brightfame52
Active Member
No conditions are mentioned, you imposing conditions, not wise. Once you do that, you forfeit Grace Salvation.
Calvin on unlimited atonement
- Thread starter TomL
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brightfame52
Active Member
Nothing about a condition. If a person believes it shows they were saved and had everlasting life. Acts 13:48
And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were ordained to eternal life believed.
You appear to be having reading difficulty
Seeing as the absence of faith precludes salvation, it clearly is a condition.
John 3:36 (KJV 1900) — 36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
If you do not believe, you will not see life
That is a condition.
Mark 16:16 (KJV 1900) — 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Believing is an obvious condition for avoiding damnation and obtaining salvation.
John 8:24 (LEB) — 24 Thus I said to you that you will die in your sins. For if you do not believe that I am he, you will die in your sins.”
Believing is a condition to avoid dying in your sin.
Verse 48. As many as were ordained to eternal life believed.] This text has been most pitifully misunderstood. Many suppose that it simply means that those in that assembly who were fore-ordained, or predestinated by God’s decree, to eternal life, believed under the influence of that decree. Now, we should be careful to examine what a word means, before we attempt to fix its meaning. Whatever τεταγμενοι may mean, which is the word we translate ordained, it is neither προτεταγμενοι nor προορισμενοι which the apostle uses, but simply τεταγμενοι, which includes no idea of pre-ordination or pre-destination of any kind. And, if it even did, it would be rather hazardous to say that all those who believed at this time were such as actually persevered unto the end, and were saved unto eternal life. But, leaving all these precarious matters, what does the word τεταγμενος mean? The verb ταττω or τασσω signifies to place, set, order, appoint, dispose; hence it has been considered here as implying the disposition or readiness of mind of several persons in the congregation, such as the religious proselytes mentioned ver. 43, who possessed the reverse of the disposition of those Jews who spake against those things, contradicting and blaspheming, ver. 45. Though the word in this place has been variously translated, yet, of all the meanings ever put on it, none agrees worse with its nature and known signification than that which represents it as intending those who were predestinated to eternal life: this is no meaning of the term, and should never be applied to it. Let us, without prejudice, consider the scope of the place: the Jews contradicted and blasphemed; the religious proselytes heard attentively, and received the word of life: the one party were utterly indisposed, through their own stubbornness, to receive the Gospel; the others, destitute of prejudice and prepossession, were glad to hear that, in the order of God, the Gentiles were included in the covenant of salvation through Christ Jesus; they, therefore, in this good state and order of mind, believed. Those who seek for the plain meaning of the word will find it here: those who wish to make out a sense, not from the Greek word, its use among the best Greek writers, and the obvious sense of the evangelist, but from their own creed, may continue to puzzle themselves and others; kindle their own fire, compass themselves with sparks, and walk in the light of their own fire, and of the sparks which they have kindled; and, in consequence, lie down in sorrow, having bidden adieu to the true meaning of a passage so very simple, taken in its connection, that one must wonder how it ever came to be misunderstood and misapplied. Those who wish to see more on this verse may consult Hammond, Whitby, Schoettgen, Rosenmüller, Pearce, Sir Norton Knatchbull, and Dodd.11 Adam Clarke, The Holy Bible with a Commentary and Critical Notes (vol. 5, New Edition.; Bellingham, WA: Faithlife Corporation, 2014), 790–791.
or other translations
(2001) Now, when those who came from the nations heard this, they started rejoicing and glorifying the Word of the Lord. And all those who were inclined to accept age-long life became believers.
(CTBible) Upon hearing this, the Gentiles rejoiced and glorified the word of the Lord; and as many as were fitly disposed for everlasting life, believed.
(Mace) when the Gentiles heard this, they received the word with joy, glorifying the Lord: and as many as were dispos'd to eternal life, believed.
(Diaglott-NT) Having heard and the Gentiles rejoiced, and glorified the word of the Lord; and believed as many as were having been disposed for life age-lasting.
(Etheridge) And when the Gentiles heard, they rejoiced and glorified Aloha; and they believed who were disposed [Or, set unto.] unto eternal life.
(GW) The people who were not Jews were pleased with what they heard and praised the Lord's word. Everyone who had been prepared for everlasting life believed.
(LHB) And when the Gentiles heard this, they were glad, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were disposed to eternal life believed.
(LONT) And the Gentiles hearing this, rejoiced, and glorified the word of the Lord: and as many as were disposed for eternal life, believed.
(Rotherham) And they of the nations, hearing this , began to rejoice, and to be glorifying God, and they believed—as many as had become disposed for life age-abiding.
brightfame52
Active Member
No believing is never stated as a condition, its an evidence one has been saved.
brightfame52
Active Member
Believing is never stated as a condition for salvation, it accompanies salvation. Thats how we know one is saved by Christ
You have some serious reading difficulty
Seeing as the absence of faith precludes salvation, it clearly is a condition.
John 3:36 (KJV 1900) — 36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
If you do not believe, you will not see life
That is a condition.
Mark 16:16 (KJV 1900) — 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
Believing is an obvious condition for avoiding damnation and obtaining salvation.
John 8:24 (LEB) — 24 Thus I said to you that you will die in your sins. For if you do not believe that I am he, you will die in your sins.”
Believing is a condition to avoid dying in your sin.
Sorry, but believing always precedes salvation, and if one does not believe, one cannot be saved.
John 3:18 (LEB) — 18 The one who believes in him is not judged, but the one who does not believe has already been judged, because he has not believed in the name of the one and only Son of God.
Mark 16:16 (LEB) — 16 The one who believes and is baptized will be saved, but the one who refuses to believe will be condemned.
John 3:36 (LEB) — 36 The one who believes in the Son has eternal life, but the one who disobeys the Son will not see life—but the wrath of God remains on him.
John 8:24 (LEB) — 24 Thus I said to you that you will die in your sins. For if you do not believe that I am he, you will die in your sins.”
Romans 11:20 (LEB) — 20 Well said! They were broken off because of unbelief, but you stand firm because of faith. Do not think arrogant thoughts, but be afraid.
@brightfame52
Mark 16:16 (KJV 1900) — 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
In Greek with Strong numbers and tenses.
Tense is bolded
Mar 16:16
ο
G3588
T-NSM
ὁ
the
πιστευσας
G4100
V-AAP-NSM
πιστεύω
to have faith
και
G2532
CONJ
καί
and
βαπτισθεις
G907
V-APP-NSM
βαπτίζω
to immerse
σωθησεται
G4982
V-FPI-3S
σώζω
to save
ο
G3588
T-NSM
ὁ
the
δε
G1161
CONJ
δέ
but
απιστησας
G569
V-AAP-NSM
ἀπιστέω
to be unbelieving
κατακριθησεται
G2632
V-FPI-3S
κατακρίνω
to judge against
Believe is of the aorist tense.
But saved is of the future tense.
Thus, salvation proceeds after faith.
Mark 16:16 (KJV 1900) — 16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.
In Greek with Strong numbers and tenses.
Tense is bolded
Mar 16:16
ο
G3588
T-NSM
ὁ
the
πιστευσας
G4100
V-AAP-NSM
πιστεύω
to have faith
και
G2532
CONJ
καί
and
βαπτισθεις
G907
V-APP-NSM
βαπτίζω
to immerse
σωθησεται
G4982
V-FPI-3S
σώζω
to save
ο
G3588
T-NSM
ὁ
the
δε
G1161
CONJ
δέ
but
απιστησας
G569
V-AAP-NSM
ἀπιστέω
to be unbelieving
κατακριθησεται
G2632
V-FPI-3S
κατακρίνω
to judge against
Believe is of the aorist tense.
But saved is of the future tense.
Thus, salvation proceeds after faith.
brightfame52
Active Member
brightfame52
Active Member
Believing is always an evidence of salvation
brightfame52
Active Member
Believing is always the evidence of salvation, never a condition.
brightfame52
Active Member
Believing is always the evidence of being in a saved/justified state.
I don't assume it, as scripture presents it as something necessary for salvation many times.
Holding out condemnation if you do not and presenting belief as happening before salvation
via Greek tenses.
Never in scripture do we ever read, If God saves you, then you will believe.
brightfame52
Active Member
I agree with those scriptures, and believing is an evidence of salvation
brightfame52
Active Member
Believing is an evidence of salvation
