Your Views on The Trinity

[Selah]

Here it is, yet another example of the blessed Trinity in the book of Matthew: God the Father, Son and Spirit.

Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when He was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto Him, and He saw the Spirit of God (God the Holy Spirit) descending like a dove, and lighting upon Him:
17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying (God the Father), This is my beloved Son, (God the Son) in whom I am well pleased.

—Selah

 

[mikesw]

Here it is, yet another example of the blessed Trinity in the book of Matthew: God the Father, Son and Spirit.

Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when He was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto Him, and He saw the Spirit of God (God the Holy Spirit) descending like a dove, and lighting upon Him:
17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying (God the Father), This is my beloved Son, (God the Son) in whom I am well pleased.

—Selah

endless indicators of the Trinity indeed but unitarians want simple text "Jesus is of the Godhead."

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

Here it is, yet another example of the blessed Trinity in the book of Matthew: God the Father, Son and Spirit.

Matthew 3:16 And Jesus, when He was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto Him, and He saw the Spirit of God (God the Holy Spirit) descending like a dove, and lighting upon Him:
17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying (God the Father), This is my beloved Son, (God the Son) in whom I am well pleased.

—Selah

Folks need to read them bibles my friend .
Many have no idea what occured to the king of israel
has occurred to christendom and this world .
Who will go forth to decieve this people that they may merge as one
and FALL .
And a voice said , I WILL GO and will convince them
of the dire urgency to meet , find common ground and believe the lie .
HOW SO
I will be a mouth IN ALL them nar prophets and liberal progressive
and realms of men
and shall a preach a love that can unify them all as one to find common ground
and to beleive this is the way for PEACE N SAFETY .
AND SO IT HAS. AND SO IT HAS . THEY all merging under the same
LIE my friend . The false love that can unify them to beleive they serve the same
GOD and that all religoins just need to love and find common ground
and this is the solutoin for PEACE n safety . OH but it is a liar my friend .
Leading them all to the day OF DESTRUCTION and perdition of ungodly men .

 

[Tothalordbeallglory]

endless indicators of the Trinity indeed but unitarians want simple text "Jesus is of the Godhead."

Folks need to read them bibles my friend .
Many have no idea what occured to the king of israel
has occurred to christendom and this world .
Who will go forth to decieve this people that they may merge as one
and FALL .
And a voice said , I WILL GO and will convince them
of the dire urgency to meet , find common ground and believe the lie .
HOW SO
I will be a mouth IN ALL them nar prophets and liberal progressive
and realms of men
and shall a preach a love that can unify them all as one to find common ground
and to beleive this is the way for PEACE N SAFETY .
AND SO IT HAS. AND SO IT HAS . THEY all merging under the same
LIE my friend . The false love that can unify them to beleive they serve the same
GOD and that all religoins just need to love and find common ground
and this is the solutoin for PEACE n safety . OH but it is a liar my friend .
Leading them all to the day OF DESTRUCTION and perdition of ungodly men .

 

[Peterlag]

1 Timothy 2:5says that it's the man Jesus, who was the mediator between God and men.

“For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” This verse calls Jesus Christ a“man” even after his resurrection. Trinitarian doctrine tries to explain the verses that say Jesus was a man by saying that he was a man, but he was also 100% God at the same time. But there are problems with that such as there is no single verse that says Jesus was both God and man and that's why the God-man doctrine is built from many verses.

Furthermore, scholars admit that there are only about eight verses in the entire New Testament that can be understood to say that Jesus is God, and every one of them can either be translated in a way that supports the Biblical Unitarian position, or disputed textually, or can be explained from the use of the word “God” in the culture. In contrast, the clear verses where Jesus is said to be a “man” such as when Peter or Paul taught their audiences that Jesus was a man appointed by God are not disputed and in the context there does not seem to be any good reason those men would not have said Jesus was a God-man if in fact that is what he is.

 

[mikesw]

1 Timothy 2:5says that it's the man Jesus, who was the mediator between God and men.

“For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” This verse calls Jesus Christ a“man” even after his resurrection. Trinitarian doctrine tries to explain the verses that say Jesus was a man by saying that he was a man, but he was also 100% God at the same time. But there are problems with that such as there is no single verse that says Jesus was both God and man and that's why the God-man doctrine is built from many verses.

Furthermore, scholars admit that there are only about eight verses in the entire New Testament that can be understood to say that Jesus is God, and every one of them can either be translated in a way that supports the Biblical Unitarian position, or disputed textually, or can be explained from the use of the word “God” in the culture. In contrast, the clear verses where Jesus is said to be a “man” such as when Peter or Paul taught their audiences that Jesus was a man appointed by God are not disputed and in the context there does not seem to be any good reason those men would not have said Jesus was a God-man if in fact that is what he is.

And I bet that every verse in the New Testament could be read in a way to support atheists, but that is because many people have good imaginations and sometimes nearly strong arguments against the actual meaning.

 

[Marvelloustime]

Folks need to read them bibles my friend .
Many have no idea what occured to the king of israel
has occurred to christendom and this world .
Who will go forth to decieve this people that they may merge as one
and FALL .
And a voice said , I WILL GO and will convince them
of the dire urgency to meet , find common ground and believe the lie .
HOW SO
I will be a mouth IN ALL them nar prophets and liberal progressive
and realms of men
and shall a preach a love that can unify them all as one to find common ground
and to beleive this is the way for PEACE N SAFETY .
AND SO IT HAS. AND SO IT HAS . THEY all merging under the same
LIE my friend . The false love that can unify them to beleive they serve the same
GOD and that all religoins just need to love and find common ground
and this is the solutoin for PEACE n safety . OH but it is a liar my friend .
Leading them all to the day OF DESTRUCTION and perdition of ungodly men .

@Tothalordbeallglory
“For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭5‬:‭2‬-‭3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

 

[MTMattie]

1 Timothy 2:5says that it's the man Jesus, who was the mediator between God and men.

“For there is one God, and there is one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.” This verse calls Jesus Christ a“man” even after his resurrection. Trinitarian doctrine tries to explain the verses that say Jesus was a man by saying that he was a man, but he was also 100% God at the same time. But there are problems with that such as there is no single verse that says Jesus was both God and man and that's why the God-man doctrine is built from many verses.

Furthermore, scholars admit that there are only about eight verses in the entire New Testament that can be understood to say that Jesus is God, and every one of them can either be translated in a way that supports the Biblical Unitarian position,

Of course. But there are 8. You cannot dispute that. Even though your side wants to say they dont mean what they indicate.

or disputed textually, or can be explained from the use of the word “God” in the culture. In contrast, the clear verses where Jesus is said to be a “man” such as when Peter or Paul taught their audiences that Jesus was a man appointed by God are not disputed and in the context there does not seem to be any good reason those men would not have said Jesus was a God-man if in fact that is what he is.

 

[dwight92070]

Now let's look at the 2nd passage listed in #1719:

John the Baptist is preaching and some Pharisees and Sadducees show up. He rebukes them and says, "from these stones God is able to raise up children to Abraham." and "He who is coming after me is mightier than I ... He (Jesus, the Son) will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
So in one sermon John mentions God, Jesus the Son, and the Holy Spirit. We see this thoughout the New Testament as a pattern - 164 times.

Now let's look at John 13:3 - "Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, and that He had come forth from God and was going back to God, ..."

This makes it clear that Jesus pre-existed with God. He knew that He had come forth from God, and that now He was going back to God. Now only did He pre-exist with God - but no man, other than Him, has ever pre-existed. "He (The Word) was in the beginning with God" John 1:1-2 and "the Word was God"

 

[dwight92070]

@Tothalordbeallglory
“For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night. For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.”
‭‭1 Thessalonians‬ ‭5‬:‭2‬-‭3‬ ‭KJV‬‬

But you forgot verse 4 "But you, brethren, are not in darkness, that the day would overcome you like a thief; ..." So the Day of the Lord, which is called the Last Day, will not surprise us, who are believers because we are "as sons of the light and sons of the day". Verse 5

 

[MTMattie]

Now let's look at the 2nd passage listed in #1719:

John the Baptist is preaching and some Pharisees and Sadducees show up. He rebukes them and says, "from these stones God is able to raise up children to Abraham." and "He who is coming after me is mightier than I ... He (Jesus, the Son) will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
So in one sermon John mentions God, Jesus the Son, and the Holy Spirit. We see this thoughout the New Testament as a pattern - 164 times.

Now let's look at John 13:3 - "Jesus, knowing that the Father had given all things into His hands, and that He had come forth from God and was going back to God, ..."

This makes it clear that Jesus pre-existed with God. He knew that He had come forth from God, and that now He was going back to God. Now only did He pre-exist with God - but no man, other than Him, has ever pre-existed. "He (The Word) was in the beginning with God" John 1:1-2 and "the Word was God"

Comment:

I do not see Jesus as "a man" pre-existing. He would have been in the spirit realm as God is Spirit, The Holy Spirit is Spirit, in pre existence Jesus would be spirit also.....no?

 

[mikesw]

Comment:

I do not see Jesus as "a man" pre-existing. He would have been in the spirit realm as God is Spirit, The Holy Spirit is Spirit, in pre existence Jesus would be spirit also.....no?

I figure dwight is speaking of Jesus' recognition of the situation before his incarnation. But indeed the discussion is nuanced when going from pre-existence and incarnation. It is interesting how John notes Jesus as baptizing in fire, which did not happen until after his resurrection.

 

[Peterlag]

I fear the "never knew you" part might mean those who never knew Jesus because they thought he was God.

Matthew 7:23
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

 

[MTMattie]

I figure dwight is speaking of Jesus' recognition of the situation before his incarnation. But indeed the discussion is nuanced when going from pre-existence and incarnation. It is interesting how John notes Jesus as baptizing in fire, which did not happen until after his resurrection.

Just my opinion only but it just seems reasonable to me that a lot, like the baptism with fire was never meant for the common man... meaning us, until if, I can say it like this. until it was a done deal and impossible to upend.

I firmly believe that Jesus walked the earth as a basic mortal... even if he was 100% God as he walked the earth he never let it be known because it was to the mortals that the teachings needed done and for those who would have the faith ... the true believing faith... it was to be just that. Faith with out the influence of say divinity walking among them. For if Jesus walked the earth as God among us, who could ever say no to him, unless you were an idiot....

That would be the only way that would be showing his true faith in what he learned as he heard.

That would explain why , while we have the inerrant bible for us, that in ways it does not quite hit the mark for all that are constantly battled in these threads.... a lot of assumptions are made... not necessarily wrong ones either.

But... now I said it and you can ignore it.... its Just my opinion

 

[mikesw]

Just my opinion only but it just seems reasonable to me that a lot, like the baptism with fire was never meant for the common man... meaning us, until if, I can say it like this. until it was a done deal and impossible to upend.

I firmly believe that Jesus walked the earth as a basic mortal... even if he was 100% God as he walked the earth he never let it be known because it was to the mortals that the teachings needed done and for those who would have the faith ... the true believing faith... it was to be just that. Faith with out the influence of say divinity walking among them. For if Jesus walked the earth as God among us, who could ever say no to him, unless you were an idiot....

That would be the only way that would be showing his true faith in what he learned as he heard.

That would explain why , while we have the inerrant bible for us, that in ways it does not quite hit the mark for all that are constantly battled in these threads.... a lot of assumptions are made... not necessarily wrong ones either.

But... now I said it and you can ignore it.... its Just my opinion

I probably could agree with all you said. Maybe the baptism in fire is only the Acts 2 related situation or may be more complex but short term.
One point I agree with is that people did not identify him as divine in the Godhead until after his resurrection. I doubt his mom knew that either. She likely had no definition of what her pregnancy meant about the God being incarnate until after Jesus' resurrection. That is partly why his encounter with Jewish teachers was notable when he was 12.

 

[MTMattie]

I probably could agree with all you said. Maybe the baptism in fire is only the Acts 2 related situation or may be more complex but short term.
One point I agree with is that people did not identify him as divine in the Godhead until after his resurrection. I doubt his mom knew that either. She likely had no definition of what her pregnancy meant about the God being incarnate until after Jesus' resurrection. That is partly why his encounter with Jewish teachers was notable when he was 12.

You may be right.

I know that at the wedding, at least according to the scriptures He seemed a little rude to her.

Now, she must have known then that He was able to change the water into wine.

But we do not know if she understood what was told to her from the angel who was explaining certain things.

Bith in Matthew and Luke we do have theat recorded, but Joseph was also told so Mary may well have just deferred to his guidance.... That would have been expected in that day.

But the instant she saw Elizabeth and John jumped in Elizabeth's belly as Mary with Jesus approached... She may well have known more then is recorded.

 

[dwight92070]

Comment:

I do not see Jesus as "a man" pre-existing. He would have been in the spirit realm as God is Spirit, The Holy Spirit is Spirit, in pre existence Jesus would be spirit also.....no?

Of course you are correct. It was the Spirit of Jesus, the man, who pre-existed, most likely known then as the Word. Not the physical flesh and blood body of Jesus

 

[dwight92070]

I fear the "never knew you" part might mean those who never knew Jesus because they thought he was God.

Matthew 7:23
And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

View attachment 2040

It's amazing how you know what will happen on judgment day. I thought only God knew that - could it be that you think that you are God?

 

[Runningman]

while what FRED says is true , some of us have been reading nothing but bible for years upon years
daily and for hours .
YOU NEEDS to read the gospel of JOHN budrow .
NO man takes my LIFE from me
I have the POWER to lay it down
and i have the POWER to raise it up . OH YES JESUS SAID THAT . HE SURE DID .

Show one example that says Jesus or the Son of God actually performed an action or was somehow involved in his own resurrection. Without that, it means Jesus gave a prophecy about the Father resurrecting him.

Here's 21 verses where someone other than Jesus is resurrecting Jesus. I challenge you to show even 1 verse about a post-mortem Jesus or Son of God resurrecting Jesus.

Acts 2:32 – "This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses."
Acts 3:15 – "And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses."
Acts 3:26 – "Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you..."
Acts 4:10 – "Be it known unto you all... that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead..."
Acts 5:30 – "The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree."
Acts 10:40 – "Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly..."
Acts 13:30 – "But God raised him from the dead."
Acts 13:33 – "God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus..."
Acts 13:34 – "And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead..."
Acts 17:31 – "Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead."
Romans 6:4 – "Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father..."
Romans 10:9 – "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
1 Corinthians 6:14 – "And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power."
1 Corinthians 15:15 – "Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ..."
2 Corinthians 4:14 – "Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus..."
Galatians 1:1 – "Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead)."
Ephesians 1:17, 20 – "That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory... Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead..."
Colossians 2:12 – "Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead."
1 Thessalonians 1:10 – "And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead..."
1 Peter 1:21 – "Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead..."

 

[mikesw]

Show one example that says Jesus or the Son of God actually performed an action or was somehow involved in his own resurrection. Without that, it means Jesus gave a prophecy about the Father resurrecting him.

Here's 21 verses where someone other than Jesus is resurrecting Jesus. I challenge you to show even 1 verse about a post-mortem Jesus or Son of God resurrecting Jesus.

Acts 2:32 – "This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses."
Acts 3:15 – "And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses."
Acts 3:26 – "Unto you first God, having raised up his Son Jesus, sent him to bless you..."
Acts 4:10 – "Be it known unto you all... that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead..."
Acts 5:30 – "The God of our fathers raised up Jesus, whom ye slew and hanged on a tree."
Acts 10:40 – "Him God raised up the third day, and shewed him openly..."
Acts 13:30 – "But God raised him from the dead."
Acts 13:33 – "God hath fulfilled the same unto us their children, in that he hath raised up Jesus..."
Acts 13:34 – "And as concerning that he raised him up from the dead..."
Acts 17:31 – "Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead."
Romans 6:4 – "Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father..."
Romans 10:9 – "That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved."
1 Corinthians 6:14 – "And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power."
1 Corinthians 15:15 – "Yea, and we are found false witnesses of God; because we have testified of God that he raised up Christ..."
2 Corinthians 4:14 – "Knowing that he which raised up the Lord Jesus shall raise up us also by Jesus..."
Galatians 1:1 – "Paul, an apostle, (not of men, neither by man, but by Jesus Christ, and God the Father, who raised him from the dead)."
Ephesians 1:17, 20 – "That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory... Which he wrought in Christ, when he raised him from the dead..."
Colossians 2:12 – "Buried with him in baptism, wherein also ye are risen with him through the faith of the operation of God, who hath raised him from the dead."
1 Thessalonians 1:10 – "And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead..."
1 Peter 1:21 – "Who by him do believe in God, that raised him up from the dead..."

Funny. You are playing the myopic reader of scripture. You disappeared when discussing John 2:19-20. You have to add that to your list. You may still be able to edit your list.