make yourself Elohiym.
(EHV) “We are not going to stone you for a good work,” the Jews answered, “but for blasphemy, because although you are a man, you make yourself out to be God.”
(EWG) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(HBIE) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being man, makest thyself God.
(HCSB) "We aren't stoning You for a good work," the Jews answered, "but for blasphemy, because You—being a man—make Yourself God."
(HRB) The Jews answered Him, saying, We do not stone You concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy; and because You, being a son of man, make Yourself Elohim.
(IAV) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself Elohim.
(JPS-ASVII) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Julia) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and that thou, being man, makest thyself God.
(KJBCE) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(KJV) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(KJV+) TheG3588 JewsG2453 answeredG611 him,G846 saying,G3004 ForG4012 a goodG2570 workG2041 we stoneG3034 theeG4571 not;G3756 butG235 forG4012 blasphemy;G988 andG2532 becauseG3754 that thou,G4771 beingG5607 a man,G444 makestG4160 thyselfG4572 God.G2316
(KJV-BRG) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Lamsa NT) The Jews said to him, It is not because of the good works we stone you, but because you blaspheme; for while you are only a man, you make yourself God.
(LEB) The Jews answered him, "We are not going to stone you concerning a good deed, but concerning blasphemy, and because you, although you are a man, make yourself to be God!"
(LHB) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we do not stone you; but for blasphemy; and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(LONT) The Jews answered, For a good work we do not stone you, but for blasphemy; because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(LSB) The Jews answered Him, “For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself God.”
(LSB+) The JewsG2453 answeredG611 Him, “For a goodG2570 workG2041 we do not stoneG3034 You, but for R1blasphemyG988; and becauseG3754 You, beingG1510 a manG444, R2makeG4160 YourselfG4572 GodG2316.”
(LSV) The Jews answered Him, saying, “We do not stone You for a good work, but for slander, and because You, being a man, make Yourself God.”
(MRC) The Yehudim answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but concerning blasphemy; and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God."
(MNT) "We are not going to stone you for a good deed," answered the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, are making yourself God."
(MSB1stDraft) “We are not stoning You for any good work,” said the Jews, “but for blasphemy, because You, who are a man, declare Yourself to be God.”
(NAB-A) The Jews answered him, We are not stoning you for a good work but for blasphemy. You, a man, are making yourself God.
(NAS95) The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
(NAS95+) The JewsG2453 answeredG611 Him, "For a goodG2570 workG2041 we do not stoneG3034 You, but for R1blasphemyG988; and becauseG3754 You, beingG1510 a manG444, R2makeG4160 YourselfG4572 out to be GodG2316."
(NASB) The Jews answered Him, “We are not stoning You for a good work, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God.”
(NASB+) The JewsG2453 answeredG611 Him, “We are not stoningG3034 You for a goodG2570 workG2041, but for R1blasphemyG988; and becauseG3754 You, beingG1510 a manG444, R2makeG4160 YourselfG4572 out to be GodG2316.”
(NET) The Jewish leaders replied, “We are not going to stone you for a good deed but for blasphemy, because you, a man, are claiming to be God.”
(NIV) "We are not stoning you for any of these," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."
(NTVR) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God!
(NHEBJE) The Jewish leaders answered him, "We do not stone you for a good work, but for blasphemy: because you, being a man, make yourself God."
(NIRV) "We are not throwing stones at you for any of these," replied the Jews. "We are stoning you for saying a very evil thing. You are only a man. But you claim to be God."
(NJB) The Jews answered him, 'We are stoning you, not for doing a good work, but for blasphemy; though you are only a man, you claim to be God.'
(NKJV) The Jews answered Him, saying, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy, and because You, being a Man, make Yourself God."
(NRSV) The Jews answered, "It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you, but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human being, are making yourself God."
(NRSVA) The Jews answered, "It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you, but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human being, are making yourself God."
(NRSVAue) The Jews answered, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human, are making yourself God.”
(NRSVAue+) The Jews answered, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human, are making yourself God.”
(NRSVue) The Jews answered, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human, are making yourself God.”
(NRSVue+) The Jews answered, “It is not for a good work that we are going to stone you but for blasphemy, because you, though only a human, are making yourself God.”
(OANT-Ps-Pv) The Judeans were saying to him, "It is not for excellent works that we are stoning you, but because you blaspheme, and as you are a man, you make yourself God."
(OJB) In reply, those of Yehudah said to him, For a ma'aseh tov we do not stone you, but for Chillul Hashem and because you, being a man, make yourself G-d. [VAYIKRA 24:16]
(Phillips) 33 "We're not going to stone you for any good things," replied the Jews, "but for blasphemy: because you, who are only a man, are making yourself out to be God."
(Remedy) The Jews replied, “We are not stoning you for the miracles you performed but for blasphemy, because you, a mere human, claim to be God.”
(Revised Standard ) The Jews answered him, "It is not for a good work that we stone you but for blasphemy; because you, being a man, make yourself God."
(RYLT-NT) The Jews answered him, saying, 'For a good work we do not stone you, but for evil speaking, and because you, being a man, do make yourself God.'
(Knox NT) It is not for any deed of mercy we are stoning thee, answered the Jews; it is for blasphemy; it is because thou, who art a man, dost pretend to be God.
(Rotherham) The Jews answered him—Concerning a noble work, are we not stoning thee; but concerning profane speech,—and because, thou, being, a man, art making thyself, God.
(RSV) The Jews answered him, "It is not for a good work that we stone you but for blasphemy; because you, being a man, make yourself God."
(RSVA) The Jews answered him, "It is not for a good work that we stone you but for blasphemy; because you, being a man, make yourself God."
(RV) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Sawyer) The Jews answered him, We do not stone you for a good work, but for blasphemy, and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(SENT) The Jewish leaders said back to him, “We’re not stoning you for a good deed, but because of blasphemy: because you’re a human being, and you make yourself out to be God.”
(Sinaitic NT 1918) The Jews answered him: For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being man, makest thyself God.
(Speck) The Jews answered Him saying, “For a good work we do not stone you, but for blasphemy, and because you, being a man, make yourself God.”
(TCENT) The Jews answered him, “We are not going to stone yoʋ for a good work, but for blasphemy, and because yoʋ, being a man, make yoʋrself out to be God.”
(The Disciple's Bible) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(MSTC) The Jews answered him saying, "For thy good works' sake we stone thee not: but for thy blasphemy, and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God."
(TKB) The Jews answered Him, and said, for a good work we do not stone You; but for blasphemy; because You, being a man, make Yourself God.
(TLV) The Judean leaders answered, “We aren’t stoning you for a good work, but for blasphemy. Though You are a man, You make Yourself God!”
(TCNT) "It is not for any good action that we would stone you," answered the Jews, "but for blasphemy; and because you, who are only a man, make yourself out to be God."
(KJV-1611) The Iewes answered him, saying, For a good worke we stone thee not, but for blasphemy, and because that thou, being a man, makest thy selfe God.
(KJVA) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(LITV) The Jews answered Him, saying, We do not stone You concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself God.
(MKJV) The Jews answered Him, saying, We do not stone you for a good work, but for blasphemy, and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(MLV) The Jews answered him, saying, We do not stone you concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy, and because you being a man, make yourself God.
(MLV2017) The Jews answered him, saying, We do not stone you concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy, and because you being a man, are making* yourself God.
(MLV2019) The Jews answered him, saying, We do not stone you concerning a good work, but concerning blasphemy, and because you being a man, are making* yourself God.
(Murdock) The Jews said to him: It is not on account of good works, that we stone thee: but because thou blasphemest; and, whilst thou art a man, thou makest thyself God.
(NAS77) The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."
(NENT) The Jews answered him, For a good work we stone thee not, but for blasphemy; and because thou, being man, makest thyself God.
(RNT) The Jews answered him, "For a good work we are not stoning you, but for profane words, because you, a man, are making yourself God."
(RSV-CE) The Jews answered him, "It is not for a good work that we stone you but for blasphemy; because you, being a man, make yourself God."
(SOMB) The Jews answered him, We are not stoning you for any good work, but for blasphemy, because you, a human, are making yourself Yahowah.
(Thomas Haweis NT 1795) D:Modules1795 by Thomas HaweisThe Jews answered him, For a good work we do not stone thee; but for blasphemy; and that thou, being merely a man, makest thyself God.
(TPT) The Jewish leaders responded, “We’re not stoning you for anything good you did—it’s because of your blasphemy! You’re just a son of Adam, but you’ve claimed to be God!”
((ULB) The Jews answered him, We are not stoning you for any good work, but for blasphemy, because you, a man, are making yourself God.
(ULLB) The Jews answered him, We are not stoning you for any good work, but for blasphemy, because you, a man, are making yourself God.
(UKJV) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone you not; but for blasphemy; and because that you, being a man, make yourself God.
(UPDV) The Jews answered him, For a good work we don't stone you, but for blasphemy; and because you, being a man, make yourself God.
(WEB) The Jews answered him, “We don’t stone you for a good work, but for blasphemy: because you, being a man, make yourself God.”
(Webster) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy, and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Wesley's) The Jews answered him, We stone thee not for a good work, but for blasphemy, and because thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
(Weymouth) "For no good deed," the Jews replied, "are we going to stone you, but for blasphemy, and because you, who are only a man, are making yourself out to be God."
(Williams) The Jews retorted, "It is not for a good deed but for blasphemy we are going to stone you; namely, because you, although a mere man, claim to be God."
(WAS) The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we stone Thee not, but for blasphemy, and because, Thou, being a Man, makest Thyself God!"
(WoY) The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself Yahweh.
(WPNT) The Jews answered Him saying, “It’s not for a good work that we are stoning you, but for blasphemy; precisely because you, being a man, make yourself God!”
(YLT) The Jews answered him, saying, 'For a good work we do not stone thee, but for evil speaking, and because thou, being a man, dost make thyself God.'
(ULT) The Jews answered him, "We are not stoning you for any good work, but for blasphemy, and because you, a man, are making yourself God."
(UST) The Jewish opponents replied, "We are wanting to take your life, not because you did any good work, but because you, just a man, are insulting God and are making yourself God!"
(WIKI) “We’re not stoning you for a good deed,” the Jewish leaders replied, “but because you are a man claiming to be God. That’s blasphemy!”
(WTNT) The jewes answered him saying: For thy good works' sake we stone thee not: but for thy blasphemy, and because that thou being a man, makest thyself God.

 

[TomL]

I don't see what you guys see. I hope I'm around in heaven assuming if you guys make it to hear you say to the Lord... What? You are not God? What about John 1:1? What about Philippians 2?

You have problems seeing the obvious

What part of God employing him to create can you not understand?

Hebrews 1:1–11 (NASB95) — 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they. 5 For to which of the angels did He ever say, “YOU ARE MY SON, TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN YOU”? And again, “I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME”? 6 And when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says, “AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.” 7 And of the angels He says, “WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS, AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.” 8 But of the Son He says, “YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. 9 “YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS.” 10 And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS; 11 THEY WILL PERISH, BUT YOU REMAIN; AND THEY ALL WILL BECOME OLD LIKE A GARMENT,

employing him to lay the foundation of the earth and the heavens which are the work of his hands

In addition, the Father addressed the son as oh God and lord.

Clearly, Christ was with the Father in the beginning and he was personal.

 

[TomL]

It's you who cannot understand how a Deity Person can be the God (the Father) and another Deity Person (the Word, Jesus) can be God in the Greek language. Your revulsion of the phrase "the Word was God" in John 1:1 is glaringly obvious to all.

Furthermore, you continue to be proud of your plot assassinations of John 8:56–59.

Clearly that passage teaches Christ's pre-existence

 

[Peterlag]

You have problems seeing the obvious

What part of God employing him to create can you not understand?

Hebrews 1:1–11 (NASB95) — 1 God, after He spoke long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, 2 in these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. 3 And He is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power. When He had made purification of sins, He sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, 4 having become as much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they. 5 For to which of the angels did He ever say, “YOU ARE MY SON, TODAY I HAVE BEGOTTEN YOU”? And again, “I WILL BE A FATHER TO HIM AND HE SHALL BE A SON TO ME”? 6 And when He again brings the firstborn into the world, He says, “AND LET ALL THE ANGELS OF GOD WORSHIP HIM.” 7 And of the angels He says, “WHO MAKES HIS ANGELS WINDS, AND HIS MINISTERS A FLAME OF FIRE.” 8 But of the Son He says, “YOUR THRONE, O GOD, IS FOREVER AND EVER, AND THE RIGHTEOUS SCEPTER IS THE SCEPTER OF HIS KINGDOM. 9 “YOU HAVE LOVED RIGHTEOUSNESS AND HATED LAWLESSNESS; THEREFORE GOD, YOUR GOD, HAS ANOINTED YOU WITH THE OIL OF GLADNESS ABOVE YOUR COMPANIONS.” 10 And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS; 11 THEY WILL PERISH, BUT YOU REMAIN; AND THEY ALL WILL BECOME OLD LIKE A GARMENT,

employing him to lay the foundation of the earth and the heavens which are the work of his hands

In addition, the Father addressed the son as oh God and lord.

Clearly, Christ was with the Father in the beginning and he was personal.

The Greek word is the plural of aiōn ( αἰών ) and means “ages.” This verse is referring to the “ages” not the “world.” Vine’s has “an age, a period of time, marked in the N.T. usage by spiritual or moral characteristics, is sometimes translated "world" the R.V. margin always has age. Bullinger’s Critical Lexicon has: “Aion [age] from ao, aemi, to blow, to breathe. Aion denoted originally the life which hastes away in the breathing of our breath, life as transitory; then the course of life, time of life, life in its temporal form. Then, the space of a human life, an age, or generation in respect of duration. The time lived or to be lived by men, time as moving, historical time as well as eternity. Aion always includes a reference to the filling of time."

Since most translators are Trinitarian and think that Jesus was the one who made the original heavens and earth, they translate “ages” as “world” or even “universe” in this verse. There are other Greek words that mean “world” such as kosmos and oikoumene, and when the Devil tempted Jesus by showing him all the kingdoms of the “world” these words are used. In Hebrews 1:2 aiōn means “ages” and should be translated that way.

 

[TomL]

The Greek word is the plural of aiōn ( αἰών ) and means “ages.” This verse is referring to the “ages” not the “world.” Vine’s has “an age, a period of time, marked in the N.T. usage by spiritual or moral characteristics, is sometimes translated "world" the R.V. margin always has age. Bullinger’s Critical Lexicon has: “Aion [age] from ao, aemi, to blow, to breathe. Aion denoted originally the life which hastes away in the breathing of our breath, life as transitory; then the course of life, time of life, life in its temporal form. Then, the space of a human life, an age, or generation in respect of duration. The time lived or to be lived by men, time as moving, historical time as well as eternity. Aion always includes a reference to the filling of time."

Since most translators are Trinitarian and think that Jesus was the one who made the original heavens and earth, they translate “ages” as “world” or even “universe” in this verse. There are other Greek words that mean “world” such as kosmos and oikoumene, and when the Devil tempted Jesus by showing him all the kingdoms of the “world” these words are used. In Hebrews 1:2 aiōn means “ages” and should be translated that way.

10 And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS;

Did you miss this?

There is no reference to ages here and

It makes him pre-existent and personal

 

[Peterlag]

Clearly that passage teaches Christ's pre-existence

1: “Form of God” Means Pre-Existence and Full Deity (Philippians 2:6

Trinitarian Argumen
“Form of God” (Greek: morphē theou) means Jesus had the nature of God before becoming human, showing eternal deity.

Unitarian Refutation:
"Form of God" Paul never says “Jesus was God.” He says Jesus was in the form (morphē) of God. Morphē implies outward appearance, status, or role, not essence. See its parallel in morphē doulou (“form of a servant,” v. 7). Are we to believe Jesus literally became a slave in essence? No—he took on a lowly position. Likewise, being “in the form of God” means functioning as God’s appointed representative, not being God Himself. The verse explicitly states: "He did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped." This destroys co-equality. Why would a co-equal member of the Trinity need to “choose” not to grasp equality with the other member? Because he wasn’t equal to begin with. Paul portrays Jesus not as pre-existent God, but as a man granted divine authority by God. “Form of God” refers to representational glory, not intrinsic deity.

Claim 2: “He emptied Himself” Means He Kept His Deity (Philippians 2:7–8)

Trinitarian Argument:
Jesus remained fully divine but laid aside divine privileges. “Kenosis” does not mean divestment of deity.

Unitarian Refutation:
The passage says Jesus “emptied himself by taking the form of a servant.” That is, he didn’t retain divine glory while merely pretending to be human—he traded glory for servant-hood. This is the opposite of the alleged “two-natures” theology. There is no suggestion that he remained “fully God.” That is extra-biblical language, invented centuries later. Paul is emphasizing humility and obedience, not dual natures. He parallels Adam, who grasped at being like God, whereas Jesus did not (Philippians 2:6 vs. Genesis 3:5–6). Jesus’ humanity is real, not a cloak. “Being found in human form” means he was truly human. This is consistent with Hebrews 2:17: “He had to be made like his brothers in every respect.” God cannot die—but Jesus did. Ergo, Jesus is not God. Jesus “emptied himself” by submitting to God’s will, becoming fully human, not by temporarily hiding his deity.

 

[Peterlag]

10 And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS;

Did you miss this?

There is no reference to ages here and

It makes him pre-existent and personal

The Lord God laid the foundation of the Earth. No I did not miss it.

 

[TomL]

The Lord God laid the foundation of the Earth. No I did not miss it.

Sorry, the son did that

Hebrews 1:8–10 (KJV 1900) — 8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom. 9 Thou hast loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore God, even thy God, hath anointed thee with the oil of gladness above thy fellows. 10 And, Thou, Lord, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands:

It's all addressed to the son

 

[TomL]

1: “Form of God” Means Pre-Existence and Full Deity (Philippians 2:6

Trinitarian Argumen
“Form of God” (Greek: morphē theou) means Jesus had the nature of God before becoming human, showing eternal deity.

Unitarian Refutation:
"Form of God" Paul never says “Jesus was God.” He says Jesus was in the form (morphē) of God. Morphē implies outward appearance, status, or role, not essence. See its parallel in morphē doulou (“form of a servant,” v. 7). Are we to believe Jesus literally became a slave in essence? No—he took on a lowly position. Likewise, being “in the form of God” means functioning as God’s appointed representative, not being God Himself. The verse explicitly states: "He did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped." This destroys co-equality. Why would a co-equal member of the Trinity need to “choose” not to grasp equality with the other member? Because he wasn’t equal to begin with. Paul portrays Jesus not as pre-existent God, but as a man granted divine authority by God. “Form of God” refers to representational glory, not intrinsic deity.

Claim 2: “He emptied Himself” Means He Kept His Deity (Philippians 2:7–8)

Trinitarian Argument:
Jesus remained fully divine but laid aside divine privileges. “Kenosis” does not mean divestment of deity.

Unitarian Refutation:
The passage says Jesus “emptied himself by taking the form of a servant.” That is, he didn’t retain divine glory while merely pretending to be human—he traded glory for servant-hood. This is the opposite of the alleged “two-natures” theology. There is no suggestion that he remained “fully God.” That is extra-biblical language, invented centuries later. Paul is emphasizing humility and obedience, not dual natures. He parallels Adam, who grasped at being like God, whereas Jesus did not (Philippians 2:6 vs. Genesis 3:5–6). Jesus’ humanity is real, not a cloak. “Being found in human form” means he was truly human. This is consistent with Hebrews 2:17: “He had to be made like his brothers in every respect.” God cannot die—but Jesus did. Ergo, Jesus is not God. Jesus “emptied himself” by submitting to God’s will, becoming fully human, not by temporarily hiding his deity.

There is nothing about form in what I posted


The father says to the son

And, “YOU, LORD, IN THE BEGINNING LAID THE FOUNDATION OF THE EARTH, AND THE HEAVENS ARE THE WORKS OF YOUR HANDS; 11 THEY WILL PERISH, BUT YOU REMAIN; AND THEY ALL WILL BECOME OLD LIKE A GARMENT,

employing him to lay the foundation of the earth and the heavens which are the work of his hands

Clearly, Christ was with the Father in the beginning and he was personal.

This is your typical avoidance of key facts and arguments.

 

[Foster]

The God Man

 

[Peterlag]

There is nothing about form in what I posted


The father says to the son



This is your typical avoidance of key facts and arguments.

You asked 148,678,986 times for more data on Philippians 2. And when I give it to you. Then you say I'm into avoidance. WOW!!!

 

[Peterlag]

The God Man
View attachment 1761

Jesus was “one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin” (Hebrew 4:15), and yet the Bible is clear that God cannot be tempted: “for God cannot be tempted with evil” (James 1:13).

Angels ministered to and strengthened Jesus at times of weakness or difficulty and we see this in Luke 22:43 that says “And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him” [in the garden of Gethsemane]. Humans need to be strengthened, but God does not need to be strengthened by angels or by anyone or anything.

Scripture says very plainly that Jesus died. God cannot die. Romans 1:23and other verses say that God is immortal. Orthodox Christian doctrine teaches only the human side of Jesus died, but that assertion is based on assumptions because there's no verse of Scripture that says anything like“only the human side of the nature of Jesus died.”

In John 14:12 Jesus told his disciples that “whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do.” If Jesus was God, then his statement would be a commission for us to do greater works than God—which is not possible.

Part of the great hope that we Christians have is that in the future Jesus “will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body” (Philippians 3:21). So in the future we will have bodies that are like the body that Jesus has, which would hardly seem appropriate if Jesus is God in the flesh.

 

[Capbook]

It seems that David and the rest of the prophets, all the way to the scribes at the time of Jesus, didn’t get the memo.
If God wanted to communicate that the Messiah was God, He was an awful communicator, because nobody understood Him.

Jesus was SEEN by thousands. So Jesus is not God, because no man has seen God.
Look how absurd can things get when we cling to a handful of verses, specially poetic, metaphoric or ill translated verses, and ignore the abundant evidence, from the mouth of Jesus and his apostles, and prophets for 2000 years, that there is only One Personal True God: The Father

So, you describe the true God as an awful communicator? Can you cite a verse that says that?

Jesus was seen as He was in the nature of man when He was on earth. The God you refer as cannot be seen is the Father.
I might believe that you are confused when "God" is mentioned, God is a title, not the personal of the Father.
I quote verses as evidence, what I see from you are just opinions.

Jesus as the only begotten God in John 1:18, is supported by the oldest manuscripts papyrus 66 and papyrus 77.

 

[Capbook]

I do not see what you see regarding Hebrews 1:8

I just don't believe that you have eyes and cannot see. I would also not say that we lack spiritual discernment.
But what I've seen was your abandonment of your argument of Psa 45:6 as "Your throne is God," I know why, because God is not a throne.

You still did not answer my question, do you believe that the Father's words in Heb 1:8 as truth?

 

[Peterlag]

I just don't believe that you have eyes and cannot see. I would also not say that we lack spiritual discernment.
But what I've seen was your abandonment of your argument of Psa 45:6 as "Your throne is God," I know why, because God is not a throne.

You still did not answer my question, do you believe that the Father's words in Heb 1:8 as truth?

You guys keep me on defense as you come at me with verse after verse but ignore everything I write. Can I get a word in here just once. What do you make of this...

Jesus was “one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin” (Hebrew 4:15), and yet the Bible is clear that God cannot be tempted: “for God cannot be tempted with evil” (James 1:13).

Angels ministered to and strengthened Jesus at times of weakness or difficulty and we see this in Luke 22:43 that says “And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him” [in the garden of Gethsemane]. Humans need to be strengthened, but God does not need to be strengthened by angels or by anyone or anything.

Scripture says very plainly that Jesus died. God cannot die. Romans 1:23and other verses say that God is immortal. Orthodox Christian doctrine teaches only the human side of Jesus died, but that assertion is based on assumptions because there's no verse of Scripture that says anything like“only the human side of the nature of Jesus died.”

In John 14:12 Jesus told his disciples that “whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do.” If Jesus was God, then his statement would be a commission for us to do greater works than God—which is not possible.

Part of the great hope that we Christians have is that in the future Jesus “will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body” (Philippians 3:21). So in the future we will have bodies that are like the body that Jesus has, which would hardly seem appropriate if Jesus is God in the flesh.

 

[Peterlag]

So, you describe the true God as an awful communicator? Can you cite a verse that says that?

Jesus was seen as He was in the nature of man when He was on earth. The God you refer as cannot be seen is the Father.
I might believe that you are confused when "God" is mentioned, God is a title, not the personal of the Father.
I quote verses as evidence, what I see from you are just opinions.

Jesus as the only begotten God in John 1:18, is supported by the oldest manuscripts papyrus 66 and papyrus 77.

I have a friend that says one can never win in a debate with the trinity folks because they pull out their free get out of jail card whenever they need it. The card that says that was the human side of Jesus. So let's talk about the two sides...

The supposed “dual nature” of Christ is never stated in the Bible and contradicts the Bible and the laws of nature that God set up. Nothing can be 100% of two different things. Jesus cannot be 100% God and 100% man, and that is not a “mystery” but it's a contradiction and a talk of nonsense. A fatal flaw in the “dual nature” theory is that both natures in Jesus would have had to have known about each other. The Jesus God nature would have known about his human nature, and (according to what the Trinitarians teach) his human nature knew he was God, which explains why Trinitarians say Jesus taught that he was God. The book of Hebrews is wrong when it says Jesus was “made like his brothers in every respect” if Jesus knew he was God (Hebrews 2:17). Jesus was not made like other humans in every way if Jesus was 100% God and 100% human at the same time. In fact, he would have been very different from other humans in many respects.

For example, in his God nature he would not have been tempted by anything (James 1:13), and his human part would not have been tempted either since his human nature had access to that same knowledge and assurance. It is written he was tempted in every way like we all are (Hebrews 4:15). Furthermore, God does not have the problems, uncertainty, and anxieties that humans do, and Jesus would not have had those either if he knew he was God. Also, Luke 2:52 says Jesus grew in wisdom, but his human part would have had access to his God part, which would have given him infinite and inherent wisdom. Hebrews says Jesus “learned obedience” by the things that he suffered, but again, the human part of Jesus would have accessed the God part of him and he would not have needed to learn anything.

Kenotic Trinitarians claim that Jesus put off or limited His God nature, but that theology only developed to try to reconcile some of the verses about what Christ experienced on the earth. The idea that God can limit what He knows or experiences as God is not taught or explained in Scripture, and Kenotic Trinitarianism has been rejected by orthodox Trinitarians for exactly that reason. The very simple way to explain the “difficult verses” that Kenotic Trinitarians are trying to explain about Christ’s human experiences is to realize that Jesus was a fully human being, and not both God and man at the same time. Some assert we have to take the Trinity “by faith” but that is not biblical either.

 

[Capbook]

You guys keep me on defense as you come at me with verse after verse but ignore everything I write. Can I get a word in here just once. What do you make of this...

Yes, I'll read all and try to address all points.

Jesus was “one who in every respect has been tempted as we are, yet without sin” (Hebrew 4:15), and yet the Bible is clear that God cannot be tempted: “for God cannot be tempted with evil” (James 1:13).

Jesus in sinful flesh from His mother Mary (not as God) can be tempted but chose not to sin. A great example for us to emulate.

Angels ministered to and strengthened Jesus at times of weakness or difficulty and we see this in Luke 22:43 that says “And there appeared to him an angel from heaven, strengthening him” [in the garden of Gethsemane]. Humans need to be strengthened, but God does not need to be strengthened by angels or by anyone or anything.

You refer to Jesus human nature. Same like us, we feel hungry need to eat, need to rest, to sleep etc.

Scripture says very plainly that Jesus died. God cannot die. Romans 1:23and other verses say that God is immortal. Orthodox Christian doctrine teaches only the human side of Jesus died, but that assertion is based on assumptions because there's no verse of Scripture that says anything like“only the human side of the nature of Jesus died.”

Jesus was put to death in flesh, means His human side.
1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, in order that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;
NASB
[/QUOTE]

In John 14:12 Jesus told his disciples that “whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do.” If Jesus was God, then his statement would be a commission for us to do greater works than God—which is not possible.

Jesus was here on earth in human capacity, same as us, also we do the commission in our human limitations.

Part of the great hope that we Christians have is that in the future Jesus “will transform our lowly body to be like his glorious body” (Philippians 3:21). So in the future we will have bodies that are like the body that Jesus has, which would hardly seem appropriate if Jesus is God in the flesh.

We will be changed from perishable to imperishable, I may say, our state of being will be change to higher quality suitable for heaven by the grace of God through our faith. Now, I've answered all your positions, can you now address my question? Do you believe the Fathers words in Heb 1:8 as truth?
[/QUOTE]

 

[Capbook]

I have a friend that says one can never win in a debate with the trinity folks because they pull out their free get out of jail card whenever they need it. The card that says that was the human side of Jesus. So let's talk about the two sides...

Ok, we'll try.

The supposed “dual nature” of Christ is never stated in the Bible and contradicts the Bible and the laws of nature that God set up. Nothing can be 100% of two different things. Jesus cannot be 100% God and 100% man, and that is not a “mystery” but it's a contradiction and a talk of nonsense. A fatal flaw in the “dual nature” theory is that both natures in Jesus would have had to have known about each other. The Jesus God nature would have known about his human nature, and (according to what the Trinitarians teach) his human nature knew he was God, which explains why Trinitarians say Jesus taught that he was God. The book of Hebrews is wrong when it says Jesus was “made like his brothers in every respect” if Jesus knew he was God (Hebrews 2:17). Jesus was not made like other humans in every way if Jesus was 100% God and 100% human at the same time. In fact, he would have been very different from other humans in many respects.

I believe the Arians would easily answers with honesty and simple logic that Jesus as "Son of man" as in the nature man because His mother is human Mary. But never answer, why such honesty, and simple logic cannot be applied to Jesus as "Son of God" as His Father is God? Jesus from His owns words acknowledged both nature in Matt 26:62-64;
It says - 62 And the high priest stood up and said to Him, "Do You make no answer? What is it that these men are testifying against You?" 63 But Jesus kept silent. And the high priest said to Him, "I adjure You by the living God, that You tell us whether You are the Christ, the Son of God." 64 Jesus said to him, "You have said it yourself; nevertheless I tell you, hereafter you shall see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven."
NASB

For example, in his God nature he would not have been tempted by anything (James 1:13), and his human part would not have been tempted either since his human nature had access to that same knowledge and assurance. It is written he was tempted in every way like we all are (Hebrews 4:15). Furthermore, God does not have the problems, uncertainty, and anxieties that humans do, and Jesus would not have had those either if he knew he was God. Also, Luke 2:52 says Jesus grew in wisdom, but his human part would have had access to his God part, which would have given him infinite and inherent wisdom. Hebrews says Jesus “learned obedience” by the things that he suffered, but again, the human part of Jesus would have accessed the God part of him and he would not have needed to learn anything.

Jesus though in the form of God, emptied Himself taking the form of a servant and in the likeness of man. I believe this verse made you confused, you always refer to Jesus human nature with limitations and insert His Godship in His human life on earth. Is it that we have eyes but cannot see? Here I will present to you another simple logic; 1. Jesus in the "form of a servant" is He man or not? 2. Jesus in the "form of God" Is He God or not? Why such honest and simple logic answer on the no. 1 question cannot be applied to the second one? Why and explain. I just hope no evasion again. And I will count those evasions.

Kenotic Trinitarians claim that Jesus put off or limited His God nature, but that theology only developed to try to reconcile some of the verses about what Christ experienced on the earth. The idea that God can limit what He knows or experiences as God is not taught or explained in Scripture, and Kenotic Trinitarianism has been rejected by orthodox Trinitarians for exactly that reason. The very simple way to explain the “difficult verses” that Kenotic Trinitarians are trying to explain about Christ’s human experiences is to realize that Jesus was a fully human being, and not both God and man at the same time. Some assert we have to take the Trinity “by faith” but that is not biblical either.

There are verses that explicitly says Jesus is God. In John 1:18 NAS95, Jesus is the "only begotten God," supported by the oldest manuscripts papyrus 66 and papyrus 75 as evidences. I just hope you can counter it with Bible text that explicitly say, "Jesus is not God' and not just opinions.

 

[Peterlag]

There are verses that explicitly says Jesus is God. In John 1:18 NAS95, Jesus is the "only begotten God," supported by the oldest manuscripts papyrus 66 and papyrus 75 as evidences. I just hope you can counter it with Bible text that explicitly say, "Jesus is not God' and not just opinions.

I don't post my opinion anywhere when referring to biblical data unless we need to consider logic and reason. So let's see what I can find on this. Having different Bibles saying different things is a problem for both of us. These are the oldest I can find...

Geneva Bible of 1587
No man hath seene God at any time: that onely begotten Sonne, which is in the bosome of the Father, he hath declared him.

Bishops' Bible of 1568
No man hath seene God at any tyme: The onely begotten sonne which is in the bosome of the father, he hath declared hym.

Coverdale Bible of 1535
No man hath sene God at eny tyme. The onely begotte sonne which is in the bosome of the father, he hath declared the same vnto vs.

Tyndale Bible of 1526
No ma hath sene God at eny tyme. The only begotte sonne which is in ye bosome of ye father he hath declared him.