Why are Calvinists so mean ?
- Thread starter civic
- Start date
The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
IMO, many of the non-Calvinists here have put Jesus, John, Paul and others on ignore. We are called to love one another. It is the hallmark of being a true Christian. Insults, condescending behavior, and snark are not the hallmarks of being a true Christian. I'm not a Calvinist, but for those who disagree with Calvinism, it is possible to do so in a respectful loving way to a brother in the Lord.
civic
Well-known member
I agree so lets start behaving like brothers in Christ.
civic
Well-known member
And lets not forget the following
2 Tim 4:2- preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching.
Titus 1:13
This testimony is true. Therefore rebuke them sternly, so that they will be sound in the faith
Titus 2:15
Speak these things as you encourage and rebuke with all authority. Let no one despise you
2 Tim 4:2- preach the word; be ready in season and out of season; reprove, rebuke, and exhort, with complete patience and teaching.
Titus 1:13
This testimony is true. Therefore rebuke them sternly, so that they will be sound in the faith
Titus 2:15
Speak these things as you encourage and rebuke with all authority. Let no one despise you
Apain
Super Member
As followers of Christ we can do it.
Distortions of the gospel will not create a life of joyful thanks. It appears that the Colossians were coming under the influence of some who subtly denied that through Christ they are fully qualified. The true gospel tells me that Christ has fully qualified me: in him I am justified and adopted.
FOR I want you to know how great is my solicitude for you [how severe an inward struggle I am engaged in for you] and for those [believers] at Laodicea, and for all who [like yourselves] have never seen my face and known me personally.
2 [For my concern is] that their hearts may be braced (comforted, cheered, and encouraged) as they are knit together in love, that they may come to have all the abounding wealth and blessings of assured conviction of understanding, and that they may become progressively more intimately acquainted with and may know more definitely and accurately and thoroughly that mystic secret of God, [which is] Christ (the Anointed One).
3 In Him all the treasures of [divine] wisdom (comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God) and [all the riches of spiritual] knowledge and enlightenment are stored up and lie hidden.
4 I say this in order that no one may mislead and delude you by plausible and persuasive and attractive arguments and beguiling speech.
5 For though I am away from you in body, yet I am with you in spirit, delighted at the sight of your [standing shoulder to shoulder in such] orderly array and the firmness and the solid front and steadfastness of your faith in Christ [that leaning of the entire human personality on Him in absolute trust and confidence in His power, wisdom, and goodness].
6 As you have therefore received Christ, [even] Jesus the Lord, [so] walk (regulate your lives and conduct yourselves) in union with and conformity to Him.
7 Have the roots [of your being] firmly and deeply planted [in Him, fixed and founded in Him], being continually built up in Him, becoming increasingly more confirmed and established in the faith, just as you were taught, and abounding and overflowing in it with thanksgiving.
8 See to it that no one carries you off as spoil or makes you yourselves captive by his so-called philosophy and intellectualism and vain deceit (idle fancies and plain nonsense), following human tradition (men’s ideas of the material rather than the spiritual world), just crude notions following the rudimentary and elemental teachings of the universe and disregarding [the teachings of] Christ (the Messiah).
9 For in Him the whole fullness of Deity (the Godhead) continues to dwell in bodily form [giving complete expression of the divine nature].
10 And you are in Him, made full and having come to fullness of life [in Christ you too are filled with the Godhead—Father, Son and Holy Spirit—and reach full spiritual stature]. And He is the Head of all rule and authority [of every angelic principality and power].
11 In Him also you were circumcised with a circumcision not made with hands, but in a [spiritual] circumcision [performed by] Christ by stripping off the body of the flesh (the whole corrupt, carnal nature with its passions and lusts).
12 [Thus you were circumcised when] you were buried with Him in [your] baptism, in which you were also raised with Him [to a new life] through [your] faith in the working of God [as displayed] when He raised Him up from the dead.
13 And you who were dead in trespasses and in the uncircumcision of your flesh (your sensuality, your sinful carnal nature), [God] brought to life together with [Christ], having [freely] forgiven us all our transgressions,
14 Having cancelled and blotted out and wiped away the handwriting of the note (bond) with its legal decrees and demands which was in force and stood against us (hostile to us). This [note with its regulations, decrees, and demands] He set aside and cleared completely out of our way by nailing it to [His] cross.
15 [God] disarmed the principalities and powers that were ranged against us and made a bold display and public example of them, in triumphing over them in Him and in it [the cross].
16 Therefore let no one sit in judgment on you in matters of food and drink, or with regard to a feast day or a New Moon or a Sabbath.
17 Such [things] are only the shadow of things that are to come, and they have only a symbolic value. But the reality (the substance, the solid fact of what is foreshadowed, the body of it) belongs to Christ.
18 Let no one defraud you by acting as an umpire and declaring you unworthy and disqualifying you for the prize, insisting on self-abasement and worship of angels, taking his stand on visions [he claims] he has seen, vainly puffed up by his sensuous notions and inflated by his unspiritual thoughts and fleshly conceit,
19 And not holding fast to the Head, from Whom the entire body, supplied and knit together by means of its joints and ligaments, grows with a growth that is from God.
20 If then you have died with Christ to material ways of looking at things and have escaped from the world’s crude and elemental notions and teachings of externalism, why do you live as if you still belong to the world? [Why do you submit to rules and regulations?—such as]
21 Do not handle [this], Do not taste [that], Do not even touch [them],
22 Referring to things all of which perish with being used. To do this is to follow human precepts and doctrines. [Isa. 29:13.]
23 Such [practices] have indeed the outward appearance [that popularly passes] for wisdom, in promoting self-imposed rigor of devotion and delight in self-humiliation and severity of discipline of the body, but they are of no value in checking the indulgence of the flesh (the lower nature). [Instead, they do not honor God but serve only to indulge the flesh.]
Colossians 2:1–23
The Rogue Tomato
Well-known member
Excellent scripture reference. Whether you believe you are elected from the foundation of the world by God's will and not of blood or the will of man, or you believe your faith is of your own free will, then if we are all in Christ we can all live a life of joyful thanks to Jesus our Lord and savior.
Hosanna
Well-known member
@The Rogue Tomato
Good point we can all stand our ground and still be cordial with one another. Like Rodney King said "can't we all just get along."
Good point we can all stand our ground and still be cordial with one another. Like Rodney King said "can't we all just get along."
Yeah let's do that
civic
Well-known member
civic
Well-known member
Amen
Rockson
Well-known member
As for me I went through the collection of comments.
I've counted about 9-10 of them there's nothing really wrong with them. A few statements maybe could have been adjusted but then we could look at what the other side has said as well. The statements do challenge Calvinism in a very pointed way but nothing wrong with that. Calvinism as a system makes very serious claims in regard to the nature and character of God and his disposition to even love sinners of not and no subject should be any more put to the test in what it claims then this.
We must admit it's true that some people DO NOT want it tested out....they can be more interested in indoctrination instead of education. You even make a claim to suggest it's wrong or improper and one is labelled as a not so good of guy as a way to shut down conversation. But then they don't stop telling people what they believe. We most certainly all need to seek to endeavor to speak with love and grace but that's an endeavor all Calvinists need to seek to do as well. Of course no body is perfect neither am I but I always seek to do better.
Theophilus
Active member
Same here I read the list and they weren't that bad. Certainly not like anything TomL had to put up with daily at the other place. Starts with a C ends with an M. They all gained up on him. And he took them on single-handedly. If you're not a calvinist over there you better run for cover
Johann
Well-known member
Stand your ground brother-for what you believe is truth.
Shalom Achi.
Johann.
Ahar
Active member
Are you sure you can handle the truth?
“What is Calvinism,” is a great question. Calvinism is a theological belief about how God saves people, that is how he keeps them out of hell and gets them into heaven. Calvinists uniquely believe that God has sovereignly selected some to be saved, but not all. It’s not God’s will for all people to be saved in Calvinistic theology. He only selected some, in fact, he selected a minority to be saved. The rest, of course by default, he has selected them not to be saved. You can’t have one without the other, okay?
Johann
Well-known member
Stand your ground brother-for what you believe is truth.
Calvin is, and has been misrepresented globally--are you prepared for truth?
Matthew 7:13-14 (NASB 2020)
Text: "Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. For the gate is narrow and the way is constricted that leads to life, and there are few who find it."
Greek Text: "εἰσέλθατε διὰ τῆς στενῆς πύλης· ὅτι πλατεῖα ἡ πύλη καὶ εὐρύχωρος ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἀπάγουσα εἰς τὴν ἀπώλειαν, καὶ πολλοί εἰσιν οἱ εἰσερχόμενοι δι' αὐτῆς· ὅτι στενὴ ἡ πύλη καὶ τεθλιμμένη ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἀπάγουσα εἰς τὴν ζωήν, καὶ ὀλίγοι εἰσιν οἱ εὑρίσκοντες αὐτήν."
Luke 13:23-24 (NASB 2020)
Text: "And someone said to Him, 'Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?' And He said to them, 'Strive to enter through the narrow door; for many, I tell you, will seek to enter and will not be able.'"
Greek Text: "Εἶπεν δέ τις αὐτῷ, Κύριε, εἰ ὀλίγοι οἱ σῳζόμενοι; ὁ δὲ εἶπεν πρὸς αὐτούς· Ἀγωνίζεσθε εἰσελθεῖν διὰ τῆς στενῆς θύρας· ὅτι πολλοί, λέγω ὑμῖν, ζητήσουσιν εἰσελθεῖν καὶ οὐκ ἰσχύσουσιν."
Exegesis and Analysis
Matthew 7:13-14
Narrow Gate and Wide Gate:
Narrow Gate (στενῆς πύλης): The adjective "στενῆς" (stenēs) means "narrow" or "constricted." This signifies a path that requires effort, discipline, and perhaps even sacrifice.
Wide Gate (πλατεῖα ἡ πύλη): The adjective "πλατεῖα" (plateia) means "wide" or "broad," suggesting an easy path with fewer restrictions.
Way to Destruction vs. Way to Life:
Way to Destruction (ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἀπάγουσα εἰς τὴν ἀπώλειαν): The broad way leads to destruction, indicating spiritual ruin and separation from God.
Way to Life (ἡ ὁδὸς ἡ ἀπάγουσα εἰς τὴν ζωήν): The narrow way leads to life, referring to eternal life and fellowship with God.
Few vs. Many:
Few (ὀλίγοι): The term "ὀλίγοι" (oligoi) suggests a smaller number. The narrow path is less traveled because it requires a commitment that few are willing to make.
Many (πολλοί): The term "πολλοί" (polloi) indicates a larger number, emphasizing that many prefer the easy, less disciplined life that leads to destruction.
Luke 13:23-24
Question about Salvation:
The question posed, "Lord, are there just a few who are being saved?" reflects a common concern among Jesus’ listeners regarding the scope of salvation.
Strive to Enter:
Strive (Ἀγωνίζεσθε): The verb "Ἀγωνίζεσθε" (agonizesthe) is in the present imperative and means "strive," "struggle," or "exert oneself." This indicates that entering the kingdom requires active effort and perseverance.
Narrow Door (στενῆς θύρας): Similar to the narrow gate in Matthew, this narrow door represents the challenging and disciplined path to salvation.
Inability to Enter:
Jesus warns that many will seek to enter but will not be able, highlighting the difficulty and the necessity of genuine commitment and readiness.
Theological Implications
Exclusive Nature of Salvation:
These passages suggest that salvation is not automatic or universal. It requires a deliberate and committed response to Jesus’ call.
Call to Discipleship:
The imagery of the narrow gate and door emphasizes the cost of discipleship. Following Jesus requires denying oneself, taking up the cross, and enduring hardships (cf. Matthew 16:24).
Human Responsibility and Divine Grace:
While salvation is by God’s grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9), these passages emphasize the human responsibility to strive and persevere in faith.
Broader Biblical Context
Parable of the Wedding Feast (Matthew 22:1-14):
Many are invited to the feast, but few are chosen, illustrating the idea that not everyone responds appropriately to God’s invitation.
Parable of the Ten Virgins (Matthew 25:1-13):
Only five of the ten virgins were prepared and entered the wedding banquet, underscoring the need for readiness and vigilance.
Sermon on the Mount (Matthew 5-7):
The broader context of the Sermon on the Mount includes teachings about righteousness, the kingdom of heaven, and the true way to follow God, culminating in the warning about the narrow and wide gates.
Conclusion
The teaching that "few will be saved" reflects the necessity of earnest commitment, genuine faith, and readiness to follow Jesus on the challenging path of discipleship. This concept underscores the importance of prioritizing spiritual readiness and vigilance. While salvation is a gift of God's grace, the human response involves striving, perseverance, and a wholehearted commitment to the narrow way that leads to eternal life. The broader biblical context reinforces these themes, emphasizing the importance of being prepared, responding rightly to God's call, and living faithfully according to Jesus' teachings.
Remember Noah?
God bless
Johann.
Ahar
Active member
I'm definitely prepared let me know if you manage to come up with some, Because Calvinism being globally Misrepresented Is just a dodge. Calvinist s have no problem representing their false doctrine. They have no problem twisting scripture around to get people to believe it.
So you're going to have to do better than that. Try coming up with some real truth.
Johann
Well-known member
Ahar
Active member
I don't bother with stuff that's taken out of context. That's what a dodge is taking your eye off the subject by adding a bunch of meaningless mumbo jumbo.
The subject is what you brought up and that is how is Calvinism being misrepresented globally. Can you answer that question?
Similar threads
