Irresistible Grace
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brightfame52
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I still see this as a attack on the sovereign reign of Grace through Christ Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life[Salvation] by Jesus Christ our Lord.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Thats your opinion and everyone has one
Selah
Well-known member
.
…but we both know that trust is essential in order to please God.
Eternally-Grateful
Well-known member
We do
He thinks it’s a work
As if trusting someone else is a work
Never heard of that in anything but Calvinism
But you do not address the scriptures
As always you run from scripture
Grace is not irresistible
Hebrews 12:15 (LEB) — 15 Take care that no one falls short of the grace of God; that no one growing up like a root of bitterness causes trouble, and by it many become defiled;
Acts 7:51 (LEB) — 51 “You stiff-necked people and uncircumcised in hearts and in your ears! You constantly resist the Holy Spirit! As your fathers did, so also do you!
2 Corinthians 6:1 (LEB) — 1 Now because we are fellow workers, we also urge you not to receive the grace of God in vain.
Hebrews 10:29 (LEB) — 29 How much worse punishment do you think the person will be considered worthy of who treats with disdain the Son of God and who considers ordinary the blood of the covenant by which he was made holy and who insults the Spirit of grace?
Righteousness is given to those who believe, who thus do not resist the grace given in the atonement
brightfame52
Well-known member
Historically, one of the “five points of Calvinism” has been the truth of irresistible grace, i.e., that the work of salvation in the hearts of those who are saved is a work which God performs irresistibly. Those whom God saves are saved; and they are saved by a work of grace which the sinner cannot resist. God overcomes all the natural resistance of the totally depraved sinner, conquers mightily and powerfully the force of sin in him, and brings him to salvation. Nothing can resist that work. Neither Satan and his hosts of devils nor the hatred and opposition of the sinner can bring that work of God to a standstill. “All that the Father giveth to Me shall come[irresistibly] to Me; and him that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out (John6:37).
This grace is worked through the preaching of the gospel, for the Holy Spirit so works in the hearts of God’s elect that that preaching is grace ,a grace that saves. So the preaching stands inseparably connected with grace. What then is the relation between grace and the free offer of the gospel? Or, to put the question a bit differently, how can those who teach that the preaching expresses God's desire and willingness to save all men still maintain at the same time that grace is absolutely irresistible?
This grace is worked through the preaching of the gospel, for the Holy Spirit so works in the hearts of God’s elect that that preaching is grace ,a grace that saves. So the preaching stands inseparably connected with grace. What then is the relation between grace and the free offer of the gospel? Or, to put the question a bit differently, how can those who teach that the preaching expresses God's desire and willingness to save all men still maintain at the same time that grace is absolutely irresistible?
brightfame52
Well-known member
I still see this as a attack on the sovereign reign of Grace through Christ Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life[Salvation] by Jesus Christ our Lord.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Man, the natural man, cannot resist God’s grace when God wills to work that grace in Him. No one can shake his fist in God’s face and say no. When God wills to work grace, the power to make the ugly sinner beautiful in His sight, the sinner cannot stop God in His intent and purpose. The reason is that grace is not only irresistible, it is efficacious, all powerful. Grace flows forth from God Himself. The Holy Spirit uses this grace as the powerful means whereby He applies the salvation which Christ merited on the cross for all the elect. Itis divine power, power that sanctifies.
Thus we read in Ephesians 2:8,“For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God.”
Paul experienced the irresistible power of Gods Grace when he was made a minister in a split second , as he was moments b4 a proud murderous pharisee and hated Jesus Christ Eph 3:7
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
See what people are saying who deny irresistible grace, they are saying man can resist the effectual working of Gods Power, which is blasphemous to say the least. Could Saul have resisted the power of Gods Grace making him a minister ?
Thus we read in Ephesians 2:8,“For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God.”
Paul experienced the irresistible power of Gods Grace when he was made a minister in a split second , as he was moments b4 a proud murderous pharisee and hated Jesus Christ Eph 3:7
7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by the effectual working of his power.
See what people are saying who deny irresistible grace, they are saying man can resist the effectual working of Gods Power, which is blasphemous to say the least. Could Saul have resisted the power of Gods Grace making him a minister ?
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civic
Well-known member
Gods will is resisted 100's of times by His chosen/elect people- covenant people.
next fallacy.
brightfame52
Well-known member
Wow you actually believe man can resist the effectual working of Gods power, that's pitiful. Almighty man
civic
Well-known member
It’s happens from Genesis through revelation it’s all through the Bible
brightfame52
Well-known member
You dont realize that Grace is the Sovereign Working of Christ in Salvation. Thats His rule from His Throne Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Its this here Isa 9:7
Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end, upon the throne of David, and upon his kingdom, to order it, and to establish it with judgment and with justice from henceforth even for ever. The zeal of the Lord of hosts will perform this.
You say man can resist Him upon His Throne friend
Address rebuttal
Grace is not irresistible
Hebrews 12:15 (LEB) — 15 Take care that no one falls short of the grace of God; that no one growing up like a root of bitterness causes trouble, and by it many become defiled;
Acts 7:51 (LEB) — 51 “You stiff-necked people and uncircumcised in hearts and in your ears! You constantly resist the Holy Spirit! As your fathers did, so also do you!
2 Corinthians 6:1 (LEB) — 1 Now because we are fellow workers, we also urge you not to receive the grace of God in vain.
Hebrews 10:29 (LEB) — 29 How much worse punishment do you think the person will be considered worthy of who treats with disdain the Son of God and who considers ordinary the blood of the covenant by which he was made holy and who insults the Spirit of grace?
Righteousness is given to those who believe, who thus do not resist the grace given in the atonement
God saves those who believeHistorically, one of the “five points of Calvinism” has been the truth of irresistible grace, i.e., that the work of salvation in the hearts of those who are saved is a work which God performs irresistibly. Those whom God saves are saved; and they are saved by a work of grace which the sinner cannot resist. God overcomes all the natural resistance of the totally depraved sinner, conquers mightily and powerfully the force of sin in him, and brings him to salvation. Nothing can resist that work. Neither Satan and his hosts of devils nor the hatred and opposition of the sinner can bring that work of God to a standstill. “All that the Father giveth to Me shall come[irresistibly] to Me; and him that cometh to Me I will in no wise cast out (John6:37).
This grace is worked through the preaching of the gospel, for the Holy Spirit so works in the hearts of God’s elect that that preaching is grace ,a grace that saves. So the preaching stands inseparably connected with grace. What then is the relation between grace and the free offer of the gospel? Or, to put the question a bit differently, how can those who teach that the preaching expresses God's desire and willingness to save all men still maintain at the same time that grace is absolutely irresistible?
John 3:14–18 (LEB) — 14 And just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, thus it is necessary that the Son of Man be lifted up, 15 so that everyone who believes in him will have eternal life.” 16 For in this way God loved the world, so that he gave his one and only Son, in order that everyone who believes in him will not perish, but will have eternal life. 17 For God did not send his Son into the world in order that he should judge the world, but in order that the world should be saved through him. 18 The one who believes in him is not judged, but the one who does not believe has already been judged, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God.
and faith comes by hearing
Romans 10:17 (LEB) — 17 Consequently, faith comes by hearing, and hearing through the word about Christ.
brightfame52
Well-known member
man cant believe in Jesus, Jn 6:44 he doesnt have the ability. Man cannot hear Gods word neither, not with spiritual understanding. Jesus also said to the natural man, even jews Jn 8:43,47
43 Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word.
Here is who hears the word of God Jesus said Vs 47
47 He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.
One has to be saved to hear Gods word, thats what being of God means
brightfame52
Well-known member
brightfame52
Well-known member
Christ victorious death over sin and death is the catalyst for grace from Him on His Throne reigning irresistibly unto eternal life Rom 5:21
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Remember its the Fathers will for Christ to give eternal life to His elect people given to Him Jn 17:2-3
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Now to say this Grace is resistible is saying the Victorious Jesus Christ to give eternal life is resistible. If Grace doesnt give eternal life to everyone the Father gave to Christ, Christ has failed, which we know that is blasphemy to entertain.
21 That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Remember its the Fathers will for Christ to give eternal life to His elect people given to Him Jn 17:2-3
2 As thou hast given him power over all flesh, that he should give eternal life to as many as thou hast given him.
3 And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.
Now to say this Grace is resistible is saying the Victorious Jesus Christ to give eternal life is resistible. If Grace doesnt give eternal life to everyone the Father gave to Christ, Christ has failed, which we know that is blasphemy to entertain.
You are diverting
The point is grace is not irresistible.
Hebrews 12:15 (LEB) — 15 Take care that no one falls short of the grace of God; that no one growing up like a root of bitterness causes trouble, and by it many become defiled;
If one falls short despite given grace, how is that grace irresistible?
Acts 7:51 (LEB) — 51 “You stiff-necked people and uncircumcised in hearts and in your ears! You constantly resist the Holy Spirit! As your fathers did, so also do you!
If one can resist the spirit of grace, how is that grace irresistible
2 Corinthians 6:1 (LEB) — 1 Now because we are fellow workers, we also urge you not to receive the grace of God in vain.
If grace is given in vain, how was it irresistible?
Hebrews 10:29 (LEB) — 29 How much worse punishment do you think the person will be considered worthy of who treats with disdain the Son of God and who considers ordinary the blood of the covenant by which he was made holy and who insults the Spirit of grace?
Sorry John 6:44 does not say men cannot hear as
John 6:45 (NASB95) — 45 “It is written in the prophets, ‘AND THEY SHALL ALL BE TAUGHT OF GOD.’ Everyone who has heard and learned from the Father, comes to Me.
In the verse you quote John 8:43, 7 the people addressed
John 8:44 (NASB95) — 44 “You are of your father the devil, and you want to do the desires of your father. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth because there is no truth in him. Whenever he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own nature, for he is a liar and the father of lies.
are of such a nature and are not all people
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