They didn't pierce Jehovah. Jesus is not Jehovah. The Father is Jehovah.
Who is Jesus?
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Peterlag
Well-known member
I wrote a book on who is the resurrected Christ... https://walking-by-the-spirit.com
101G
Well-known member
ERROR, if not then answer this. (The Son), John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:2 "The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."
the Son made all things .... correct. Now this. Isaiah 44:24 "Thus saith the LORD, thy redeemer, and he that formed thee from the womb, I am the LORD that maketh all things; that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself;"
now take careful study of both verses of scripture. the "LORD", all chaptalized, said he made all things and he.... one person was alone and by himself. so he didn't go through anyone to MAKE ALL THINGS.
the Son/Word in John 1:1-3 who MADE ALL THINGS is the SAME ONE person in Isaiah 44:24, else you have two separate and distinct creators, which is anti-bible. your choice, 101G believes the bible.
101G.
The word is not called capitol G God in the Greek lexicons=100% fact.
Isaiah 44:24=YHVH(Jehovah) = the only one with the power and wisdom to create anything. All by himself, except he created all other things-THROUGH and FOR Jesus(Col 1:16)
Psalm 110:1-quoted at Matt 22:44= The utterance of YHVH(Jehovah) to my Lord( Jesus) sit at my( not ours) right hand until i( not we) make your enemies your footstool.-- Jesus would of had to of sat at his own right hand if he were YHVH(Jehovah)
But bible proof is 100% clear-By myself=Gen 1:27=HE ( not we) created-- Prov 8:27-28= HE( not we)Created--Isaiah 40:26= HE( not we) created
All of it showing 100% that YHVH(Jehovah) by himself= the only one with the power and wisdom)
101G
Well-known member
First ERROR, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. just one example, James 1:23 "For if any be a hearer of the word, and not a doer, he is like unto a man beholding his natural face in a glass:"
word: G3056 λόγος logos (lo'-ğos) n.
1. a word, something said (including the thought).
2. (by implication) a saying or expression.
3. (by extension) a discourse (on a topic).
4. (informally) a conversation (on a topic).
5. (thus) a matter.
6. (also) a reasoning (of the mental faculty).
7. (hence) a reason (i.e. a motive).
8. (negatively) a rationalization (i.e. application of plausible reasoning on a faulty premise).
9. (by further extension) a calculation, computation, or an account (as an accounting of).
10. (hence) a reckoning or an inventory (as called to account).
11. (of asking) a question.
12. (specially, with the article in John) the Word of God (capitalized), the Divine Expression, the Creator, the Word of Yahweh (i.e. the Anointed One, whether pre- or post-incarnate; that is, when Jesus is not embodied in the unglorified state of the old flesh of clay man, being quite dependent upon the Holy Spirit in that humble state of subsistence; see John 1:1-14 and Philippians 2:6-11; Also see context 15 below).
13. (special use #2) the “Holy-word” of God (as the Holy Scriptures of the Old Testament).
14. (special use #3) the “Redemptive-word” of God (as the full counsel and instruction of the Good News of Redemption through trust in Jesus Anointed, our Savior and eternal High Priest; not merely its announcement).
15. (Note #1) (the three INTERTWINED MEANINGS of “Word† of God” and “word of God” can refer to a few simultaneous (and inseparable) contexts resulting in an intentional double or triple entendre; of special note is Hebrews 4:12 which should be understood simultaneously in all three contexts: 12, 14 and 13, in that order of priority).
16. (Note #2) (often, “the word” is used as a shortened form of “the word of God” throughout the New Testament, connoting any these preceding contexts/concepts; see Acts 4:29, Acts 4:31).
17. (Note #3) (Redemptive-word: this is the clear and instructive communication of the promised Redemption with sources including Old Testament passages from the Torah-Law, the Holy Prophets, and the Psalms, and in the whole New Testament: the Holy Angels at Jesus' birth, John the Immerser, Jesus our Glorious Savior, first Ambassadors who were eyewitnesses of these things, including Paul as one born “out-of-season,” also Mark and Luke, and through the continuously active and enabling ministry of the promised Holy Spirit who reminds us of and tutors us in these eternal matters).
[from G3004]
KJV: account, cause, communication, X concerning, doctrine, fame, X have to do, intent, matter, mouth, preaching, question, reason, + reckon, remove, say(-ing), shew, X speaker, speech, talk, thing, + none of these things move me, tidings, treatise, utterance, word, work
Root(s): G3004
Compare: G4487
101G source, Mickelson's Enhanced Strong's Dictionaries of the Greek and Hebrew Testaments
and also the Greek lexicons, https://biblehub.com/lexicon/james/1-23.htm
Second ERROR, Through is "BY" as in "BY himself..... (smile). 101G source. The Noah Webster's 1828 Dictionary of American English
THROUGH, prep. thru.
1. From end to end, or from side to side; from one surface or limit to the opposite; as, to bore through a piece of timber, or through a board; a ball passes through the side of a ship.
2. Noting passage; as, to pass through a gate or avenue.
Through the gates of iv'ry he dismiss'd
His valiant offspring.
3. By transmission, noting the means of conveyance.
Through these hands this science has passed with great applause.
Material things are presented only through their senses.
4. By means of; by the agency of; noting instrumentality. This signification is a derivative of the last.
Through the scent of water it will bud. Job 14.
Some through ambition, or through thirst of gold,
Have slain their brothers, and their country sold.
Sanctify them through thy truth. John 17.
The gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord. Rom 6.
5. Over the whole surface or extent; as, to ride through the country.
Their tongue walketh through the earth. Psa 73.
6. Noting passage among or in the midst of; as, to move through water, as a fish; to run through a thicket, as a deer.
THROUGH, adv. thru.
From one end or side to the other; as, to pierce a thing through.
1. From beginning to end; as, to read a letter through.
2. To the end; to the ultimate purpose; as, to carry a project through.
To carry through, to complete; to accomplish.
To go through, to prosecute a scheme to the end.
1. To undergo; to sustain; as, to go through hardships.
BY, prep.
1. Near; close; as, sit by me; that house stands by a river.
[L. pressus.]
2. Near, in motion; as, to move, go or pass by a church. But it seems, in other phrases,or with a verb in the past time, to signify past, gone beyond. "The procession is gone by;" "the hour is gone by;" "John went by." We now use past as an equivalent word. The procession is gone past. Gone by is in strictness tautology, as now used; but I apprehend by signifies primarily near.
3. Through, or with, denoting the agent, means, instrument or cause; as, "a city is destroyed by fire;" "profit is made by commerce;" "to take by force." This use answers to that of the Latin per, through, denoting a passing, acting, agency, or instrumentality.
4. "Day by day;" "year by year;" "article by article." In these phrases, by denotes passing from one to another, or each particular separately taken.
5. "By the space of seven years." In this phrase, by denotes through, passing or continuing, during.
6. "By this time, the sun had risen." The word here seems to denote, at, present or come to.
7. According to; as, "this appears by his own account;" "these are good rules to live by."
8. On; as, "to pass by land or water;" "great battles by sea and land." In the latter phrase, at or on might be substituted for by.
9. It is placed before words denoting quantity, measure or proportion; as, to sell by the pound; to work by the rod or perch; this line is longer by a tenth.
10. It is used to represent the means or instrument of swearing, or affirming; as, to swear by heaven, or by earth; to affirm by all that is sacred.
11. In the phrase, "he has a cask of wine by him," by denotes nearness or presence.
12. "To sit by one's self," is to sit alone, or without company.
13. "To be present by attorney." In this phrase, by denotes means or instrument; through or in the presence of a substitute.
14. In the phrase, "North by West," the sense seems to be north passing to the west, inclining or going westward, or near west.
As an adverb, by denotes also nearness, or presence; as, there was no person by, at the time. But some noun is understood. So in the phrase, "to pass or go by," there is a noun understood.
By and by is a phrase denoting nearness in time; in a short time after; presently; soon.
When persecution ariseth, because of the word, by and by, he is offended. Math.13.
By the by signifies, as we proceed or pass.
To stand by, is to stand near, or to support.
By in lullaby, and in the nursery, a word used in lulling infants to sleep, is evidently allied to words found in many languages, signifying to rest, or be quiet, or to appease; that is, to press, to stop. [L.paco.]
By or bye, in by-law.
In the common phrase, good-bye, bye signifies passing, going. The phrase signifies, a good going, a prosperous passage, and it is precisely equivalent to farewell.
By is used in many compound words, in most of which we observe the sense of nearness, closeness, or a withdrawing or seclusion.
do you understand the terms "Through", and "By" now. understand in Isaiah 44:24 he was "ALONE" and "BY himself". meaning there was no one else to go through........
K, do you understand what "RIGHT HAND" means ....... metaphorically?. it's not physical, it means in "POWER". Oh my, my.
yes, but did not verse 26 say "US", and "OUR?". we have to deal with that. and as said, 101G can answer that if you cannot.
ONLY "ONE" sits on the throne........
John 1:1 "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." John 1:2 "The same was in the beginning with God." John 1:3 "All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made."
the keywords are in verse 1 and 2... "WITH". if you can grasp the understanding of these words, "WITH" then one will know the truth. if you cannot answer just ask 101G.
101G.
I tend to bypass anti-Biblical material that denies the Trinity.
Peterlag
Well-known member
Speaking about pronouns... here's a bit more about them: The pronouns in the Bible that refer to “God” are singular and there are lots of them. “The Hebrew Bible and the New Testament contain well over twenty thousand pronouns and verbs describing the One God” (Anthony Buzzard and Charles Hunting, The Doctrine of the Trinity: Christianity’s Self-inflicted Wound, International Scholars Publications, New York, 1998, p. 17). Singular pronouns include “I” “my” and “he.” We would expect it to say “For God so loved the world that they gave the Father’s only begotten Son….” if “God” were composed of three co-equal beings who each had their own mind and together agreed to send Christ. The fact that the pronouns in the Bible refer to “God” as a singular being is also evidence that there is no Trinity.
Fact= In the Greek lexicons at both John 1:1-2Cor 4:4-- 2 different words used at both spots for God-god--One ends in a g like character, one ends in a v like character to show a difference--Translating is the same at both spots-thus the word gets-god.
101G
Well-known member
101G said James 1:23 please look it up. and two there is no God-god. for John 1:1 is clear. there is no god with God. supportive scripture, Deuteronomy 32:39 "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand."
will be looking for your answer.
101G
My post is fact. Every bible scholar in the world knows it is. They can't give up the billions $$$$$ every year to say truth.
101G
Well-known member
#1. 101G can careless about your post, my post, or anyone's post, only bible. now, 101G asked do the term "word" at James 1:23 is not G3056 λόγος logos (lo'-ğos) n. a noun? or, we can take this as you cannot deny that the "word" at James 1:23 is speaking of a PERSON? thought so.
as for those billions of dollars scholars ............ as JAMES WHITE, (a scholar himself), ONCE SAID, " SCHOLARS ALSO LIE".
101G.
No matter what any one says, translating in the Greek lexicons has small g god to the word.
dwight92070
Well-known member
Amen. There is great truth here in your response.
Sadly, however, there is great error in your quote of Benjamin Warfield. He appears to have put John Calvin on a higher level than Jesus.
civic
Well-known member
Many reformers do the same. Good observation. The same with the creeds and confessions they developed.
dwight92070
Well-known member
I think the word "catholic" there means "universal", not necessarily the Roman Catholic church, which also is not my cup of tea. The Roman Catholic church is replete with error. It amazes me that anyone in that church could actually be saved, but then there are some very corrupt Protestant churches as well. In the creed above, I also take issue with Jesus descending into hell, for which I see little Biblical evidence. But the creeds are NOT the canon of scripture, so we should not be surprised in what some of them say.
Actually, Jesus descended into Hades (Gr: αδου). Catholics have it wrong when they say Hell. 1 Pet 3:18-20 describes the descent of Christ into the very heart of Hades (the Prison) where He crippled it by the sheer fact that He is God.
dwight92070
Well-known member
I think that is a wrong interpretation. I don't follow John Piper much, but I think he has it right on this topic:
Did Christ ever descend to hell?
There are two passages in the New Testament that, taken a certain way, would seem to indicate that he did. One is in Ephesians 4:9 where it says that Christ descended into the lower parts of the earth. This probably means that he descended to the earth, which is the lower parts. The "of" there doesn't mean that he is going under the earth. So I don't think that text warrants the interpretation that he descended into hell.
The other text is 1 Peter 3:18-20 where it says that Christ went to speak to the spirits who are now in bondage. That is, they have died—having lived in the days of Noah—and they are now in bondage; and Christ went to speak to them. Some take that to mean that between Good Friday and Easter Christ went to hell and he preached the gospel there. But I don't think that is the meaning of this text either. I think it means that when these people were alive in the days of Noah, in the Spirit Christ spoke to them through the preaching of Noah; and now they are in prison.
So my conclusion is that there is no textual basis for believing that Christ descended into hell. In fact, he said to the thief on the cross, "Today you will be with me in paradise." That's the only clue we have as to what Jesus was doing between death and resurrection. He said, "Today—this Friday afternoon, after we're both dead—you and I will be in paradise together." I don't think the thief went to hell and that hell is called paradise. I think he went to heaven and that Jesus was there with him.
So I don't say that phrase "he descended into hell" when I recite the Apostle's Creed. But study it yourself and see whether you think there are other foundations for it. As for me, though, I would say that the foundation for that particular sentence in the Apostle's Creed is pretty weak biblically.
John Piper (@JohnPiper) is founder and teacher of desiringGod.org and chancellor of Bethlehem College & Seminary. For 33 years, he served as pastor of Bethlehem Baptist Church, Minneapolis, Minnesota. He is author of more than 50 books, including Desiring God: Meditations of a Christian Hedonist and most recently Foundations for Lifelong Learning: Education in Serious Joy.
Did Christ ever descend to hell?
There are two passages in the New Testament that, taken a certain way, would seem to indicate that he did. One is in Ephesians 4:9 where it says that Christ descended into the lower parts of the earth. This probably means that he descended to the earth, which is the lower parts. The "of" there doesn't mean that he is going under the earth. So I don't think that text warrants the interpretation that he descended into hell.
The other text is 1 Peter 3:18-20 where it says that Christ went to speak to the spirits who are now in bondage. That is, they have died—having lived in the days of Noah—and they are now in bondage; and Christ went to speak to them. Some take that to mean that between Good Friday and Easter Christ went to hell and he preached the gospel there. But I don't think that is the meaning of this text either. I think it means that when these people were alive in the days of Noah, in the Spirit Christ spoke to them through the preaching of Noah; and now they are in prison.
So my conclusion is that there is no textual basis for believing that Christ descended into hell. In fact, he said to the thief on the cross, "Today you will be with me in paradise." That's the only clue we have as to what Jesus was doing between death and resurrection. He said, "Today—this Friday afternoon, after we're both dead—you and I will be in paradise together." I don't think the thief went to hell and that hell is called paradise. I think he went to heaven and that Jesus was there with him.
So I don't say that phrase "he descended into hell" when I recite the Apostle's Creed. But study it yourself and see whether you think there are other foundations for it. As for me, though, I would say that the foundation for that particular sentence in the Apostle's Creed is pretty weak biblically.
John Piper (@JohnPiper) is founder and teacher of desiringGod.org and chancellor of Bethlehem College & Seminary. For 33 years, he served as pastor of Bethlehem Baptist Church, Minneapolis, Minnesota. He is author of more than 50 books, including Desiring God: Meditations of a Christian Hedonist and most recently Foundations for Lifelong Learning: Education in Serious Joy.
101G
Well-known member
Listen carefully, Deuteronomy 32:21 "They have moved me to jealousy with that which is not God; they have provoked me to anger with their vanities: and I will move them to jealousy with those which are not a people; I will provoke them to anger with a foolish nation."
now, Deuteronomy 32:39 "See now that I, even I, am he, and there is no god with me: I kill, and I make alive; I wound, and I heal: neither is there any that can deliver out of my hand."
so all that "god" at John 1:1c is over with.
101G
Jesus and the Thief on the Cross went to Paradise which is also known as the Bosom of Abraham. That's the portion of Hades (Gr: αδου) that all believers went to after death.
dwight92070
Well-known member
You think we're going to discard the truth of John 1:1 with that weak argument? Don't count on it.
