What is Communion ?

[Truther]

There is great power in the proper application of quotes of God. Jesus quoted the Word of God (thus quoting Himself) in His defense against the temptations of Satan. Satan even quoted the Word of God in his temptations against Christ, but he was misusing the Scriptures, and so the Scriptures had no power for him.

Why would you believe that it is improper for God to quote Himself?

Jesus is an absolute physical and mental torment and now he’s quoting scriptures? That’s absurd to think that. The fact is the lamb that was slain from the foundation of the world was being quoted in Psalm 22.

 

[Doug Brents]

Jesus is an absolute physical and mental torment and now he’s quoting scriptures? That’s absurd to think that. The fact is the lamb that was slain from the foundation of the world was being quoted in Psalm 22.

When you are in the worst torment and stress, what is most deeply within you will come out. Have you ever stubbed your toe, or bashed your shin on a corner? Or have you ever witnessed someone else do so? Did you or they curse, blaspheme, etc? Or did you quote Scripture? Most people, myself included in my earlier life, emit expletives and/or curses when this happens. But that is because we are immersed in a world where that is the norm. But Jesus was so full of the Spirit and of the Scriptures that when He was tempted He defended Himself with Scripture, and when He hung on the cross in torment and pain, what was in Him came out: Scripture, Love, and Blessing.

 

[Truther]

When you are in the worst torment and stress, what is most deeply within you will come out. Have you ever stubbed your toe, or bashed your shin on a corner? Or have you ever witnessed someone else do so? Did you or they curse, blaspheme, etc? Or did you quote Scripture? Most people, myself included in my earlier life, emit expletives and/or curses when this happens. But that is because we are immersed in a world where that is the norm. But Jesus was so full of the Spirit and of the Scriptures that when He was tempted He defended Himself with Scripture, and when He hung on the cross in torment and pain, what was in Him came out: Scripture, Love, and Blessing.

Versus 1 through 18 are all the very words of Jesus as he was dying on the cross ….did he forget the rest and only quote verse 1? Really?
How many verses can you quote if your beard was ripped off your face you have a crown of thorns on your head and your back and legs were lacerated to the bone?
Fact is, Jesus could hardly talk at all.

 

[Doug Brents]

Versus 1 through 18 are all the very words of Jesus as he was dying on the cross ….did he forget the rest and only quote verse 1?

Jesus did not say all of Psalm 22:1-18 while He hung on the cross. He only spoke seven times while hanging on the cross that we have recorded. And in the one reference His quote of Psalm 22, He only spoke verse 1.

Really?
How many verses can you quote if your beard was ripped off your face you have a crown of thorns on your head and your back and legs were lacerated to the bone?
Fact is, Jesus could hardly talk at all.

You are right, He could hardly speak, and to do so He had to support His weight on the nails through His feet to take the weight off His diaphragm so He could breath deeply enough to make a sound at all.

 

[Truther]

Jesus did not say all of Psalm 22:1-18 while He hung on the cross. He only spoke seven times while hanging on the cross that we have recorded. And in the one reference His quote of Psalm 22, He only spoke verse 1.

You are right, He could hardly speak, and to do so He had to support His weight on the nails through His feet to take the weight off His diaphragm so He could breath deeply enough to make a sound at all.

By saying that Jesus was quoting scripture instead of the scripture quoting him, you are saying that God did not actually know His begotten son Jesus at the beginning of the world. Think about it.
The implications of your position is that God cannot transcend time. Time contains God.

 

[Doug Brents]

By saying that Jesus was quoting scripture instead of the scripture quoting him, you are saying that God did not actually know His begotten son Jesus at the beginning of the world. Think about it.
The implications of your position is that God cannot transcend time. Time contains God.

That is not what I am saying at all. I said before that Jesus, being one of the three that makes up God, is outside of time, and so had knowledge of everything that occurs in time before He created anything, including time. As such, He knew what He would say, and He knew what David would write. But when He became incarnate, He emptied Himself of all His power and knowledge. So He was not omniscient while He hung on the cross, and only had His knowledge of the Scriptures from His study and any information given Him by the Holy Spirit (which Scripture does not record any supernatural knowledge given Him at this point). But He, being filled with His study of the Scriptures for 33 years, had David's Psalm in His mind (knowing that he was foretelling of Jesus' suffering), and so that Psalm was what He quoted.

 

[Truther]

That is not what I am saying at all. I said before that Jesus, being one of the three that makes up God, is outside of time, and so had knowledge of everything that occurs in time before He created anything, including time. As such, He knew what He would say, and He knew what David would write. But when He became incarnate, He emptied Himself of all His power and knowledge. So He was not omniscient while He hung on the cross, and only had His knowledge of the Scriptures from His study and any information given Him by the Holy Spirit (which Scripture does not record any supernatural knowledge given Him at this point). But He, being filled with His study of the Scriptures for 33 years, had David's Psalm in His mind (knowing that he was foretelling of Jesus' suffering), and so that Psalm was what He quoted.

Was that Jesus actually speaking in Psalms 22? Think about what I’m saying right now. If Jesus was speaking, is he rehearsing his own words 1000 years later on the cross?
You really think he was doing that? It’s like reciting a book you wrote?

You are trying to say that Jesus was reciting his own words. That’s unthinkable.

 

[Truther]

These are the words and the thoughts of Jesus while he was dying on the cross 1000 years later

22 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?

2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.

3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.

4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.

5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.

6 But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.

7 All they that see me laugh me to scorn: they shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying,

8 He trusted on the Lord that he would deliver him: let him deliver him, seeing he delighted in him.

9 But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.

10 I was cast upon thee from the womb: thou art my God from my mother's belly.

11 Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help.

12 Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round.

13 They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.

14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.

15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.

16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.

17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.

18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.

19 But be not thou far from me, O Lord: O my strength, haste thee to help me.


They were not telling him what to say while he’s on the cross. Read the whole thing and you will see what I’m talking about.

God, who transcends time, saw this event in eternity. It is real to him. He was not waiting around for it to happen. This is why the Bible says the lamb was crucified from the foundation of the world. God is not bound by time.

 

[Doug Brents]

Was that Jesus actually speaking in Psalms 22? Think about what I’m saying right now. If Jesus was speaking, is he rehearsing his own words 1000 years later on the cross?
You really think he was doing that? It’s like reciting a book you wrote?

You are trying to say that Jesus was reciting his own words. That’s unthinkable.

It is not unthinkable at all.

These are the words and the thoughts of Jesus while he was dying on the cross 1000 years later

22 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?
2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.
3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.
4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.
5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.
6 But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.
7 All they that see me laugh me to scorn: they shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying,
8 He trusted on the Lord that he would deliver him: let him deliver him, seeing he delighted in him.
9 But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother's breasts.
10 I was cast upon thee from the womb: thou art my God from my mother's belly.
11 Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help.
12 Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round.
13 They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.
14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.
15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.
17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.
18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.
19 But be not thou far from me, O Lord: O my strength, haste thee to help me.

They were not telling him what to say while he’s on the cross. Read the whole thing and you will see what I’m talking about.

God, who transcends time, saw this event in eternity. It is real to him. He was not waiting around for it to happen. This is why the Bible says the lamb was crucified from the foundation of the world. God is not bound by time.

These words do indeed depict the events of the crucifixion, but they also depict what David was experiencing at the time he wrote this. And certainly God transcends time and gave these words to David as if they were happening to Jesus at the time of David. But none of that means that Jesus was not quoting David, who was writing the words given him by God over a thousand years before. This, from our perspective, is one of the paradoxes that are portrayed in time travel movies. But in God it is not a paradox.

 

[Truther]

It is not unthinkable at all.

These words do indeed depict the events of the crucifixion, but they also depict what David was experiencing at the time he wrote this. And certainly God transcends time and gave these words to David as if they were happening to Jesus at the time of David. But none of that means that Jesus was not quoting David, who was writing the words given him by God over a thousand years before. This, from our perspective, is one of the paradoxes that are portrayed in time travel movies. But in God it is not a paradox.

This event was not about Jesus, but it was about David? Were they casting lots for David’s clothing?

 

[Theophilus]

To me communion is celebrating The New Covenant.

For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death till He comes.
—1 Corinthians 11:26

Paul also explains Communion this way: “The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?” 1 Corinthians 10:16

 

[Truther]

To me communion is celebrating The New Covenant.

For as often as you eat this bread and drink this cup, you proclaim the Lord’s death till He comes.
—1 Corinthians 11:26

Paul also explains Communion this way: “The cup of blessing which we bless, is it not the communion of the blood of Christ? The bread which we break, is it not the communion of the body of Christ?” 1 Corinthians 10:16

Yes, a depiction of this New Testament covenant is seen in 1 Corinthians chapter 11. It started as a feast, just as the feast of the Passover was the unfulfilled depiction for Jews.

 

[Icabod]

Communion is a reminder of our covenant relationship with God through Christ. It is no accident that Jesus used the word remembrance twice when He introduced the ordinance.

“And when He had given thanks, He broke it and said, ‘Take, eat; this is My body which is broken for you; do this in remembrance of Me.’ In the same manner He also took the cup after supper, saying, ‘This cup is the new covenant in My blood. This do, as often as you drink it, in remembrance of Me.’” 1 Cor. 11:24–25

 

[dwight92070]

It's really quite simple, isn't it? And yet profound. I like to look at the other verses that speak of it as well, because they give different details. For example Matthew 26:28 "for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins."

His blood was poured out, NOT for healing, NOT for prosperity, but ONLY for forgiveness of sins.

 

[Anja]

It's really quite simple, isn't it? And yet profound. I like to look at the other verses that speak of it as well, because they give different details. For example Matthew 26:28 "for this is My blood of the covenant, which is poured out for many for forgiveness of sins."

His blood was poured out, NOT for healing, NOT for prosperity, but ONLY for forgiveness of sins.

Then came the empty tomb the resurrection of Jesus. Jesus gives us life “more abundantly” John 10:10

 

[Quintus5]

Time is a part of creation. It has no meaning (as far as I can determine, and in my opinion) outside of creation (ie: in Heaven and with God). So yes, I believe that God is outside of time, and can be in all places in time at the same time. But that has no impact on whether Jesus was created or not. Scripture, always correct, always reliable Scripture, says that EVERYTHING that was created was created by/through Jesus, and NOTHING that was created was created without Him. That means that Jesus cannot be a created being, because He could not create Himself, and if He was created then He would be something that He did not create (thus violating what Scripture says).

Further, John 1:1 says that "In the beginning...". That is the beginning of time, and since time was created, Jesus existed before that; in the eternity before there was anything else. God is the only thing that is eternal, with no beginning and no end, and Jesus has always been there with, and a part of, God.

Exactly. In the beginning(time) God created the heavens(space) and the earth (matter) Gen 1:1

 

[Bob Carabbio]

What Christians commonly call “communion” is an ordinance started by Jesus during the Last Supper with His disciples.

What we used to do in the communion service was to exchange cups with other individuals, speaking a blessing as we did so. that seemed to be a meaninful practice. Covid took care of all that, though.

 

[civic]

What we used to do in the communion service was to exchange cups with other individuals, speaking a blessing as we did so. that seemed to be a meaninful practice. Covid took care of all that, though.

Yes that is how we celebrated it when I was a member of the Christian Missionary Alliance in the 80’s

 

[Keiw1]

That is not what I am saying at all. I said before that Jesus, being one of the three that makes up God, is outside of time, and so had knowledge of everything that occurs in time before He created anything, including time. As such, He knew what He would say, and He knew what David would write. But when He became incarnate, He emptied Himself of all His power and knowledge. So He was not omniscient while He hung on the cross, and only had His knowledge of the Scriptures from His study and any information given Him by the Holy Spirit (which Scripture does not record any supernatural knowledge given Him at this point). But He, being filled with His study of the Scriptures for 33 years, had David's Psalm in His mind (knowing that he was foretelling of Jesus' suffering), and so that Psalm was what He quoted.

God always was and always will be-means time goes on forever both ways.

 

[Doug Brents]

God always was and always will be-means time goes on forever both ways.

God's existence does not require time to exist. God says that to Him, a day is as a thousand years, and a thousand years is as a day. Time is meaningless to Him. Because of our limited understanding, we cannot conceive of the nonexistence of time. But time is a fabrication of God's mind. For there to have been a beginning (Gen 1:1), there had to have been a start to time, and that start occurred as God created space and the Earth. That is what Gen 1:1 means: God created time (in the Beginning), space and all the stars, planets, etc. in it (the heavens), and the Earth.