sethproton
Active member
What's going on is unclear use of words on your part. If you wish to clarify that is your decision
Did God ( Christ ) die ?
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GeneZ
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sethproton
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GeneZ
Well-known member
Yes..... The unregenerate is spiritually dead, having no human spirit.
Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.”
“How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second
time into their mother’s womb to be born!”
time into their mother’s womb to be born!”
Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water
and the Spirit. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’.’ John 3:3-7
and the Spirit. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’.’ John 3:3-7
Back in those days before the Cross took place, when someone was born (natural childbirth)?
The mother 'broke water' to begin the process of birth...
Hence, "born of water." Meaning our first birth.
Jesus meant 'born of water' to mean the physical birth. Our first birth.
Then to become regenerate? For the spiritual birth?
Jesus said that the Holy Spirit must give birth to our human spirit.
In that way we must be born twice - "born again."
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Do not marvel that I said to you, ‘You must be born again.’.’
There has been some misunderstand today when believers assume that to be born again Jesus was telling Nicodemus we needed to receive the indwelling Holy Spirit. But, what Jesus was telling Nicodemus was said some time before the then unknown baptism of the Holy Spirit was to be given.
After Jesus was resurrected and went back in heaven, and was glorified by the Father, after that took place was when Pentecost took place.
Since Pentecost when regeneration takes place we not only get a human spirit (like OT believers had).. But now, we also receive the gift of the indwelling Holy Spirit....
grace and peace ...............
Looks like Adam is out of luck with your definition of "born of water". I'll let you break that news to him.
I'm trying to follow you. Are you saying that OT believers had a human spirit whereas NT believers get a human spirit at Pentecost? If so, at what point did humans stop having a human spirit before they had to acquire it at Pentecost?
GeneZ
Well-known member
This much I will say.
OT believers were born again.
They were body, soul, and human spirit.
What the Church age introduced was as follows:
Like the OT believers being body, soul, and human spirit.
The Christian was also given the indwelling of the Holy Spirit.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Adam being unique was never born to begin with.
In his case he simply needed regeneration.
Can you show us at least one OT verse that explicitely says that?
So both OT and NT believers always had human spirit, right? That I would agree to.
Jesus never mentioned any exception to how anyone can see the Kingdom of God. Unfortunately, your idea of seminal fluid = water fails.
GeneZ
Well-known member
What was Nicodemus?
Nicodemus was living as an OT Jew.
Jesus taught him as a rabbi.
Matter of fact, Jesus taught his disciples as a rabbi taught Jews.
Jesus told Nicodemus as a Jew that he needed to be born again in order to know He was the Messiah.
That should be sufficient ....
GeneZ
Well-known member
Jesus did not need any exception to be mentioned. Jesus knew that Nicodemus was intelligent enough.
Nicodemus needed to be regenerated at Pentecost. That was coming up shortly for him and everyone else alive at that time.
That's why there's not even a hint of anyone being regenerated in OT times across the entire OT.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Seminal fluid?
That is what the male produces during sexual intercourse!
You need to learn this:
https://www.webmd.com/baby/what-is-amniotic-fluid
.
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GeneZ
Well-known member
Nicodemus went from being a born again Jew prior to Pentecost to becoming a born again Christian after Pentecost.
It's Adam that you're claiming that Jesus made an exception for. That's not in the Bible. Therefore, your idea of amniotic fluid = water fails.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Was Adam ever born? No. He could not be born again.
In Adam's case, God knew Adam repented and restored his human spirit. Adam was simply "regenerated."
Born again only applies to people who were born. Adam was never born.
You should able to figure this out for yourself....
Huh? Bible reference please. Without any supporting verses, this idea of yours will be tossed out.
That's the only way to be born again.
There is no "generated" or "born once" in the Bible, only "regenerated" or "born again". By your thinking then Adam will never be born again (regenerated). I'll let you break that news to him.
GeneZ
Well-known member
Diserner
Well-known member
He was born, just not of a woman.
The earth had come from the prehistoric waters, and perhaps was a bit muddy as a steam is said to come up from the ground.
However, I think this first water represents a fallen creation.
It is potentially possible Adam committed the unpardonable sin, and was dealt with just for the sake of his progeny.
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