What is the difference between the Rapture and the Second Coming?

But some dps say, "But John heard a voice like the sound of a trumpet in Rev.4:1, Isn't that what happens at the rapture?" Yes, but look at Revelation 1:10: "I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like the sound of a trumpet." Does this mean that John was also raptured in Revelation 1:10? Of course not. So hearing a sound like a trumpet does not always mean a rapture occurs.

Finally, John does not represent the whole church. He is just one believer (although a very special one) and he alone was taken up to heaven in Rev. 4:1, not the whole church.
I agree. It was a real stretch when some of the brethren sought to imply Rev 4:1 was the rapture. When they said John was a type of the church....so many have used this approach on other things too. This is a type of this or this is a type of that. You can make the Bible say anything that way. So if one were to look and find the rapture I think you would look for something like this, Rev 7:9

After this I looked and saw a multitude too large to count, from every nation and tribe and people and tongue, standing before the throne and before the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and holding palm branches in their hands. 10And they cried out in a loud voice: "Salvation to our God, who sits on the throne,
and to the Lamb!”
Rev 7:9




 
You're not reading it right. The ONLY thing that the Corinthians verses say will happen in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, is that "we shall all be changed". Everything else mentioned also happens on that Last Day, but NOT in a moment.

I hope this helps us to read these verses more carefully.
I can read just fine thank you.
 
The rapture and the second coming of Christ are often confused. Sometimes it is difficult to determine whether a scripture verse is referring to the rapture or the second coming. However, in studying end-times Bible prophecy, it is very important to differentiate between the two.
Of course, since it's all nothing more than "Theology"/"Eschatology", the events of the end times will play out AS THEY ARE INTENDED TO. What we happen to Believe has no importance, and no effect.

Personally, I'm a "knee jerk pre-tribber", since that's the version I was first exposed to 60 years ago. But the issue is of no importance to me and whatever will happen is fine. I liked Watchman Nee's version: "you FIRST REACTION when the trumpet blows determines what happens". like Lot's wife, if you "Look back" you don't "go". Do I believe that??? Nah - but it's a nice story.

Christians, who are actually BORN AGAIN of the Holy Spirit don't have any worries one way or the other. We're already taken care of.

NON-Christians can't avoid what's coming, or their destruction.
 
This is a great thread as an example of most of the various views on this subject. They all contain misunderstandings and misapplication of their "pet" verses. Good overview of the arguments.
 
The rapture and the second coming of Christ are often confused. Sometimes it is difficult to determine whether a scripture verse is referring to the rapture or the second coming. However, in studying end-times Bible prophecy, it is very important to differentiate between the two.

The rapture is when Jesus Christ returns to remove the church (all believers in Christ) from the earth. The rapture is described in 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50-54. Believers who have died will have their bodies resurrected and, along with believers who are still living, will meet the Lord in the air. This will all occur in a moment, in a twinkling of an eye. The second coming is when Jesus returns to defeat the Antichrist, destroy evil, and establish His millennial kingdom. The second coming is described in Revelation 19:11-16.

The important differences between the rapture and second coming are as follows:

1) At the rapture, believers meet the Lord in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At the second coming, believers return with the Lord to the earth (Revelation 19:14).

2) The second coming occurs after the great and terrible tribulation (Revelation chapters 6–19). The rapture occurs before the tribulation (1 Thessalonians 5:9; Revelation 3:10).

3) The rapture is the removal of believers from the earth as an act of deliverance (1 Thessalonians 4:13-17, 5:9). The second coming includes the removal of unbelievers as an act of judgment (Matthew 24:40-41).

4) The rapture will be secret and instant (1 Corinthians 15:50-54). The second coming will be visible to all (Revelation 1:7; Matthew 24:29-30).

5) The second coming of Christ will not occur until after certain other end-times events take place (2 Thessalonians 2:4; Matthew 24:15-30; Revelation chapters 6–18). The rapture is imminent; it could take place at any moment (Titus 2:13; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18; 1 Corinthians 15:50-54).

Why is it important to keep the rapture and the second coming distinct?

1) If the rapture and the second coming are the same event, believers will have to go through the tribulation (1 Thessalonians 5:9; Revelation 3:10).

2) If the rapture and the second coming are the same event, the return of Christ is not imminent—there are many things which must occur before He can return (Matthew 24:4-30).

3) In describing the tribulation period, Revelation chapters 6–19 nowhere mentions the church. During the tribulation—also called “the time of trouble for Jacob” (Jeremiah 30:7)—God will again turn His primary attention to Israel (Romans 11:17-31).

The rapture and second coming are similar but separate events. Both involve Jesus returning. Both are end-times events. However, it is crucially important to recognize the differences. In summary, the rapture is the return of Christ in the clouds to remove all believers from the earth before the time of God’s wrath. The second coming is the return of Christ to the earth to bring the tribulation to an end and to defeat the Antichrist and his evil world empire.

From Got?

The difference between the Rapture and the Second Coming is as follows:

#1 - There is NO Difference as the Rapture will not and cannot occur until AFTER the Resurrection.

#2 - There is NO Difference since the Resurrection PRECEDES the Rapture and the Resurrection ONLY takes place at His Second Coming.

#3 - There is NO Difference since it is impossible for God to lie! But men/religion/pre-trib lie all the time!

#4 - 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18

Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death,c so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope.14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep.16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise.17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

18Therefore encourage one another with these words.
 
The difference between the Rapture and the Second Coming is as follows:

#1 - There is NO Difference as the Rapture will not and cannot occur until AFTER the Resurrection.

#2 - There is NO Difference since the Resurrection PRECEDES the Rapture and the Resurrection ONLY takes place at His Second Coming.

#3 - There is NO Difference since it is impossible for God to lie! But men/religion/pre-trib lie all the time!

#4 - 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18

Brothers, we do not want you to be uninformed about those who sleep in death,c so that you will not grieve like the rest, who are without hope.14For since we believe that Jesus died and rose again, we also believe that God will bring with Jesus those who have fallen asleep in Him.

15By the word of the Lord, we declare to you that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who have fallen asleep.16For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a loud command, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will be the first to rise.17After that, we who are alive and remain will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will always be with the Lord.

18Therefore encourage one another with these words.

Agreed. The chronology is crystal clear in Matthew 24 and Revelation 6-7 (along with 1 Thessalonians, etc.). It is difficult for me to understand why it's unclear to some people.

Matthew 24: Immediately after the distress of those days (the Great Tribulation, which Jesus was just talking about)

Hard to miss the timing here.

Revelation 6: The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, 13 and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. 14 The heavens receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.

15 Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can withstand it?”

We will have tribulation. We are not appointed to wrath. The return of Jesus is that turning point.
 
Agreed. The chronology is crystal clear in Matthew 24 and Revelation 6-7 (along with 1 Thessalonians, etc.). It is difficult for me to understand why it's unclear to some people.

Matthew 24: Immediately after the distress of those days (the Great Tribulation, which Jesus was just talking about)

Hard to miss the timing here.

Revelation 6: The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, 13 and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. 14 The heavens receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.

15 Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can withstand it?”

We will have tribulation. We are not appointed to wrath. The return of Jesus is that turning point.
The second coming is not the rapture you are conflating them.
 
Scripture please - thank you
The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).

The rapture will involve an instantaneous transformation of our bodies to fit us for eternity. “We know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is” (1 John 3:2). The rapture is to be distinguished from the second coming. At the rapture, the Lord comes “in the clouds” to meet us “in the air” (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At the second coming, the Lord descends all the way to the earth to stand on the Mount of Olives, resulting in a great earthquake followed by a defeat of God’s enemies (Zechariah 14:3–4).got?

Hope this helps !!!
 
1) At the rapture, believers meet the Lord in the air (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At the second coming, believers return with the Lord to the earth (Revelation 19:14).
1 Thess. 4:14 For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

It doesn't look like anyone who was raptured and alive went to heaven to be among His army. At the second coming He comes with His army in white linen on white horses but they are "those who sleep."
 
The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).

The rapture will involve an instantaneous transformation of our bodies to fit us for eternity. “We know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is” (1 John 3:2). The rapture is to be distinguished from the second coming. At the rapture, the Lord comes “in the clouds” to meet us “in the air” (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At the second coming, the Lord descends all the way to the earth to stand on the Mount of Olives, resulting in a great earthquake followed by a defeat of God’s enemies (Zechariah 14:3–4).got?

Hope this helps !!!
Your thesis: "The rapture is to be distinguished from the second coming."

Very Good except you did not provide a single scripture whereby your assumption can supported.

1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 refutes your thesis in clear and precise wording.

Please give your full attention to the words of the LORD

But I do not want you to be ignorant, brethren, concerning those who have fallen asleep, lest you sorrow as others who have no hope.
For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so God will bring with Him those who sleep in Jesus.

For this we say to you by the word of the Lord,
that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God.
And the dead in Christ will rise first.

After that we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air.
And thus we shall always be with the Lord.
Therefore comfort one another with these words.

CLEAR and Precise

No return of the LORD until the Father says go - verse 14 - "God will bring with Jesus"
No rapture before the His Coming - verse 15
No rapture before the Resurrection - verse 15 - the living(alive Saints) will NOT precede the dead in Christ

Resurrection only occurs at His Coming - verses 14 & 15 - "Coming of the LORD...LORD will descend from Heaven"
Rapture only occurs AFTER the Resurrection - verses 15 & 16 - "dead in Christ rise FIRST"

Conclusion: 1 Thess 4:13-18 agrees with Matthew 24:29 "Immediately after the Tribulation"

The rapture is the very LAST Event to take place(on earth) for the Saints worldwide as we wait for His Coming.

Peace Brother Civic = 1 Corinthians ch15 corroborates 1 Thess ch14 = at His Coming
 
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The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).

The rapture will involve an instantaneous transformation of our bodies to fit us for eternity. “We know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is” (1 John 3:2). The rapture is to be distinguished from the second coming. At the rapture, the Lord comes “in the clouds” to meet us “in the air” (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At the second coming, the Lord descends all the way to the earth to stand on the Mount of Olives, resulting in a great earthquake followed by a defeat of God’s enemies (Zechariah 14:3–4).got?

Hope this helps !!!
I would love it if a pre-trib rapture was true, but in 1 Thes. 4:14 Jesus brings back those who sleep in Jesus. I would think if there were TWO instances where Christ returns it would be spelled out in one large passage and explained fully.
 
I would love it if a pre-trib rapture was true, but in 1 Thes. 4:14 Jesus brings back those who sleep in Jesus. I would think if there were TWO instances where Christ returns it would be spelled out in one large passage and explained fully.
I’m not saying I’m right and others are wrong. It’s my hope :)
 
Let us look at those Biblical passages most commonly used in support of the rapture theory, and that form the basis for the 'Left Behind' phenomenon.

As we study these scriptures we must realise that all of them are in the context of prophecy regarding the second coming of Jesus Christ. It is the second advent that climaxes all the above crisis' and is the focal point of all prophecy.

Matthew 24:37-41 But as the days of Noe were, so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. For as in the days that were before the flood they were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, And knew not until the flood came, and took them all away; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Then shall two be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two women shall be grinding at the mill; the one shall be taken, and the other left.

Now please note carefully what Jesus is saying here. First, the second coming will be affected in precisely the same way as the great flood. The unrighteous will not be aware of the signs of the times, they shall be living at ease, living life as normal with little or no thought of eternity, when they shall be taken all away.

Let us go to the parallel passage in the gospel of Luke. You will note that Luke adds a little more detail giving a slightly different perspective.

Luke 17:26-37 And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, until the day that Noe entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all. Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded; But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all. Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed. In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. Remember Lot’s wife. Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

The people that Matthew says are taken away, Luke adds that they are destroyed. Thus the 'taken away' aspect or context of what Jesus is telling His disciples equates to death or destruction. This is borne out later in Luke's passage when the disciples ask Him, "where are they taken to?" Jesus answer concerning the gathering of eagles around the carcasse echoes the following:

Revelation 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; That ye may eat the flesh of kings, and the flesh of captains, and the flesh of mighty men, and the flesh of horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both free and bond, both small and great. And I saw the beast, and the kings of the earth, and their armies, gathered together to make war against him that sat on the horse, and against his army. And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone. And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.

I am beginning to think that being left behind isn't such a bad alternative. But we shall see. We will now look at another passage and see how consistent Jesus is regarding the subject.

Matthew 13:24-30 ¶ Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field: But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way. But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also. So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares? He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up? But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them. Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

A little later Jesus explains the parable to His disciples.

Matthew 13:37-42 He answered and said unto them, He that soweth the good seed is the Son of man; The field is the world; the good seed are the children of the kingdom; but the tares are the children of the wicked one; The enemy that sowed them is the devil; the harvest is the end of the world; and the reapers are the angels. As therefore the tares are gathered and burned in the fire; so shall it be in the end of this world. The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

So let us recap the main points:
The second coming of Jesus Christ is in like manner as the great flood.
The wicked, who in Noah's day were living their normal everyday lives in ignorance and sin, were all taken away by the flood (Matthew 24:39) therefore so also will the wicked be at the second coming.
They are taken away to their ultimate death, or destruction. (Luke 17:27,29)
The concept of the wicked being taken is repeated many times. (Matt. 24:39-41; Luke 17:34-36)
The taking away or removal of the wicked to be destroyed comes before the gathering of the righteous.
Now, let me ask a question. In Noah's day, after the flood had removed the wicked from the face of the earth and destroyed them all, who was left behind?

Genesis 7:23 And every living substance was destroyed which was upon the face of the ground, both man, and cattle, and the creeping things, and the fowl of the heaven; and they were destroyed from the earth: and Noah only remained alive, and they that were with him in the ark.
Who was it that was left behind when fire and brimstone fell from heaven and destroyed Sodom and the other cities of the plain? Was it not Lot and his two daughters?

The Left Behind series of books and movies are based on the premise that it would be a terrible thing to be left behind; that to be left behind was to be avoided at all costs. If we are to believe the words of Jesus however it would appear to me that to be left behind, alive and kicking, would be a far better alternative.
 
The rapture is described primarily in 1 Thessalonians 4:13–18 and 1 Corinthians 15:50–54. God will resurrect all believers who have died, give them glorified bodies, and take them from the earth, along with all living believers, who will also be given glorified bodies at that time. “For the Lord Himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. After that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” (1 Thessalonians 4:16–17).

The rapture will involve an instantaneous transformation of our bodies to fit us for eternity. “We know that when Christ appears, we shall be like him, for we shall see him as he is” (1 John 3:2). The rapture is to be distinguished from the second coming. At the rapture, the Lord comes “in the clouds” to meet us “in the air” (1 Thessalonians 4:17). At the second coming, the Lord descends all the way to the earth to stand on the Mount of Olives, resulting in a great earthquake followed by a defeat of God’s enemies (Zechariah 14:3–4).got?

Hope this helps !!!
The above passages are the typical ones used by those who hold to a pre-trib rapture. Just an FYI for the readers. :)
 
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