The Bible does not teach to pray to Jesus

TibiasDad said:
The Father and the Lamb are not the same person, and no one is saying anything otherwise. Both are equally God in nature.



I didn’t need anything cleared up; your understanding of what I believe is apparently is a little foggy though.


Doug
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Is God a status or what exactly?
 
TibiasDad said:
The Father and the Lamb are not the same person, and no one is saying anything otherwise. Both are equally God in nature.



I didn’t need anything cleared up; your understanding of what I believe is apparently is a little foggy though.


Doug
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Your response is proper.

Runningman in another post challenged my post by saying "How is God the same person as Jesus if the Spirit of God raised Jesus from the dead?"

So the concept of "person" is not matching with the terms used to acknowledge and describe (or narrow) the understanding of the Triune God. Maybe that is what confuses Runningman about the essence of God -- i.e., the misconception of "person."
 
mikesw said:
I however would disagree. Abraham did start off as pagan but believed God. Moses maybe had basic introduction to the God of Abraham and Isaac but this was sufficient not to call him pagan. The Israel people usually followed pagan gods, but the prophets were aligned with the true God. So I would say the pagan influence was effectively non-existent.
It is also very boastful and exaggerating to say billions got it right but a little colony of people figured out the "true christ" and thus stand high above all others. If your doctrine is as messed up as other unitarians, it would be best to hide in a little corner and hope at least you will still be accepted by Christ.
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The trinity is Pagan. That was my point and there was no other point about Abraham or Moses or Israel.
 
Runningman said:
Is God a status or what exactly?
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God is a state of being, just like being human is a state of being. It is a category of existence determined by the characteristics of its essential reality. Dogs are canine, cats are feline. Men and women are human, angels are angelic, and the members of the Trinity are God/divine.

The essential thing that determines God in my mind is being eternal/uncreated. Secondary to this is being “Omni” in capacity of abilities, and thus being Sovereign above and over all other levels of existence and reality.


Doug
 
TibiasDad said:
God is a state of being, just like being human is a state of being. It is a category of existence determined by the characteristics of its essential reality. Dogs are canine, cats are feline. Men and women are human, angels are angelic, and the members of the Trinity are God/divine.

The essential thing that determines God in my mind is being eternal/uncreated. Secondary to this is being “Omni” in capacity of abilities, and thus being Sovereign above and over all other levels of existence and reality.


Doug
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Amen brother !!!
 
TibiasDad said:
God is a state of being, just like being human is a state of being. It is a category of existence determined by the characteristics of its essential reality. Dogs are canine, cats are feline. Men and women are human, angels are angelic, and the members of the Trinity are God/divine.

The essential thing that determines God in my mind is being eternal/uncreated. Secondary to this is being “Omni” in capacity of abilities, and thus being Sovereign above and over all other levels of existence and reality.


Doug
Click to expand...
This is consistent with my theory that you belong to the LDS church. I believe they are they only sect that thinks that deity is a status or state of being that can be achieved. I already asked once and I don't recall you answering. So are you an LDS?
 
Runningman said:
This is consistent with my theory that you belong to the LDS church. I believe they are they only sect that thinks that deity is a status or state of being that can be achieved. I already asked once and I don't recall you answering. So are you an LDS?
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Wrong he doesn't think that and you are misrepresenting what he believes. He like myself is a trinitarian not a mormon.
 
civic said:
Wrong he doesn't think that and you are misrepresenting what he believes. He like myself is a trinitarian not a mormon.
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The Latter Day Saints believe that God is a status or state of being. In this way, they can become gods too. If God is a person, and He is, then all bets are off and Jesus can't be God. This is similar to what trinitarians do as well, except it's a little bit of a different approach because God becomes an essence or substance this is distributed among three members. Either way, you are both calling God a thing and it's a mighty heresy.

He has said a number of things that are in lock step with LDS doctrine, such as his most recent statement.

According to Hebrews 1 God is a person and God is described as a thinking, feeling, talking person all over the Bible.

Hebrews 1 KJV
3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
 
Runningman said:
The Latter Day Saints believe that God is a status or state of being. In this way, they can become gods too. If God is a person, and He is, then all bets are off and Jesus can't be God. This is similar to what trinitarians do as well, except it's a little bit of a different approach because God becomes an essence or substance this is distributed among three members. Either way, you are both calling God a thing and it's a mighty heresy.

He has said a number of things that are in lock step with LDS doctrine, such as his most recent statement.

According to Hebrews 1 God is a person and God is described as a thinking, feeling, talking person all over the Bible.

Hebrews 1 KJV
3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Click to expand...
Well neither @TibiasDad or I believe what the mormons do about Gods state of being. So you are arguing a strawman.
 
Runningman said:
The Latter Day Saints believe that God is a status or state of being. In this way, they can become gods too. If God is a person, and He is, then all bets are off and Jesus can't be God. This is similar to what trinitarians do as well, except it's a little bit of a different approach because God becomes an essence or substance this is distributed among three members. Either way, you are both calling God a thing and it's a mighty heresy.

He has said a number of things that are in lock step with LDS doctrine, such as his most recent statement.

According to Hebrews 1 God is a person and God is described as a thinking, feeling, talking person all over the Bible.

Hebrews 1 KJV
3Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Click to expand...
God is not a thing no more than you are a thing. God like you is PERSONAL, a PERSONAL BEING.

next fallacy
 
civic said:
Well neither @TibiasDad or I believe what the mormons do about Gods state of being. So you are arguing a strawman.
Click to expand...
civic said:
God is not a thing no more than you are a thing. God like you is PERSONAL, a PERSONAL BEING.

next fallacy
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You just contradicted @TibiasDad who said God is a state of being (a thing) to which you had initially went on record shouting a resounding amen. Now that you've been exposed, it seems you are back pedaling fast out of that hole. So now you confess God is a being instead?

Question, are you and @TibiasDad secret mormons?
 
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Runningman said:
You just contradicted @TibiasDad who said God is a state of being (a thing) to which you had initially went on record shouting a resounding amen. Now that you've been exposed, it seems you are back pedaling fast out of that hole. So now you confess God is a bieng instead?
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He doesn't mean in in the same way as the mormons.

next fallacy
 
"Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son." John 14:13
So if we ask the Father for something, Jesus will answer us? So if Jesus answers our request of the Father, who are we really praying to when we're requesting that thing? BOTH the Father and the Son.
This is confirmed by Jesus' next statement:
"If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it." The Greek says: "If you ask Me anything in the name of Me, I will do it." John 14:14
Is this confusing? Well, yes, if there's no such thing as a Trinity.

Once again, Jesus encourages us to pray to Him - as well as the Father. And why wouldn't we? We are in fellowship with both the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. 1 John 1:3 "our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son ..."
2 Cor. 13:14 "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all."
 
dwight92070 said:
"Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son." John 14:13
So if we ask the Father for something, Jesus will answer us? So if Jesus answers our request of the Father, who are we really praying to when we're requesting that thing? BOTH the Father and the Son.
This is confirmed by Jesus' next statement:
"If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it." The Greek says: "If you ask Me anything in the name of Me, I will do it." John 14:14

Once again, Jesus encourages us to pray to Him - as well as the Father. And why wouldn't we? We are in fellowship with both the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. 1 John 1:3 "our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son ..."
2 Cor. 13:14 "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all."
Click to expand...
yes they just give Jesus lip service and pick and choose what they agree with in the bible, not what contradicts their beliefs.
 
dwight92070 said:
"Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son." John 14:13
So if we ask the Father for something, Jesus will answer us? So if Jesus answers our request of the Father, who are we really praying to when we're requesting that thing? BOTH the Father and the Son.
This is confirmed by Jesus' next statement:
"If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it." The Greek says: "If you ask Me anything in the name of Me, I will do it." John 14:14
Is this confusing? Well, yes, if there's no such thing as a Trinity.

Once again, Jesus encourages us to pray to Him - as well as the Father. And why wouldn't we? We are in fellowship with both the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. 1 John 1:3 "our fellowship is with the Father and with His Son ..."
2 Cor. 13:14 "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all."
Click to expand...
No that's wrong. In the context of John 14, Jesus was telling them they could talk to him now and he would in turn ask the Father. However, later Jesus gave clear instructions to stop asking him for things after he ascended to heaven. So Jesus never taught anyone to pray to him. Have you ever read Matthew 6:6,9?

John 16
23And in that day ye shall ask me nothing. Verily, verily, I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall ask the Father in my name, he will give it you.
 
Runningman said:
This is consistent with my theory that you belong to the LDS church. I believe they are they only sect that thinks that deity is a status or state of being that can be achieved. I already asked once and I don't recall you answering. So are you an LDS?
Click to expand...
I am not LDS nor do I employ the word “status” in the sense that you accuse me of using. It is a category of being or type of existence, and one cannot ascend to something different; I am an ordained pastor in the Church of the Nazarene and am opposed to the doctrinal positions of the LDS in its Christology and its definition of God’s nature of existence.

Your argument reinforces the notion that you have no understanding of my beliefs and theology in particular, nor of what Orthodoxy teaches in general.

Doug
 

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