Revelation 20 describes a period of 1000 years, but it does not say where that occurs.
well, Revelation 19:11-16 describes the King of Kings, and Lord of lords, riding on a white horse, and the Armies of heaven join him, also on white horses.
The subsequent passages describe a number of activities, which lead to the 1000 years.
So, why wouldn't this happen in the order it's written?
John 14:3 says that when Jesus returns He will take us with Him so that where He is we may also be.
Yep.
1 Thes 4:16-17 says that those who are dead will go to the Lord first, and then those who are alive will meet Him "in the air", not on Earth.
Yep.
2 Thes 2:8, "And then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord Jesus will overthrow with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the splendor of his coming."
Yep.
Rev 19:21, says, "The rest of them were killed with the sword that came out of the mouth of the rider on the horse."
Yep.
All the evil ones will die, and all the righteous ones will go to Heaven with Jesus, to forever be where He is.
where Jesus is...
does Jesus ever come back to the earth? Or does he remain in heaven forever?
if he remains in heaven, who is the King of kings, and Lord of lords, riding on the white horse in 19:11-16?
Absolutely it will. And they will all be killed by Jesus on His return while the righteous are taken up to Heaven.
Interresting...
But there won't be some 45 days of judgement BEFORE the thousand years.
Joel 3, and Daniel 12 say otherwise.
Judgement comes after the thousand years.
there is a final judgment in Revelation 20:10-15. But that doesn't mean there's not a judgment of the nations before the 1000 years. Matthew 25:31-46 and Joel 3 shows there will be. Daniel 12 what gives us the number of days it'll last.
Jesus' Kingdom is not of this world.
True. It doesn't mean that it won't return to the earth.
It is a Heavenly, Spiritual Kingdom, and so will not be in the earthly Jerusalem.
Really? Hmm... the Bible says it will be.
According to Revelation 21-22, the heavenly Jerusalem will come down to the new earth.
And they did, in 70 AD. But the Covenant that was established had already been confirmed (the New Covenant).
Different from the biblical narrative.
The prince who is to come is who confirms a covenant with the many. He will break it mid point. Daniel 9:26-27. He will take away the offering and sacrifices. Daniel 12.
From David Guzik's Enduring Word Commentary
4. (26) What happens after the first sixty-nine weeks.
“And after the sixty-two weeks
Messiah shall be cut off, but not for Himself;
And the people of the prince who is to come
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary.
The end of it shall be with a flood,
And till the end of the war desolations are determined.
a.
After the sixty-two weeks Messiah shall be cut off: The Biblical term
cut off is sometimes used to describe execution (see
Genesis 9:11 and
Exodus 31:14). Gabriel told Daniel that the Messiah will
be cut off for the sake of others,
not for Himself.
i. “Able chronologists have shown that the crucifixion of the Lord Jesus Christ occurred immediately after the expiration of 483 prophetic years, of 360 days each, from the time of Artaxerxes’ order.” (Ironside)
ii. Strangely, many able commentators simply ignore these numbers. “The numbers are symbolic and not arithmetical.” (Baldwin)
iii.
Cut off is a poignant description of Jesus’ earthly life up to and including the cross. “Born in another man’s stable, cradled in another man’s manger with nowhere to lay his head during his life on earth, and buried in another man’s tomb after dying on a cursed cross, the Christ of God and the Friend of the friendless was indeed cut off and had nothing.” (Heslop)
b.
Shall destroy the city and the sanctuary: After the Messiah was
cut off, Jerusalem and her temple would be destroyed
again by an overwhelming army (
with a flood). Most all Bible scholars and commentators agree that this was fulfilled in the Roman destruction of Jerusalem in A.D. 70.
c.
The people of the prince who is to come shall destroy: The destroying army is made up of the
people of the prince who is to come. This
coming prince is described more in
Daniel 9:27.
5. (27) The events of the seventieth week.
Then he shall confirm a covenant with many for one week;
But in the middle of the week
He shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering.
And on the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate,
Even until the consummation, which is determined,
Is poured out on the desolate.”
a.
He shall confirm a covenant: The “
he” Gabriel described is the
prince who is to come mentioned in the previous verse. If we know that the prince’s
people destroyed Jerusalem in A.D. 70, then we know this coming prince has his ancestral roots in the soil of the ancient Roman Empire.
i. Therefore, the
prince who is to come will in some way be an heir to the Romans, even as the final world government is an heir to the Roman Empire (
Daniel 7).
b.
He shall confirm a covenant with many for one week: The coming prince will make a
covenant with Israel for the final unit of seven years, completing the seventy weeks prophesied for the Jewish people and Jerusalem.
i.
Covenant with many: The word
many here is a
specific reference to Israel, not a
general reference to a group. The ancient Hebrew says, “
covenant with the many.”
ii. With this
covenant Israel will embrace the Antichrist as a political messiah, if not the literal Messiah. Jesus predicted this in
John 5:43:
I have come in My Father’s name, and you do not receive Me; if another comes in his own name, him you will receive.
iii. Taking the description of what would be accomplished in the 70 Weeks from
Daniel 9:24, we know that the 70 Weeks are not yet complete. Yet the events promised in the first 69 weeks
are fulfilled, indicated that there is a lengthy “pause” in the 70 Weeks, between the 69th week and the 70th week. The 70th week will begin when the coming prince
shall confirm a covenant with the Jewish people. These gaps or pauses in prophecy may seem strange to us, but they are common. Comparing
Isaiah 9:6 and
Luke 1:31-33 shows another significant pause or gap in prophecy regarding the coming of the Messiah.
iv. We can think of it in this way: God appointed 490 years of special focus on Israel in His redemptive plan. The years were paused by Israel’s rejection of Jesus. Now there is no
special focus on Israel in God’s redemptive plan because this is the time of the church. God’s focus will return to Israel when the church is taken away (at the rapture) and the last seven years of man’s rule on this earth begin.
v. “The 70th week will begin when the Jewish people are restored in unbelief to their land and city; and among them will be found a faithful remnant, owning their sin, and seeking Jehovah’s face.” (Henry Ironside writing in 1911)
c.
In the middle of the week he shall bring an end to sacrifice and offering: The coming prince will break the covenant with Israel in the
middle of the seven years, the final week (period of seven years).
i. The Book of Revelation sees this seven year period with both its halves as yet future (
Revelation 12:6,
13-14;
13:5-9,
14-15). The
middle of the week and the
end of sacrifice had not yet happened in 90 A.D.
d.
On the wing of abominations shall be one who makes desolate: The ending of sacrifice will come with
abominations, followed by tremendous
desolation.
i.
Abominations translates an ancient Hebrew word (
shiqquwts) that is connected to horrific idolatry (
Deuteronomy 29:17,
1 Kings 11:5-7,
2 Kings 23:13). The idea is that the coming prince breaks the covenant and brings an end to sacrifice and offering by desecrating the holy place of the temple with a horrific idolatry.
ii. Jesus called this the
abomination of desolation (
Matthew 24:15) and indicated that it would be a pivotal sign in the Great Tribulation. Paul referred to the idolatry of the coming prince in
2 Thessalonians 2:3-4.
e.
Until the consummation, which is determined, is poured out on the desolate: This breaking of the covenant and abomination of desolation has a promised
consummation. Before the 70th week is completed, each of the things described in
Daniel 9:24 will be accomplished and everlasting righteousness will reign.
The Seventy Weeks of Daniel
as Understood by Sir Robert Anderson in “The Coming Prince”
Daniel 9:24-25 says that from the decree to rebuild Jerusalem to the coming of the Messiah there will be 483 years.
7 + 62 “weeks” = 69 groups of seven years. 7 x 69 = 483 years
Anderson understood a prophetic year as 360 days. This is based both on ancient history and on
Revelation 11:2,
13:5,
11:3, and
12:6 which indicate that 42 months - 3 ½ years - are equal to 1,260 days.
Therefore, 483 years x 360 days = 173,880 days
Artaxerxes started his reign in 465 B.C. The decree to rebuild Jerusalem was given on the first day of Nisan, in the 20th year of Artaxerxes. In our calendar system (the Julian calendar) that date is March 14, 445 B.C. (
Nehemiah 2:1)
Jesus started His ministry in the 15th year of Tiberius (see
Luke 3:1). Tiberius started his reign in A.D. 14, so Jesus’ ministry started in A.D. 29. Anderson believed that Jesus celebrated four Passovers during His ministry, one each in A.D. 29, 30, 31. and His final Passover in A.D. 32. With the help of lunar charts, we can calculate the exact date of ancient Passovers, so it is possible to calculate the exact day of Jesus’ triumphal entry into Jerusalem as April 6, A.D. 32.
From 445 B.C. to A.D. 32. there are 476 years on the Julian calendar
(not 477 years, because there is no year zero).
476 years x 365 days = 173,740 days.
Adjusting for the difference between March 14 and April 6 adds 24 days.
Adjusting for leap years over a period of 476 years adds 116 days.
The total number of days from March 14, 445 B.C. to April 6, A.D. 32.
173,740 + 24 + 116 = 173,880 days.
According to his calendar, Daniel told us there would be 173,880 days between the decree and the arrival of Messiah the Prince.
Jesus said to the Jews of this day:
If you had known, even you, especially IN THIS YOUR DAY, the things that make for your peace! (
Luke 19:42). David said of this day in
Psalm 118:24: THIS IS THE DAY
which the LORD has made; we will rejoice and be glad in it.
©2018 David Guzik – No distribution beyond personal use without permission
Yes, and these things have already happened.
not all of them. There's much more to take place.
The antichrist has been in the world since almost the very beginning of the Church.
1 John 4, indeed. Spirit of antichrist.
not THE Antichrist. Not the man of sin described in 2 Thessalonians 2.
He can't be revealed until that which retains is taken out of the way.
2Th 2:1-12 WEB 1 Now, brothers, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to him, we ask you 2 not to be quickly shaken in your mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter as if from us, saying that the day of Christ has already come. 3 Let no one deceive you in any way. For it will not be unless the rebellion comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of destruction. 4 He opposes and exalts himself against all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, setting himself up as God. 5 Don’t you remember that when I was still with you, I told you these things? 6 Now you know what is restraining him, to the end that he may be revealed in his own season. 7 For the mystery of lawlessness already works. Only there is one who restrains now, until he is taken out of the way. 8 Then the lawless one will be revealed, whom the Lord will kill with the breath of his mouth and destroy by the manifestation of his coming; 9 even he whose coming is according to the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders, 10 and with all deception of wickedness for those who are being lost, because they didn’t receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 11 Because of this, God sends them a powerful delusion, that they should believe a lie, 12 that they all might be judged who didn’t believe the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
Then the end has already come, and we do not really exist.
Many ancient Jews viewed the actions of Antiochus Epiphanes as the fulfillment of Daniel 9:27, which says, "On the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate." However, the time frame in verses 24–27 begins with the decree of Cyrus that sent the Jews back to their land after the exile (Ezra 1). This makes it impossible that Daniel's prophecy refers to Antiochus Epiphanes. The year 186 BC was far too early to fit the prophecy—but the year AD 70 was not. In that year, the Roman general Titus invaded Jerusalem to crush a Jewish revolt, entered the temple, had the building destroyed, and carried off the lampstand and other temple artifacts to Rome.
It seems incontrovertible that Titus' actions were the specific fulfillment of Jesus' warning in Mark 13:14 about the "abomination of desolation standing where he ought not to be." After all, the parallel verse in Matthew 24:15 says that the abomination would stand in "the holy place," a clear reference to the temple. Christ told the disciples that when they saw the abomination, they were to flee the city. They were not to return from the field for their possessions if they were out working the crops. If they were on the roof of their home, they were not to enter the home before fleeing; rather, they were to scurry down the outdoor staircases (most houses in Judea had flat roofs that people accessed via an outdoor staircase) and flee. The flight would be so perilous that winter travel would be difficult and pregnant women would find it hard to keep up (Mark 13:14–20).
None of which changes anything. The prince is not the object, the people of the prince are. "He" cannot refer back to the prince, but must refer back to the Messiah.
why can't it refer to the prince?
What.... specifically.... prevents it from referring to the prince of the "people of the prince who is to come..."
Are you familiar with Revelation 17?
Rev 17:9-14 WEB 9 Here is the mind that has wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains on which the woman sits. 10
They are seven kings. Five have fallen, the one is, and the other has not yet come. When he comes, he must continue a little while. 11
The beast that was, and is not, is himself also an eighth, and is of the seven; and he goes to destruction. 12 The ten horns that you saw are ten kings who have received no kingdom as yet, but they receive authority as kings with the beast for one hour. 13 These have one mind, and they give their power and authority to the beast. 14 These will war against the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for he is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with him are called, chosen, and faithful.”
It's curious that there are 8 kings, 7 of which have already happened.
So, why must the prince not be the antichrist?
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