He that believes and is not water baptised is saved

At least explain what your belief is on water baptism.
Is it physical or spiritual?

Water baptism is physical. It does not save. It can be after your spiritual baptism.
This interpretation that water is birthing fluid is silly.

It comes as close to explaining what those other verses that I posted say.
I'm not trying to insult you Sir.

Dont worry. You did not. Only those who have told me I am not saved do that... and that is close to a dozen from the C oC church.
If I offended you, it was not my intention.
 
Water baptism is physical. It does not save. It can be after your spiritual baptism.
I really appreciate you answering my questions. I'm thankful I didn't offend you. I really do love you.
Alot of questions can help folks think about what they've been taught.

But unfortunately I can't get alot of people to answer my questions.
No doubt they think they are "gotcha" questions.

My questions aren't intended to win arguments.
All of my questions are to help others learn where their doctrines dont hold up to being examined with book, chapter and verse.


Water baptism is physical. It does not save. It can be after your spiritual baptism.
Matthew 21:25,
- The baptism of John whence was it from heaven or of men?

Does your answer agree with what Jesus believes about where John's baptism comes from?

- And they reasoned with themselves saying if we shall say from heaven Jesus will say unto us Why then did ye not believe John
- but if we shall say Of men, we fear the people for all hold John as a prophet

You understand that the baptism of John is a spiritual baptism?

John was given the Holy Spirit in his mothers womb.
His ministry which mainly was baptizing for the Jews only, was from God.

Therefore Jesus knows these that reject John's baptism are rejecting Gods will.
John's baptism is his spiritual work that he is doing for Jesus.

It cannot be physical because water baptism is not from men.
God the Holy Spirit is guiding John to baptize the Jews in water.
Therefore this baptism is from the Holy Spirit.
God authorized it.

No physical work of man can take away sins.
But John's baptism can forgive sins.
Therefore God Himself must be working in water baptism to save the jews.

The water is only the element.
The power is God Himself forgiving sins.

So the work that saves is Gods work.
Baptism in water is passive.
You allow someone else to do it to you.
You are not doing it to yourself.
Therefore it is a work that God works as you allow God to cleanse you.

Colossians 2:12,
- buried with Jesus in baptism wherein also ye are risen with Him through faith of the working of God who hath raised Him from the dead
 
I really appreciate you answering my questions. I'm thankful I didn't offend you. I really do love you.
Alot of questions can help folks think about what they've been taught.

But unfortunately I can't get alot of people to answer my questions.
No doubt they think they are "gotcha" questions.

My questions aren't intended to win arguments.
All of my questions are to help others learn where their doctrines dont hold up to being examined with book, chapter and verse.



Matthew 21:25,
- The baptism of John whence was it from heaven or of men?

Does your answer agree with what Jesus believes about where John's baptism comes from?

- And they reasoned with themselves saying if we shall say from heaven Jesus will say unto us Why then did ye not believe John
- but if we shall say Of men, we fear the people for all hold John as a prophet

You understand that the baptism of John is a spiritual baptism?

I do not believe that the people who received Jonh's baptism would have thought of it being spiritual, even thinking of him as a prophet.

Remember... The baptisms John performed had the specific purpose of readying their hearts for the coming of the Lord. They had heard
the Messiah would be coming, and believed it to be so, and to the people this was the first step .

It was the first step for many of them who recognized they could not continue in their ways and be accepted by the Messiah.

11 "I baptize you with water for repentance, but he who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire., said Paul.

And they who went for Paul's baptism were doing so to be ready for the Messiah's baptism.

I see John’s baptism as a baptism of repentance. He told the people to believe in the one coming after him, that is, in Jesus.” John’s baptism had to do with repentance...it was a symbolic representation of changing one’s mind and going a new direction. “Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River”

Being baptized by John demonstrated a recognition of one’s sin, a desire for spiritual cleansing, and a commitment to follow God’s law in anticipation of the Messiah’s arrival.

So, sorry. I still see John's baptism as physical

If you want to argue about Mark 16:16... He who believes and is baptized yada yada... Dont. It is a worn out shoe and no one definitively knows where anything after Mark 16:8 came from.




John was given the Holy Spirit in his mothers womb.
His ministry which mainly was baptizing for the Jews only, was from God.

Therefore Jesus knows these that reject John's baptism are rejecting Gods will.
John's baptism is his spiritual work that he is doing for Jesus.

It cannot be physical because water baptism is not from men.
God the Holy Spirit is guiding John to baptize the Jews in water.
Therefore this baptism is from the Holy Spirit.
God authorized it.

No physical work of man can take away sins.
But John's baptism can forgive sins.
Therefore God Himself must be working in water baptism to save the jews.

The water is only the element.
The power is God Himself forgiving sins.

So the work that saves is Gods work.
Baptism in water is passive.
You allow someone else to do it to you.
You are not doing it to yourself.
Therefore it is a work that God works as you allow God to cleanse you.

Colossians 2:12,
- buried with Jesus in baptism wherein also ye are risen with Him through faith of the working of God who hath raised Him from the dead
Sorry. I disagree... and we will have to because I am not a predestined person, I am a free will soul.
I believe once you are born again it is strictly Spirit to spirit and baptisms would follow the being born again, IF one is so moved.

What do I mean? Spiritual rebirth, or "born again," is a fundamental concept in Christian theology that signifies a profound transformation and renewal of an individual's spirit. This transformation is believed to be initiated by the Holy Spirit and marks the beginning of a new life in Christ.

The term "born again" is derived from the Greek word "anōthen," which can mean "again" or "from above," indicating both a renewal and a divine origin.

It has nothing to do with water. Water is a great tool to show others where your beliefs are, but water will only get you wet.

My church believes that baptism and Holy Communion are sacraments. So does the RCC except they add others.

But it was not until many many years later when I understood the importance of being born again Spiritual and have had so many wonderful times since when the Holy Spirit has filled me to over flowing and given me a sense of peace and calm and even answered many of the posts
that I would have stumbled over that I knew the importance of that spiritual connection.

The process of spiritual rebirth begins with repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. (Water is not needed) It involves acknowledging one's sinfulness, turning away from sin, and trusting in Christ's atoning sacrifice for salvation. The Holy Spirit plays a crucial role in this process, convicting individuals of sin, (And let me tell you that when He convicts you, you know it) leading them to repentance, and regenerating their hearts.

The experience of being born again can vary among individuals. For some, it may be a dramatic and instantaneous event, while for others, it may be a gradual realization and transformation. Regardless of the manner, the evidence of spiritual rebirth is seen in a changed life, characterized by a love for God, obedience to His commandments, and a desire to grow in holiness. For me, it started gradual then all at once "boom".

For me this meant profound implications for Christian living. It marks the beginning of a lifelong journey of sanctification, where I was progressively conformed to the image of Christ. You know... as Paul said... (Ephesians 4:24) "believers to "put on the new self, created to be like God in true righteousness and holiness" (I am still working on it)

Now, in case you are wondering... Yes, I was baptized. Someday Ill talk about that first 12 or 13 years of my life.... not now.
 
I do not believe that the people who received Jonh's baptism would have thought of it being spiritual, even thinking of him as a prophet
You are not agreeing with Jesus or the jews, of what they believed of John's ministry and his spiritual work that was from the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.

Matthew 21:25,
- the baptism of John whence was it from heaven(spiritual) or of men(physical)
- and they reasoned with themselves, saying,
if we say from heaven(spiritual) Jesus will say to us, Why did ye not then believe John

But if we say from men(your position)we fear the people for all hold John as a prophet


So you do not agree with Jesus.
And the Jewish people do not agree with you.

Jesus taught John's baptism was from heaven.
You have to have a theology that teaches water baptism is from man to not see what the Bible teaches on water baptism.

According to Jesus it is from heaven.
John was guided by the Holy Spirit to baptize in water.
Jesus says it's from heaven.
The Jews believe it's from heaven.

The men challenged by Jesus said if they did not answer from heaven, Jesus would accuse them of not believing in John or his ministry.
The Jews would have rejected their denial of John's water baptism being from heaven as dening John is a prophet of God.

You are disagreeing with Jesus and the Jews and you dont realize it.
And the reason is simple.
Your theology wont allow you to agree with what the Bible says.


So, sorry. I still see John's baptism as physical
Jesus does not.
Nor do the jews.


Remember... The baptisms John performed had the specific purpose of readying their hearts for the coming of the Lord. They had heard
the Messiah would be coming, and believed it to be so, and to the people this was the first step .

It was the first step for many of them who recognized they could not continue in their ways and be accepted by the Messiah
This is all your theology will allow for the purpose of John's baptism.

John's baptism prepared the Jews to be allowed into the kingdom of God.
You could not enter in the kingdom if you were still in your sins.

You purposely left out what John's baptism does for the jews.

Mark 1:4,
- John did baptize in the wilderness and preach the baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins

The Greek word for here is eis,
It means into, to, towards, for, in order to obtain, it expresses the purpose, result, or the end goal of an action

Water baptism by John was for the purpose to obtain forgiveness of sins.
That is what the word of God says.
Changing the meaning is denying the word.

Do you realize that no one can be saved if they refuse to do the will of God?
When Gods will is for you to be baptized, you cannot go against Gods will and be forgiven of your rebellious heart.
Luke 7:30,
- but the Pharisees and lawyers rejected the will of God against themselves being not baptized by John

It was impossible for any jew to enter into Gods kingdom without obeying the will of God.
You are teaching that John's baptism was not essential to obey.
Therefore sins can be forgiven by not obeying Gods will.

The kingdom at this time was at hand,
Mark 1:15,
- and saying,
the time is fullfilled and the kingdom of God is at hand, repent ye and believe the gospel

Impossible for those Jews who rejected the will of God by not being baptized by John to have repented.
Only way true repentance occured is if the were baptized by John.

Therefore no repentance no access into the kingdom.
Your theology has Jews saved before they repented.
You have the Jews who rejected the counsel of God by not being baptized as not being condemned.

No repentance= refusal to be baptized by John.
No repentance = no forgiveness of sins.
No baptism = no repentance nor forgiveness of sins.

You cannot under John's ministry have repented if you refused to be baptized.

The two God joined together.

Mark 10:9,
- What therefore God hath joined together lot no man seperate

This is a universal law.
It does not only apply to marriage.
Anything God joins together man cannot alter by taking some of what God says and excluding the rest of what He says.

With God it is all or nothing.


The term "born again" is derived from the Greek word "anōthen," which can mean "again" or "from above," indicating both a renewal and a divine origin.

It has nothing to do with water. Water is a great tool to show others where your beliefs are, but water will only get you wet.
You are separating born again from baptism.
Gods word doesn't teach this. You are teaching this.

We are in agreement. The water is not the cleansing agent.
God is the agent for how we are cleansed from our sins.

The water is only the element that God not man has decreed we use.

If Gods will was a burial in dirt. Then dirt would not cleanse us.
But since God decreed dirt then dirt cannot be seperated from being born again.

Look at the story of Naaman.
Told to immerse himself in the river Jordan seven times.
Did the water remove his leporsy?
No, God is the agent that removed it.
But would Naaman have been made clean if he refused Gods will?

Cant seperste the river Jordan and immersion from Naaman's cleansing just as you cannot seperate John's baptism from being born again.

Was there some scientific reason for dipping seven times?
Did the water cleanse If it wasn't seven times.
Obviously it was God doing the cleansing not the water.

But it should be obvious that Naaman could not be cleansed if he did not do the will of God.

2 Kings 5:14,
- So Naaman went down to the Jordan river and dipped himself seven times as the man of God had instructed him and his skin became as healthy as the skin of a young child and he was healed.

You must do what God says to be cleansed.
No power in water.
Grace is only given to those who obey Gods commandments.

The process of spiritual rebirth begins with repentance and faith in Jesus Christ. (Water is not needed)
You are teaching that those who refused John's baptism could repent without immersion in water.
That's from a theology. Not from the Bible friend.
 
Because you do not need water to be born again.
Jesus said you do.
I am teaching nothing. I am not called to teach on this. I am explaining what I have been taught. If you dont like my answers dont ask me.
If what you have been taught contradicts Scripture, then you need to abandon what you have been taught and cling to the truth in Scripture. Salvation requires being born again through both water and the Spirit.
 
Jesus said you do.

If what you have been taught contradicts Scripture, then you need to abandon what you have been taught and cling to the truth in Scripture. Salvation requires being born again through both water and the Spirit.
Water means your first body. It's mostly water. The verse you are probably referring to is just saying you need to be first born and then be also born of the spirit.
 
Water means your first body. It's mostly water. The verse you are probably referring to is just saying you need to be first born and then be also born of the spirit.
John 3:5 is not talking about natural birth. Jesus is talking about spiritual rebirth, which He makes clear when He says that what is born of the Spirit is spirit, and what is born of the flesh is flesh. But Spiritual rebirth requires both water and Spirit (John 3:3, 5).
 
John 3:5 is not talking about natural birth. Jesus is talking about spiritual rebirth, which He makes clear when He says that what is born of the Spirit is spirit, and what is born of the flesh is flesh. But Spiritual rebirth requires both water and Spirit (John 3:3, 5).
Water does not do anything other than get you wet. Water baptism is a carryover from part of the Levitical Law. There are many examples of people in the Old Testament who would wash themselves with water as a final step to being clean. Water baptism was an outward sign of washing, and then you would be clean to God. Baptism in water, and the need to be circumcised passed away with the coming of Pentecost, as did the other Levitical Laws. To be led by the spirit is to not be under the yoke of bondage with the extreme of legalism, seeking the works of the flesh from the old covenant concerning the past Law administration that was written to Israel.

It's clear from the gospels that water baptism had to do with the kingdom, which was ministered by John who was known as the Baptizer, and not a minister for the Church of God. John who was a prophet functioning under the old covenant was appointed by God to prepare and confirm the promises made to Israel. His message was to tell those who lived under the old covenant that the king had come and “the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” He used water as a sign to baptize those who believed the promised Messiah would be coming in just a matter of months and to illustrate that he would be the Christ, who would baptize them not with material water, but with holy spirit, which is “power from on high.” From the habit of tradition, and only for a short period of time, a small handful of people were baptized with water into the New Testament, but never again afterwards.

In the epistles written just a little bit past the beginning of the New Testament is where we read the only time water baptism is mentioned is to note there is no more need for it, and that we are now to be baptized with holy spirit. And this is why in Acts 2:38, Peter commands “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ.” In Acts 8:16, Peter and John “baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.” In Acts 10:48, Peter “commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.” In Romans 6:3, it declares “that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ.” There is not one exception to this practice where we see water baptism, which belonged to the time period when Christ walked the earth, being used once the Church of God had become established.
 
Water does not do anything other than get you wet.
Without faith, that is correct. But because of our faith, the Holy Spirit removes our sins during baptism (Rom 6:1-7, Col 2:11-14, 1 Pet 3:21).
Water baptism is a carryover from part of the Levitical Law. There are many examples of people in the Old Testament who would wash themselves with water as a final step to being clean. Water baptism was an outward sign of washing, and then you would be clean to God.
Very true. That is indeed the origin of water baptism.
Baptism in water, and the need to be circumcised passed away with the coming of Pentecost, as did the other Levitical Laws. To be led by the spirit is to not be under the yoke of bondage with the extreme of legalism, seeking the works of the flesh from the old covenant concerning the past Law administration that was written to Israel.
The act of dipping in water made the dipper ceremonially clean. He was not clean and then dipped to show that he was clean. The dipping made him clean. This goes all the way back to Naaman dipping in Jordan. He was not healed of leprosy and then he dipped to show that he was healed. Nor did he receive healing and then dip in appreciation of being healed. He dipped six times and was still a leaper. But after he dipped the seventh time, when he came up he was completely healed and pure. And it is the same with NT water baptism.
It's clear from the gospels that water baptism had to do with the kingdom, which was ministered by John who was known as the Baptizer, and not a minister for the Church of God. John who was a prophet functioning under the old covenant was appointed by God to prepare and confirm the promises made to Israel. His message was to tell those who lived under the old covenant that the king had come and “the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” He used water as a sign to baptize those who believed the promised Messiah would be coming in just a matter of months and to illustrate that he would be the Christ, who would baptize them not with material water, but with holy spirit, which is “power from on high.” From the habit of tradition, and only for a short period of time, a small handful of people were baptized with water into the New Testament, but never again afterwards.
The commandment to be baptized with water did not end with the Apostles nor with the first century.
In Matt 28:19, Jesus commands the Apostles to go and baptize new disciples, and then to teach them to do everything He had taught them (which would include the instruction to go, teach, and baptize other new disciples).
In 1 Pet 3:21, Peter states that we are saved through baptism. He makes the point that this is not like the Old Covenant laws about ceremonial cleanliness, but is about the Holy Spirit giving us a clear conscience during the act of baptism.
In Gal 3:26-27, Paul makes the point that in baptism we are clothed (literally, we put on) Jesus and are made children of God.
In Eph 5:26-27, Paul makes the point that in baptism we are made pure, holy, righteous, and spotless and united to the bride of Christ.
All of these passages speak to the ongoing nature of baptism in the NT Church, and that it was not just for the first century Church, but for the Church for all time.
In the epistles written just a little bit past the beginning of the New Testament is where we read the only time water baptism is mentioned is to note there is no more need for it, and that we are now to be baptized with holy spirit. And this is why in Acts 2:38, Peter commands “Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ.” In Acts 8:16, Peter and John “baptized in the name of the Lord Jesus.” In Acts 10:48, Peter “commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord.” In Romans 6:3, it declares “that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ.” There is not one exception to this practice where we see water baptism, which belonged to the time period when Christ walked the earth, being used once the Church of God had become established.
Ahh, here is where your error is rooted my friend. Eph 4:5-6 tells us that there is only one baptism in the NT Church, just as there is only one Lord, and one faith, one hope, etc.
But what is that one baptism? Is it water or Spirit? Let's consider...
1 Pet 3:21 says that baptism in water (like the Flood) now saves us through our faith in Jesus.
Acts 22:16 says that Ananias told Saul to get up and make haste to be baptized and wash away his sins. Why would he need to move if it was Spirit baptism? And why would he need to make haste if it was something that the Spirit alone could do?
Matt 28:19, as mentioned before, tells the Apostles, and us through extension from them, to go, teach, and baptize new disciples. This is an action that the teacher must do. Man cannot make the Holy Spirit do anything, so this baptism is absolutely not "Spirit baptism".
John 3:5 is Jesus talking to Nicodemus, and He tells him that he must be reborn through both water and the Spirit to enter the Kingdom of God. There is no indication or reason to believe that this was just an OT requirement, or that it passed away with the first century. The Kingdom of God did not even start until Jesus' death (or possibly Pentecost). So to enter the Kingdom of God required, and still requires, both water and the Spirit.
Acts 8:36 tells of the Eunuch who had been taught by Philip. When they were passing by water, the Eunuch asked if he could be baptized. This tells us several things: first, that Philip had taught him about baptism as part of the Gospel teaching. Second, it was clearly water baptism that was taught because if it were Spirit baptism then he could have received that while traveling, and would not need to stop, or even to have seen water. Third, the conversion of the Eunuch seems to have occurred between 33-35AD, and Jesus was crucified in 29AD. That means that this event was four to six years after Pentecost. If baptism in water were an OT thing, then it would have already been ceased being taught and endorsed by the Apostles and the primary preachers of the Gospel, like Philip.

It is clear from these passages that it is water baptism, not "Spirit baptism" that is linked with salvation/justification. And that this practice was not an OT practice only, but was incorporated into the NT through Jesus' teaching and the Apostles practices and teaching.
 
Without faith, that is correct. But because of our faith, the Holy Spirit removes our sins during baptism (Rom 6:1-7, Col 2:11-14, 1 Pet 3:21).

Very true. That is indeed the origin of water baptism.

The act of dipping in water made the dipper ceremonially clean. He was not clean and then dipped to show that he was clean. The dipping made him clean. This goes all the way back to Naaman dipping in Jordan. He was not healed of leprosy and then he dipped to show that he was healed. Nor did he receive healing and then dip in appreciation of being healed. He dipped six times and was still a leaper. But after he dipped the seventh time, when he came up he was completely healed and pure. And it is the same with NT water baptism.

The commandment to be baptized with water did not end with the Apostles nor with the first century.
In Matt 28:19, Jesus commands the Apostles to go and baptize new disciples, and then to teach them to do everything He had taught them (which would include the instruction to go, teach, and baptize other new disciples).
In 1 Pet 3:21, Peter states that we are saved through baptism. He makes the point that this is not like the Old Covenant laws about ceremonial cleanliness, but is about the Holy Spirit giving us a clear conscience during the act of baptism.
In Gal 3:26-27, Paul makes the point that in baptism we are clothed (literally, we put on) Jesus and are made children of God.
In Eph 5:26-27, Paul makes the point that in baptism we are made pure, holy, righteous, and spotless and united to the bride of Christ.
All of these passages speak to the ongoing nature of baptism in the NT Church, and that it was not just for the first century Church, but for the Church for all time.

Ahh, here is where your error is rooted my friend. Eph 4:5-6 tells us that there is only one baptism in the NT Church, just as there is only one Lord, and one faith, one hope, etc.
But what is that one baptism? Is it water or Spirit? Let's consider...
1 Pet 3:21 says that baptism in water (like the Flood) now saves us through our faith in Jesus.
Acts 22:16 says that Ananias told Saul to get up and make haste to be baptized and wash away his sins. Why would he need to move if it was Spirit baptism? And why would he need to make haste if it was something that the Spirit alone could do?
Matt 28:19, as mentioned before, tells the Apostles, and us through extension from them, to go, teach, and baptize new disciples. This is an action that the teacher must do. Man cannot make the Holy Spirit do anything, so this baptism is absolutely not "Spirit baptism".
John 3:5 is Jesus talking to Nicodemus, and He tells him that he must be reborn through both water and the Spirit to enter the Kingdom of God. There is no indication or reason to believe that this was just an OT requirement, or that it passed away with the first century. The Kingdom of God did not even start until Jesus' death (or possibly Pentecost). So to enter the Kingdom of God required, and still requires, both water and the Spirit.
Acts 8:36 tells of the Eunuch who had been taught by Philip. When they were passing by water, the Eunuch asked if he could be baptized. This tells us several things: first, that Philip had taught him about baptism as part of the Gospel teaching. Second, it was clearly water baptism that was taught because if it were Spirit baptism then he could have received that while traveling, and would not need to stop, or even to have seen water. Third, the conversion of the Eunuch seems to have occurred between 33-35AD, and Jesus was crucified in 29AD. That means that this event was four to six years after Pentecost. If baptism in water were an OT thing, then it would have already been ceased being taught and endorsed by the Apostles and the primary preachers of the Gospel, like Philip.

It is clear from these passages that it is water baptism, not "Spirit baptism" that is linked with salvation/justification. And that this practice was not an OT practice only, but was incorporated into the NT through Jesus' teaching and the Apostles practices and teaching.
Baptism means immersed. Romans 6 does not mention water.
 
Baptism means immersed.
Correct. Everywhere that "baptism" is mentioned in Scripture the proper word should be "immersion", and everywhere that "baptized" is mentioned the proper word should be "immersed". The Greek "baptisma" is the noun, and "baptismo" is the verb for immersion/to immerse.
Romans 6 does not mention water.
Out of all of that, this was all you could find to comment on? Seriously?

Rom 6 does not need to mention water. All of Scripture is unified, and must ALL be true and correct at the same time. That means that every passage of Scripture must agree with EVERY other passage. So when baptism is mentioned in relation to salvation, it can only be the ONE baptism that is associated with salvation in ANY Scripture. 1 Pet 3:21 makes it clear that salvation is associated with water immersion and the working of the Holy Spirit. John 3:5 makes it clear that both water and the Spirit are required to have rebirth. Matt 28:19 makes it clear that baptism is an act that is required for the teacher to do to the student (thus pointing to water, not Spirit, immersion).
 
Correct. Everywhere that "baptism" is mentioned in Scripture the proper word should be "immersion", and everywhere that "baptized" is mentioned the proper word should be "immersed". The Greek "baptisma" is the noun, and "baptismo" is the verb for immersion/to immerse.

Out of all of that, this was all you could find to comment on? Seriously?

Rom 6 does not need to mention water. All of Scripture is unified, and must ALL be true and correct at the same time. That means that every passage of Scripture must agree with EVERY other passage. So when baptism is mentioned in relation to salvation, it can only be the ONE baptism that is associated with salvation in ANY Scripture. 1 Pet 3:21 makes it clear that salvation is associated with water immersion and the working of the Holy Spirit. John 3:5 makes it clear that both water and the Spirit are required to have rebirth. Matt 28:19 makes it clear that baptism is an act that is required for the teacher to do to the student (thus pointing to water, not Spirit, immersion).
Only in your mind does Peter make it clear. Which word in the following verse says water?

1 Peter 3:21
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
 
No, he is not. He is talking about faith. Faith is the same before salvation is received as it is after salvation is received. And, as Paul says in Eph 2:8-9, we receive salvation through faith, and the faith through which we receive salvation must be a living, active, effective faith. If it is not alive, then it cannot bring salvation to us. You like to talk your way around God's Word, but He says very clearly that salvation is received only after certain actions are performed (repentance, public verbal confession, and baptism). These three actions of faith lead to/result in receiving salvation. This is clear and plain in Scripture, but not to the spiritually blind. God veils the truth from those in whom His Spirit does not reside.
Oh, but he is. Who is James' audience? Primarily Jewish Christians. Believers. He's not talking to unsaved Jews. He's talking to saved Jewish believers and of course believing Gentiles as well.
Look at how he addresses his audience:
James 1:2 "My brethren";
James 1:9 "But the brother of humble circumstances ...";
James 1:18 "In the exercise of His will He brought us forth by the word of truth, ..." - so they were already born again;
James 2:1 "My brethren, do not hold your faith in our Lord Jesus Christ ..." - they already had become believers;
James 2:5 "Listen, my beloved brethren:";
James 2:14 "What use is it, my brethren,";
James 2:15 "If a brother or sister is without clothing ..."
James 3:1 "Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, ...";
James 3:10 "My brethren, these things ought not to be this way."
James 3:12 "Can a fig tree, my brethren, ..."
James 4:11 "Do not speak against one another, brethren."
James 4:11 "He who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, ..."
James 5:7 "Therefore be patient, brethren, until the coming of the Lord."
James 5:9 "Do not complain, brethren, against one another, ..."
James 5:10 "As an example, brethren, of suffering and patience, ..."
James 5:12 "But above all, my brethren, do not swear, ..."
James 5:19 "My brethren, if any among you strays from the truth ..."

So his audience are born again believers, each of whom have already been saved by faith. So obviously in chapter 2, he is telling these Christians what their faith should look like NOW, not back when they first got saved, which required only faith, not any works.
At least explain what your belief is on water baptism.
Is it physical or spiritual?

This interpretation that water is birthing fluid is silly.
I'm not trying to insult you Sir.
If I offended you, it was not my intention.
I assume you don't think it was silly when it was keeping you alive in your mother's womb. Your life depended on it.
Peter didn't think it was silly when he said, "for you have been born again, not of seed which is perishable but imperishable ..." and "like newborn babes, long for the pure milk of the word." 1 Peter 1:23; and 2:2
 
Only in your mind does Peter make it clear. Which word in the following verse says water?

1 Peter 3:21
The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:
Read the context. in verse 20, Peter is talking about the water of the Flood. And he says that the water of the flood was an antitype, a symbol, that represents baptism (immersion in water), and that it is immersion in water that now saves us.
 
Oh, but he is. Who is James' audience? Primarily Jewish Christians.
Why is it that it is primarily Jewish Christ follower? Because James was the first book of the New Testament that was written. And when it was written, there were primarily Jews in the Church.
Believers. He's not talking to unsaved Jews. He's talking to saved Jewish believers and of course believing Gentiles as well.
Look at how he addresses his audience:
James 1:2 "My brethren";
James 1:9 "But the brother of humble circumstances ...";
James 1:18 "In the exercise of His will He brought us forth by the word of truth, ..." - so they were already born again;
James 2:1 "My brethren, do not hold your faith in our Lord Jesus Christ ..." - they already had become believers;
James 2:5 "Listen, my beloved brethren:";
James 2:14 "What use is it, my brethren,";
James 2:15 "If a brother or sister is without clothing ..."
James 3:1 "Let not many of you become teachers, my brethren, ...";
James 3:10 "My brethren, these things ought not to be this way."
James 3:12 "Can a fig tree, my brethren, ..."
James 4:11 "Do not speak against one another, brethren."
James 4:11 "He who speaks against a brother or judges his brother, ..."
James 5:7 "Therefore be patient, brethren, until the coming of the Lord."
James 5:9 "Do not complain, brethren, against one another, ..."
James 5:10 "As an example, brethren, of suffering and patience, ..."
James 5:12 "But above all, my brethren, do not swear, ..."
James 5:19 "My brethren, if any among you strays from the truth ..."

So his audience are born again believers, each of whom have already been saved by faith. So obviously in chapter 2, he is telling these Christians what their faith should look like NOW, not back when they first got saved, which required only faith, not any works.
LOL, faith is faith. Faith that is required to become saved is the same faith that is required long after we are saved. He is describing faith in general, not the faith that is required to become saved. But it is still the same faith. Any faith must have action, or it is not really faith.

It is Eph 2:8-9 that tells us that the faith that saves (active and alive) must come before salvation is received.
I assume you don't think it was silly when it was keeping you alive in your mother's womb.
Sure, it sustained us before we were born. But that is natural birth, not rebirth into the Kingdom of God.
Peter didn't think it was silly when he said, "for you have been born again, not of seed which is perishable but imperishable ..." and "like newborn babes, long for the pure milk of the word." 1 Peter 1:23; and 2:2
Neither of these passages even come close to referring to amniotic fluid. Just picking out verses that talk about babies, and infants doesn't mean that they will support your thesis (especially when it is wrong).
 
Correct. Everywhere that "baptism" is mentioned in Scripture the proper word should be "immersion", and everywhere that "baptized" is mentioned the proper word should be "immersed". The Greek "baptisma" is the noun, and "baptismo" is the verb for immersion/to immerse.

Out of all of that, this was all you could find to comment on? Seriously?

Rom 6 does not need to mention water. All of Scripture is unified, and must ALL be true and correct at the same time. That means that every passage of Scripture must agree with EVERY other passage. So when baptism is mentioned in relation to salvation, it can only be the ONE baptism that is associated with salvation in ANY Scripture. 1 Pet 3:21 makes it clear that salvation is associated with water immersion and the working of the Holy Spirit. John 3:5 makes it clear that both water and the Spirit are required to have rebirth. Matt 28:19 makes it clear that baptism is an act that is required for the teacher to do to the student (thus pointing to water, not Spirit, immersion).
"ALL must be true", except for the 213 verses that don't mention baptism in relation to salvation, right? Compared to the 10 verses that do. Yet in all 223 verses, none tell us that baptism is required for salvation.
Read the context. in verse 20, Peter is talking about the water of the Flood. And he says that the water of the flood was an antitype, a symbol, that represents baptism (immersion in water), and that it is immersion in water that now saves us.

No, Peter tells us in that verse that baptism is figurative, "saving" our convicted conscience by obeying Jesus in getting baptized, NOT that baptism saves anyone.
 
Why is it that it is primarily Jewish Christ follower? Because James was the first book of the New Testament that was written. And when it was written, there were primarily Jews in the Church.

LOL, faith is faith. Faith that is required to become saved is the same faith that is required long after we are saved. He is describing faith in general, not the faith that is required to become saved. But it is still the same faith. Any faith must have action, or it is not really faith.

It is Eph 2:8-9 that tells us that the faith that saves (active and alive) must come before salvation is received.

Sure, it sustained us before we were born. But that is natural birth, not rebirth into the Kingdom of God.

Neither of these passages even come close to referring to amniotic fluid. Just picking out verses that talk about babies, and infants doesn't mean that they will support your thesis (especially when it is wrong).
Okay, I see your point, amniotic fluid and the new birth of a baby have nothing in common. Right!! Have you ever heard of a pregnant woman's water breaking?
 
"ALL must be true", except for the 213 verses that don't mention baptism in relation to salvation, right? Compared to the 10 verses that do. Yet in all 223 verses, none tell us that baptism is required for salvation.
LOL Ummm, no. ALL verses must agree, which means that those 213 generalized verses MUST agree with the ten that specify certain things that are required to receive salvation. Those 213 give general, vague, "belief"/"faith" as the condition for receiving salvation. The ten that I have cited clarify the image, and give specific actions that must be part of the "belief/faith" as the condition for receiving salvation.
No, Peter tells us in that verse that baptism is figurative, "saving" our convicted conscience by obeying Jesus in getting baptized, NOT that baptism saves anyone.
The Greek says that the Flood water is the symbol (or shadow), and that NT baptism is the "real" that the symbol represents.
Okay, I see your point, amniotic fluid and the new birth of a baby have nothing in common. Right!!
No, neither of those have anything to do with RE-birth. Jesus, in John 3, is not talking about natural birth, and the water He mentions has nothing to do with amniotic fluid.
 
Read the context. in verse 20, Peter is talking about the water of the Flood. And he says that the water of the flood was an antitype, a symbol, that represents baptism (immersion in water), and that it is immersion in water that now saves us.
Mentioning Noah was saved and that now Christians are saved has nothing to do with water. The water did not save Noah and water does not save Christians.
 
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