The Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil

[armylngst]

The idea of salvation being administered through a covenant is a central theme in the Bible and speaks clearly of the New Covenant established through Jesus Christ, which brings eternal redemption.
The following verses directly connect God's covenant with the promise of salvation or eternal redemption:

Yes, but it does not say that there is no eternal redemption for the Gentiles. It still just shows that Israel maintains a special place before God. This is what you are missing. Salvation in Christ is present for everyone. Salvation is by grace as Peter says in Acts 15:11. However, he links that to the salvation of the Gentiles and Jews. THat we (Jews) will be saved by the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, just as... they. (Non-Jewish Gentiles). The point Peter is making is that the Jews are not saved by the covenant or the Law, but by the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ. He doesn't say that the covenant is worthless, but that it isn't for salvation. That land God promised to Israel that they have never had... THEY WILL. It will happen. They will live under God their King for the millennial kingdom, that God might fulfill the promises He made in the Old Testament to Israel. However, non-Hebrew Gentiles are mentioned in those promises and prophecies. They come seeking God through the Jews. This again speaks to the special position of the Jews before God. I have never said they don't have a special position before God.

The New Covenant and Salvation​

The book of Hebrews is particularly explicit about the connection between the New Covenant and salvation:

15 And for this cause he is the mediator of the new testament, that by means of death, for the redemption of the transgressions that were under the first testament, they which are called might receive the promise of eternal inheritance. Hebrews 9:15.

That doesn't limit who will be saved. It does give specific reason to the salvation of the Jews. That is the inheritance of Abraham, which is only a portion of the Earth.

20 Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting ecovenant,
21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen. Hebrews 13:20–21.

Again, this says nothing about the Gentiles, and doesn't limit salvation to the Jews only. Again, I have already stated that there are differences in the status between Gentiles and Jews. Gentiles are saved by the kindness of God. God's mercy. Non-Hebrew Gentiles who are God fearers, and have come to believe and have faith in Christ benefit in the covenant, but are not part of it. There is soooo much to Abraham's faith, that by God's promise, it overflows to all who have faith. God doesn't say that about the covenant. Just when God says that in Christ, ALL the nations of the world will be blessed. Not will be partakers, but will be blessed. The gospel given to Abraham within a promise given because of the portrayal of the gospel when God replaced Isaac with a ram. It all goes together. None of it had anything to do with Abraham being a Hebrew, but everything to do with his bottomless faith in God. That is why the promise is separate from the covenant.

6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises. Hebrews 8:5–6.

I would love to see you argue with a Pauline Dispensationalist. It is almost as tiring as arguing with you. Going from someone who says that Gentiles are not part of the covenant (though I have already told you I agree) to someone who clearly states that Jews are not part of the church. Jews are not a part of the body of Christ.

This does not say the Gentiles aren't saved. Not at all. You have yet to present any such verse.

God's Covenant with Israel and Future Salvation​

Paul also connects the future salvation of Israel with God's covenant promises:

26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins. Romans 11:26–27.

These verses demonstrate the teaching in the Scripture that salvation (or eternal inheritance/redemption) is secured and administered through God's established covenant—specifically the New Covenant in the blood of Christ.

The Mosaic Covenant clearly established animal substitution sacrifice for the sins of Israel past, present, and future. It was through the Mosaic Covenant through which God and Christ would provide salvation from sin and death. Someone had to die for Israel's sins and as part of the Law of Moses animals were sacrificed yearly on Israel's holiest day (Yom Kippur) for that purpose. From Abel's first substitutionary sacrifice as taught them by God (Gen. 3:21) sin had to be paid for by the death of the sinner. But by the grace of God the Law of Moses commanded the death of the sinner but also through the Law of Moses substitutionary sacrifice was commanded by God to Israel until in the fulness of time God would Himself provide a sacrifice who died for the sins of Israel and this was done through God's own Son, Jesus Christ.

Now I would like you to know that I am a die hard futurist. I would believe you would already know that. Stop talking about the Mosaic covenant as that is dead and gone. It wasn't even in force when Jesus came. Israel violated that covenant once they ran after false gods. God even spoke at how He was tired of all the sacrifices.

Salvation is offered universally for any who would fear God and believe in His Christ by faith. However, Paul humbled the Jew and the Gentile/Greek by saying that salvation is first to the Jew (humbling the Gentiles), and then to the Gentile (humbling the Jews within the contention that arose between the Jews and the Greeks). However, Paul recognized, as I spoke of above, the special place Israel has before God in that salvation was first to the Jew, then the Greek/Gentile. (non-Hebrew type). The non-Hebrew Gentiles owe their salvation to God first, but also to the Jews. This is what you must understand. Salvation is not simply there for the Jews, however, if you read the back of the book, the final salvation of God's elect within the nation of Israel will be glorious. The Gentiles don't get that. They just receive the kindness of God, and the promise that if they don't remain within that kindness, they will be shut out. For the Jews, unbelief/rejection of Christ shuts them out. Belief brings them in, without warnings of being ejected again. Why? They, as well as all true believers, are held fast by God.

Stop looking at the covenant when looking at salvation. Peter explains what salvation is after rejecting the covenant in salvation. The last two words must not be removed from my statement. Acts 15:10-11. The church is made up of both non-Hebrew Gentiles and Jews. I reject what the Pauline dispensationalists say. All believers in Christ are one in His body, the church. However, with the covenant, with Old Testament prophecy, with the Olivet Discourse in Matthew, with Daniel's 70 weeks and other end times prophecies, with Revelation 19 and Revelation 20, the covenant God made with Israel, and the New Covenant are solid. God will not allow Israel to be destroyed. There is a remnant there still to be saved, and they will be. And as I said before, and I can't help repeating, it will be glorious. I am with Paul's presented emotions when he says what could the salvation of Israel be, but life from the dead. And those in the church, non-Hebrew Gentile, and Jews, will be there to see this glorious "resurrection". (I get that from life from the dead, so I am not saying actual resurrection.)

Christ's inheritance is all of creation. Israel's inheritance is what was promised by God to Abraham. What about the rest? From prophecy, there are Gentiles in those other lands, seeking out God through the Jewish people.

The covenant is not all there is. As you said, the Gentiles do not have a covenant with God. All the God-fearers amongst the non-Hebrew Gentiles have are the blessing of God (Psalms) and the kindness of God (Romans). As Adam was the representative of all humanity, the New Adam is also the representative of all humanity. However, the difference is that the New Adam (Christ) is the representative of all humanity who believe in Him by faith. Jew and Gentile.

 

[armylngst]

The Law of Moses (Mosaic Covenant) provided Israel the means to avoid the wrath of God through substitutionary sacrifice. This is contained primarily in the Ceremonial Law, but the Social and Moral Law is also part of the full redemption of Israel through covenant.

It provided a covering for sin, but only a covering. And, if you read your Old Testament properly, only for those sins that are not willful. So those who committed a willful sin were not covered by the sacrifice.

The initial doctrine of substitutionary sacrifice through covenant is described being taught Adam and Eve in Genesis 3:21.

I can see that. I think it is more that there is only covering for sin (shown metaphorically also by God making clothing) by the shedding of blood. I believe the true example of the substitutionary sacrifice of Christ is seen in Abraham sacrificing Isaac. God provided Abraham a substitute for his son in the ram trapped in a thicket.

21 Unto Adam also and to his wife did the LORD God make coats of skins, and clothed them. Genesis 3:21.
From the beginning and being passed on to God's people relationship with God is established early.

I believe there are a lot of people from the Old Testament that will be in heaven from before Abraham's time. Why? The closer we are to Adam and Eve, people knew God. Even Abimelech, who was not a Hebrew, knew who God was and feared Him. (I am not saying feared God as a believer, but actual fear.) When God told Abimelech not to touch Sarah because she is Abrahams wife, Abimelech immediately said they hadn't touched her, and God said that he didn't allow them to. Why? Mercy.

26 And to Seth, to him also there was born a son; and he called his name Enos: then began men to call upon the name of the LORD. Genesis 4:26.
This does not mean people can "call" upon the Lord as in calling out to someone. Those that call upon the Lord are already in relationship with God and is a term that speaks of relationship. For no man may approach the Lord unless they are first called out by God. As David said:

4 Blessed is the man whom thou choosest,
And causest to approach unto thee, that he may dwell in thy courts:
We shall be satisfied with the goodness of thy house,
Even of thy holy temple.
Psalms 65:4.

I believe that this is that people prayed to God and called out to Him. God's relationship towards people was different in the beginning. I am not saying that God was different, but the way He related to HIs creation and how He presented Himself was different. Again, I would say that it is due to the amount of knowledge people had of God the closer we get to Adam and Eve. Psalms 65:4 is not dealing with that.

The terminology of "to call upon the Lord" refers to worship. And only those whom God chooses can approach God for worship. And worship itself speaks of relationship. From Adam to Moses God has had a people in relationship with Him. Later, in the process of time God made promises to each person so named in Scripture that were in relationship with God. That's all these promises were. They were God's promises (covenant) to these people at the very beginning. Later, with Abram God made promises to Abram and to his wife, Sarai, and these are recorded in Scripture. Formality was effected with Abram, then Isaac, and then Jacob and his twelve sons. They were heirs of the Abrahamic Promises (covenant) and so continued the plan of God for His people Israel.

"To "call upon the Lord" is to pray, worship, or call out to God in times of need, seeking His help, guidance, or salvation." God expects worship and praise from His creation. He does refuse it, even from the Hebrews. Now, these were not covenants made to people who called out to Him. The formation of a covenant requires the shedding of blood and sacrifices. For Abraham, Abraham prepared the sacrifices, and God passed through it. Death/blood is a requirement for covenant. Look at Jacob and Laban. They made a covenant, and sacrifices ere part of it. The shedding of blood was part of it. The making of a covenant using blood was the same for those between God and man, and those between men. God served as the example.

For the Mosaic covenant, Aaron's family had blood placed on their right ear, right thumb, and right big toe. The people had blood sprinkled all over them when the made their statement and made covenant with God. Hence the New Covenant was in Jesus' blood. The only covenant mentioned, besides Adam, Abraham and Moses, is Noah. However, that covenant was made with all creation, not simply with Noah. The promise of not flooding the world again, and the day that meat was added to the menu.

Those who feared God were blessed by God and saved. There was no covenant necessary. What saved them? Hebrews says it clearly... FAITH. I am not saying that God did not make covenants, however, scripture does not say so, and there is no room for assumption. So I say no, with the understanding that it MAY have happened, just that there is no need for it to have happened.