Did God ( Christ ) die ?

civic

Well-known member
@dizerner @armylngst

Did God die when Jesus died on the cross? The answer depends on how we understand the meaning of the word die. To die does not mean to go out of existence. Death is separation. Physical death is when the soul-spirit separates from the physical body. So, in that sense, yes, God died, because Jesus was God in human form, and Jesus’ soul-spirit separated from His body (John 19:30). However, if by “death” we mean “a cessation of existence,” then, no, God did not die. For God to “die” in that sense would mean that He ceased to exist, and neither the Father nor the Son nor the Holy Spirit will ever cease to exist. The Son, the second Person of the Trinity, left the body He temporarily inhabited on Earth, but His divine nature did not die, nor could it.

Jesus is truly God and truly man. His physical body did die; His heart stopped beating, and “he gave up his spirit” (Matthew 27:50). Just as our physical bodies will someday die, so did His. But as Jesus died physically, He remained alive spiritually. Jesus made good on His promise to the believing thief on the cross—He and the thief both went to paradise, not physically, but in spirit (Luke 23:43).

So, Jesus died physically on the cross, as was plain for all to see (John 19:34). But there is also the matter of spiritual death. When Jesus was hanging on the cross, He experienced death on our behalf. Even though He is God, He still had to suffer the agony of a temporary separation from the Father due to the sin He bore. After three hours of supernatural darkness, Jesus cried, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Mark 15:34). So, could it be said that Jesus also “died” spiritually? Again, it was only His human nature that was separated from God, not His divine nature. God did not “die.”

The question for all people to ask is “what will happen to my soul/spirit when it leaves my physical body?” This is the most crucial question in life. As we saw with Jesus, our spirits will leave our bodies and travel on to somewhere else. We will either follow Him to heaven to spend eternity with Him, or we will go to hell to spend eternity in “outer darkness” where there will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth” (Matthew 8:12). There is no other option. Jesus’ death on the cross paid the way for all who would ever believe in Him so that we can know for sure where our spirits will reside for eternity. His death provided us spiritual life, both here and in heaven. “And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you” (Romans 8:11). got ?

hope this helps !!!
 
@dizerner @armylngst

Did God die when Jesus died on the cross? The answer depends on how we understand the meaning of the word die. To die does not mean to go out of existence. Death is separation. Physical death is when the soul-spirit separates from the physical body. So, in that sense, yes, God died, because Jesus was God in human form, and Jesus’ soul-spirit separated from His body (John 19:30). However, if by “death” we mean “a cessation of existence,” then, no, God did not die. For God to “die” in that sense would mean that He ceased to exist, and neither the Father nor the Son nor the Holy Spirit will ever cease to exist. The Son, the second Person of the Trinity, left the body He temporarily inhabited on Earth, but His divine nature did not die, nor could it.

Jesus is truly God and truly man. His physical body did die; His heart stopped beating, and “he gave up his spirit” (Matthew 27:50). Just as our physical bodies will someday die, so did His. But as Jesus died physically, He remained alive spiritually. Jesus made good on His promise to the believing thief on the cross—He and the thief both went to paradise, not physically, but in spirit (Luke 23:43).

So, Jesus died physically on the cross, as was plain for all to see (John 19:34). But there is also the matter of spiritual death. When Jesus was hanging on the cross, He experienced death on our behalf. Even though He is God, He still had to suffer the agony of a temporary separation from the Father due to the sin He bore. After three hours of supernatural darkness, Jesus cried, “My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?” (Mark 15:34). So, could it be said that Jesus also “died” spiritually? Again, it was only His human nature that was separated from God, not His divine nature. God did not “die.”

The question for all people to ask is “what will happen to my soul/spirit when it leaves my physical body?” This is the most crucial question in life. As we saw with Jesus, our spirits will leave our bodies and travel on to somewhere else. We will either follow Him to heaven to spend eternity with Him, or we will go to hell to spend eternity in “outer darkness” where there will be “weeping and gnashing of teeth” (Matthew 8:12). There is no other option. Jesus’ death on the cross paid the way for all who would ever believe in Him so that we can know for sure where our spirits will reside for eternity. His death provided us spiritual life, both here and in heaven. “And if the Spirit of him who raised Jesus from the dead is living in you, he who raised Christ from the dead will also give life to your mortal bodies through his Spirit, who lives in you” (Romans 8:11). got ?

hope this helps !!!
No. God did not die. God cannot be separated from Himself. Jesus died, God did not. The flesh died. The human part of Jesus died. Why do we die? Because of sin. So are you saying that God became a sinner, and thus died? You have to consider everything. The reason why God did not die is because God is 1. God, and God never sinned, and the reason why we die is because of sin. And the reason Jesus died is because our sin was imputed to Him. By Jesus dying (the humanity), Jesus fulfilled the Law of death for us. God, however, did not die. It is difficult to understand, because we are human, and God, and Jesus, are completely different from us. Jesus was human, but He was also 100% God. We have no analog to which we can compare Him.
 
No. God did not die. God cannot be separated from Himself. Jesus died, God did not. The flesh died. The human part of Jesus died. Why do we die? Because of sin. So are you saying that God became a sinner, and thus died? You have to consider everything. The reason why God did not die is because God is 1. God, and God never sinned, and the reason why we die is because of sin. And the reason Jesus died is because our sin was imputed to Him. By Jesus dying (the humanity), Jesus fulfilled the Law of death for us. God, however, did not die. It is difficult to understand, because we are human, and God, and Jesus, are completely different from us. Jesus was human, but He was also 100% God. We have no analog to which we can compare Him.
Thats your definition of death but that is only one meaning. just like love has many different meanings and nuances to the word the context gives words there meaning. So in the context His body was dead but His soul/spirit was alive since its eternal.
 
Again, it was only His human nature that was separated from God, not His divine nature. God did not “die.”

There is no Bible verse that says this. Notice there were no quotations from the Bible, just an unproven assertion based on human reasoning.


Jesus said:

"Behold, I was dead."

Jesus is God.

That's an equation, where if you believe both propositions, there is no way around the conclusion.


Jesus did not say:

"I was a little dead somewhere."

"Part of me was dead."

"My external associated non-personal human nature died."


Jesus said "I."

The same "I" in "I am the Light of the World," and "I am the First in the Last."

"I was dead."


That's straight Bible.

It takes human philosophy to make it say the opposite of what it says.


Now think of it this way:

If all God meant by "You shall surely die," is physical death, then we don't need Jesus to die for us.

Why?

Because we all physically die.

And then, when we physically die, we have paid the price of sin, and now we merit heaven afterwards, having paid sin's price.

No more Jesus necessary!

"I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain." (Gal. 2:21 NKJ)

Now explain to me what "Christ died in vain" even means?

It means we have removed the purpose of Christ dying.


And why is there in Scripture a "second death"?

Did God say to Adam and Eve, "In the day you eat of it, you will die twice?"

What is the purpose of even having a second death?

That death is described as real death—the end result of sin—the wrath of God, experiencing God negatively.

Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. (Rev. 20:14 NKJ)

"Shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death." (Rev. 21:8 NKJ)



Now I ask you this, straightforwardly and honestly:

Did Jesus somehow evade the second death when he died for us?

Did Jesus only die the first death, and that's it, nothing more?!
 
There is no Bible verse that says this. Notice there were no quotations from the Bible, just an unproven assertion based on human reasoning.


Jesus said:

"Behold, I was dead."

Jesus is God.

That's an equation, where if you believe both propositions, there is no way around the conclusion.


Jesus did not say:

"I was a little dead somewhere."

"Part of me was dead."

"My external associated non-personal human nature died."


Jesus said "I."

The same "I" in "I am the Light of the World," and "I am the First in the Last."

"I was dead."


That's straight Bible.

It takes human philosophy to make it say the opposite of what it says.


Now think of it this way:

If all God meant by "You shall surely die," is physical death, then we don't need Jesus to die for us.

Why?

Because we all physically die.

And then, when we physically die, we have paid the price of sin, and now we merit heaven afterwards, having paid sin's price.

No more Jesus necessary!

"I do not set aside the grace of God; for if righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain." (Gal. 2:21 NKJ)

Now explain to me what "Christ died in vain" even means?

It means we have removed the purpose of Christ dying.


And why is there in Scripture a "second death"?

Did God say to Adam and Eve, "In the day you eat of it, you will die twice?"

What is the purpose of even having a second death?

That death is described as real death—the end result of sin—the wrath of God, experiencing God negatively.

Then Death and Hades were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. (Rev. 20:14 NKJ)

"Shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death." (Rev. 21:8 NKJ)



Now I ask you this, straightforwardly and honestly:

Did Jesus somehow evade the second death when he died for us?

Did Jesus only die the first death, and that's it, nothing more?!
Did you consider that the disciples interacted with Jesus humanity? Did I not say Jesus humanity, the flesh, died? His flesh was dead. However, HIs Spirit was alive. It is not something that can be simply explained, because Jesus was God. We have no analog, no experience, no knowledge by which we can explain this, so it isn't worth trying. Just understand what Peter said. While the flesh died, the Spirit was alive. You can't compare Jesus/God to Adam and Eve. There are some things you just have to accept through faith.
 
Did you consider that the disciples interacted with Jesus humanity? Did I not say Jesus humanity, the flesh, died? His flesh was dead. However, HIs Spirit was alive. It is not something that can be simply explained, because Jesus was God. We have no analog, no experience, no knowledge by which we can explain this, so it isn't worth trying. Just understand what Peter said. While the flesh died, the Spirit was alive. You can't compare Jesus/God to Adam and Eve. There are some things you just have to accept through faith.
Yet Jesus is One Person who is Divine. He is a Divine Person with a human nature. Natures do no die, people do.
 
Yet Jesus is One Person who is Divine. He is a Divine Person with a human nature. Natures do no die, people do.
Jesus was one person with two natures. Divine and human. As someone put it, Jesus was the High Priest and the sacrifice in one body, for the High Priest must sanctify the sacrifice before it is offered.
 
Did God die when Jesus died on the cross? The answer depends on how we understand the meaning of the word die.
No. And no. Scripture tells us God raised Jesus from the dead. Romans 10:9.

This means Jesus died in every meaning of the word. It also means God remained alive during the time that Jesus was dead.
 
I nearly threw up in my throat to read trinitarian and logic in the same sentence (without NOT). :eek:
I'm glad you have a sense of humor its much needed when talking about the bible and exchanging our beliefs with each other. I don't take things like you said anymore personally. :)

Some might be highly offended but I have learned not to take things like that personally.
 
I don't take things like you said anymore personally.
I’m grateful for that. Very grateful!

This morning I spent some time with the young man I mentioned in another thread to mentor. We played Pickleball. Having no specific agenda, we just engaged in small talk.

I know I was doing the work the Holy Spirit laid in my heart when he abruptly asked, ‘Same time next week?’

We did not talk doctrine or politics. He doesn’t know what my political or doctrinal beliefs are. I doubt it matters for the work I am called to do. And what is that?

Do life with him. Let him know I am a friendly ear to hear his trials and tribulations. Raising 3 kids, he has his hands filled. Practical, Christian advice.
 
You're both changing what the Bible says.

"Behold, my flesh was dead." — No Bible Ever.

You guys quote a lot from the "NBE." :)
 
You're both changing what the Bible says.

"Behold, my flesh was dead." — No Bible Ever.

You guys quote a lot from the "NBE." :)
Peter said this in I Peter 3: "18 For Christ also [m]suffered for sins once for all time, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the [n]spirit;"

So what was that you were saying? :)
 
Peter said this in I Peter 3: "18 For Christ also [m]suffered for sins once for all time, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the [n]spirit;"

So what was that you were saying? :)

I was saying you contradicted the Bible.

Now you did it by a lame attempt to pull in another verse and make the Bible contradict itself.

And of course civic doesn't even give 10 ounces of thought to it and posts "oops" as per usual.

If Jesus was not "put to death in the spirit" as well, how could he be "made alive in spirit"?

You can't "make" something alive that's already alive, that's redundant.

The point is, what we see in the flesh is not the final word.


No, this verse does not some nullify and contradict the more plain Bible verse you both bent over backwards to nullify.

Jesus said "I was dead."
 
I was saying you contradicted the Bible.

Now you did it by a lame attempt to pull in another verse and make the Bible contradict itself.
If I take what you say, and what that verse says in context, then I guess your Bible contradicts itself.
And of course civic doesn't even give 10 ounces of thought to it and posts "oops" as per usual.
BTW, I mentioned Peter the last time I said what you say I said, because this was the actual passage I was referring to. (Quite a few times, actually).
If Jesus was not "put to death in the spirit" as well, how could he be "made alive in spirit"?
What did God tell people about having fear for God? Don't fear the one who can kill the body, rather fear the one who can destroy both the body and soul in hell. So even here, there is separation. You cannot kill someone's soul, you can only kill the body. However, you seem to have forgotten that Jesus is both God and man in one body. Both divinity and human spirits in one body, in perfect union, fellowship and communion. The Catholic Church, in the Catechism says that it was such that when one spoke, it was both speaking. That is how perfect the communion/fellowship was. Complete harmony, to the point that Satan could not tempt the flesh, the humanity, into sin. The only reason Satan tried is because it was "possible". (In quotes because, while something is possible, it doesn't mean it will ever happen.)

So Jesus died as humans do, but the Logos never died. So Jesus was put to death "in the flesh" that is His humanity, the fleshy part. Hence there was a body to put in the tomb. And the human nature/spirit died, however it is impossible to know what that means, since we have only one example of incarnation anywhere in history, and they didn't bother explaining how that worked. The only thing one could say is that the spirit was separated from the body, but was reunited with the Logos, once again in perfect harmony, communion and fellowship, after having been forsaken on the cross. (That forsaken was when the sin that the sacrifice, the human side of Jesus bore, disrupted the fellowship between the human and the divine. God cannot abide sin, so...yeah, that happened. That ended once Jesus said "It is finished". What was finished? The sacrifice for sin borne by Christ. (He made Him who knew no sin to be sin on our behalf.) He was innocent though, so His spirit did not remain dead.
You can't "make" something alive that's already alive, that's redundant.
If you don't understand, don't go beyond what you don't understand or you ask questions that make us go "huh?"
The point is, what we see in the flesh is not the final word.
So why are you only seeing the flesh? You forgot completely about the Logos become flesh. You stopped at the flesh.
No, this verse does not some nullify and contradict the more plain Bible verse you both bent over backwards to nullify.
No, it shows that you can't nullify or contradict the context of scripture. Peter tells us what happened, and the result of what happened.
Jesus said "I was dead.
He was dead. You could have checked his pockets for loose change. However, Peter tells us what was going on in the background. He was put to death in the flesh, so you could pick up His hand and let go and it would instantly drop. You could check His pulse (He didn't have one). However, how do you check to see if the spirit is dead? If His Spirit was dead and remained dead, He would have gone to hell as an inmate, and not to proclaim His victory over sin and death.
 
Where did Jesus go for the three days and three nights after dying on the cross? No one knows for certain where Jesus was the entire time during the three days between His crucifixion and resurrection. We know for certain where he was part of the time––in Paradise. But an enigmatic verse in 1 Peter about, “preaching to the spirits in prison” opens up other possibilities.

"For Christ died for sins once for all... to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built..." 1 Peter 3:18-20

What did Jesus preach to them, the gospel? Was He preaching to "the spirits in prison" intimates that the people who died before the crucifixion (especially the people who lived in the days of Noah) were given a second chance to repent! I don't think we can be sure since Peter is the only one that mentions this. But it's in the Bible.
 
Back
Top Bottom