Praying to Jesus

Try praying to the Father

I do, and to Jesus.

Your assertion concerning John 16:23 was a total flop.

Ephesians 5:20
Giving thanks always and for everything to God the Father in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,

1 Timothy 1:12
I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who strengthened me, for He considered me faithful, putting me into the ministry.

That's great you quoted Ephesians 5:20 in reference to praying to the Father, because 1 Timothy 1:12 is in reference to praying to the Lord Jesus.
 
I will never embrace a cultist and even you,
that spread heresy. I am particular about my friendships. I draw the line on heretics, sexual predators, scam artists and other undesirables.
You called him a moron a few posts back! Not very Christlike. I am sure some folks are very relieved you do not wish to call them friends.
 
You called him a moron a few posts back! Not very Christlike. I am sure some folks are very relieved you do not wish to call them friends.
If the shoe fits wear it. I have no shortage of friends. I have a lot of chutzpah, maybe more than I should.
When you have undesirable's as friends, in time they will make your life undesirable. That's a biblical principal
you should learn and follow.
 
You called him a moron a few posts back! Not very Christlike. I am sure some folks are very relieved you do not wish to call them friends.
I agree. We should all speak to each other respectfully. I actually happen to like David a lot even though he doesn’t seem to like me much.
 
To make a doctrine of prayer to Jesus, you should systemically explain how speaking to Jesus is different than speaking to someone else on earth or heaven because the word prayer is not used in conjunction with speaking to Jesus. It just isn't and that's the truth.

When we are speaking to each other we are not praying. When John spoke to an elder in heaven he wasn't praying. None of the examples of speaking to Jesus say it's praying. Sounds like Jesus was never prayed to in the Bible.

You don't think Jesus' only teaching directly specifying prayer is not good enough? He was direct about it in Matthew 6:6,9.
Again framing

Prayer is petition to, conversation with, a supernatural being/God.

Stephen on Earth calling on Christ in heaven to receive his Spirit (which BTW the spirit is stated to return to God at death) and asking him to forgive the sins of those who stoned him (Only God can forgive sin) is clearly prayer
 
I do, and to Jesus.

Your assertion concerning John 16:23 was a total flop.



1 Timothy 1:12
I thank Christ Jesus our Lord, who strengthened me, for He considered me faithful, putting me into the ministry.

That's great you quoted Ephesians 5:20 in reference to praying to the Father, because 1 Timothy 1:12 is in reference to praying to the Lord Jesus.
He is playing the typical word salad to deny Christs glory, honor, power, praise and worship due His Name that is above every name.
 
If the shoe fits wear it. I have no shortage of friends. I have a lot of chutzpah, maybe more than I should.
When you have undesirable's as friends, in time they will make your life undesirable. That's a biblical principal
you should learn and follow.
Really? How is he so undesirable that you should disdain him? Because he disagrees.? Call it whatever you like, it is a very unbecoming way to speak about him. Doesn't matter how many friends you have.. But are you stopping him from association because you are tired of arguing. you can still like someone and be tired of arguing. How is he going to make your life undesirable? You dont have to be friends with everyone, but if you get angry with someone, you need to stop and question that spirit of anger.
 
It is not just Jehovah’s Witnesses that argue for only praying to the Father. I have also heard a few evangelical Christians argue that we should not pray to Jesus.1 One argument made for this position is that the Lord’s Prayer is addressed to the Father and not to the Son. However, it is precisely because Jesus is a divine Person that we can (and should) pray to Him.

One of the students I taught at that weekend seminar shared with me that for years she had taught her children only to pray to the Father, since that is what she was taught by an influential evangelical teacher. But this family practice gradually lapsed into prayers to both the Father and the Son since praying to both seemed so natural for the kids—and the parents. My student wanted to know what I thought about the issue. Other students have asked in one way or another: “Is it wrong to pray to Jesus?” This article will respond to that question.

The Lord’s Prayer 2

Does the fact that this model prayer addresses the Father and not the Son mean that we are never to address the Son (or the Spirit) in prayer? No. By giving us a model prayer, Jesus did not limit our prayers to a certain structure or verbiage. Otherwise, we would need to eliminate using the words “in Jesus’ name,” since they do not appear in the Lord’s Prayer. We would also need to eliminate thanksgiving from our prayers, since that does not show up in the Lord’s Prayer. But obviously, we should give thanks to God in our prayers (1 Thessalonians 5:17–18). Christ's words, “Our Father which art in Heaven” don't keep us from praying to Jesus any more than his words “Give us our daily bread” keep us from praying for something to drink. Furthermore, it would have been a bit odd for Jesus to pray to Himself instead of the Father. We learn a great deal from this prayer, but it does not teach us everything we should know about talking to God.

It is appropriate to pray to the Father directly; the Lord’s Prayer clearly shows that. However, just because we are permitted to pray, and even commanded to pray to the Father, doesn’t mean that we are not permitted to pray to the Son.

Jesus accepted prayers of praise and petition​

Some might say that prayers of praise to Jesus are legitimate while prayers of petition are not. I will argue that Jesus accepted and still accepts both kinds of prayer. Take note of both in the examples shown below.

New Testament Christians everywhere praying to Jesus​

According to the apostle Paul, New Testament Christians were everywhere praying to Jesus. “Paul. . . to the church of God in Corinth, to those sanctified in Christ Jesus and called to be holy, together with all those everywhere who call on3 the name of our Lord Jesus Christ—their Lord and ours (1 Corinthians 1:1–2).”4 It appears that Paul includes himself among those who called upon the name of Jesus. These prayers directed to Jesus were universal. And the present tense of “call” suggests that the prayers were on-going.5

Paul petitions Jesus to remove the “thorn in the flesh”​

Paul also prayed to Jesus when he “besought the Lord” to remove his thorn in the flesh (2 Corinthians 12:8). Why do we believe that the reference to “the Lord” here refers to Jesus instead of the Father? In the Pauline epistles, the term “Lord” (kurios) usually signifies Jesus,6 while “God” usually denotes to the Father. And look at the response of Paul when the Lord said to him, “[My] strength is made perfect in your weakness” (2 Corinthians 12:9). Paul tells us that he would glory in his weakness that the “power of Christ” (the Lord) would be revealed in him. So the referent for “the Lord” is Jesus. Paul prayed to Jesus, and Jesus responded. Notice that these were prayers of petition, not praise. These were not spontaneous petitions or petitions given in response to the voice of the Lord or a vision, but a prayer prayed three times, as Paul persisted in his request to Jesus. If it were inappropriate for someone to offer supplication to Jesus, Paul would not have asked Jesus three times to answer a specific request. Jesus did not rebuke Paul for praying the prayer, but He did inform Paul that he was better off without the request being granted.

Other prayers of Paul​

In 2 Thessalonians 2:16–17, Paul blessed the Thessalonians with these words: “May our Lord Jesus Christ himself and God our Father. . . encourage your hearts and strengthen you in every good deed and word.” Even though this benedictory prayer is in a different form than other prayers, it implies a request to Jesus (and the Father), and this suggests the legitimacy of prayer to Jesus.7 Paul expected Jesus to answer this request. A similar benedictory prayer (invoking the name of Jesus) is found in 1 Thessalonians 3:11–14.

The worship of Jesus​

In the Gospels, Jesus was worshipped, and He accepted it (John 9:38). Surely this involved verbal communication to Jesus or prayer. The Gospels are not the only place where worship of Jesus occurs. The angels are told to worship Jesus.8 There is worship of Jesus (the Lamb) in Revelation by both angels and humans (Revelation 5:8–13).

Since all three members of the Trinity are God, then worship is due to each of them, collectively and individually, because of the nature of the Trinity. Worship involves praise and adoration. It would be wrong to discourage people from addressing each member of the Trinity in praise and adoration. God expects us to worship Jesus. The Jehovah’s Witnesses will not pray to Jesus because they think that He is not worthy of worship. We pray to Jesus because we know He is worthy of worship, and that He even demands worship. Jesus commanded us to honor the Son just as we honor the Father (John 5:23). If we fail to give praise to the Son in our prayers, as we give praise the Father, would we really be honoring the Son as we do the Father?

The early church recognized the importance of worshipping Jesus through prayer. In fact, when Athanasius made his case against Arianism in the early 300’s, he pointed out that Christians had prayed to Jesus from the beginning. Athanasius argued that if Jesus was not of the same substance as the Father (homoousios) and was instead only a creature—only of like substance with the Father (homoiousios), then Christians from the beginning would have been committing idolatry by praying to Jesus.9

Petitions to Jesus in the Gospels​

In the Gospels, many people asked Jesus for miracles. In a survey of the New Testament, I counted at least seven distinct times when people cried out to Jesus for mercy, treating him as a divine person, and they expected an answer. Should not these requests be considered prayers? Surely, Christ’s departure into Heaven does not mean that his followers can no longer bring petitions to Him.

Other examples of prayers to Jesus​

There are other examples of appropriate prayers to Jesus in the New Testament.10Stephen prayed, “Lord Jesus, receive my Spirit” (Acts 7:59). At Paul’s conversion, he prayed to Jesus: “Lord, what wilt thou have me do?” (Acts 9:6). Ananias conversed with Jesus when Jesus spoke to him in a vision (Acts 9:10–14). And the very last prayer in the New Testament is addressed to Jesus by the Apostle John: “Even so come, Lord Jesus!” (Revelation 22:20). If it were wrong to petition Christ, John the inspired writer may have said, “Father, may the Son come.” But instead he gave us these words to also cry out to Jesus: “Even so, come!”

The last verse referred to may allude to the phrase, “Maranatha” (found in 1 Corinthians 16:22), which is usually translated as the petition, “Come, O Lord.” “Maranatha” is an Aramaic expression that originated before Christians had filtered throughout the Gentile community. It seems that very early on, the Christians were crying out to Jesus, “Come, O Lord!”11 This was a prayer of petition.

Jesus claimed that He will answer our petitions​

A verse in John 14 strongly encourages prayers of petition to Jesus. Jesus said, “Whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, so that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it.”12 Jesus here says that he would answer prayer when we asked him anything in his name. So Jesus authorizes us to address him in prayer when we come in his name—in his own authority, and in his will. And he promised that he would answer.

Prayers in the name of Jesus​

Prayers to Jesus are permitted and encouraged by Christ’s teaching in John 14:14, and by any passage in which Jesus says that we are to pray in His name. When Jesus told us to pray in His name, He wasn’t asking us to use a particular phrase at the end of each of our prayers, though the expression “in Jesus’ name, Amen” is certainly appropriate, and God-honored. Jesus was actually asking us to come to God (therefore any member of the Trinity) in His authority. We have the right to come to God and receive grace and help because of who Christ is, what He did for us, and what He promised. He has given us “great and exceeding promises” (2 Peter 1:1–4) and when we come to God with our requests, we have been authorized to come in faith, believing that He will fulfill what He has promised. It is like the note I wrote to my girls to motivate them to clean their room,


This note was a promissory note with my signature. When one of the girls came to present the note to me, she was coming in my name, or authority. The girls had every right to expect that I would take them out for ice cream when they brought back the note with my promise and my name on it. Jesus gave us some promises as a divine being with the authority to make much greater promises than I could make. We come to Him or to the Father in His authority. He has given us the “promissory note” with His “signature” so that we can be assured of the answer to our prayers. Praying in His name is praying with faith that He will keep his promises as the good, faithful, and all-powerful God. Whether those faith-filled words are directed to the Son or to the Father makes little difference, since both Father and Son are the one true God. (If one wants to use the phrase “in Jesus’ name” at the end of a prayer prayed to Jesus, “in your name, Amen” can be used instead.)

Praying to the Father, through the Son, in the Holy Spirit​

There is a sense in which all of our prayers, even ones we pray to the Spirit or the Son, are ultimately directed to the Father, who is the Head of the Trinity (John 14:26; 1 Corinthians 11:3). It is through Christ that we have access to the Father. And we pray in the Spirit to the Father. “For through Him we both have access by one Spirit to the Father” (Ephesians 2:18). The Spirit’s role is important. Romans 8:26 says that the Spirit helps us in our weakness: “For we do not know what we should pray for as we ought, but the Spirit Himself makes intercession for us with groaning which cannot be uttered.” So we are to pray in the Spirit and through Jesus (on the basis of what He has done for us, and in His authority). However, to actually pray to the Spirit or to the Son while praying in the Spirit does not delegitimize our prayer. When we pray to the Spirit we are still praying to God. And when we pray to Jesus in His authority, we are still praying to God, and in a sense to the Father Himself.

Because prayers directed to the Father are so common in the New Testament, it is certainly appropriate to address the Father on a regular basis (we should pray to him often). But I am confident that God is not counting our prayers to each member of the Trinity to make sure we have prayed to each one in proper proportion. The Trinity is not “jealous” of one another. Of course, if we are leaving one member of the Trinity out completely, then there may be a problem with our view of that member of the Trinity. Communicating to each Person in the Godhead is important for having fellowship with our tri-personal God.

Prayer is important to cultivate a personal relationship with Jesus​

Think about the fact that Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are all divine persons. Since they are persons, they are all capable of having relationships not just with each other, but also with humans. Does God want us to have a personal relationship with each of the divine persons in the Trinity? If so, how could we develop a relationship specifically with Jesus without verbally communicating with Him? How could we develop a relationship with anyone we don’t talk to? Personal relationships must involve communication. If we communicate with God the Son, we are praying to Him.

In John 10, Jesus claims that He knows his followers, His “sheep,” and that He calls them all by name. If our Shepherd calls us by our name (a most comforting thought), then why shouldn’t we also call Him by His name? At the very least, this passage indicates that real Christians have a personal, one-on-one, intimate relationship with Jesus. This must involve talking to Jesus and listening for His voice.

What about the Holy Spirit? Are prayers to Him legitimate too? The Apostle Paul refers to our communion with the Holy Spirit13 and to our fellowship with the Spirit.14 Again, how can we have communion or fellowship with someone we don’t talk to? Even the Holy Spirit desires to have fellowship with us. Dr. Bill Ury asks, “When’s the last time, in prayer, that you spoke to the Holy Spirit with the same tenderness, intimacy, and trust as you do the Father and Son?”15 If prayers to the Holy Spirit are legitimate, then of course it is appropriate to pray to Jesus.

The Sinner’s Prayer: Praying to Jesus to enter into a relationship with Him​

If you have ever prayed with someone to receive Christ, you may have quoted John 1:12(“But as many as received him [Jesus], to them gave he the right to become the Sons of God”). You may have encouraged the sinner to acknowledge Jesus as Lord and ask Him for forgiveness of sins. This is very important for the sinner to do. If you believed it were inappropriate to pray to Jesus, you would not ask the sinner to pray to Jesus.16 But believing it is proper to pray to Christ, you encourage the sinner to say a prayer to Him. This prayer to Jesus will be the beginning of a lifetime of fellowship between this new Christian and his Savior, whom he can commune with every day.

Singing to Jesus as a form of prayer​

In Ephesians 5:19 Paul wrote that believers should “[Speak] to one another in psalms and hymns and spiritual songs, singing and making melody in your heart to the Lord.” Paul is likely telling us to sing to Jesus (“the Lord”). Since songs addressed to a divine Person are simply prayers set to rhyme and music, we could take it as a command: We are to pray to Jesus in the form of singing.

There is early evidence from church history that Christians took this command seriously. For example, proof of early hymns to Jesus is found in a letter from the Roman Governor Pliny the Younger to the Emperor Trajan (about A.D. 110). Pliny accused the Christians of “singing hymns to Christ as to a god.” This demonstrates that Christians worshiped Christ very close to the time the church began. These early Christians verbalized their adoration of Christ in hymns of praise, and risked their lives in doing so.

A hymn that developed perhaps in the later decades of the second century is called the Phos Hilaron. It lauds Jesus as “Joyous light of the holy glory of the immortal Father,” and says to Jesus, “at all times you should be praised with auspicious voices, Son of God, Giver of life.”17 https://answersingenesis.org/jesus/jesus-is-god/can-we-pray-to-jesus/

hope this helps !!!

The Godhead, in my understanding, include God the Father, and His Son, the Lord's Christ. There is no question that Jesus said to pray to and worship the Father, "in His Name". He is still an Advocate between us, and His Father even to this day, according to Scriptures.

The danger of praying to Jesus alone, besides flat out rejecting His Sayings, is that this world's religions have created other Christs, and another Jesus. In the religions of this world God placed me in, they created an image of God, in the likeness of some random, very handsome long-haired man. This image of God is worshiped and installed all other the place. These same religions have created high days in worship of this same image, while rejecting the very Feasts of the Lord that are Holy to God's people, and Holy to Him.

This is in direct rebellion to the first of the 10 commandments. Paul warns about this same thing in Romans 1.

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

In this world's religions, the God and Father of the Lord's Christ is relegated as an unjust God, who places impossible to follow Laws they preach to others are a "Yoke of Bondage" on the necks of men who place their trust in Him, and then kills them when they couldn't keep them. Then this long haired, very handsome man that they call "Jesus", born on Dec. 25th, came to save them from this unjust God, and His impossible Laws.

By being a "Doer" of the Jesus "of the Bible's" Sayings, and not a hearer only, men can escape the snare and seduction of this world's religions, and Glorify God, "AS God", through His Son, the Holy One of Israel whose Day Abraham saw, and was glad. The Same "Rock" who became a man and dwelled among them to show them in the way that they should go, and provide atonement for those who would repent, turn to God, His Father, and do Works worthy of repentance.

Jesus said that this is Eternal Life, "that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

He also said All who are HIS, were given to Him by His Father, and they were also "learned of the Father". This World's religions promote "another Jesus" and we should "take Heed" not to be seduced by the "many" who come in Christ's Name, who promote this "image of God in the likeness of man".

Great Topic.
 
The Godhead, in my understanding, include God the Father, and His Son, the Lord's Christ. There is no question that Jesus said to pray to and worship the Father, "in His Name". He is still an Advocate between us, and His Father even to this day, according to Scriptures.

The danger of praying to Jesus alone, besides flat out rejecting His Sayings, is that this world's religions have created other Christs, and another Jesus. In the religions of this world God placed me in, they created an image of God, in the likeness of some random, very handsome long-haired man. This image of God is worshiped and installed all other the place. These same religions have created high days in worship of this same image, while rejecting the very Feasts of the Lord that are Holy to God's people, and Holy to Him.

This is in direct rebellion to the first of the 10 commandments. Paul warns about this same thing in Romans 1.

25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

In this world's religions, the God and Father of the Lord's Christ is relegated as an unjust God, who places impossible to follow Laws they preach to others are a "Yoke of Bondage" on the necks of men who place their trust in Him, and then kills them when they couldn't keep them. Then this long haired, very handsome man that they call "Jesus", born on Dec. 25th, came to save them from this unjust God, and His impossible Laws.

By being a "Doer" of the Jesus "of the Bible's" Sayings, and not a hearer only, men can escape the snare and seduction of this world's religions, and Glorify God, "AS God", through His Son, the Holy One of Israel whose Day Abraham saw, and was glad. The Same "Rock" who became a man and dwelled among them to show them in the way that they should go, and provide atonement for those who would repent, turn to God, His Father, and do Works worthy of repentance.

Jesus said that this is Eternal Life, "that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.

He also said All who are HIS, were given to Him by His Father, and they were also "learned of the Father". This World's religions promote "another Jesus" and we should "take Heed" not to be seduced by the "many" who come in Christ's Name, who promote this "image of God in the likeness of man".

Great Topic.
I never said pray to Jesus alone did I ?

I said Jesus is prayed to in the Bible just like the Father is prayed to in the Bible.
 
What the Bible says about Denying that Jesus was God in the Flesh
(From Forerunner Commentary)

1 John 2:22-23

The denial "that Jesus is the Christ" does not imply that the Docetists thought Jesus was not the Messiah. Rather, the Docetists claimed that Jesus—the Man whom John had heard, seen and touched—was not truly God in the flesh and that the true Christ was an ethereal being in heaven. John argues that such a teaching denies the family relationship of the Father and the Son, obscuring the true nature of God.

Furthermore, John writes, anyone who denies that Jesus was God in the flesh, subject to temptation just like all human beings, "does not have the Father either." Such a person simply does not understand the gospel message that we have the opportunity to become members of the God Family (I John 3:1-2). Jesus says, "He who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9). If we distort the image of Jesus Christ and who He was, we end up altering our concept of the Father also.
 
What the Bible says about Denying that Jesus was God in the Flesh
(From Forerunner Commentary)

1 John 2:22-23

The denial "that Jesus is the Christ" does not imply that the Docetists thought Jesus was not the Messiah. Rather, the Docetists claimed that Jesus—the Man whom John had heard, seen and touched—was not truly God in the flesh and that the true Christ was an ethereal being in heaven. John argues that such a teaching denies the family relationship of the Father and the Son, obscuring the true nature of God.

Furthermore, John writes, anyone who denies that Jesus was God in the flesh, subject to temptation just like all human beings, "does not have the Father either." Such a person simply does not understand the gospel message that we have the opportunity to become members of the God Family (I John 3:1-2). Jesus says, "He who has seen Me has seen the Father" (John 14:9). If we distort the image of Jesus Christ and who He was, we end up altering our concept of the Father also.
I have a thread on that topic which ties it into the spirit of antichrist which cross-references 1 John 4:2-3 with 2 John 1:7.
 
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