What is the difference between eternal security, once saved always saved, and perseverance of the saints?

[GodsGrace]

1 Thessalonians 1:5 - For our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Spirit and in much assurance, as you know what kind of men we were among you for your sake.

1 Thessalonians 1:5 Your verse

3 constantly bearing in mind your work of faith and labor of love and steadfastness of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ in the presence of our God and Father,

5 for our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction; just as you know what kind of men we proved to be among you for your sake.

6 You also became imitators of us and of the Lord, having received the word in much tribulation with the joy of the Holy Spirit,

7 so that you became an example to all the believers in Macedonia and in Achaia.


Let's examine what Paul states:

1. Paul mentions their work of faith and labor of love. verse 3

2. Paul mentions their steadfastness in the hope of Jesus. verse 3

3. The Thess became IMITATORS of Paul, Silas and Timothy.... verse 5
just as the Apostles were imitators of Jesus. (1 Corinthians 11:1 Be Imitators of ME as I am of Jesus)

4. They also became imitators of Jesus in the joy of the Holy Spirit. verse 6

5. They also became an example to all the believers. verse 7


No matter what scripture you post MMD...
The demand for obedience is there.
The demand for good works is there.

Why?

Because this is the reason Jesus came....
to bring the Kingdom of God on earth....
to atone for our sins...
to teach us how to get to heaven.

 

[GodsGrace]

Forsake means to quit or leave entirely, abandon, or desert. It can also mean to give up or renounce a habit or way of life. In a literary context, it can mean to leave someone forever, especially when they need you. Forsake is a synonym of abandon and desert, and means to leave without intending to return.

But when the world beats us down and our life is like hell on earth wake up we turn back to our Fathers house.

Forsake means exactly what you've posted Tranquil.

God will NEVER forsake us...
but we forsake Him with our disobedience or downright apostacy.

I'd say that disobedience IS apostacy.
If it's willful...there remains no more sacrifice for us.

Hebrews 10:26-17
26 For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,
27 but a terrifying expectation of judgment ...

 

[mailmandan]

1 Thessalonians 1:5 Your verse

3 constantly bearing in mind your work of faith and labor of love and steadfastness of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ in the presence of our God and Father,

5 for our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power and in the Holy Spirit and with full conviction; just as you know what kind of men we proved to be among you for your sake.

6 You also became imitators of us and of the Lord, having received the word in much tribulation with the joy of the Holy Spirit,

7 so that you became an example to all the believers in Macedonia and in Achaia.

Let's examine what Paul states:

1. Paul mentions their work of faith and labor of love. verse 3

2. Paul mentions their steadfastness in the hope of Jesus. verse 3

3. The Thess became IMITATORS of Paul, Silas and Timothy.... verse 5
just as the Apostles were imitators of Jesus. (1 Corinthians 11:1 Be Imitators of ME as I am of Jesus)

4. They also became imitators of Jesus in the joy of the Holy Spirit. verse 6

5. They also became an example to all the believers. verse 7

No matter what scripture you post MMD...
The demand for obedience is there.
The demand for good works is there.

Why?

Because this is the reason Jesus came....
to bring the Kingdom of God on earth....
to atone for our sins...
to teach us how to get to heaven.

The demand for obedience/good works is there. Not as the basis or means by which we obtain salvation (Romans 4:5:6; Ephesians 2:8,9) but as our reasonable service to do good works which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them. (Ephesians 2:10)

Now in regard to 1 Thessalonians 1:3, notice the words "work of" faith, "labor of" love and "patience of". These are the practical outworking of the Thessalonians' conversion. The "work" the Thessalonians do is a result or consequence of their faith. So too their "labor" flows from love and their "endurance" comes from hope. IMITATORS indeed.

Work "of" faith does not mean that faith in essence is the work accomplished. Their work is a result or consequence "of" their faith. The work done is "of" faith or done "out of" faith. Faith was already established at conversion and then the work "followed" as a result of their faith.

No matter what scripture you post, salvation by works/works-righteousness is not there.

 

[GodsGrace]

The demand for obedience/good works is there. Not as the basis or means by which we obtain salvation (Romans 4:5:6; Ephesians 2:8,9) but as our reasonable service to do good works which God prepared beforehand that we should walk in them. (Ephesians 2:10)

Now in regard to 1 Thessalonians 1:3, notice the words "work of" faith, "labor of" love and "patience of". These are the practical outworking of the Thessalonians' conversion. The "work" the Thessalonians do is a result or consequence of their faith. So too their "labor" flows from love and their "endurance" comes from hope. IMITATORS indeed.

Work "of" faith does not mean that faith in essence is the work accomplished. Their work is a result or consequence "of" their faith. The work done is "of" faith or done "out of" faith. Faith was already established at conversion and then the work "followed" as a result of their faith.

No matter what scripture you post, salvation by works/works-righteousness is not there.

Works is all over the NT.
Obedience to God is all over the bible.
Faith without works is a dead faith.

James warns against a faith without works.
It is DEAD.

Jesus warns of not being fruitful.
John 15:1-2
Unfruitful branches are CUT OFF...severed...taken away.

Unfruitful branches are taken away....

I would tend to listen AND HEAR what Jesus teaches.

Not some odd idea that YOU have about doing good works.

 

[mailmandan]

Works is all over the NT.
Obedience to God is all over the bible.
Faith without works is a dead faith.

James warns against a faith without works.
It is DEAD.

Jesus warns of not being fruitful.
John 15:1-2
Unfruitful branches are CUT OFF...severed...taken away.

Unfruitful branches are taken away....

I would tend to listen AND HEAR what Jesus teaches.

Not some odd idea that YOU have about doing good works.

Nowhere does the NT teach that we are saved "by" good works but it does teach we are saved FOR good works. (Ephesians 2:10)

In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims he has faith but has no works (to evidence his claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So, when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. So, James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine.

In regard to "faith without works is dead," (James 2:20) James does not mean that faith is dead until it produces works and then it becomes a living faith or that works are the source of life in faith. That would be like saying that a tree is dead until it produces fruit and then it becomes a living tree, and the fruit is the source of life in the tree. James is simply saying faith that is not accompanied by evidential works demonstrates that it's dead. If someone merely says-claims they have faith, but lack resulting evidential works, then they demonstrate that they have an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic faith. (James 2:14) Simple!

In John 15:1-2, there are two kinds of connections with Christ as the vine. The self-attached connection that bears no fruit (faith without works is dead) and the spiritual and vital connection that bears fruit. Apart from Christ we can do nothing. Unfruitful branches (like Judas Iscariot) are cut off/taken away.

 

[TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY]

Good, we agree on this.

Ever witness me claiming to others to "Earn" the gift of grace, salvation? The topic on perseverance is a "contentious one" yet thoroughly biblical @Eternally-Grateful

Romans 2:4- Greek: ἀνοχή
 "Or do you think lightly of the riches of His kindness and tolerance and patience..."
 (ἀνοχή = forbearance, a divine quality of restraining judgment)

Romans 5:3 - Greek: ὑπομονή
 "...but we also celebrate in our tribulations, knowing that tribulation brings about perseverance..."
 (ὑπομονή = endurance, steadfastness under pressure)

1 Corinthians 13:4 - Greek: μακροθυμία
 "Love is patient, love is kind and is not jealous..."
 (μακροθυμία = longsuffering, slow to anger)

2 Corinthians 6:6 - Greek: μακροθυμία
 "...in purity, in knowledge, in patience, in kindness..."
 (μακροθυμία = longsuffering, spiritual patience in trials)

2 Corinthians 12:12 -Greek: ὑπομονή
 "The signs of a true apostle were performed among you with all perseverance..."
 (ὑπομονή = enduring hardship as proof of apostleship)

Galatians 5:22 - Greek: μακροθυμία
 "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience..."
 (μακροθυμία = a Spirit-produced quality of patience and forbearance)

Ephesians 4:2- Greek: μακροθυμία
 "...with all humility and gentleness, with patience, bearing with one another in love..."
 (μακροθυμία = practical, relational patience in community)

Colossians 1:11 - Greek: ὑπομονή, μακροθυμία
 "...strengthened with all power, according to His glorious might, for the attaining of all perseverance and patience..."
 (ὑπομονή = endurance toward circumstances; μακροθυμία = patience toward people)

Colossians 3:12- Greek: μακροθυμία
 "...put on a heart of compassion, kindness, humility, gentleness and patience..."
 (μακροθυμία = the attitude of longsuffering commanded of believers)

1 Thessalonians 1:3- Greek: ὑπομονή
 "...constantly keeping in mind your work of faith and labor of love and perseverance of hope in our Lord Jesus Christ..."
 (ὑπομονή = endurance springing from hope)


Define a list of Greek synonyms for "endurance"
greek_synonyms
"ὑπομονή": "endurance, steadfastness",
"μακροθυμία": "longsuffering, patience",
"καρτερία": "perseverance",
"ἀνεξικακία": "forbearance",
"ἀνοχή": "tolerance, forbearance"


Sample verses from Pauline Epistles where these words might appear (for demonstration)
pauline_epistles
"Romans": ["5:3", "2:4"],
"1 Corinthians": ["13:4"],
"2 Corinthians": ["6:6", "12:12"],
"Galatians": ["5:22"],
"Ephesians": ["4:2"],
"Colossians": ["1:11", "3:12"],
"1 Thessalonians": ["1:3"],
"2 Thessalonians": ["1:4"],
"2 Timothy": ["3:10"]


Construct a list of tuples combining the references with the Greek term expected
verses_with_synonyms
("Romans 2:4", "ἀνοχή"),
("Romans 5:3", "ὑπομονή"),
("1 Corinthians 13:4", "μακροθυμία"),
("2 Corinthians 6:6", "μακροθυμία"),
("2 Corinthians 12:12", "ὑπομονή"),
("Galatians 5:22", "μακροθυμία"),
("Ephesians 4:2", "μακροθυμία"),
("Colossians 1:11", "ὑπομονή, μακροθυμία"),
("Colossians 3:12", "μακροθυμία"),
("1 Thessalonians 1:3", "ὑπομονή"),
("2 Thessalonians 1:4", "ὑπομονή"),
("2 Timothy 3:10", "ὑπομονή")
]

verses_with_synonyms = verses_with_synonyms[:10]

verses_with_synonyms

[('Romans 2:4', 'ἀνοχή'),
('Romans 5:3', 'ὑπομονή'),
('1 Corinthians 13:4', 'μακροθυμία'),
('2 Corinthians 6:6', 'μακροθυμία'),
('2 Corinthians 12:12', 'ὑπομονή'),
('Galatians 5:22', 'μακροθυμία'),
('Ephesians 4:2', 'μακροθυμία'),
('Colossians 1:11', 'ὑπομονή, μακροθυμία'),
('Colossians 3:12', 'μακροθυμία'),
('1 Thessalonians 1:3', 'ὑπομονή')]


Would you agree?

J.

I would . so please answer me this one question .
DID JESUS preach TWO Gospels or one .
DID the apostels preach TWO gospels or one .
AND DID THEY Not all stress the dire importance of THAT OL BELIEVE IN JESUS phrase .
SO the question i ask to all is this .
WHY would anyone have any part or lott
in satans interfaith finding common ground anti christ lie . cause I SURE SEEN a deadly LIE
taught by them leaders to the false religoins . AND friend THEY DO THE WORK OF ANTI CHRIST .
so is there all of a sudden two gospels , one which says YE MUST BELEIVE while the other says IT DONT MATTER .
YEAH RIGHT . DONT exist . i expose the harlot , i expose that which is of anti christ
AND INTERFAITH IS OF ANTI CHRIST . I GOT nothing in common with darkness . we preach JESUS to the lost
we dont try and find common ground for world peace .
IN fact JESUS never came to bring peace on earth .
BUT ANOTHER ONE DOES , and friend WE DARN SURE DONT wanna follow that one .

 

[Adherent]

Just a hypothetical, but say your an externally devout Christian for 20 years and one fine day you on the freeway and get cut off. You give the driver a one finger salute and call him a fool "raca". and on the way home you get in a car wreck and lose you life. Do you lose your salvation?

Jesus warns that even calling another person insulting names such as “raca” of fool is sinful. Murder begins in the heart, and epithets such as “raca” are signs that there is hatred lurking within. The hatred that causes one person to hurl insults is the same hatred that causes another to commit murder. The attitude of the heart is the same, and it’s this attitude that makes a person morally guilty before God.

So how does that work? Are some sins acceptable?

In Greek culture, sin originally meant to “miss the mark” —to miss the center of the target. Therefore, sin was considered a miscalculation or failure to achieve. There is some truth in that idea even today, as when a person is genuinely repentant over some sinful behavior and is earnestly seeking to overcome it but still fails frequently. He wants to hit the bull’s-eye every time but can’t seem to pull it off. Usually, however, our sinful actions stem not from a failure to achieve but rather from an inner urge to fulfill our own desires. As James wrote, “Each person is tempted when he is lured and enticed by his own desire”.

The apostle Paul, in stressing the need to seek justification by faith in Christ alone, quoted from the Old Testament, “Cursed be everyone who does not abide by all things written in the Book of the Law, and do them”. Galatians 3:10

Now that is a perfectly exacting standard of obedience. In academic terms, that means that a 99 on a final exam is a failing grade. It means that a misplaced comma in an otherwise fine term paper would garner an “F.”

Now, happily, Paul goes on to assure us that Christ has “redeemed us [all who trust in Him as their redeemer] from the curse of the law by becoming a curse for us” Galatians 3:13

Sin does have consequences in peoples lives here and now. Adultery can break up a happy home and so on.

Key points for us is Sanctification, repenting and asking for forgiveness. I like the verse from 1 John 1:9 in the Bible, which states that if we confess our sins, God is faithful and just to forgive us and cleanse us from all unrighteousness. It emphasizes the importance of acknowledging our wrongdoings to receive forgiveness.

And the on that should be at the top of the list Abiding in Christ.

Yet God, in his grace, freely makes us right in his sight. He did this through Christ Jesus when he freed us from the penalty for our sins. Romans 3:24

We have been set free and we will not and can not go back into bondage. We can't undo what Jesus did. We are not that powerful.

 

[GodsGrace]

Nowhere does the NT teach that we are saved "by" good works but it does teach we are saved FOR good works. (Ephesians 2:10)

Apparently, Jesus does not agree with you.


Jesus stated that a wise person who HEARS His words and ACTS on them will not fall because he is founded on the rock.
Matthew 7:24
24 "Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock.


Jesus stated that a foolish person who HEARS His words and DOES NOT ACT on them will experience a great fall.
Matthew 7:26
26 "Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand.


Matthew 7:27
27 "The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell -and great was its fall."


No long-winded explanations MMD.
There it is in black and white.
You could heed Jesus or not...
YOUR choice.

In James 2:14, we read of one who says/claims he has faith but has no works (to evidence his claim). That is not genuine faith, but a bare profession of faith. So, when James asks, "Can that faith save him?" he is saying nothing against genuine faith, but only against an empty profession of faith/dead faith. So, James does not teach that we are saved "by" works. His concern is to show the reality of the faith professed by the individual (James 2:18) and demonstrate that the faith claimed (James 2:14) by the individual is genuine.

In regard to "faith without works is dead," (James 2:20) James does not mean that faith is dead until it produces works and then it becomes a living faith or that works are the source of life in faith. That would be like saying that a tree is dead until it produces fruit and then it becomes a living tree, and the fruit is the source of life in the tree. James is simply saying faith that is not accompanied by evidential works demonstrates that it's dead. If someone merely says-claims they have faith, but lack resulting evidential works, then they demonstrate that they have an empty profession of faith/dead faith and not authentic faith. (James 2:14) Simple!

Isn't it unfortunate that the writers of the NT did not know how to communicate what Jesus had taught them?!

Faith without works is dead.
Works, together with faith, is what gives life.
Abraham obeyed God....and he was declared righteous.

James 2:14 your verse
14 What use is it, my brethren, if someone says he has faith but he has no works? Can that faith save him?

If one has faith,,,,but no works,,,that faith will not save him.

Faith Alone will not save anyone because it's NOT what Jesus taught.


James 2:20 your verse
20 But are you willing to recognize, you foolish fellow, that faith without works is useless?

James seems to be agreeing with Jesus!
A FOOLISH person believes faith alone is all that is needed.
Without works...faith is uselss...it's dead.
A foolish person does not ACT on the words of Jesus.
A wise person ACTS on the words of Jesus.

Plain and simple.
According to you...Jesus left no words or instructions or teachings.

James is speaking about FAITH.
FAITH without works is DEAD.

In John 15:1-2, there are two kinds of connections with Christ as the vine. The self-attached connection that bears no fruit (faith without works is dead) and the spiritual and vital connection that bears fruit. Apart from Christ we can do nothing. Unfruitful branches (like Judas Iscariot) are cut off/taken away.

You copy and paste.
Who knows if you even know what you're posting.

There are no two types of branches.
There is ONE type of branch.
The type that is ATTACHED to the vine and gets it's nourishment from the vine.

John 15:1-2
1 "I am the true vine, and My Father is the vinedresser.
2 "Every branch in Me that does not bear fruit, He takes away; and every branch that bears fruit, He prunes it so that it may bear more fruit.


Every branch IN JESUS that does not bear fruit...
God TAKES AWAY.

No further explanation needed.

Jesus and the NT writers knew full well how to communicate their message.

It's just that some persons to not wish to receive it.

 

[Marvelloustime]

I would . so please answer me this one question .
DID JESUS preach TWO Gospels or one .
DID the apostels preach TWO gospels or one .
AND DID THEY Not all stress the dire importance of THAT OL BELIEVE IN JESUS phrase .
SO the question i ask to all is this .
WHY would anyone have any part or lott
in satans interfaith finding common ground anti christ lie . cause I SURE SEEN a deadly LIE
taught by them leaders to the false religoins . AND friend THEY DO THE WORK OF ANTI CHRIST .
so is there all of a sudden two gospels , one which says YE MUST BELEIVE while the other says IT DONT MATTER .
YEAH RIGHT . DONT exist . i expose the harlot , i expose that which is of anti christ
AND INTERFAITH IS OF ANTI CHRIST . I GOT nothing in common with darkness . we preach JESUS to the lost
we dont try and find common ground for world peace .
IN fact JESUS never came to bring peace on earth .
BUT ANOTHER ONE DOES , and friend WE DARN SURE DONT wanna follow that one .

@TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY

 

[GodsGrace]

@TOTHALORDBEALLGLORY
View attachment 1997

M... you could make your images smaller before posting them.
It would save space.

 

[Foster]

Amen. I agree.

Ok.

Moving on to principle #2


Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved. But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13

Principle # 1 -

• lest they should believe and be saved.

Principle 1 teaches us that believe = saved.


But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

• who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away.

Principle 2 is much the same and teaches us those who believe for awhile are saved for awhile.

Since the condition for being saved is to believe, once that condition is no longer in place, then salvation is no longer in place.


Believe = saved

Believe for a while = saved for a while


Believing that endures to the end = a salvation that endures to the end.

But he who received the seed on stony places, this is he who hears the word and immediately receives it with joy; yet he has no root in himself, but endures only for a while. For when tribulation or persecution arises because of the word, immediately he stumbles. Matthew 13:20-21





Ok. Sorry.

Or maybe the didn't believe with their whole heart. Just head knowledge. they didn't have roots.

Head knowledge refers to any information stored in your mind. This can range from phone numbers you’ve memorized to knowing how to complete a task, like sewing on a button. Keep reading to find out about head knowledge and how different types of knowledge affect how we process information.

You say you have faith, for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror. James 2:9

The “faith” of demons is useless, even though they tremble at what they know to be true. People who say they “believe” in God while showing no evidence of faith have a level of “belief” similar to that of demons.

 

[Administrator]

M... you could make your images smaller before posting them.
It would save space.

I got it, thanks.

 

[JLB]

Yes but he will make sure we return. I've seen it happen.

We know it can happen. We pray it will happen.

Are we going after those of His sheep who become lost? It happens all the time.

Are we allowing Jesus who dwells in us to use us in this way.


Let’s look at the teaching about His sheep who becomes lost, to see what’s involved.


What do you think? If a man has a hundred sheep, and one of them goes astray, does he not leave the ninety-nine and go to the mountains to seek the one that is straying? And if he should find it, assuredly, I say to you, he rejoices more over that sheep than over the ninety-nine that did not go astray. Even so it is not the will of your Father who is in heaven that one of these little ones should perish.
“Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’ And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church. But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.
Matthew 18:12-17


Jesus shows us the steps we are to take if one of His sheep becomes lost.

1. Moreover if your brother sins against you, go and tell him his fault between you and him alone. If he hears you, you have gained your brother.
2. But if he will not hear, take with you one or two more, that by the mouth of two or three witnesses every word may be established.’
3. And if he refuses to hear them, tell it to the church.

But if he refuses even to hear the church, let him be to you like a heathen and a tax collector.

 

[JLB]

Or maybe the didn't believe with their whole heart. Just head knowledge. they didn't have roots.

I hear this type of response frequently. It seems to come from a place of not understanding the words of the text.


Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.

Believe = saved.


But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away. Luke 8:12-13


In this group we see that they “received the word with joy” because Jesus said the believed.

• when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while

Do you understand how we know for sure that they believed and were saved?


#1 Jesus said they believed, and also that they received the word with joy, the joy of salvation.

#2 Also, we know they believed and were saved because they met the condition for salvation that Jesus said was required for salvation; which is believe.

if you believe more is required to be saved then please explain to all of us what else is required to be saved.


#3 However the main reason we know they had believed and were saved is they were being PERSECUTED because they believed. Read Matthew’s version.

Do you understand that when a Jew in Israel was to become a follower of Jesus that they were going to be persecuted by members of their family and community to turn back to Judaism and renounce Jesus as a false Messiah and teacher.

This is what believe for a while means. They decide to save their natural life to live a little longer but would lose their eternal life.


This is what the entire book of Hebrews is about. Bringing understanding to the the Jews of who Jesus Christ is; He is LORD. God who became flesh.

It’s all about UNDERSTANDING.

THOSE who understand this will choose to lose their physical life, if necessary, to gain eternal life.


Judaism is THE antichrist religion that rejects Jesus as Messiah. The Talmud teaches the followers of Judaism that Jesus is boiling in hell in His own feces.



Please brother. Understand this. There are many scriptures that teach this.

 

[civic]

But didn't Jesus say he would never leave us or Forsake us?

Jesus is the Good Shepherd


I give them eternal life, and they shall never perish; no one will snatch them out of my hand. My Father, who has given them to me, is greater than all no one can snatch them out of my Father’s hand. John 10:28-29

He will leave the 99 and go get that one lost lamb

View attachment 1994

Scripture from both testaments on never being forsaken

2 Corinthians 4:9- persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.

Hebrews 13:5- Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, for God has said: "Never will I leave you, never will I forsake you."

Romans 8:35
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?Shall trouble or distress or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword?

Deuteronomy 4:31
For the LORD your God is a merciful God; He will not abandon you or destroy you or forget the covenant with your fathers, which He swore to them by oath.

Deuteronomy 31:6
Be strong and courageous; do not be afraid or terrified of them, for it is the LORD your God who goes with you; He will never leave you nor forsake you."

Deuteronomy 31:8
The LORD Himself goes before you; He will be with you. He will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid or discouraged."

Joshua 1:5
No one shall stand against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so will I be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you.


Psalm 9:10
And they that know thy name will put their trust in thee: for thou, LORD, hast not forsaken them that seek thee

Psalm 37:25, 28
I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread: For the LORD loves justice and will not forsake His saints. They are preserved forever,but the offspring of the wicked will be cut off.

Isaiah 41:17- The poor and needy seek water, but there is none; their tongues are parched with thirst. I, the LORD, will answer them; I, the God of Israel, will not forsake them

 

[Foster]

I hear this type of response frequently. It seems to come from a place of not understanding the words of the text.
Please brother. Understand this. There are many scriptures that teach this.

I apricate your concern but this hill is the one I'll die on. The reason being I know what happen in my life and I underhand just how saved I really am. Without going into the details it was shown to me by the Holy Spirit and divine intervention.

Lets just say you understanding and my understanding of the text are different and that ok. No hard feelings. I'm sure we will both spend eternity in Heaven. Unless you lose you salvation... just kidding. That can't happen.

 

[Adherent]

Scripture from both testaments on never being forsaken

2 Corinthians 4:9- persecuted, but not forsaken; struck down, but not destroyed.

Hebrews 13:5- Keep your lives free from the love of money and be content with what you have, for God has said: "Never will I leave you, never will I forsake you."

Romans 8:35
Who shall separate us from the love of Christ?Shall trouble or distress or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword?

Deuteronomy 4:31
For the LORD your God is a merciful God; He will not abandon you or destroy you or forget the covenant with your fathers, which He swore to them by oath.

Deuteronomy 31:6
Be strong and courageous; do not be afraid or terrified of them, for it is the LORD your God who goes with you; He will never leave you nor forsake you."

Deuteronomy 31:8
The LORD Himself goes before you; He will be with you. He will never leave you nor forsake you. Do not be afraid or discouraged."

Joshua 1:5
No one shall stand against you all the days of your life. As I was with Moses, so will I be with you; I will never leave you nor forsake you.


Psalm 9:10
And they that know thy name will put their trust in thee: for thou, LORD, hast not forsaken them that seek thee

Psalm 37:25, 28
I have been young, and now am old; yet have I not seen the righteous forsaken, nor his seed begging bread: For the LORD loves justice and will not forsake His saints. They are preserved forever,but the offspring of the wicked will be cut off.

Isaiah 41:17- The poor and needy seek water, but there is none; their tongues are parched with thirst. I, the LORD, will answer them; I, the God of Israel, will not forsake them

Good word! Jesus never fails! Men may let us down but God saved us because He know what's best for us.

Earthly friends may prove untrue,
Doubts and fears assail;
One still loves and cares for you:
Jesus never fails.

Jesus never fails,
Jesus never fails;
Heav’n and earth may pass away,
But Jesus never fails.

2 Though the sky be dark and drear,
Fierce and strong the gale,
Just remember He is near,
And He will not fail.

3 In life’s dark and bitter hour
Love will still prevail;
Trust His everlasting pow’r,
Jesus will not fail.

 

[JLB]

I apricate your concern but this hill is the one I'll die on. The reason being I know what happen in my life and I underhand just how saved I really am. Without going into the details it was shown to me by the Holy Spirit and divine intervention.

Lets just say you understanding and my understanding of the text are different and that ok. No hard feelings. I'm sure we will both spend eternity in Heaven. Unless you lose you salvation... just kidding. That can't happen.

The text refers to believing for a while because when they are being persecuted for being Christians in First century Israel they no longer believed; they turned away from Christ.


At least address the actual text rather than going by some emotion you have.

 

[Foster]

The text refers to believing for a while because when they are being persecuted for being Christians in First century Israel they no longer believed; they turned away from Christ.


At least address the actual text rather than going by some emotion you have.

Yeah, I'll get back to you with that.

 

[Hosanna]

That's the "No True Scotsman Fallacy."
Calvinists are a silly bunch.

You missed the point of the OP, it about pointing out the difference between the three. I prefer the once-saved-always-saved position that rejects the traditional Reformed doctrine of the perseverance of the saints in favor of the doctrine of eternal security.

“Those who once become true Christians cannot totally fall away and be lost—that while they may fall into sin temporarily, they will eventually return.

Within this broad description of the doctrine of Perseverance, or of “once saved, always saved,” two distinct subsystems exist.

Do you know what are the differences are?

Because that's the point of this thread. not "no true Scotsman" or making calling Calvinists a silly bunch.

That would be against the rules. 1c. No attacks on another poster's religious beliefs, race, national origin, or gender.

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