civic
Well-known member
You can’t see faith precedes regeneration/ new birth/ eternal life , salvation . God has not granted to eyes to see the truth.You cant see it
Hope this helps !!!
You can’t see faith precedes regeneration/ new birth/ eternal life , salvation . God has not granted to eyes to see the truth.You cant see it
GOD TAKES NO PLEASURE IN THE DEATH OF THE WCKED so HE would never create them to just damn them...God created the reprobate to punish them for their sins, before they existed to sin. It pleased Him to do that.
...and free masonry I believe.That is not the God of the bible but the god of gnosticism
Ok Don't know much About them...and free masonry I believe.
Nothing there to seeYou cant see it
Your choiceI think it is time we stop. We are only contradicting each other, trying to explain by repetition. It's getting nowhere.
It certainly is as you are determining nothing. God determines it all in Calvinismmakesends said:
Yes. I said no different. What you decide is part of what God determined. But perhaps you can show me how I said different.
You are sloughing your words again. "Part of what God determined" does not contradict that God determines all things —it doesn't even qualify what God determines. It only includes what you decide within what God determined. This is getting ridiculous.
Its good to see some "calvinists" distance themselves from some of the doctrines taught by Calvin and others. Double predestination being one of them for example and meticulous determinism.It certainly is as you are determining nothing. God determines it all in Calvinism
If God merely foresaw human events, and did not also arrange and dispose of them at his pleasure, there might be room for agitating the question, how far his foreknowledge amounts to necessity; but since he foresees the things which are to happen, simply because he has decreed that they are so to happen, it is vain to debate about prescience, while it is clear that all events take place by his sovereign appointment.
(John Calvin, Institutes of Christian Religion, Book 3, Chapter 23, Paragraph 6)
God is the only being who is ultimately self-determining, and is himself ultimately the disposer of all things, including all choices — however many or diverse other intervening causes are. On this definition, no human being has free will, at any time. Neither before or after the fall, or in heaven, are creatures ultimately self-determining A beginners guide to free will
Nothing that exists or occurs falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing, including no evil person or thing or event or deed. God’s foreordination is the ultimate reason why everything comes about, including the existence of all evil persons and things and the occurrence of any evil acts or events. And so it is not inappropriate to take God to be the creator, the sender, the permitter, and sometimes even the instigator of evil… Nothing — no evil thing or person or event or deed — falls outside God’s ordaining will. Nothing arises, exists, or endures independently of God’s will. So when even the worst of evils befall us, they do not ultimately come from anywhere other than God’s hand.
b Talbot, "All the Good That Is Ours in Christ", in Suffering and the Sovereignty of God, ed. John Piper and Justin Taylor,
Quote may be found
All the Good That Is Ours in Christ
“Never shall I forget those moments that murdered my God and my soul and turned my dreams to ashes.” Nobel Peace Prize winner Elie Wiesel wrote these words in light of his horrific experience at Auschwitz. He questioned where God was during his unjust suffering. Many of us wonder the same.www.desiringgod.org
Calvinist; Dr. James N. Anderson, of the Reformed Theological Seminary, Charlotte NC, in his published work; Calvinism and the first sin, states the underlying proposition: “It should be conceded at the outset, and without embarrassment, that Calvinism is indeed committed to divine determinism: the view that everything is ultimately determined by God…..take it for granted as something on which the vast majority of Calvinists uphold, and may be expressed as the following: “For every event [E], God decided that [E] should happen and that decision alone was the ultimate sufficient cause of [E].
Calvinism and the problem of evil pg 204.205
You still can't see it may God have mercy on youYou can’t see faith precedes regeneration/ new birth/ eternal life , salvation . God has not granted to eyes to see the truth.
Hope this helps !!!
That's talking about something else he definitely takes pleasure in damning the reprobate the vessels of wrathGOD TAKES NO PLEASURE IN THE DEATH OF THE WCKED so HE would never create them to just damn them...
Because you can't see itNothing there to see
projecting since Jesus has made me see- John 9:6You still can't see it may God have mercy on you
Again it is not there.Because you can't see it
Calvinism does indeed have some very difficult doctrines that paint God in a bad light.Its good to see some "calvinists" distance themselves from some of the doctrines taught by Calvin and others. Double predestination being one of them for example and meticulous determinism.
The other one they have trouble swallowing and make every excuse in the book for is in predestination God ordains EVERYTHING that comes to pass but somehow gets a free pass with sin/evil and is not responsible as the cause.
Its doubletalk and their creeds are filled with such nonsense. I know I once believed them hook, line and sinker. The doctrines are many contradictions where " mystery " comes into play when there are logical/moral contradictions.
The question has to be asked, "Why has God chosen us?"I've seen on here someone who says Jesus is the elect, not believers. 1 Thessalonians says otherwise:
NKJV
2 We give thanks to God always for you all, making mention of you in our prayers, 3 remembering without ceasing your work of faith, labor of love, and patience of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ in the sight of our God and Father, 4 knowing, beloved brethren, your election by God.
NIV
4 For we know, brothers and sisters loved by God, that he has chosen you
I'm not going say I disagree or agree with a lable - calvinist and/or reformed. What I will point out is what is stated in Scripture and what it seems to suggest.
Romans 9:6-29
But it is not as though the word of God has failed. For they are not all Israel who are descended from Israel; 7 nor are they all children because they are Abraham’s seed, but: “THROUGH ISAAC YOUR SEED WILL BE NAMED.” 8 That is, the children of the flesh are not the children of God, but the children of the promise are considered as seed. 9 For this is the word of promise: “AT THIS TIME I WILL COME, AND SARAH SHALL HAVE A SON.” 10 And not only this, but there was Rebekah also, when she had conceived twins by one man, our father Isaac; 11 for though the twins were not yet born and had not done anything good or bad, so that the purpose of God according to His choice would stand, not because of works but because of Him who calls, 12 it was said to her, “THE OLDER SHALL SERVE THE YOUNGER.” 13 Just as it is written, “JACOB I LOVED, BUT ESAU I HATED.”
14 What shall we say then? Is there any unrighteousness with God? May it never be! 15 For He says to Moses, “I WILL HAVE MERCY ON WHOM I HAVE MERCY, AND I WILL HAVE COMPASSION ON WHOM I HAVE COMPASSION.” 16 So then it does not depend on the one who wills or the one who runs, but on God who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “FOR THIS VERY PURPOSE I RAISED YOU UP, IN ORDER TO DEMONSTRATE MY POWER IN YOU, AND IN ORDER THAT MY NAME MIGHT BE PROCLAIMED THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE EARTH.” 18 So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.
19 You will say to me then, “Why does He still find fault? For who resists His will?” 20 On the contrary, who are you, O man, who answers back to God? WILL THE THING MOLDED SAY TO THE MOLDER, “WHY DID YOU MAKE ME LIKE THIS”? 21 Or does not the potter have authority over the clay, to make from the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 And what if God, wanting to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath having been prepared for destruction, 23 and in order that He might make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory— 24 even us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from among Gentiles? 25 As He says also in Hosea,
“I WILL CALL THOSE WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, ‘MY PEOPLE,’
AND HER WHO WAS NOT BELOVED, ‘BELOVED.’”
26 “AND IT SHALL BE THAT IN THE PLACE WHERE IT WAS SAID TO THEM, ‘YOU ARE NOT MY PEOPLE,’
THERE THEY SHALL BE CALLED SONS OF THE LIVING GOD.”
27 And Isaiah cries out concerning Israel, “THOUGH THE NUMBER OF THE SONS OF ISRAEL BE LIKE THE SAND OF THE SEA, IT IS THE REMNANT THAT WILL BE SAVED; 28 FOR THE LORD WILL EXECUTE HIS WORD ON THE LAND, THOROUGHLY AND QUICKLY.” 29 And just as Isaiah foretold,
“UNLESS THE LORD OF SABAOTH HAD LEFT TO US A SEED,
WE WOULD HAVE BECOME LIKE SODOM, AND WOULD HAVE RESEMBLED GOMORRAH.”
For this is the word of promise: “AT THIS TIME I WILL COME, AND SARAH SHALL HAVE A SON.” 10 And not only this
That is, the children of the flesh are not the children of God, but the children of the promise are considered as seed. 9 For this is the word of promise: “AT THIS TIME I WILL COME, AND SARAH SHALL HAVE A SON.”
Correct since you cant see it, its not there to youAgain it is not there.
You are not reading scripture.
You are inserting your theology.
AmenGOD TAKES NO PLEASURE IN THE DEATH OF THE WCKED so HE would never create them to just damn them...
Where does it say this?? I have at least two verses saying HE takes NO pleasure in their death.That's talking about something else he definitely takes pleasure in damning the reprobate the vessels of wrath
GOD TAKES NO PLEASURE IN THE DEATH OF THE WCKED so HE would never create them to just damn them...